Messi retires from Argentina.

barros said:
Did you watch the 86 WC? Maradona was a brilliant player and he was a true leader unlike Messi and the other failed free kicker taker.
Maradona was and still is the best player ever, he dragged his team, like Messi he had good players around him but the difference was Maradona leading them.
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I was too young to see that WC (also not my post, just wanted to share it here)

I think you're missing the point. Maradona was surrounded with good players but he never had to do it alone. No one can do it alone. May I remind you that in the 86 Final, he wasn't even the best player. Hell, when was the last time in a tournament that someone other than Messi scored 4 goals for Argentina?

Messi is not faultless, but this Argie side is getting overrated because people want to push this 'Messi is not a leader/has no balls' narrative. They have a ton of star power up front, but Sergio fecking Romero is their GK, 3/5 of their defense is Romero, Rojo and Funes Mori, and their CM is in shambles, not just compared to world class sides but in general.

About the leadership thing, eh, I don't want to speak on it as I was too young for Maradona's time to compare. However, I do believe that it's easier to be a leader when you're surrounded with people who do their jobs.

Dumbstar said:
Ah poor old Messi. If only he'd been alive during Maradona's time and had great players around him like the world class squad containing, erm, erm, can't think of a defender's name, but you know, that argie. And Valdano, of course, the fat Ronaldo of his day. If Maradona was young now with shit players around him like Macherano, Godin, Higuain, Aguero then of course Maradona would have failed epicly worse than Messi. Epicly!

Poor old Messi. No shame in retiring because you can't win. Sign of a true world class champion.
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That you can't name any of their defenders speak more about your lack of football knowledge more than anything else. It's absurd to think a defense like that wasn't rock solid.

What an absolutely absurd post. Living up to your name I see.
 
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CLARiiON said:
Everyone including my dog has a different definiton of this word. People say he's not good for NT, now when he gives the chance to other players to do what he failed, they are again unhappy. If people like you think that he's isn't good for Argentina, then you guys should be happy that he won't play for them now. I think he couldn't care less what anyone thinks about him at this stage.
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He's an extremely talented player that i enjoy watching and its a shame he retired from the national team at such a young age. Perhaps I didn't explain that properly.
 
I'm not willing to debate Messi's talent - because for me he is the most talented I have ever seen. I also am not willing to debate where he stands on any all- time list.

However, his immature reaction to a difficult defeat, makes me wonder about his true make up. As a true leader, as one of the greatest ever, my expectation for him would have been one of class and a promise to the Argentinian people and teammates that he will continue to give his all for the shirt, no matter how difficult of a task. He had an opportunity to unite the squad and country, but went to other direction.

The fact that anyone at his level can throw in the towel makes me question his true grit and character. The talent is right there, in front of everyone to see and he has amazed each and every one of us with his skills on the pitch. But the one quality that all of the GOATS have/had is one of relentless pursuit, especially during trying times. I don't see this in Messi - he has never really had to overcome any truly difficult obstacles in his career, bar maybe his growth issues. He has been in the greatest academy, surrounded by some of the greatest players, within one of the biggest clubs since he was 13.

All that said - I watch in awe nearly every time I see him play. But that is only part of the equation when judging the true royalty in sport.

I hope he comes back and I think he will - but he will never be able to live down what has occurred this week. For me, he has tarnished his legacy.

One point to his credit - none of us know what it is like to have the weight of an entire country on our shoulders - especially a country we left at 13 years old that we may not necessarily identify with any longer.
 
MounchesterUtd said:
They have a ton of star power up front, but Sergio fecking Romero is their GK, 3/5 of their defense is Romero, Rojo and Funes Mori
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A bit unfair when they didn't even score a goal in 3 finals. Defenders did their job by not conceding in 2 Copa finals and only a brilliant goal from Gotze prevented them from another clean sheet in WC final. For all practical purposes, players like Romero and Rojo did well throughout the 3 tournaments while attackers Higuain, Aguero let them down. Romero even saved the first penalty on Sunday giving heavy advantage to Argentina but they didn't make full use of it.
 
All of this its a shame comments are strange cause he doesn't do all that much at these big international tournaments anyways, so won't be much of a big miss. Winning the WC isn't the blemish on his CV, its performing at a much lower level for his national team than he does for his club side. Argentina have actually done decently well in recent times but we can't act like he's played to the sort of standards that he should be at those tournaments.
 
IFC 1905 said:
Well, the members of the FA made everything wrong until the point that Messi exploded and said that they are a disaster. The organization was just too bad. When Messi exploded because their flight was delayed, the FA released a statement against what he said. There are a lot of issues that the world doesn't know. For example, Martino's salary is delayed, the last time he got paid was like 4 months ago.

And then the players left him alone too. Aguero, Higuain, Di Maria...they were a shadow and watching Messi trying to run against 4 guys in front of him, starting in the midfield, just broke our heart. Even the anti-Messi guys I know said he played with two balls yesterday.
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About Di Maria, can't we say he was in a bad shape (injured in the previous 2 weeks and loss of his grand-mother) ?

Maybe, the defensive-minded players should have further protected him.

I do remember a TV report about Zidane & the WC 2006: Vieira said 'It's always hard to see Zidane receiving blows but it's part of my job with Makélélé to bring him justice'
 
I still can't believe I'm reading the "Messi needs Iniesta/Xavi to perform" lines being peddled. After all these years. :lol:

Anyhow, hopefully he's back for the 2018 WC.
 
I personally think it's not the end of him on the international scene. Seems like a snap decision. It would be a huge shame for a player of the caliber of Messi to not go out after a World Cup. That's the big stage, regardless of result. I reckon he might take a little break and will be back. Suspicion is he is physically not right.
 
Downcast said:
About Di Maria, can't we say he was in a bad shape (injured in the previous 2 weeks and loss of his grand-mother) ?

Maybe, the defensive-minded players should have further protected him.

I do remember a TV report about Zidane & the WC 2006: Vieira said 'It's always hard to see Zidane receiving blows but it's part of my job with Makélélé to bring him justice'
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You can say that, but it has been happening in all the decisive instances. In 2014 against Belgium, in 2015 in the final itself, and now in the fisrt game or second game....people get tired of that.
 
In a nutshell

CmCDi69WEAAn-fO.jpg:large
 
IFC 1905 said:
You can say that, but it has been happening in all the decisive instances. In 2014 against Belgium, in 2015 in the final itself, and now in the fisrt game or second game....people get tired of that.
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Against City (1st & 2nd leg) with PSG...

You're right
 
IFC 1905 said:
Well, the members of the FA made everything wrong until the point that Messi exploded and said that they are a disaster. The organization was just too bad. When Messi exploded because their flight was delayed, the FA released a statement against what he said. There are a lot of issues that the world doesn't know. For example, Martino's salary is delayed, the last time he got paid was like 4 months ago.

And then the players left him alone too. Aguero, Higuain, Di Maria...they were a shadow and watching Messi trying to run against 4 guys in front of him, starting in the midfield, just broke our heart. Even the anti-Messi guys I know said he played with two balls yesterday.
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You're not really painting a better picture. Team mates playing poorly doesn't matter. The manager's wages isn't his business. If this is however some kind of publicity stunt in order for the FA to get their affairs in orders there are better ways than announcing your retirement straight after the game.
 
MounchesterUtd said:
Seedorf is one of my favorite players ever, but he was never absolutely crucial to his team's UCL successes. Messi was in 3 out of the 4 he won. This is like saying Horry > Jordan or Gotze > Messi (because of the WC).
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He's won 3 CL's, no? I don't recall him being in the final in 06. I can't remember him at all in 06 tbh.
 
Argentina don't deserve him

Lets see how well they do without him
 
Ish said:
I still can't believe I'm reading the "Messi needs Iniesta/Xavi to perform" lines being peddled. After all these years. :lol:

Anyhow, hopefully he's back for the 2018 WC.
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It's madness. He's come terribly close to winning 4 big international trophies. It will mean nothing to him as like all winners it's the winning that matters. But with only a little more luck it could have well been a very very different story for him in terms of big international trophies and it's not as if he played badly in the last three finals (only ones I remember tbh) at all.
 
Dumbstar said:
Ah poor old Messi. If only he'd been alive during Maradona's time and had great players around him like the world class squad containing, erm, erm, can't think of a defender's name, but you know, that argie. And Valdano, of course, the fat Ronaldo of his day. If Maradona was young now with shit players around him like Macherano, Godin, Higuain, Aguero then of course Maradona would have failed epicly worse than Messi. Epicly!
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Were you talking about Ruggeri and Passarella?
 
amolbhatia50k said:
It's madness. He's come terribly close to winning 4 big international trophies. It will mean nothing to him as like all winners it's the winning that matters. But with only a little more luck it could have well been a very very different story for him in terms of big international trophies and it's not as if he played badly in the last three finals (only ones I remember tbh) at all.
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Aye amol. You couldn't make it up. The "he's done nothing for Argentina" & "he can't perform without Xavi/Iniesta" lines will stay with him forever, in the eyes of some I guess.
 
MounchesterUtd said:
That you can't name any of their defenders speak more about your lack of football knowledge more than anything else. It's absurd to think a defense like that wasn't rock solid.

What an absolutely absurd post. Living up to your name I see.
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I apologise if you are not English and my irony in the post regarding not being to name the defenders whooshed above giving you a slight buzzing sensation. :)
 
Ban said:
:lol:
This is what I was talking about in my post.

Don't you guys get tired of the same old ridiculous statements.
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It's easy to play devil's advocate in here, it's a cafe tradition that every single player thread has one or more persons saying that he did it against nothing opposition.

The fact that he did something against Venezuela, a country that doesn't have any hot water or effective sanitation system just goes to show the straws people are clutching.

All players can only beat what is out in front of them. Messi is a fantastic player, had he not played for barca, maybe he wouldn't have done as well.
 
BigTimeCharlie said:
It's easy to play devil's advocate in here, it's a cafe tradition that every single player thread has one or more persons saying that he did it against nothing opposition.

The fact that he did something against Venezuela, a country that doesn't have any hot water or effective sanitation system just goes to show the straws people are clutching.

All players can only beat what is out in front of them. Messi is a fantastic player, had he not played for barca, maybe he wouldn't have done as well.
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Yeah. I guess Messi should pick his own opponents so everybody can be satisfied......
 
No way Messi retires... If he does, his reputation would take a huge hit.

That being said, I don't see them winning in 2018. In 2014, ARgentina waslucky to be on the weaker side of the bracket, which is why they made it to the finals imo. Also, Messi should not be captain,just like ronaldo and neymar. It should of been mascherano...
 
CLARiiON said:
Not really, if you include WC finals as well. You will need just 3 years more (considering last Copa was in 2015).
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And comparing Argentina with Portugal when they have world class players and even without Messi they still would win, Portugal sometimes would be better without Ronaldo but our striker is Eder .... fecking Eder
 
VanGaalEra said:
Are you sure Messi won 06? He wasn't involved in the final at all?
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He was injured but played 6 Champions League games during this season. So, he has contributed to this success.

That is why, Ludovic Giuly - on the right wing - played the SFs & final
 
The common misconception is people look at the Argentinian forwards names and think that they must be good enough to win things. The truth is, none of those forward names have had a single good tournament in Messi's career. Aguerro has never been decisive, Higuain keeps missing guilt edge chances in the finals.

Im sure he wont retire, he will be back for the world cup.
 
Why do they play Higuain after he fails continously during final matches? He's a good forward, but just never plays during finals. Are these coaches idiots? Sometimes when such people make these decisions, I doubt how they actually get the job.
 
RedStarUnited said:
The common misconception is people look at the Argentinian forwards names and think that they must be good enough to win things. The truth is, none of those forward names have had a single good tournament in Messi's career. Aguerro has never been decisive, Higuain keeps missing guilt edge chances in the finals.

Im sure he wont retire, he will be back for the world cup.
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IFC 1905 said:
There were public polls today. 85% of the people asked, want Higuain out. 80% want Aguero out. 75% Want Martino out. 80% Want Messi to stay.

I think they are done. All of them bar Messi & Mascherano. We need to focus on the new guys that are coming.
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That's how good our incredible strikers are, nobody wants them in the team lol.


PS: I heard Maradona retired from 1982+ until getting near to the 1986 WC, I hope Leo does the same.



But well guys, the entire country is begging Messi to comeback. The president called him when he just arrived. And there's gonna be a movement next saturday, at the Buenos Aires obelisk. Ex players and all kind of famous personalities are sending their messages. I bet the Pope called him too.
 
VanGaalEra said:
He's won 3 CL's, no? I don't recall him being in the final in 06. I can't remember him at all in 06 tbh.
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VanGaalEra said:
Are you sure Messi won 06? He wasn't involved in the final at all?
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Downcast said:
He was injured but played 6 Champions League games during this season. So, he has contributed to this success.

That is why, Ludovic Giuly - on the right wing - played the SFs & final
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This is true, although last I read about it, Messi doesn't even look at his medal from '06 anymore.

MichaelKorleone said:
A bit unfair when they didn't even score a goal in 3 finals. Defenders did their job by not conceding in 2 Copa finals and only a brilliant goal from Gotze prevented them from another clean sheet in WC final. For all practical purposes, players like Romero and Rojo did well throughout the 3 tournaments while attackers Higuain, Aguero let them down. Romero even saved the first penalty on Sunday giving heavy advantage to Argentina but they didn't make full use of it.
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You're right. They did allow only one goal in 3 finals, but I think it's more due to Germany and Chile not taking enough risks, in Chile's case in 2016 they went super defensive and was content with going to pens IMO. Every time I watch this generation of Argentina defend, they look like they'll allow a goal every time their opponent gets the ball over the halfway line.
 
I'm mixed. Part of me thinks he's a quitter since Argentina has so much more quality than the rest of South American teams (in attack at least - and in the big games, that's where they fail). Another part knows all the drama their FA and fans are doing and understand why he doesn't want to be a part of that.
 
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