He's not fit to ref Premier League games. He's influences by the crowd and players too easily. The crowd was upset because they thought the ball was out (it wasn't), Oliver noticed it and was afraid to give the penalty. He's weak and incompetent.
Michael Oliver
- Thread starter stubie
- Start date
Souness is usually pretty fair.
Quinn might as well wear a Man City shirt whenever he is on though. He's the absolute worst.
He doesn't have to book Rash if he saw it as a 'coming together' or legal shoulder barge. Surprised he didn't pull out the yellow though.
No mention on BBC commentary of the Mangala non-yellow etc...cut from the same cloth.
I have no problem in believing that he is completely crooked.
Sounness has ripped into us loads this season, but tbf I guess he's mostly been right.
I hope he accidentally drinks stale milk
He may be harsh and often pretty obvious in his feelings towards United and Liverpool, but he always does seem fair and honest.
I never understand referees not giving those when a player is through on goal. Rashford was bearing down on goal if he hadn't of got hacked down. Why the heck would he just dive or fall over in that position ? There was more chance of a goal from him getting clear than there would have been from any resultant penalty.
He's rubbish, pleace bring the video ref and get scums like these searching for a new job.
After all the shite we had from Webb and Gallagher about Payet deserving a penalty last week, I'm not sure video refs are the answer.
Long as it isn't Webb watching the video.....
Just watched MoTD and the bottle job is just either incompetent/he's bought. What a wanktard. Absolutely nowhere near the ball was DiMichelis, and if he didn't blow for a dive then what the hell was he doing not giving a penalty?
We seem to always be on the end of his shite performances.
His problem is he lacks spine. He should've sent Smalling off in the second half but bottled it.
He should've booked Mangala in the first half but bottled it. He's just trying hard to not make key decisions really.
He should've booked Mangala in the first half but bottled it. He's just trying hard to not make key decisions really.
Not sure if serious?
I just don't get it, why people blame referees, it's one of the most stupid things to do. When you actually analyze the situation calmly, objectively without conspiracy theory googles you can only come to one conclusion, it's not referees who are biased, it's the fans. I mean every genuine 50-50 decisions are "stonewall pen" or "never the pen", it's ridiculous.
Every teams get a lot of lucky and unlucky decisions over the course of the season, for example i remember a very similar episode to the one Rashford had against City, when against Watford i think in the end of the game their substitute raced on the right side, wet into the box and them was shoulder barged by one of our players.
I think Oliver is a fine ref, and if you look at his Utd matches over the last 3 years i'm sure you could find many controversial or 50-50 decisions that were awarded to United.
Every teams get a lot of lucky and unlucky decisions over the course of the season, for example i remember a very similar episode to the one Rashford had against City, when against Watford i think in the end of the game their substitute raced on the right side, wet into the box and them was shoulder barged by one of our players.
I think Oliver is a fine ref, and if you look at his Utd matches over the last 3 years i'm sure you could find many controversial or 50-50 decisions that were awarded to United.
Just venting mate
I agree with you. Not only on Oliver specifically but more generally on the point about fans being biased and the fact it's stupid to criticize refs. It's one of the things that annoys me the most in football.
He is a fecking cnut, hate the prick. Looks like a fecking schoolboy, thats how he referees too. Hope he is the first one to lose his job once we get robots.
100% Bullied by the crowd and players, he's to young and wet behind the ears.
You saw the Smalling incidents?
Bottled the two big decisions in the derby. I still rate him as a ref, think he is one of the better ones recently, but there was no excuse for his mistakes on Sunday (which I must add benefited City more than United). Clattenburg invented a handball by Sterling to give Tottenham a penalty too. That's two big games alone at the Etihad where the referees have made huge mistakes. The use of technology is long overdue.
He's some weird combination of a proper Hollywood ref and an absolute coward. Usually the Hollywood types are desperate to award a penalty or send someone off, and cowards usually give absolutely nothing to anyone for fear of making the wrong call. Oliver somehow manages to combine them both by not awarding blatant penalties, but absolutely jizzing his pants at the prospect of calling a player over for a talking to.
I just don't see it happening for those type of decisions. It's not like you need advanced technology for that anyway - unlike goal line decisions - as it's just video reviewing. It could've been implemented a decade or two ago. I'm not sure it's necessary either, these decisions were made by incomprehensible interpretations by a referee, not a failure to spot something. All we need is refs that aren't brain dead.
But referees are always going to make mistakes and in this case it seemed mainly due to fear at making a big decision. If we had the use of technology in an instance like on Sunday the Rashford incident could have been reviewed and the correct decision reached. Referees are humans and will be influenced by the crowd, players and previous incidents among numerous other factors. Using technology reduces the impact these factors can have on a game.
I think he knew he fecked up in not giving the penalty, probably watched a replay at half time, and his refusal to send off Smalling was him trying to even it up.
He's a shite referee in my opinion
He's a shite referee in my opinion
Perfectly put
Totally agree, I think the penalty was a penalty but not quite as stonewall as we might like to think. I believe a lot of their motivation is an 'easy afternoon' or game management, some are keener on it than others. Better chance of a 'big decision' being made in the 2nd half than the first few minutes.
Difficult job esp around what is red/yellow or a 2nd yellow. Got to be pretty sure a player deserves to go off the field which they might do good on, then there's all the technical crap - shirt off, silly handball, pen AND red card for a 'DOGSO' - which we all moan about if they're NOT applied when in our favour
I do have some sympathy but some of them don't help themselves with their sheer consistency of being crap.
Oliver is a proper contender for that but Clattenberg has a good lead, imo.
Yeah, I think it's embarrassingly childish. It's a weirdly accepted convention that doesn't exist in the vast majority of top level sports. Criticism, sure, but the vitriol is absurd.
Agreed. And for most of these people, they can't actually name a referee they think is good. So if they are all bad, your expectations are too high.
Or they can and they name the one that actually mistakes in United's favor which is way worse.
So you don't think Oliver's a bottler? There are plenty of crap referees in the prem but very few who don't at least try and make a few tough calls in a game. I actually think Oliver would be a very good referee if he grew a pair of bollocks.
Webb was basically the exact opposite. Not all that brilliant but very self confident and commanding and thus he garnered a lot of respect in the game.
Webb also looked like a tank so players would think twice before trying to bully him but in case of Oliver I do agree, he could be a very a good referee if he starts making some calls that might not please the home crowd.
There are 19 referees that are part of the Select Group allowed to officiate Premier League games as the primary official. Obviously not all of them are bad referees. However, I'd say there's definitely some sort of correlation between how bad a referee is perceived and how high their profile is. I'd say the only exception to this in recent(ish) years has been Collina. Looking at the list, the only referees I could say with any confidence are poor referees are Michael Oliver and Mark Clattenburg, two of the more high-profile referees.
Referees get a high-profile in a few ways: being noticeably good at their job, officiating high-profile matches, and making controversial or match-changing decisions. In fairness to refs, it's pretty hard to gain recognition for doing the right thing unless it's a tight call (penalties, offsides, etc.), and even then they usually just get a bit of nod from the commentators. Conversely, it's very easy to gain a reputation for doing the wrong thing, particularly when it changes the game, and even more so when that game is high-profile. If a referee does little wrong then he's not going to have his name mentioned very often and won't get much air-time.
Clattenburg and Oliver are both given high-profile matches to officiate with relative frequency, and both are likely to finish their careers as generally well-respected referees in the eyes of the media. Basically, they'll follow a similar trajectory to Howard Webb. Just as I don't rate Oliver and Clattenburg, I didn't particularly rate Webb either. The primary reasons for this are that they all enjoy the spotlight too much, and are all very reactionary. The simple fact is, referee's shouldn't enjoy the spotlight and they shouldn't base decisions on crowd or media reaction.
Enjoying the spotlight can help refs assert control over games because they'll be confident in their ability to control the players. It's also extremely detrimental because time and time again we see the same referees jumping at the opportunity to send someone off, award a penalty, or the new favourite, dish out a random booking for diving despite often ignoring a number of other dives. Another, less obvious habit of these refs is to steal the spotlight by doing doing absolutely nothing, whether it's walking twenty yards away from an incident to call a player over, just to give him a talking to, or giving it the old Benitez x-arms to deny a penalty claim. The latter usually depends on how loudly the crowd reacts.
There's clearly a lot of bias that goes into someone's opinion of a ref, whether it's due to a decision he made that had negative consequences for the team they support, or whether the ref has recently made the wrong call on a high-profile decision. That said, I think it's unfair to accuse people have having standards that are too high or that they think all referees are bad. I'll moan a lot about the likes of Oliver and Clattenburg thinking they're the main event in a Manchester derby, but I'm unlikely to ever mention the likes of Anthony Taylor, Craig Pawson and Robert Madley because they just get on with their jobs.
Referees get a high-profile in a few ways: being noticeably good at their job, officiating high-profile matches, and making controversial or match-changing decisions. In fairness to refs, it's pretty hard to gain recognition for doing the right thing unless it's a tight call (penalties, offsides, etc.), and even then they usually just get a bit of nod from the commentators. Conversely, it's very easy to gain a reputation for doing the wrong thing, particularly when it changes the game, and even more so when that game is high-profile. If a referee does little wrong then he's not going to have his name mentioned very often and won't get much air-time.
Clattenburg and Oliver are both given high-profile matches to officiate with relative frequency, and both are likely to finish their careers as generally well-respected referees in the eyes of the media. Basically, they'll follow a similar trajectory to Howard Webb. Just as I don't rate Oliver and Clattenburg, I didn't particularly rate Webb either. The primary reasons for this are that they all enjoy the spotlight too much, and are all very reactionary. The simple fact is, referee's shouldn't enjoy the spotlight and they shouldn't base decisions on crowd or media reaction.
Enjoying the spotlight can help refs assert control over games because they'll be confident in their ability to control the players. It's also extremely detrimental because time and time again we see the same referees jumping at the opportunity to send someone off, award a penalty, or the new favourite, dish out a random booking for diving despite often ignoring a number of other dives. Another, less obvious habit of these refs is to steal the spotlight by doing doing absolutely nothing, whether it's walking twenty yards away from an incident to call a player over, just to give him a talking to, or giving it the old Benitez x-arms to deny a penalty claim. The latter usually depends on how loudly the crowd reacts.
There's clearly a lot of bias that goes into someone's opinion of a ref, whether it's due to a decision he made that had negative consequences for the team they support, or whether the ref has recently made the wrong call on a high-profile decision. That said, I think it's unfair to accuse people have having standards that are too high or that they think all referees are bad. I'll moan a lot about the likes of Oliver and Clattenburg thinking they're the main event in a Manchester derby, but I'm unlikely to ever mention the likes of Anthony Taylor, Craig Pawson and Robert Madley because they just get on with their jobs.
Mike Dean and Martin Atkinson are just as bad as them as well.
True, hence im such a big fan of technology in the game so that people spend less time talking about refs. Its absurd how much time is wasted on people who probably matter the least in the success or failure of teams.
One (probably) incorrect penalty call and this is how you all react. Jeez.
He's by far and away the best referee in the league.
He's by far and away the best referee in the league.
I'll defend Oliver slightly for Sunday - he did 'end up' having been fair to both sides on an overall basis. Though that is with the only reason he doesn't send Smalling off is because of the 'wrong' penalty call in the 1st half.
If you like.. his journey is chaos but he does get to the correct destination.
Still think he's a dreadful referee, mind. But the rules they are asked to enforce, and the way in which they are asked to enforce them are no help in the overall attempt to fairly control a football game.
If you like.. his journey is chaos but he does get to the correct destination.
Still think he's a dreadful referee, mind. But the rules they are asked to enforce, and the way in which they are asked to enforce them are no help in the overall attempt to fairly control a football game.
Don't forget not giving the Aguero penalty in the Capital One Cup Final and not showing Dier a second yellow in the North London derby. Oh and not forgetting Smalling's first booking which suddenly wasn't worthy of a booking when done by Mangala later in the same game.
That is just in the last 3-4 weeks.
For "by far and away the best referee in the league" he does an awfully good impression of a clueless clown.