Does he have wingers like he did at Sporting? Do the players here know his system? Do they work as hard? Can they play as a team? Can this team string 2 passes together without losing the ball? Our attack isnt as good as Sporting meaning we need to have the good attacking players we have higher up the pitch for them to do some damage.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
At times yes.
It is not about Licha vs Maguire. I have already said Martinez has been poor. But Maguire has hardly been good either. You talk about his aerial prowess but we look vulnerable aerially . I would rather do Maz De ligt and yoro cb comboFair play, I wish I had your enthusiasm for this current iteration of Manchester United
Nothing to do with the redemption arc, at the moment he atleast offers better protection aerially and can even be a threat in the opposition box. Other than some nice passes to forwards that can do feck all with it, what can Licha bring that Maguire isn't?
Come on. Mourinho was easily our most successful manager after Fergie and it isn't even debateable. That was the only time where we felt on the verge of potentially challenging for the league. He also won the Europa. league. Also our highest league finish since Fergie on 81 points.
Sounds like a sensible option.
Yep, agreed. He clearly values the pre season training phase alot so, hopefully, he can get us through the remainder of this season and we can start fresh from next season.
Amorims making ETH look elite ffs!
Slightly unfair to assess during a period of total Pep dominance but I get your point. It's also a huge culture shift for the club across all are ranges, and mad to do this mid season.
Amorim now has a 36% win percentage and has lost the majority of games since arriving. Surely by far the worst start a manager has had here in recent history?
Cant he atleast try Antony at LWB ?
Yeah agree. We don't have enough quality to be playing just two centre midfielders and expecting them to control the ball, track runners, press etc.
Even against poor PL teams, I think he needs to be playing a three of Mainoo, Ugarte and Eriksen with Bruno ahead of them. We dont have the luxury of playing two 10s, especially with 3 CBs stood around doing feck all. Amad needs to do what he can from the wingback position.
Its also time for Collyer to start getting minutes.
I can safely predict we’re in for a real hiding at Anfield.
Yes. Unfair to criticize him too much there. Mainoo probably should have started but he hasn’t been great either.
OK remove Peps team
What about Klopp 90+ point teams.
Arteta teams.
Madrid domination in UCL has been through 433. Cas, Modric, Kross
Even the Barca of Xavi, Iniesta and Busquest was a 3 midfield team.
The jury's still out a bit on Yoro although his potential is plain to see. But I would like to see this combo as well in fairness, Maz was great at RCB.
It's football, not a philosophy course where he's trying to get them to understand Kantian Ethics.
What could possibly be so complex about his "idea" of how football should be played that the players aren't getting it?
I do disagree with you a lot but carrying on playing dalot anywhere and especially there at this point is madness. I agree. One of my biggest problems with ETH was the favouritism and Amorim seems to have that with Dalot, playing him despite his form being consistently dreadful. When's the last time Dalot had a good game? Even Rashford has had more good games this season.
There is such a massive lack of understanding on the wingback role. A lot of people saying to just put Garnacho or Antony in there.
In my opinion, i think Amorim doesnt want that because their instinct, given they are wide forwards, would be to push too high, too soon.
Sporting created numerical mismatches by having their windbacks play level with their two in midfield. That creates a problem for the opposition in terms of who marks the wingback. Does a full back push up on the wingback? Or does a midfielder come over?
If the opposition fullback pushes up it creates space in behind for the 10 or forward to move into. If a midfielder of the oppositions 3 gets dragged over, then passing lanes through the middle open up for the two midfielders or the two tens.
Maybe Amorm changes in January to playing wingers as wingbacks, or maybe it will just take more coaching and positional discipline, as well as understanding from other players on when and how to use the wingbacks. But i feel for now, he must think that Maz and Dallot being too defensive, at times, is better than others being too far forward, and thus taking up space that he wants others to utilise.
In my opinion, i think Amorim doesnt want that because their instinct, given they are wide forwards, would be to push too high, too soon.
Sporting created numerical mismatches by having their windbacks play level with their two in midfield. That creates a problem for the opposition in terms of who marks the wingback. Does a full back push up on the wingback? Or does a midfielder come over?
If the opposition fullback pushes up it creates space in behind for the 10 or forward to move into. If a midfielder of the oppositions 3 gets dragged over, then passing lanes through the middle open up for the two midfielders or the two tens.
Maybe Amorm changes in January to playing wingers as wingbacks, or maybe it will just take more coaching and positional discipline, as well as understanding from other players on when and how to use the wingbacks. But i feel for now, he must think that Maz and Dallot being too defensive, at times, is better than others being too far forward, and thus taking up space that he wants others to utilise.
Nah, by the point he came to us he had already settled for being Texas Pete to Guardiola's Superted.
The worrying thing is that he doesn’t seem to be learning from his mistakes
Keeps playing Dalot & Mazraouri as our wing backs despite them not creating anything
Keeps chopping and changing the back 3 so they have zero understanding of each other
I think this system in the premier league will always been found out against the better teams as you end up quite often 2 vs 3 in the centre of midfield
Keeps playing Dalot & Mazraouri as our wing backs despite them not creating anything
Keeps chopping and changing the back 3 so they have zero understanding of each other
I think this system in the premier league will always been found out against the better teams as you end up quite often 2 vs 3 in the centre of midfield
I’m sure the players know full well what the manager wants, but that won’t turn Maz or Dalot into Trent or Roberto Carlos.
Then he should be coaching Antony, who has excellent work rate to play the role exactly as he intends it.
Top managers can take a player and coach him to play a role in the way they desire, and a simple matter of positioning is one of the simplest things to coach.
Sounds pretty easy this coaching lark.
When did you do your badges bro?
wtf? When did I say that?Are you seriously arguing we should continue with Maz & Dalot at wing back?
Perhaps the biggest single contributor to our current situation was down to Woodward very generously extending the contracts of some bang average players.
Pretty sure we had Sporting fans on this very forum explaining how the coach started off there with more conservative wing backs, before progressing to more attacking options there.
The lack of patience on this forum over the last few weeks has been truly insane.
I didn't like him either, thought sacking him was the right decision too. Doesn't change what I said. It's more of a reflection of how bad we've been.
Can’t help but feel a lot of that’s on him today. It was obvious they’d bully a midfield of Casemiro & Eriksen.
All you need is four sessions.
Too much negativity around. We all knew this squad was trash, most of us believe in this coach. Amorim warned of a storm and a run of bad results.. Just have patience and believe that he'll turn it around.
100%. As soon as everyone saw the team today we all knew how it would go. I'm putting it down to just how many games there have been lately, and that he's trying to manage fatigue etc given the injuries we've had over the last 18 months.
Agree he had us looking better than most - but couldn't see him winning the league with us in a hundred years.
I believe and trust in Amorim. With the exception of today especially first 20 minutes, and also I think vs Wolves. I think every match before I’ve seen constant progression, even when the result went against us.
But today is one him. Starting Casemiro & Eriksen was a howler, so bad I actually thought Mainoo was injured so thought he had no other options. Until I see him bring on Mainoo. Game shifted once Mainoo came on, from 30 minutes onwards in thought it was very equal.
But today is one him. Starting Casemiro & Eriksen was a howler, so bad I actually thought Mainoo was injured so thought he had no other options. Until I see him bring on Mainoo. Game shifted once Mainoo came on, from 30 minutes onwards in thought it was very equal.
Watched his post-match presser and I have to say I thought it was the first time he sounded like he didn't really know what to do.
Was talking about there being no point trying to get the players to play the system they know because they failed that way under ETH, but also recognized that these aren't the players for the system he wants to play. Add to that he knows we can't buy anyone this window. Why would he take the job with that in mind? For the inevitable set for life payout in a years time?
I think he underestimated the impact of some of his methods in the premier league without a proper pre season.
He basically started pre season on arrival, and went on a run of excessive rotation, and when we actually started playing well, he went on the next game to rotate half the squad yet again. I think this killed momentum, and wasn't necessary.
Our squad is terrible, but not as terrible as we're playing at the moment. We don't have the proper WBs for his system, nor the 10s, so we end up really poor going forward. Our squad as it is now is more suited to a different style. He can wait till the summer to implement his ideas, but for now he needs to be more pragmatic.
We seem to be getting worse by each passing game, which is very worrying, and a defeat against Liverpool seems inevitable. He can't just say feck it, it's my way or the high way. Poor results will cost him the dressing room.
He basically started pre season on arrival, and went on a run of excessive rotation, and when we actually started playing well, he went on the next game to rotate half the squad yet again. I think this killed momentum, and wasn't necessary.
Our squad is terrible, but not as terrible as we're playing at the moment. We don't have the proper WBs for his system, nor the 10s, so we end up really poor going forward. Our squad as it is now is more suited to a different style. He can wait till the summer to implement his ideas, but for now he needs to be more pragmatic.
We seem to be getting worse by each passing game, which is very worrying, and a defeat against Liverpool seems inevitable. He can't just say feck it, it's my way or the high way. Poor results will cost him the dressing room.
There was obviously a reason why he didn't want to start Mainoo.
Yup. And that reason was him being terrible vs Wolves. Obviously.
Bruno and Ugarte were suspended. Who was he supposed to play? Zirkzee came off for Mainoo
I’m putting it down to Bruno and Ugarte being unavailable and Mainoo playing shite in the last match he started. I mean, we’re not exactly spoilt for choice in central midfield, are we?
I’d prefer Garnacho honestly, and stick Dalot on the right with Maz as RCB and Yoro LCB.
No more Martinez LCB and no more double defensive WB’s on both sides
I just can't get on board with that. It's a nice idea that if you just stick with something you believe in, it'll come good. I don't believe that to be the reality though, and it's not great management in my view.
Anyone can have a view of an ideal system or process that works well when all the right parts are in place. When that's not possible though, alterations (compromises) should be made to try to achieve the best possible outcome at the time, which for us is simply giving the current available players the best chance of winning a game of football. You then earn the time, money, belief, backing etc from all stakeholders to change, tweak, refine whatever needs to happen over time.
Amorim talks a good game, and it'd be great to offer him a squad suited to his needs, but by all accounts we're so far from being able to do that. So there will likely need to be a compromise somewhere along the line before it's too late. Ten Hag had his best season with us when he was being more pragmatic, he then appeared to become wed to his ideals for the most part, everything fell apart from there and never improved. I don't want that for Amorim too.
It's a strange thing in football fans, that a lot of people seem to believe that picking one system/way of playing and sticking with it is the best way to get results, even if it is visibly not working well on the pitch in front of them.
I'm not ridiculous about it, I understand that some patience is required, but I really don't want to see us unnecessarily throwing points away and boring/disappointing our fans for the sake of playing a particular formation. In my opinion that's so far from what top management is about.