He just isn't that good, IMO. Neither is Shawrosss. Both have established themselves as good Premier League defenders but neither would improve us significantly, if at all.
Ron Vlaar
- Thread starter RoadTrip
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
I think Rio has only played 1 more game in 3 years than Vlaar (that's with more chances of games in Europe) and he has made far more appearances than Vidic has in the last 3 years. Not saying he is a fitness machine but I just think the injury argument is just a phase a lot of fans are going through at the moment. One year it's about being proven in the league, next it's injury records etc. It just comes down to what suits ones argument.
The people who say this probably use a measuring stick of Rio and Vidic.
When you however compare him to Jones, Evans, Smalling Rojo, Terry, Cahill, Mertesacker, Koscielny, Lovren, Škrtel, Kompany, Mangala, Kaboul, Vertonghen
In terms of actually defending, i would probably place him 5th among those lot. He may not be bonafide world class, but how many defenders today are? and how many are actually obtainable?
Last edited:
As I said on the last page, Villa fans themselves have been complaining about how regularly he gets injured. Those might not be long spells on the sideline but they disrupt the stability of their team, something we've been complaining about for a while too. Plus there is no doubt that Vlaar has a problem with his calf and, at 29, there is every chance that his fitness is going to get worse from this point on.
Comparing him to Rio and Vidic is definitely faint praise given how many people thought they were far to injury prone too.
Arsene Wenger promising a centre back in January, linked with Vlaar over the last few days. Looking like Vlaar will be our January transfer saga instead of Vidal or Strootman.
If it's a case of paying £10-£12m in January I think it would be worth it, although we might be able to get him on a free if we wait until the Summer, we might miss out on the Champions League again if we don't strengthen our defence.
If it's a case of paying £10-£12m in January I think it would be worth it, although we might be able to get him on a free if we wait until the Summer, we might miss out on the Champions League again if we don't strengthen our defence.
I don't see the point really. We've got four senior centre-backs in the squad with McNair and Blackett coming through.
We have more than enough numbers in there so why add someone who wouldn't really stand out?
We have more than enough numbers in there so why add someone who wouldn't really stand out?
I think he'd do well and surprise quite a few people here.
He's not slow, he didn't have a bad season last year, he plays enough games.
Of all of the central positions (CF, CM, CB, GK), centre back is probably the one where you don't actually need to be a 'world class' player to have a huge impact.
If he comes in and settles the defence for two years or so, and adds some authority - he's worth signing for a decent fee. He's got the mental attributes too, in my opinion.
Given the option of having Vlaar or having Vidic back, I'd go for Vlaar now.
He's not slow, he didn't have a bad season last year, he plays enough games.
Of all of the central positions (CF, CM, CB, GK), centre back is probably the one where you don't actually need to be a 'world class' player to have a huge impact.
If he comes in and settles the defence for two years or so, and adds some authority - he's worth signing for a decent fee. He's got the mental attributes too, in my opinion.
Given the option of having Vlaar or having Vidic back, I'd go for Vlaar now.
I'm maybe a nostalgic, but I think that Vidic playing one game a week in our team without leader could have been great for us. I really think that United's mistake this summer was to let go Vidic, Evra and Rio at the same time. Even if one of them doesn't play, we should have a father figure the lads at the back.
As for Vlaar, I imagine with Cleverley there, we might use is loan in order to negotiate the fee...
I am actually surprised with all the negativity on here. For me Vlaar would be a welcome addition. I think he is better than Smalling, Evand and arguably better than Jones. Though if Jones could get himself fit for a season he definitely has the potential to surpass Vlaar. Also Vlaar played really well last PL season as the WC. Last not least he is actually a realistic option, dont bother naming Kompany and such. Its the same as screaming for Messi. It will simply not happen.
We aspire to be champions, so McNair and Blackett have to show LvG they can perform like one, if they do theyll play nontheless. I am not worried that Vlaar would block their progression at all. Furthermore Cl next season is way more important then having our youngsters getting a few games. They still need a few years, and by then who knows how our team will look.
We aspire to be champions, so McNair and Blackett have to show LvG they can perform like one, if they do theyll play nontheless. I am not worried that Vlaar would block their progression at all. Furthermore Cl next season is way more important then having our youngsters getting a few games. They still need a few years, and by then who knows how our team will look.
Last edited:
Nobody with a proven record of absence through injury should be considered. He's a good guy but we've more than enough of that shit around already.
Irrespective of whether we should actually be in for him or not - it is a bit baffling that Shawcross does not get called up to the England squad.
I think Rojo is the only defender on that list he could possibly be better than(and I only say that since I have not watched him a ton yet). Plus he is older than everyone on that list with the exception of Skrtel so there is less room for improvement. We have not been great defensively so far this season but, the situation is not bad enough that someone like Vlaar would improve us. Like someone said a few pages ago he has been outplayed by Nathan Baker this season.
Shawcross is poor on the ball, lacks pace and fouls too much no mystery there.
Shawcross isn't poor on the ball, and I'd prefer him to Vlaar.
Sorry but what games are you referring to where he was outplayed by Barker?? As far as p remember his partner has been Senderos, they were unbeaten before he got injured than began to flood goals.
Last edited:
I just checked, the games Barker must have done the outplaying was against, Leyton Oreint ( who they lost against) supposed to have put in a mom against Liverpool and preceded to concede 8 goals against City, Cheslea and Arse. No shame in that but i dont know how you can say he outplayed him?
Shawcross's injury record is impressive. I'd like to sign him just to see how long it would take us to turn him into a glass guinea pig.
Because Smalling is incredible on the ball? Or Cahill and Jagielka are great on the ball too? And are lightning quick?
In terms of England, the defenders are there, first and foremost, because they are decent defenders... Shawcross is a decent defender.
If we're going for Vlaar for 12m when he's got half a season left of his contract then we're bleeding money
We'd "bleed" a lot more money if we miss out on European football for 2 years running. Not worth the risk, we need big Ron.
I hope we sign a better defender. Vlaar is just not good enough. Chilleni has 6 months on his contract and if we want an experienced player he would be my choice. If we want some one from our league vertonghen is a good choice and if someone younger then france has a good list of CB's coming through.
Chiellini already plays for a big club where he wins trophies though. We could pay him more but he might just stay at Juventus. I wouldn't go changing your username to Chiellini just yet.
I actually thought De Vrij was the better of the duo in the World Cup. Not much of a fan of Vlaar, but he's a good CB.
But, Smaling is lighting quick and while it is not their strong suits Cahill and Jags are much better on the ball and quicker than Shawcross. Shawcorss would be out of his depth on the international level.
Good bit of business IMO, he's Villas captain and is experienced in the Prem. We need to get the defence tight again and I think he'll be a good addition to the squad.
I'm not against the idea of Vlaar, however, I'm sick of hearing that he is proven in the Premier League. Well, Fellaini was too, it means absolutely nothing. Di Maria wasn't proven.
It's a stupid thing people bring up far too often when talking transfers.
It's a stupid thing people bring up far too often when talking transfers.
That was my impression too.
I could see Vlaar coming here in January and we give them a player on loan for the rest of the year (Smalling, perhaps) and 3-4 million.
Yeah Smalling would go from being Arsenal's first choice to replace Vermaelen to being loaned to Aston Villa
VG just love buying defenders from ALDI
I don't get this signing (if it happens) at all. Disregard those six games at the WC, look at his performances in the entirety of his time in England and he's not good enough to be anything other than a squad player, unless we assume we're going to remain shit at the back in the long term.
If we're buying a CB we should buy a really good one in the same way we tried to overhaul the forward positions.
If we're buying a CB we should buy a really good one in the same way we tried to overhaul the forward positions.
We have yet to have a settled centre back pairing this season. If (big if) our defenders can stay fit until the Jan transfer window, I think we will start seeing a settled pairing (Jones + Rojo maybe?) and won't have a need for Vlaar.
That's just mental. Pack Smalling off to Villa with a bag of money for big Ron? Enough, now. Get our centre-halves fit and organised and we'll be fine. What do people think Chelsea's back line would look like with a new manager and the amount of upheaval and changing formations and personel that we've had this year? Do people remember what John Terry looked like the season before Jose arrived? Smalling, Jones and Evans are all good quality centre-halves. 3 months with them all training together and playing together and we can talk about sending them on loan to Villa or Bolton of East Fife or whatever the Caf has decided their level is now.
They are not really that good to be honest
However I would only replace them with a good defender and not Vlaar
Exactly right.
I wasn't saying it's what I would do, but I don't think LVG is in love with Smalling and Villa would want another CB to replace Vlaar, right? And if we're trying to get them to go from 12 million down to a more reasonable fee and we're not in Europe so only playing once a week, I could see it.
Thanks sir.
Smalling would just go join Welbeck
Why on earth would he contemplate a team like Villa? He was our best CB last season. LVG may not want him, we'll see if that turns out to be the case, but he won't be without good teams willing to take him
I agree he would likely go to a better team than Villa on a permanent move, but if you read, I said a loan. That way Smalling gets another 15-20 starts (and he might be desperate to actually play by January), Villa get an immediate replacement and Van Gaal gets the experienced CB he is rumored to want.
We really have no way of knowing if Wenger still rates Smalling, by the way. You just can't assume he'd definitely go to Arsenal. Wenger just bought a young English defender in Chambers for a fair chunk. He might not want to do so again. Maybe he has his eye on a Ligue 1 player or some other CB for January or next summer. And if Wenger passes and Everton don't want to spend enough to get him, a mid-table team like West Ham or Newcastle that desperately needs a non-geriatric CB and has spent 10-15 million on players in the past might end up as his destination, as that's presumably his value.
Yeah, we have enough decent CB's. Vlaar doesn't have a ton of upside, obviously. I think what will end up happening is we don't go for Vlaar, one of Evans or Smalling leaves in the summer and we sign an expensive CB and it's:
LCB - Rojo, Evans/Signing, Blackett
RCB - Jones, Smalling/Signing, McNair
Evans can play either side but LVG won't want Smalling at LCB, so I think if Smalling wins out we sign an LCB but if Evans does it could be a CB who is best on either side.
Vlaar being on a free means some team that really wants him badly will snap him up early in the window while we're still working on bringing in someone like Miranda or Hummels.
He'd get the starts at a much better team than Villa and wouldnt be interested in a loan. He's not a youngster anymore.
Wenger insisted on Smalling as part of the Vermaelen deal and that held it up. Its true he might feel he has enough players there now, but with their current CB issues thats probably not the case.