That doesn't sound that great to be honest. I appreciate that he's very blunt but...he's just admitting he's extremely dogmatic.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
That doesn't sound that great to be honest. I appreciate that he's very blunt but...he's just admitting he's extremely dogmatic.
well 81 being 9 points off 90, which is the kind of point tally where we won the league with fergie many times, wasn't that far off. I thought a good window then might've done it. Instead we got a Jose meltdown because of the whole Pogba/martial not being sold situation.
But we’ve seen Mainoo is our best CM, even if a player was bad last match. You look at the bigger picture and choose the one with the right profile.
@sammyhol
Has said this
Now we will spend alot of money just to return to 3rd position. A position we were in May 2023.
And On this weekend in 2021, we were joint Top of The League with Ole.
As you can see, we have compounded our problems immensely. Getting back to the position we were ( top 4 team) will cost us huge amount of money
1. Because Amorim won't change anything.
2. Amorim wants specific players who will play specifically how he wants.
3. 95% of the players are not comfortable in this setup, so we need new players.
And this is not a guarantee we will win..
Has said this
Bolded part reinforced.
Now we will spend alot of money just to return to 3rd position. A position we were in May 2023.
And On this weekend in 2021, we were joint Top of The League with Ole.
As you can see, we have compounded our problems immensely. Getting back to the position we were ( top 4 team) will cost us huge amount of money
1. Because Amorim won't change anything.
2. Amorim wants specific players who will play specifically how he wants.
3. 95% of the players are not comfortable in this setup, so we need new players.
And this is not a guarantee we will win..
That’s nonsense. Form matters.
Yeah might have been able to finish first against Pellegrini or similar but never looked like he had a hope against Guardiola in his pomp. He was already last year's man.
Yeah we really didn’t have options there. I can’t stress enough to people how terrible this squad really is. It’s just getting exposed now that the tactics aren’t just chaos ball or Ole/counter ball.
Ugarte is our only source of athleticism in midfield. Amad is the only dangerous player we have in attack. In a combined Newcastle/United XI we probably contribute 4 players total (Maz, Amad, Onana, and a CB). Not to mention we have 0 depth
Yeah, I agree with that.
Amorim has finally said it. We are in a relegation battle.
Be interesting to see us in 2/3 weeks time. There is a run of 3 home games (Southampton, Brighton, Rangers) where we can hopefully put a run together.
Don't expect anything at Anfield or Emirates
Don't expect anything at Anfield or Emirates
One things for certain, he has to be backed extremely well in the summer.
I'm worried now. At some point the players will lose trust and stop even trying to implement the tactics as they want to be winning games. Probably not far off, then it's only a matter of time before a sack.
One match. Yet Casemiro and Eriksen have had the same no legs issue for a season and a half.
90% of things we can’t blame the manager for. But today he has to be accountable for that. I love the guy’s personality, can see the improvements, I know most of things have been beyond his control, but it’s been enough matches where team selection errors are on him.
I think he's just convinced that's the right way to go and he probably knows half the team is too shite regardless of system for where the club actually wants to get. And when I say half the team, I mean three quarters. When he says he doesn't have another idea I think he's politely saying "you are the fourth so-called journalist asking me this in 5 minutes, why don't you go feck yourself" but I could be wrong : )
The higher-ups need to support him properly in January and for the rest of the season. First order of business is get out the players he deems least fitting/most troublesome, whether on-loan, early termination if their contracts are running out, or sold permanently. Clear the air.
He'll obviously need a left wing-back, but I'd suggest he'll need another #10 too, even if it's just on loan.
There are managers who deploy this tactic who have had success/been considered to be at the top of the game - Tuchel, Conte, Nagelsmann come to mind
The players are undoubtedly an issue and are not good enough for the club but they are also being set up to fail by this system just as they were in Ten Hag's system.
Some players especially those with Mainoo’s talent and especially age you give them the opportunity to regain their form. When Mainoo came on today he was our best player.
No Ten Hag made a bastardized ping pong system to fit the players. That's why they are so shite now.
I was very optimistic when he was appointed (although Iraola would have been my choice), but it's becoming clear that he's not a good fit for this squad, and as we're effectively skint, I'm concerned about where we're going to end up.
Mainoo had had too much burden and far too much game time thrust upon him for his age. Happened with Garnacho too, and we are seeing the same with Diallo now, the situation just drags these young prospects into the dust. And then the over exposure leads to criticism of their form and it becomes a big talking point when they are dropped, rather than the right thing to do - just ease them out of the spotlight for a bit.
Problem is for us is that we have absolute joke senior players - you have to swap the youngsters who shouldn't have that burden out for Casemiro, Eriksen, Antony and Rashford and the like.
Does any other top club have this problems where they have senior players paid Hundreds of thousands a week who are so unbelievably bad and uninterested that they have to make the youngest squad players play 50 games a season whilst the fat cats sit on the bench?
Heh
If we're conceding 2/3/4 goals over multiple games in a short period whilst barely scoring, there's nothing good about that.
If you play well but lose a couple, that's normal. I was happy that we had more possession and apparent control in the first few games. That potential platform hasn't been built on though, we're still not scoring many and conceding loads of needless shitey goals. That's the only story that's important as we're not really controlling anything in that case.
I know it's very early days, and I think Amorim talks well and I hope he really can improve things. I'm a bit worried by what I'm seeing so far though, as soon as we had a remotely challenging run we've really struggled.
I like a coach with convictions but even Pep / Klopp had to adjust their methods in different leagues / teams.
I definitely don't want to see Casemiro and Eriksen together again and would like to see us try a winger at wing back but I'm still not convinced we wouldn't get battered by all these teams.
It's not just midfield where we're lacking physically, it's everywhere on the pitch. Just hope we get better as the fixture list gets a bit kinder.
It's not just midfield where we're lacking physically, it's everywhere on the pitch. Just hope we get better as the fixture list gets a bit kinder.
So many teams are fast powerful and athletic now in the PL or at least have a sufficient players in their prime who are. We are slow, weak and lethargic. Pedestrian players at the end of their careers in midfield supplemented by still developing kids upfront who are lightweight and easily bullied, bypassed and pushed off the ball. Bad recruitment has led to this situation plain and simple. There are promising youngsters in the side and a great academy plus excellent young prospects being recruited there. The future looks brighter but short term I see nothing to disprove that mid table to Top 6 is the very best we can expect Amorim or not...
We've basically brought in a manager who needs money to be spent in order to successfully impose 'his system', at the same time the club has come out and said that we have no money to buy players. He needs something like a complete overhaul of the team, and we've got no money because Ten Hag spent it last summer.
If you're looking on the bright side, you need to ask yourself why at this point. Why the feck would you install a manager who will require a squad overhaul if you haven't got money to give him?
It would have made more sense just to keep Van Nistelrooij or find someone like Carrick and get the best out of the players. No wonder this guy looks completely shot already. We're so poorly run it's laughable.
If you're looking on the bright side, you need to ask yourself why at this point. Why the feck would you install a manager who will require a squad overhaul if you haven't got money to give him?
It would have made more sense just to keep Van Nistelrooij or find someone like Carrick and get the best out of the players. No wonder this guy looks completely shot already. We're so poorly run it's laughable.
Last edited:
I'm saying confidence is a huge part of doing well in top level sport and that confidence comes in the main from winning matches.
The point I'm trying to make is that even with five defenders on the pitch we're conceding a lot from bad mistakes and as you rightly point out, often conceding first. If we're going to be doing that, we need to be able to score a lot more goals to be able to outscore the opposition, and I don't feel we are using a set up that allows for that (nor do we have the quality in attack if we're honest), so we're on a bit of a hiding to nothing at the moment, and confidence is going to be worsening with every loss.
They both didnt go from playing 5 at the back to playing with 4, which is what the cafe is asking Amorim to do.
I'll double down on this point.
He needs some positive results quick or he'll be gone by February.
He needs to he somewhat pragmatic when it comes to style of play and formation. The crowd is behind him but he probably has credit in the bank because of the city result. Heavy defeats in the next two and the crowd will turn.
These long term "project" type managers have always struggled because its such a results driven business that people don't really care about what happens in a few months never mind a few years.
He needs some positive results quick or he'll be gone by February.
He needs to he somewhat pragmatic when it comes to style of play and formation. The crowd is behind him but he probably has credit in the bank because of the city result. Heavy defeats in the next two and the crowd will turn.
These long term "project" type managers have always struggled because its such a results driven business that people don't really care about what happens in a few months never mind a few years.
I dont think we are getting anywhere with this system without some new players and a pre season.
Personally I think we should go to a rigid back 4 sitting deep and then try to launch it in behind for Garnacho and Hojlund on the counter as well as allowing Bruno a bit more freedom. Its about all we’ve got the personnel for and negates a lot of the possession and running we cant do
What do you mean that doesnt sound great? He is being pragmatic not dogmatic. Jamie Jackson asked him this 5 at the back is not working so why not go 4 at the back to the old system? To which Ruben said if I dont have convictions in my own idea how am I sell this idea to the players? He also said these players were tailor made and hand picked for each position in the previous system of 4-2-3-1 even with 3 preseasons and 2 full season playing the same formation and they still lost games and thats why there was a coaching change in the first place.
Last edited:
Pep definitely evolved with formations depending on players, while Klopp had a smooth transition to EPL so there was no need for him to change the underlying formation.
We have no choice but to play out of this rough patch and be better. There is no point in bringing in a coach who plays like this and telling him to change his system. So if he changes to a 4-2-3-1, which btw he hasnt played before, and we continue to lose what then? Change back to 3 at the back or continue with 4 at the back?
It’s exactly what we have been crying out for as fans. To develop a system and an identity, not just to revert to type just because it suits the players we currently have.
We gave ETH shit for saying the opposite of Amorim in that he can’t play like he did with Ajax. Now we have got what we want and unfortunately it will take a lot of time before it works out.
He didnt evolve formations. He made tweaks like moving a wingback to midfield to overload the midfield. And Klopp played the same 4-3-3 at Dortmund and Liverpool. The posters here are asking Amorim to play 4 at the back. Thats a change in formation meaning the way we play is completely different.
Things are incredibly shit right now but I believe in this man long term. The board need to pull their finger out and radically change this squad though. First thing we need to fix is the physicality. Bring in players who are cheap but are physical specimens who put in a real shift. Amorim can work with that. The quality can come later. We'll have to complement that with 4/5 youth options that also have the physical qualities.
He accepted that relegation is a possibility in his post game interview. What a time to be alive.
I am sick of all those posts on internet who are absolutely convinced he is the guy and losing consecutive games is the way to success.
Maybe he is, maybe not. But it is not a given. Ineos is also a huge work in progress with their decisions still hardly reliable and question marks on what they are doing.
Maybe he is, maybe not. But it is not a given. Ineos is also a huge work in progress with their decisions still hardly reliable and question marks on what they are doing.
They didn't adjust, they started implementing their systems immediately. It took while for both them to get going. Both had the benefit of a more suitable squad of players that fit their system. Pep took over a league winning team and Klopp took over a team that took the league title down to the last match.
Amorim has taken over a shit show.