McTominay (Out) | announced - signed for Napoli

Status
Not open for further replies.
SER19 said:
Selling McTominay, assuming we sign ugarte, leave us with

Casemiro, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Bruno. (Eriksen?)

It's a little bit light I think. Theres a good squad planning succession there. Eg Casemiro out next summer and replaced with a younger target, then a new player, mainoo, ugarte, mount, bruno is a good age profile.

But 5 bodies for the middle runs a risk, and McTominay does offer something a bit different. I think he's a useful squad player. I don't know enough about Collyer but maybe he's good enough to step into a squad role? I would have wanted Ugarte without McTominay leaving
Click to expand...
If we sign Rabiot on free after Ugarte hypothetically, I think that completes our midfield depth quite nicely and a big improvement on where it was last year.
 
Idxomer said:
He started 27 games last season with all the injuries and before signings like Zirkzee. If he stays, he will get around 15 starts in all competitions like he did in 22/23.
Click to expand...
We'll have more games this season, as we'll go decently far in the Europa
 
DarkXaero said:
If we sign Rabiot on free after Ugarte hypothetically, I think that completes our midfield depth quite nicely and a big improvement on where it was last year.
Click to expand...

Agreed. That would be very good business. McTominay is not a player we will mourn losing if replaced, but purely numbers wise I think we need 6 good standard players for 3 midfields positions.
 
DarkXaero said:
If we sign Rabiot on free after Ugarte hypothetically, I think that completes our midfield depth quite nicely and a big improvement on where it was last year.
Click to expand...

The lack of interest should be red flag to him that his demands need lowering if he wants a club
 
We shouldn't let him go unless it's a guaranteed 25m minimum. They can keep the add ons for some other schmuck.
 
croadyman said:
Care to throw a name forward for more expensive?
Click to expand...
lord knows - I don't think we're going for a bigger name DM than Ugarte. I think selling McT would help us structure a similar overall offer that's more attractive to PSG.
 
VP89 said:
This only makes sense if the other midfielder we go for is more expensive than Ugarte.

I think selling McT can help us finance Ugarte, perhaps with the same or similar original fee but with an ability to frontload the payment terms and push it over the line.
Click to expand...
Yeah possibly to improve the payment structure but I doubt we want to go any higher than 42M which is already more than fair. The other midfielder I'm referring to is on top of Ugarte. Personally think we'd do well to bring in a competent, more experienced 8 for Mainoo to share minutes and learn from. Based on our tactics during preseason and against Fulham, we'd do well to bring in a B2B midfielder, which is why I like Rabiot's profile.
 
Vault Dweller said:
Read that earlier, that they could be waiting until Osimhen is confirmed as leaving then using that money for McT. Makes sense, then gets us the £25 million for him that United have been asking for.
Click to expand...
I mean I know he had a problematic season last season but the year before he was seen as a god by Neapolitans when they won the Scudetto.

Imagine seeing your star striker being replaced by Scott McTominay.

Christ.
 
VP89 said:
Heh, bidding war? We should ask for 40m
Just kidding
Click to expand...
Show them prices for Rice and Caicedo. We can even show them what they are rumoured to have paid for Smith Rowe. Nothing to talk about. If they want McTominay they need to look what other central midfielders went for.
 
Pronewbie said:
Yeah possibly to improve the payment structure but I doubt we want to go any higher than 42M which is already more than fair. The other midfielder I'm referring to is on top of Ugarte. Personally think we'd do well to bring in a competent, more experienced 8 for Mainoo to share minutes and learn from. Based on our tactics during preseason and against Fulham, we'd do well to bring in a B2B midfielder, which is why I like Rabiot's profile.
Click to expand...

Yeah I like his profile too but as already said here it looks very much like his demands are putting potential clubs off signing him. So he either waits for Saudi clubs to come in (Toney could affect that now) or he needs to ask for lower salary.
 
Last edited:
SER19 said:
Selling McTominay, assuming we sign ugarte, leave us with

Casemiro, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Bruno. (Eriksen?)

It's a little bit light I think. Theres a good squad planning succession there. Eg Casemiro out next summer and replaced with a younger target, then a new player, mainoo, ugarte, mount, bruno is a good age profile.

But 5 bodies for the middle runs a risk, and McTominay does offer something a bit different. I think he's a useful squad player. I don't know enough about Collyer but maybe he's good enough to step into a squad role? I would have wanted Ugarte without McTominay leaving
Click to expand...
Collyer is loved and well get games though I would like us to get a player similar to Mainoo in.
 
VP89 said:
lord knows - I don't think we're going for a bigger name DM than Ugarte. I think selling McT would help us structure a similar overall offer that's more attractive to PSG.
Click to expand...

Yeah would definitely help a better payment structure
 
croadyman said:
Yeah I like his profile too but as already said here it looks very much like his demands are putting potential clubs off signing him. So he either waits for Saudi clubs to come in (Toney could affect that now) or he needs to ask for lower salary.
Click to expand...
I should have been clearer. I meant a midfielder of Rabiot's B2B profile. Doesn't have to be him. However if our plan is to bring in someone like Amrabat instead than I'd rather not sell McT. The replacement needs to be an upgrade.
 
Pronewbie said:
I should have been clearer. I meant a midfielder of Rabiot's B2B profile. Doesn't have to be him. However if our plan is to bring in someone like Amrabat instead than I'd rather not sell McT. The replacement needs to be an upgrade.
Click to expand...

Trying to think who else has that B2B profile and is available for reasonable price, what about Berge/Amrabat or are their profiles too similar to Ugarte and Casemiro.
 
croadyman said:
Trying to think who else has that B2B profile and is available for reasonable price, what about Berge/Amrabat or are their profiles too similar to Ugarte and Casemiro.
Click to expand...
I'm with you on this. I think it's a shame we were only linked with Rabiot and Fofana for CM. Fofana was my favourite for a reasonably priced CM to take some of the load off Mainoo, but I guess he went with Milan because they showed a stronger interest.

It may well be that the CM is only possible if we make space in the squad for one, with McTominay or Eriksen leaving. I think McTominay is a dead cert to leave now. So it will probably be Rabiot that joins. I can't say I'm too sure about that with Rabiot being left footed, how well would it work to reduce the dependency on Mainoo?

Time will tell who were after, if and when we sell.
 
Overhaul FC said:
I'm with you on this. I think it's a shame we were only linked with Rabiot and Fofana for CM. Fofana was my favourite for a reasonably priced CM to take some of the load off Mainoo, but I guess he went with Milan because they showed a stronger interest.

It may well be that the CM is only possible if we make space in the squad for one, with McTominay or Eriksen leaving. I think McTominay is a dead cert to leave now. So it will probably be Rabiot that joins. I can't say I'm too sure about that with Rabiot being left footed, how well would it work to reduce the dependency on Mainoo?

Time will tell who were after, if and when we sell.
Click to expand...

Yeah hopefully this is the week where we get proper movement on outgoings such as Pellistri, McTominay, Hannibal and Eriksen too ideally. My gut feeling is that Sancho will drag on until the final days of window but hopefully wrong
 
simonhch said:
Well I meant in all comps for a start. Which is generally how I assess a players overall contribution. Not just in the league. And also factoring in him playing the majority of games as a starter, not as a sub. So I think it’s a fairly reasonable assessment to say that in a team where he was playing as a box to box with a reasonable amount of freedom (which was a criteria mentioned specifically because that’s his natural game), and playing regular games as a starter, for a mid table club, he could definitely be a 7-10 goals a season from midfield player. Even the attempt to put cold water on that doesn’t assuage me from how reasonable that statement is.

Last season he scored 10 goals in all comps but only played 30 games worth of 90 mins. He made 43 appearances but only averaged 63 minutes per game on the field. 1 in 4 for appearances, 1 in 3 per 90. The season before where he had a much lower output, it was 3 goals in just 18 games worth of 90 mins. So 1 in 6. Playing 42 full games a season across all comps, even at that lowest output of the season before last is an average of 7 goals across all comps. Going by last season, across 42 full games, it would average 14 goals for the season. Obviously it’s hard and erroneous to some degree to average things out like that, but as stats were brought up, I’ll just extrapolate them out further for context.
Click to expand...
Moving the discussion here so we don’t clutter up the transfer thread.

Just look at all comps then.

22/23 he scored 3 in all competitions.
21/22 he scored 2 in all competitions.

So was last season’s haul what we should expect if he goes to a different team or should we expect something more in line with the two seasons prior to that? Assuming the former seems no more reasonable than assuming the latter when you actually look at the evidence across multiple seasons.

You’ve gone from claiming he’s got a knack and is good for 7-10 goals per season to saying he could get that if all the necessary elements at a hypothetical new club line up. Sure, maybe. Maybe not.
 
Zumbi said:
Moving the discussion here so we don’t clutter up the transfer thread.

Just look at all comps then.

22/23 he scored 3 in all competitions.
21/22 he scored 2 in all competitions.

So was last season’s haul what we should expect if he goes to a different team or should we expect something more in line with the two seasons prior to that? Assuming the former seems no more reasonable than assuming the latter when you actually look at the evidence across multiple seasons.

You’ve gone from claiming he’s got a knack and is good for 7-10 goals per season to saying he could get that if all the necessary elements at a hypothetical new club line up. Sure, maybe. Maybe not.
Click to expand...
I think I pretty much put those data points into context. 3 goals but only 18 ninety minute appearances. Which gave him a ratio of 1 in 6.
 
FrankWhite said:
Collyer is loved and well get games though I would like us to get a player similar to Mainoo in.
Click to expand...
I don't understand why we aren't interested in Angel Gomes for Mainoo.

With Carsley in charge for the next England matches....Gomes has a chance to be in the squad (unless his head injury is really bad).
 
Annihilate Now! said:
As in you feel like we should have accepted Fulham's £20m offer already?
Click to expand...

As in "accept any fee".

Maguire and McTominay are still our players and get games for us. Both are shining examples for our mediocrity. The day both leave, we'll be better off.
 
Not surprised there is more traction to this now. I couldn’t see us selling to them before we played them. If we can get 25m or close enough then it works for all parties. Decent player, solid character but time to move on. Hopefully, this sale will enable us to bring Ugarte in.
 
simonhch said:
I think I pretty much put those data points into context. 3 goals but only 18 ninety minute appearances. Which gave him a ratio of 1 in 6.
Click to expand...

And the season before that he got 2 in 33 ninety minute appearances. So a ratio of 1 in 16.

Even based just on his better seasons, your calculations still seem fanciful. For a start, I'm a little baffled how you made the leap to him playing 42 full games worth of minutes across a season in all comps for a hypothetical future club - he's never come close to that many club minutes in a season in his whole career. Sure, he may start more for a mid table club, but that doesn't mean he'd be starting and playing 90 every match, and any lower table club would almost certainly have fewer games to play over the course of the season anyway. For context, in the 22-23 season there wasn't a single PL player that managed to play that many minutes in all competitions.

I'm also not sure how sound the assumption is that any player's scoring rate will be maintained when moving to a different club, let alone a lower table club.

So it seems like your "reasonable assessment" is actually based on a variety of different best case scenarios coming together. Which doesn't seem especially reasonable to me.
 
BabySinclair said:
I don't understand why we aren't interested in Angel Gomes for Mainoo.

With Carsley in charge for the next England matches....Gomes has a chance to be in the squad (unless his head injury is really bad).
Click to expand...
How has he developed since leaving?
 
McTominay symbolises everything that's been wrong at United for the last decade. Young talent initially with big hopes, but talent wise, ultimately ends up stagnating becoming a mediocre player. But we held onto him for years longer than we should have. Like Martial, Fred, Lindelof...Rashford has become another one.

We should have got rid of him a few seasons ago.
 
Thank heavens Fulham are back for him. Get this done for 20-25M please.

McT out, Ugarte in is how I see this playing out. Unless Eriksen leaves, I dont see anymore incomings

CM : Casemiro, Mainoo, Ugarte, Mount, Eriksen, Collyer
AM : Bruno, Mount

Is what I see as our options. Ofcourse Mount can play both as #8 or #10.
 
simonhch said:
I think I pretty much put those data points into context. 3 goals but only 18 ninety minute appearances. Which gave him a ratio of 1 in 6.
Click to expand...
He offers feck all on the pitch anytime we play, wow he got a few goals one season and we finished eight! That's amazing! Note the sarcasm. He's just not good enough if we want to get back to the top, even as a squad player.
He's be okay signing for a mid table club.
 
Fugeeface said:
As in "accept any fee".

Maguire and McTominay are still our players and get games for us. Both are shining examples for our mediocrity. The day both leave, we'll be better off.
Click to expand...

How is that helpful though? We're trying to build a new culture where a) clubs can't rinse us and b) clubs can't take the piss ... so how is selling a decent asset for "any fee" good business sense?

Nevermind the fact that he represents pure profit from a PSR perspective so it's in our best interest to get as much as possible... £20m does feck all for us in the market anyway.
 
Zumbi said:
Moving the discussion here so we don’t clutter up the transfer thread.

Just look at all comps then.

22/23 he scored 3 in all competitions.
21/22 he scored 2 in all competitions.

So was last season’s haul what we should expect if he goes to a different team or should we expect something more in line with the two seasons prior to that? Assuming the former seems no more reasonable than assuming the latter when you actually look at the evidence across multiple seasons.

You’ve gone from claiming he’s got a knack and is good for 7-10 goals per season to saying he could get that if all the necessary elements at a hypothetical new club line up. Sure, maybe. Maybe not.
Click to expand...
Depends what position he plays. In the two seasons you named he mostly played as a #6. Last season he played as a #10. In the seasons he was a box-to-box #8 he scored 5-7.

I don't rate McTominay, and I actually think his all-round game is even worse when playing as a #10 than it was when he played deeper. However, the one thing I would be fairly confident in is that if he's played as a #10 he will score a decent amount of goals.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
How is that helpful though? We're trying to build a new culture where a) clubs can't rinse us and b) clubs can't take the piss ... so how is selling a decent asset for "any fee" good business sense?

Nevermind the fact that he represents pure profit from a PSR perspective so it's in our best interest to get as much as possible... £20m does feck all for us in the market anyway.
Click to expand...

Dead right man.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.