Ron Vlaar

big difference Falcao and DI maria were available. No top defender was available this summer, exception Benatia. But from the moment Bayern wanted him, we had no chance. That is the reason why we should have gone for Vlaar.
 
izec said:
big difference Falcao and DI maria were available. No top defender was available this summer, exception Benatia. But from the moment Bayern wanted him, we had no chance. That is the reason why we should have gone for Vlaar.
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Perhaps we could have gone for Benatia before the world cup and had a free run at him?
I'm still hopeful Rojo will excel at CB and that Jones can stay fit enough to get a run of games alongside though as I think those two could be good together
 
I think he would be a good, soilid signing in the short term and would provide a level of leadership in the back line that we are sorely lacking. None of Evans, Smalling or Jones strike me as the type of player that will organise a defence and take charge of situations.

If Vlaar can be the type of player to do that then he could prove to be an important short term signing for us. As long as the fee is reasonable then I can't see any issues with it.
 
I said in the Summer it was a no brainer to sign him.

He's experienced; he's used to organising young/average defenders; he knows Van Gaal's system; and he is far better than his time at Villa on paper would suggest. Most Villa fans saw their season hinging on him staying and are desperate for him to sign a new contract. Looking good last season in a side with Baker, Clark, Bennett, Lowton, Okore etc next to him would be a tall order for any top centre back, but he came out of it being voted as their second best player. I hate the "Premier League proven" title that adds millions to average player's, but in a centre back having 2 seasons under your belt in the League is another big bonus.

I think he's massively underrated because of Villa's poor defensive record these last 2 years. However that's like saying Rooney is shite because of what was behind him last year. Not only that but he'd be happy playing a squad role on the rare occasions that everyone is fit.

I can certainly see him signing for £2-3m in January (6 months left on his deal).
 
It will be for 6 months then he will most likely be on the bench for a year as a squad rotation next season.
 
I am bemused by the discriminative comments about Vlaar, hes probably in the top 5 central defenders last year, performance wise, but hes is not good enough because he plays for Villa, i guess, or he is not a superstar exotic defender?

Who is the answer for our defensive problems. Hummels? Slim chance of getting him. We are are not blessed with age with a depth of truly word class defenders. Even if we find another Vidic, it may take him 6 month to settle it did for him and Evra.

Even if we go for Vlaar now, i fear Villa may flat our refuse and let him place out his contract as he is far more valuable to them keeping them in the league than 4 or 5 million in Jan..
 
Forgiveness if I'm wrong but doesn't he have a questionable injury record? if so the last thing we need is yet another CB that we can't rely upon.
 
If we sign him I wonder if he'll insist on having Roncrete on the back of his shirt instead of Vlaar, just to get some branding done while under the United badge.
 
starman said:
I am bemused by the discriminative comments about Vlaar, hes probably in the top 5 central defenders last year, performance wise, but hes is not good enough because he plays for Villa, i guess, or he is not a superstar exotic defender?

Who is the answer for our defensive problems. Hummels? Slim chance of getting him. We are are not blessed with age with a depth of truly word class defenders. Even if we find another Vidic, it may take him 6 month to settle it did for him and Evra.

Even if we go for Vlaar now, i fear Villa may flat our refuse and let him place out his contract as he is far more valuable to them keeping them in the league than 4 or 5 million in Jan..
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Had a great World Cup. If Van Gaal can get that kind of performance out of him for United, he would not be a bad acquisition at all.
 
Maybe we could get Nigel Reo Coker to plug the DM hole while we're at it.
 
He's a good option, I think.
LVG knows him, he's played in the Premier League already and he is in a position where we are short of cover.

The much sought-after 'world class' centre-half to lead the back 4 he may not be, but certainly would be a big help to the squad.

Go get him, Ed.
 
i think we should go for him in january. signing a decent PL proven defender who can stay fit most of the time next transfer window might be the difference of us getting into the top 4 or not.
 
Just looked at the Ron Vlaar thread on a random Villa forum. They say he's injury prone. Do not want.

I get that signing a top class CB will be difficult but surely we can at least sign someone who can actually stay fit?
 
If we're signing an injury prone centre half from villa I'd rather Okore.
 
Ekeke said:
Hasnt looked that good this season for Villa. 29 now.

Not a chance
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Games played this season 3 - W2 D1 with one goal conceded...

In short, he (and Villa) made a great start to the season - then he got injured...
 
I wouldn't mind Concrete myself. I don't think we necessarily need a 'World-Class defender'. That is just the result of the short-termists we have become of late and have lost sight of what it takes to build a top side I think. It is panic.

Our league has been full of teams with very good defences for years simply made up of good, organised defences. Tony Pulis doesn't require Mats Hummels to get a team to stop conceding every half an hour, for example. I also think that our defenders are actually good enough anyway, although I do hold question marks re: Evans.

The likes of Demichelis has come into an organised back-four at City and been excellent. Concrete could help us to improve. We are getting the basics wrong at the back at the minute. I reckon the line between a 'world-class centre half' and a 'good' one can be a bit blurry in my opinion anyway. It largeley depends on what team you play for, for starters. I think centre-half is the one position where it is not as simple as taking a world class player out of one team and putting him in another and expecting world class performances. The whole team defends.

I think Rio Ferdinand, for instance, was undoubted world-class. Vidic, however, I think, was certainly a world class player in the end, but not necessarily more talented than Vlaar and in the Villa side may have looked little better. The conditions at United were just right for Nemanja's strengths to blossom, but I do believe that another player in his mould could have probably replaced him competently who may well have spent most of the last decade at Europa League level.

Basically, some teams just know how to defend. We don't right now. I'm more inclined to believe that could be fixed on the training ground (and in the medical centre) as much as it could be in the transfer market. I think Senderos is the worst PL centre-half of recent times (although Mike Williamson is rapidly closing on him), but even he has had excellent international tournaments in the Swiss defence. Materazzi was a nobody struggling at Everton, but in the Inter team he became a CL winner and World Cup winning international regular. Right now, I don't think Hummels would change much. Bringing in Tony Pulis to fix our defence would be more effective, providing he has fit defenders to work with anyway.
 
No need to add a defender just to add one. We need to have an experienced defender and a talented one.

If Jones, Smalling and Evans are injury prone, we still have Rojo and Blackett in depth to partner this top defender

But Vlaar is not a United player, he doesn't have the quality to be top class.
 
sullydnl said:
Just looked at the Ron Vlaar thread on a random Villa forum. They say he's injury prone. Do not want.

I get that signing a top class CB will be difficult but surely we can at least sign someone who can actually stay fit?
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Wiki says his league appearances in his last 5 seasons were 32, 32, 32, 27 and 32. Numbers in bold were in the Eredivise, which has 36 game seasons.

We can only dream of a Manchester United central defender racking up those sort of stats.
 
Baker has been quite good too admittedly but it's big Ron we should be focusing on. If we could do it in January I'd be delighted as we have a horrible run of fixtures after that.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Wiki says his league appearances in his last 5 seasons were 32, 32, 32, 27 and 32. Numbers in bold were in the Eredivise, which has 36 game seasons.

We can only dream of a Manchester United central defender racking up those sort of stats.
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Those stats are pretty good tbf.

Still though, he's been managing a recurring calf problem for the last two years at Villa (missing about a quarter of their games), he was basically out for two full season at Feynoord with multiple injuries (broke a bone bone in foot, then did his cruciate, then a bacterial infection, then medial ligament damage, then damaged the same cruciate again) and he isn't getting any younger at 29 either....
 
We need to be realistic in January literally no top top players will be avaloble so we need a stop gap.

Vlaar and dare I say it shawcross is perfect temporary cover and both are a hell of a lot better than what we currently have. They have plenty of prem experience and on their day are both very good CBs probably get both for under £25 million.

No brainer for me we should go for them 2 as I said purely as temporary cover until we can go for the big boys.
 
dannyrhinos89 said:
We need to be realistic in January literally no top top players will be avaloble so we need a stop gap.

Vlaar and dare I say it shawcross is perfect temporary cover and both are a hell of a lot better than what we currently have. They have plenty of prem experience and on their day are both very good CBs probably get both for under £25 million.

No brainer for me we should go for them 2 as I said purely as temporary cover until we can go for the big boys.
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Yes to Vlaar but I think Jones already has what Shawcross has with potential to improve when he cuts out the rashness.
 
Rozay said:
I wouldn't mind Concrete myself. I don't think we necessarily need a 'World-Class defender'. That is just the result of the short-termists we have become of late and have lost sight of what it takes to build a top side I think. It is panic.

Our league has been full of teams with very good defences for years simply made up of good, organised defences. Tony Pulis doesn't require Mats Hummels to get a team to stop conceding every half an hour, for example. I also think that our defenders are actually good enough anyway, although I do hold question marks re: Evans.

The likes of Demichelis has come into an organised back-four at City and been excellent. Concrete could help us to improve. We are getting the basics wrong at the back at the minute. I reckon the line between a 'world-class centre half' and a 'good' one can be a bit blurry in my opinion anyway. It largeley depends on what team you play for, for starters. I think centre-half is the one position where it is not as simple as taking a world class player out of one team and putting him in another and expecting world class performances. The whole team defends.

I think Rio Ferdinand, for instance, was undoubted world-class. Vidic, however, I think, was certainly a world class player in the end, but not necessarily more talented than Vlaar and in the Villa side may have looked little better. The conditions at United were just right for Nemanja's strengths to blossom, but I do believe that another player in his mould could have probably replaced him competently who may well have spent most of the last decade at Europa League level.

Basically, some teams just know how to defend. We don't right now. I'm more inclined to believe that could be fixed on the training ground (and in the medical centre) as much as it could be in the transfer market. I think Senderos is the worst PL centre-half of recent times (although Mike Williamson is rapidly closing on him), but even he has had excellent international tournaments in the Swiss defence. Materazzi was a nobody struggling at Everton, but in the Inter team he became a CL winner and World Cup winning international regular. Right now, I don't think Hummels would change much. Bringing in Tony Pulis to fix our defence would be more effective, providing he has fit defenders to work with anyway.
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Great post and I think people tend to get lost on the term ''world class''. Players aren't born world class and a very talented player, in the right setting can perform at this level or just below it, case in point Gary Cahill wouldn't look half the player he is playing behind Fellaini and Cleverley alongside an ever changing partner. Phil Jones is young enough to outgrow his fitness and composure issues but we can not wait for him whilst discarding him would be foolhardy so the best course of action is a stop gap signing.
 
When is he even back from injury? I swear he's been a 'doubt' for Villa's next game for the past few weeks.
 
Baker is as average a footballer as you'll see. Vlaar is much better than him albeit not exactly world class either. Mind you, I'd still take him over the muppets we have marshalling our defence at this current moment in time.
 
No Thanks. I admit I havent seen a lot of him but no. I get the arguement people make about him looking better at United rather than Villa because we are a better side but I dont see the entangables like say a Ryan Shawcross. I'd rather stick with Blackett ,McNair et al to be frank.
 
Manucho the boss said:
Yes to Vlaar but I think Jones already has what Shawcross has with potential to improve when he cuts out the rashness.
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Still it would be nice to have a bit of depth in defence tbh shawcross has been seriously underrated for a long time now, he is consistently good week in week out and he should've been in the England squad years ago but gets overlooked probably because of when he broke Ramsey's leg ages ago.

Even so he is one of the most underrated CBs in the prem.
 
Señor said:
Baker is as average a footballer as you'll see.
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Yes, Baker is bang average and was absolutely shocking at times last season. He has played above himself a-few times this season, but his actual level, is not very good.
 
Straight swap for clevz would do. Definitely wouldn't pay 12 mill for a 29yo in the last year of his contract.
 
Rozay said:
I wouldn't mind Concrete myself. I don't think we necessarily need a 'World-Class defender'. That is just the result of the short-termists we have become of late and have lost sight of what it takes to build a top side I think. It is panic.

Our league has been full of teams with very good defences for years simply made up of good, organised defences. Tony Pulis doesn't require Mats Hummels to get a team to stop conceding every half an hour, for example. I also think that our defenders are actually good enough anyway, although I do hold question marks re: Evans.

The likes of Demichelis has come into an organised back-four at City and been excellent. Concrete could help us to improve. We are getting the basics wrong at the back at the minute. I reckon the line between a 'world-class centre half' and a 'good' one can be a bit blurry in my opinion anyway. It largeley depends on what team you play for, for starters. I think centre-half is the one position where it is not as simple as taking a world class player out of one team and putting him in another and expecting world class performances. The whole team defends.

I think Rio Ferdinand, for instance, was undoubted world-class. Vidic, however, I think, was certainly a world class player in the end, but not necessarily more talented than Vlaar and in the Villa side may have looked little better. The conditions at United were just right for Nemanja's strengths to blossom, but I do believe that another player in his mould could have probably replaced him competently who may well have spent most of the last decade at Europa League level.

Basically, some teams just know how to defend. We don't right now. I'm more inclined to believe that could be fixed on the training ground (and in the medical centre) as much as it could be in the transfer market. I think Senderos is the worst PL centre-half of recent times (although Mike Williamson is rapidly closing on him), but even he has had excellent international tournaments in the Swiss defence. Materazzi was a nobody struggling at Everton, but in the Inter team he became a CL winner and World Cup winning international regular. Right now, I don't think Hummels would change much. Bringing in Tony Pulis to fix our defence would be more effective, providing he has fit defenders to work with anyway.
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That's very well put, Rozay. On the money.
 
I must say if we sign Vlaar it will be the first time I'd question Van Gaal's judgement.

Don't think he's good enough for us at all.
 
Couldn't we sign Vlaar on a pre-agreement contract in January if he doesn't commit to Villa? I'd be willing to wait a few months and he could prove to be a huge coup, especially on a free.
 
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