Herman you say you are only a member of your church for 1 year or so. Did you have other beliefs before or another faith?
Religion, what's the point?
- Thread starter TheRedFlag
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It's not rude, it's just strange given your arrogant pontificating on here; you ought to know this stuff in your sleep.
Here's an intersesting bit from one of the articles you linked
http://www.terryvirgo.org/Articles/...cles/Series/The_future_of_Newfrontiers_A.aspx
Herman, I feel that we're going around in circles a bit here. Perhaps it is my fault after all, I mean, after all, you've been helpful but let me try to say it more clearly.
1) Your own website which you gave me a link to and told me to take a look at and then follow the articles stated that the leaders of Newfrontiers should not call themselves Apostle's. (Just look back at your replies to me, you'll find the link that you posted, to Newfrontiers, your church etc.
2) Then in a further post you said that if you had any questions, within the church, you'd go and talk with an apostle.
Therein lies the contradiction, I cannot be any plainer I'm afraid and at the end of the day you have been the cause of the confusion because I happen to know very well that the Apostles within your church were disbanded at some point around 2007.
At the end of the day, I'm not asking difficult questions am I? I just wanted to know if you knew who holds the reins within your group of churches, and then we could have moved on. However you have decide to make a very silly argument over a simple matter that could have been oh so easy.
It isn't difficult stuff. Your link, posted to me, I'm asking you to do no more than you expected of me when instead of just answering me you posted a link and instructed me to find the information. Look and ye shall find Herman. Go. The answer lies within one link on that first page. How can I make it any clearer? This website represents your church not mine after all.
I became a Christian when I was about 18/19 and then it wasn't until I moved to where I am now that I joined the church I am a part of. That was about a year ago. Just over.
I've read through the entirety of what I sent you a few times and don't see this declaration you're claiming is there. That's why I said it would be better if you quote it in context and verbatim, please. I also didn't say I would go to an apostle over any questions I had concerning the church, I'd go to my pastor who of course knows more about newfrontiers than I do.
I'm happy for you that you've found something to believe in and that you'd like to share your experience. At 20 I didn't know my arse from my elbow and still don't but I don't think I'd ridicule others beliefs in the way you have in this thread. If you want to convince folk that your religion is the religion above all then getting petty and personal with others isn't the way. Just state what your religion stands for and trust folks to either accept or reject it.
That's really all that has happened, Stick.
Wait Herman is only 20?
Makes me feel totally horrible.
Didn't you call the Catholic Church the Harlot Church?
If you believe anything he says.
What in your words do you think has happened in this thread since your arrival?
I am 25. (Going on 26 as the child inside me says).
All I'm asking is whether you can clear up who leads your church, is it just Terry Virgo or is there another layer in the 'hierarchy' below him if you like?
I'm only asking this really because Terry said himself, I think some time back in 2012 - "Who dare carelessly to claim to be an apostle knowing that one day he will face Jesus and give an account of his life? The thought has scared me for a long time."
If you are tired of that discussion, and I sincerely am, is there a person within your own church who takes the function of 'Discipler" or something similar?
Yes, which possibly wasn't the most sensible thing to lead with in the manner I did because it set the wrong tone for a conversation that could otherwise have been fruitful.
25? And you've been a Christian since you were 18? At what point in your life where you a "fire breathing atheist"? When you were 12? This has thrown it all up in the air for me. This is mental.
I see what you're saying. My church, just like any other newfrontiers church, is really its own entity and the church disciples its own. I know Terry Virgo and his 12 apostles (forgive me for not knowing the exact details of it) were the original leaders, so to speak. I honestly don't know if it's still those 12 apostles who are Terry's close associates. I know there are regional apostles who sort of act like Bishops. The one I am most familiar with is the one for my "sphere" which is Guy Miller but he's more recent.
I know they don't view themselves as the original 12 Apostles but I would really have to sit down and talk with my pastor about the arrangements. I've never paid much attention to it, oates.
25? And you've been a Christian since you were 18? At what point in your life where you a "fire breathing atheist"? When you were 12? This has thrown it all up in the air for me. This is mental.
18-19. Believe me when I say, I read a lot when I was 18. I had bookshelves full of philosophy, science, new atheist stuff, etc. But I am not really sure what my age has to do with it. I am surely not judged by my age?
I hope he is not a Liverpool etc fan and trolling us on hereBrilliant.
Do you mind if I ask you if you are married or have a partner, honestly just being nosy and wonder what if any impact that has with your worship or implications with the fellowship (or has had)?
What do you mean by fruitful?
Full of fruit, he's a literalist remember.
I've recently discovered a fruit called a donut peach. It's essentially a squashed peach. I hope this fruit is included....
Producing something good.
I don't know. I found your chats with Walt, Penna and Oates to be very fruitful. Do you feel you've wasted your time or got side tracked from your main aim?
As entertaining as the convo between Oates and HVR was, they are still both arguing over the same old nonsense. Oates version is a little more palatable because it has a big dose of 'be excellent to each other' within, but ultimately it's still belief in a ridiculous fairy-tale.
It's more about the manner things are done in, Stick. Because I am not perfect I sometimes wield a club in my debates with others. It's not that I don't believe what I am saying it's just that the intention and the tone isn't always right and it makes people resentful. I don't feel like I've wasted my time or even got side tracked. I am just honest with myself; I could say some things better.
The only reasonable cause to have any debate about religion in the interwebz is entertainment. The intellectual conflict is so simple, that it could be conclusively dealt with in a few sentences. The only people that get really engaged in these kind of arguments are religious people, trolls or young rebellious atheists, who dont understand that its completely pointlessness.
that would be brilliant
You know that I'd always try to make an exception for you Grinner.
He's a Gooner, talk about believing in a ridiculous fairy-tale!
I'm a gooner too but that's not the only thing Grins is deluded over - he even believes he is found devastatingly attractive by any woman over 35.
My 'fairy-tale' is true and provable though. Yours isn't.
Pics Grinner?
Please don't start me off. Again. And mine is provable. No. Don't. It is though. I'm going.
I could send you pics that would send you straight to hell, boy.
So they meant to say "goner" and not "gooner".
Arsenal is god's team. Man Utd is clearly the team of satan.
Aye, but he's gooner get round to dealing with you, too.
Yeah, I don't mean pictures of you in the woods wearing your gun and nothing else Grinner.
PS. Thanks for calling me Boy, made my day!