It sounds like god has some real jealousy issues.
Religion, what's the point?
- Thread starter TheRedFlag
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Which should entail that it's not your fault, to some degree... If there are such consequences, it's because we live in a universe designed so that it could be that way... Your God is still an absolute cnut.
There's no reason to take the bible literally though, is there? It's not (supposedly) dictated word for word by god like the quran, but rather a collection of stories of the creation of the world, the lives of prophets, the life of Jesus, some letters and a doomsday prophecy. The only literal words of god in it would be the ten commandments.
And then some.
I've said before the 66 books of the Bible contain many different genres of writing. I don't interpret the narrative in the same way I do the poetry, or the prophetic texts. The whole "literal" accusation just bores me, to be honest.
Well going from atheist to believing the word in the bible is literally true is a massive leap. I'm just wondering what caused that jump. As an atheist I can't imagine anything happening to me or being said to me that would make me question whether I was right or wrong nevermind converting to the extent that I believe that the bible is literally true.
Your skygod is a vindictive, jealous, insecure douchebag. Thankfully he's nothing more than a creation of the human psyche, and most people with sense can now see this. Your belief in him is an absolute joke.
I've often wondered what religious people would think if aliens ever came to earth and they had a different god.
Indeed. Now could you please identify who God is for me, oates. If I was somebody who didn't know him but wanted to, who would you tell me he is?
"You're wrong, you harlot!"
It's strange. I don't particularly feel compelled to sit in a thread for atheists and tell them how all their convictions are a joke and insult things I don't believe in.
This IS a thread for atheists. Haven't you read the OP? Or the title? Or any of the posts?
No, you would rather sit in a church with your fellow Christians to hear how the non-believers are going to be tortured in Hell for eternity.
Well hopefully you'll come back to me with some answers to my earlier questions Herman but far from being all wrath and jealousy I might focus on these texts, maybe; -
A perfection of his character which he exercises towards his creatures according to their various circumstances and relations "(Ps. 145:8, 9; 103:8; 1 John 4:8). Viewed generally, it is" benevolence; as exercised with respect to the miseries of his "creatures it is mercy, pity, compassion, and in the case of" "impenitent sinners, long-suffering patience; as exercised in" "communicating favour on the unworthy it is grace. "Goodness and" "justice are the several aspects of one unchangeable, infinitely" "wise, and sovereign moral perfection. God is not sometimes" "merciful and sometimes just, but he is eternally infinitely just" "and merciful." God is infinitely and unchangeably good (Zeph." "3:17), and his goodness is incomprehensible by the finite mind" "(Rom. 11: 35, 36). "God's goodness appears in two things, giving" "and forgiving."
They talk of an infinitely merciful God I suppose Herman.
Shall we talk a bit about your church for a while Herman? Can you tell me what the Clarendon Trust has to do with Newfrontiers?
You're in it now.
I wouldn't have either. I was lucky enough to engage with a Christian family in debate on the subject, back when I was a fire-breathing atheist and though they didn't tell me at the time, they prayed for me after the long and mostly insulting (on my behalf) debate I had with them. My worldview fell apart in about the space of two weeks following that and when i told them what had happened they told me they'd been praying for me. I am not going to list all the details and reasons for my old worldview falling apart. The significant thing was that I wasn't looking at things the way I used to, with the same old blinkers on. The Bible describes God as opening Lydia's heart to the truth in the book of Acts and the scales are described as falling off Paul's eyes. The same thing happened to me by the grace of God.
Can't remember that ever being the subject of a sermon.
Oates, your quarrel isn't with me it's with God. You don't accept the gospel. I accept all of the scriptures you give to me on the goodness of God. I'll say it again, it is God's good purpose to bring as many people as will freely come to his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins. There is no other way that man can be saved. That is God's plan of restoration for man and the whole creation. Salvation is by faith alone in Christ alone. That's the gospel. I'd prefer you just accepted or rejected it rather than trying to obfuscate and bring in red herrings.
There are millions of people who share your experience, only with reference to another religious truth. Whether it's the truth of the Quran, the Catholic Church, the Book of Mormon or countless other 'truths'....they all believe, with just as much sincerity as you do, that their experience was a spiritual one and a revelation of truth. Your experience is not unique or special, and it certainly is not evidence of what you claim it to be.
Couldn't he just save time by appearing in front of us all?
I simply answered the question concerning my conversion. I haven't attempted to give reasons or evidence (in answering that specific question) for why my faith is the right one. You're becoming a bore, nev.
So you are quite happy to quote texts that say that he loves his people and show this steadfastly while saying that these people will not go to Heaven to be with him, in addition ignoring the fact that he is an infinitely merciful God?
I also have to feel that I've had no quarrel with God but that it seems that you are at odds with the Bible itself.
Well he did do that several times Malcolm.
When? I must have missed it. I miss so much living in Japan.
Not since the development of cameras, interestingly.
I am not ignoring anything. I've stated the gospel, which testifies of the goodness of God and his steadfast love and forgiveness. I can see you're still having trouble with this.
Au contraire mon ami, it is you that is having the trouble. However I can understand your difficulty.
Now, back to the Clarendon Trust. Can you explain its relationship to your church and its function?
I think several very good artists have attempted to 'capture' his image down the centuries.
It's very tempting. I don't usually do it, but it's tempting. My biggest fetish when I was growing up was telling my grandmother (whom I loved very much) exactly what rednev told you.
The way I see it, they (Christians around me) tried to destroy me. Everything I like about me wouldn't be there if they had succeeded. Fortunately they really don't have much of a coherent argument, and I, alone, as a 11 year child, had already become an atheist without the least interference from the outside. I became happy. When I stopped believing in God, the only source of anxiety in my life was gone. I was lucky to grow up in a peaceful place, with a loving family, in full physical health, I was an excellent student - I was supposed to live in almost permanent happiness - yet the penalty for something as insidious as "stealing" a candy from my own kitchen or missing sunday church to play hide and seek with other kids could be nights of insomnia and fear, until the next opportunity for confession arose. Someone routinely told me God doesn't like kids who do that. And when someone as powerful as him doesn't like you it can be pretty damn scary.
Now tell me I shouldn't feel vindictive towards that.
Your God (I can't say I'm very familiar with others, given that my homeland was 99% Christian region when I was born) instills anger due to his own actions, it's not like people say it out of spite.
What the white, straight haired 1st century middle eastern Jew? Seems about right.
That's not at all the sane thing.
My church or all newfrontiers churches? I don't have a clue about the latter. Obviously you're leading somewhere with this, so feel free to divulge your information to me (in a private message would be most helpful) and I will bring up any concerns with the pastor of my own church.
I did see what you done there.
Herman, I understood that you attended a church within the Newfrontiers group, is that not so? Have I got that wrong?
Do you know what the Clarendon Trust does? It is a simple question.
Weren't they forced to do it on threat of death? I'm sure I heard that recently.
As usual Malcolm, you are in possession of more information than I am.