Well he’s a magician isn’t he? Does a hell of a disappearing act alright.
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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Well he’s a magician isn’t he? Does a hell of a disappearing act alright.
The CL may be more prestigious but you only have to play 7 games after the group stage to win it.
Get a low level team in the 2nd round then you only have to play the best teams 5 times.
In the league Real have to play the best teams 4 times. Barca and Athletico.
Just because all the best teams are in it does not mean you have to play all of them big teams.
My point is that Ronaldo only has to be at his best for 7 games at most, and teams can win it with their best player only at their best for 3 games.
Messi has been great for 8 months and has 1 bad game against Roma. Ronaldo was poor for 4 months and has been great for 4.
It is ridiculous to discredit Messi for one game but then credit Ronaldo for possibly the next four.
No one can argue who has been better for longer this season.
With a good solid team winning the league is piss easy. You play 38 games and you can afford to lose a few, in 38 games the quality of the team really shows an averages out over 38 games.
A team like barca or madrid can get a shock lost against anyone but at the end they're too good in 38 games for anyone else.
Playing a knockout competition is a different animal, all it takes is a lapse of focus and you're suddenly fighting an uphill battle.
True, but read my post above mate. Ron only has to be at his best for 7 games in the CL. But has to be at his best all season to have any chance of Real winning the league.
Messi has been way more consistent.
Well it’s settled.
I guess there should be no exams or tests in school any longer. Homework should be worth more since it’s a longer duration than them.
And what about all those seasons Ronaldo failed and Messi was winning it earlier? This rivalry didn't start from 2014.
If people put their biases and agenda's aside it's clear to see both of their successful periods have come when they were playing in very strong teams. Not saying there is anything wrong with that.
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Basically you're saying Messi is a more consistent player than Ronaldo in 17/18.
Consistency doesn't always mean greatness.
Messi is the better footballer.
Ronaldo is the better big game player.
That is probably a fair assessment.
Ronaldo is the better big game player.
That is probably a fair assessment.
Everyone always degraded Ronaldo so it’s fair Messi deserves it as well. From 2012-2018, Lionel Messi only has one good UCL campaign. That’s unacceptable and deserves criticism. You can’t keep performing well in La Liga but look like a different player in Europe and expect a free pass just because your name isn’t Ronaldo.
I didn't say he disappear in every game, but 4 QF exits in 5 seasons suggest he's not doing much, even if he occasionally performs in the L16 games.
True but showing up in big games does not always mean greatness either.
Ronaldo has shown up more than Messi in the last 2/3 years of the CL but Messi did more than Ronaldo before that.
I would say Messi is the more talented footballer, being the most talented ever.
That's true if he only does it in cl. The same ronaldo also plays week in week out with considerable goals churned.
The way you put it is as if madrid only plays 7 games a year. Look at their appereances this season, the numbers are comparable.
Well that seems all a bit childish and a waste of time.
Both are great players, who's better comes down to personal preference.
This abomination of a thread is 216 pages long and no one is likely to change their mind.
He has disappeared according to you because the only way a player performs well for you is if he scores goals or/and his team goes through. We won't come to an agreement because I simply have a fundamentally different perspective on football than you and this is why I rate Messi higher (not because I am in some cult or anything like you imply). I never really understood the fuss around pure goal scorers and always rated creators higher. Messi does both and when he had a brillant team around him was the indisputed best player in the world.
That's also why Ronaldo can win as many CLs as he wants. As long as he plays the way he plays (and he is most likely not going to change this style anymore) I won't consider him the greater regardless of what a force in the box he is. All this obsession with titles is ridiculous, I think. Messi was lucky to be playing in the best team in the world when he was younger and Cristiano is lucky now because he is playing in it for the last four years. In the end, he may very well end up with more CL titles because he played longer for an absolute top team. Or Barca gets their shit together, turns it around and Messi ends up with more titles. In the end, it won't matter for me. I've seen what Messi is capable of and what Cristiano is and for me it is clear who is the better player.
Call it whatever you want.
Fact of the matter is at the end of the day it’s a 2way road and now Messi homers get to taste it. Mostly because they think Messi is perfect and nothing is ever his fault. Hint hint: wrong & wrong.
What's a homer?
That tweet doesn’t do anything. Because we can argue that Xavi is better than them both because he has won far more than either. And has 3 international trophies also.
I was talking about this season. Because Ronaldo was very poor from August to the end of December.
Has he really though? I think we can agree 09-11 Messi had better team mates, which Ronaldo has already more than made up for in the last few years.
12 & 13 they both failed to make the final.
Real Madrid - 2012 lost to Bayern on penalties.
Barcelona -2012 went out to Chelsea with Messi missing a penalty
Real Madrid - 2013, lost out by 1 goal to Dortmund
Barcelona - 2013, DESTROYED 7-0 on agg by Bayern
Someone who favours one so much they have tunnel vision, can’t see anything other than what they deem right, and turn a blind eye to anything that goes against their narrative.
Well, the poll has gone from 72-28 to 59-41 in the space of a few weeks.
People do change their minds.
You can't change your vote in the poll, there have been voting spikes after the recent CL games which explains the changes.
Plenty of those on both sides though.
Ahh, so it's gone completely towards Ronaldo in recent weeks... makes sense...
Ronaldo has had better team mates the last few years though, we can’t really use that excuse.
Bayern destroyed Barca 7-0 in 2013. If Barca had such a better team than this Real side then how the hell did they have such a heavy defeat. This Real team are no slouches.
The problem is that Messi hasn't created much either in these big CL games, it's not just about the lack of goals. Obviously he shows up in big games too but for the last couple of years he hasn't been doing it nearly enough in the Champions League and he deserves that criticism.
He was bad yesterday, against PSG away last season he was geniunely awful, against Atletico in the past he's been nullified and there are more examples of it. It happens to everyone but for a player of his caliber it shouldn't happen this often.
It obviously has with the change in %, what's that got to do with the original point?
I'm saying 09 & 11 are balanced with 16 & 17 in terms of the better team-mates argument.
Ronaldo has still out-performed Messi if you look at everything else excluding those 4 seasons.
I think we need a poll where you can change your votes.
Some people do change their minds, not many.
Why are Barca walking the league without Xavi / Iniesta then? Could it be, because of Messi? Messi is less reliant on others because of his playing style. That's not a praise for him or a criticism of Ronaldo, it's simply evident.
I actually agree with you that Ronaldo is more successful than Messi, but your ridiculous double standardsy way of debating the point makes it utterly impossible to side with you. Even if I accepted Ronaldo as my lord and savior and the 2nd coming of Christ, I would still argue against you.
We do appreciate both. It’s the certain Messi Fans on here that think Ronaldo doesn’t even compare or he falls in the top 10 footballers at best.
Messi one’s are far more deluded.
Like I said, CR7 has carried his weight even in the past when Madrid have failed and got his share of blame. Barca fail and Messi doesn’t carry his weight / no shows and it’s fine? Yea, no.
I've pointed out a few times that Messi has been more consistent in the 17/18 La Liga season.
Exactly this. I've not seen a single person on the Ronaldo side claim Messi doesn't make the top 10 or he's not as good as Rivaldo or Ronaldinho or other ludicrous statements like that.
The Messi brigade, however, has regularly said those things about Ronaldo.
It's silly to blame one player for a loss in a team game the same way it is silly to attribute a win solely to one single player. Whoever does that has a very limited understanding of football.
I've been following this forum for a couple of years and I just have to say what's on my mind.
It's 2018 and people are still debating about thisIt's absolutely hilarious. Especially this Cal? guy. If you have ever kicked a football you can clearly see who the better player is. A player who is 95% reliant on the service he gets from his teammates vs a player who scores as much while being also the best passer and dribbler in the world and playing basically as a midfielder. If you think Cristiano is better, you either haven't watched them play regularly or you don't understand a single thing about football. Why are players like Maradona and Cruyff regarded as much better players than Gerd Muller?
Everyone are laughing at Messi for bottling a 4-1 lead against Roma. If Cristiano had played instead of Messi, he probably wouldn't have even touched the ball. I'm not saying that Messi played well though. But the point is that Cristiano is absolutely useless nowadays if his team isn't able to create chances for him.
Comparing these two is like comparing which amount of money is more; 100 euros or 80 euros.
Claiming Cristiano is the GOAT is so delusional that I'm not even going to say anything about that.
Well, I guess I'm part of the 'Messi brigade' now.
Only the bold sums up the Messi fanatics in this thread and across. They’re not willing to discuss results but it’s just “oh Messi is better because we know about football”
If anything the joke is on you because you think dribbling past players and play making are the only factors to consider when judging a players greatness.
Ronaldo compared to muller again. I guess the likes of rio and saf don’t know shit about footie
Then I misread. I thought you were saying you enjoyed watching Messi, but weren't bothered to watch Ronaldo. Hard to see how you'd want to watch anyone anywhere if your standards are that finicky.
So if it’s silly to blame Messi for the loss can we say Messi is reliant on a good midfield ? (I don’t believe this but I’m responding to the “Ronaldo just relies on service” comments )
That's been done since well before either of them was born.
The sheer number of people who claim Maradona won WC86 on his own.
When you dominate the competition as much as Ronaldo did in CL 2017, there will be claims that the win was solely down to a player.
Okay but I thought Messi didn’t rely on chances created for him and made his own chances so why should his team matter? I get it that ronaldo is just crespo but Messi has it all right?
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