Indeed. Absolutely shocking performance.
I'd like to see him next to Yoro though.
4
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 12
- Clean sheets
- 5
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 2
Indeed. Absolutely shocking performance.
I'd like to see him next to Yoro though.
It's very hard to beat a striker like Samu physically, he didn't have a great game, but it's hard to hold that against him. He would be a problem for basically any CB in the world.
So fecking slow.
We did sign a wide defender in Yoro. It's not like the club ignored it, but he is young and will need time to adapt. I can see De Ligt at LCB and Yoro at RCB before the end of the season. The club needed to replace someone with Maguire's profile now because he is likely to be let go at the end of the season. They are obviously going to rebuild the squad step by step and I get a sense, they are not fully convinced by Martinez. Because I agree with you on one sense, if they felt Martinez is a lock as a starter, you don't target De Ligt as his ideal CB partner. With Maguire, Lindelof and Evans gone at end of the season, we are likely to target another young, athletic CB good at defending in wide spaces, probably Branthwaite again unless he signs a new contract at Everton. Martinez will revert to being a 3rd CB rotation and LB option.
I mostly agree, however, Yoro is 18 years old and he's probably going to be making mistakes, having bad games, etc. whereas Branthwaite would've been ready to come in and play 50 games a season and probably be reliable for the next 1-2 seasons.
Also, Maguire turning 32 soon is obviously not ideal, but has he shown any signs of physical decline so far? I'm not convinced he has. A Maguire replacement could've waited for a few more years with him being first choice next to a wide defender, unless it's ten Hag who, for some reason, didn't want to "salvage" him, which is a stupid decision from his part. Now we have the younger Maguire type in de Ligt for the long-term, but still need a wide defender unless Yoro defies expectations and is a consistent reliable performer from day 1 onwards.
I do think we will be in for a left-footed wide defender, though, and I agree that Branthwaite will probably be our main target for the position next summer. And that will probably mean Martínez pushed to LB, especially under a new manager.
Maguire with pace? I really don't think that's an accurate assessment of Branthwaite, but I hope you know that Maguire with pace would be one of the greatest defenders of all time?
I don't think Branthwaite would be detrimental to our game when we have the ball either, if that's what you're hinting at. And neither is Maguire.
Nearly spat my coffee out.
What is it that he would be still lacking if he had blistering pace? Absolutely nothing
Christ, was he dire at Juve too?
De Ligt is a great player. Let’s see how he gets on when we have a competent manager. No-one looks good for United under Ten Egg.
What do you base his greatness on?
The Caf and wild agendas
No, I don't think my opinions are very popular on here. It's not a "caf agenda". It rather feels like fighting a horde of NPCs on a daily basis, who form their opinions based on what the likes of Mark Goldbridge say, and what social media lets them think.
You’re being silly
I made the mistake of quoting a verbatum so to speak. That include how Maltese people (most of whom are well versed in both the EPL and the Serie A) talk to one another which might sound weird to the average guy. Let me explain it better
If you consider being world class as a spectrum then there are three main categories in it. There is the upper end of it ie someone who was almost born with superb talent, superb physical attributes and top class maturity/composure from the start. Maldini was like that. At age 17 he would play with the same level of composure of an experienced WC CB. Then there's the mid tier WC player ie someone with the right talent and the right attitude but who still had to work on certain areas of his game before becoming WC. The first person to come to mind is Keane but most WC players are like that (Scholes, Beckham, Gerrard, Modric etc). Then there is the lower end of WC ie players who may have certain deficiencies in their game (usually technical) but who are able to bridge that with an almost stellar attitude. Chiellini and Gattuso are part of that group and in my opinion Gaz came close but was 'betrayed' by his smaller built. Thus the term he's not a Chiellini let alone a Maldini suddenly makes sense.
You claim that De Ligt is the 4th highest paid CB in the league. I haven't checked that stat TBH. If its the case then considering how rich the EPL is then he's probably among the top 6-8 highest paid CB in the world. That means he needs to produce like a top 6-8 top CB in the world or else he's in trouble of being replaced. That's what basically happened at Juventus (they considered Bremer as good as him but whose on a way cheaper salary) and what happened at Bayern as well.
Jarrad is superb on air. He's way better then all of our CBs bar Maguire (whose slightly better then him tbh). He's built like a concrete wall like Maguire is and he's used to a low block same as Maguire. Unlike Maguire though he's very fast. What lets him down is distribution of the ball. At 80-84% he's weaker to Maguire (88%) let alone the likes of De Ligt and Yoro (92%+). If you arrange that stat to accommodate the fact that Jarrad is playing for a Dycke side then he'll probably be around Maguire's territory
I wanted Jarrad to join us. I actually preferred him to De Ligt. The reason being that I find De Ligt to be very similar to Martinez (an upgrade actually) while Jarrad would compliment him greatly.
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I suggest that you read the posts after that. There's a clear explanation of what I meant.
Very poor performance from him yesterday. For now I don't see it with him. Outside of a catchy name and old Ajax glory days the here and now player that I see is rash in rushing out, poor positionally, doesn't dominate his area, is not dominant in air, not comfortable with pacey games (that will be in majority of games in EPL). And as laughable as it would sound a year ago and another big question mark on our coaching team and their decision making is that Maguire would be much more suited to yesterdays game with his aerial ability. He would prevent the first two goals 100%. Why he didn't start in fecking EL nobody knows.
Maguire with pace might not be one of the best defenders of all time, but I do think he would be absolutely immense player.
It’s not looking good. Martinez has lost the plot but De Ligt hasn’t managed to clear up one mess.
He got absolutely bullied by the kid last night, and he’s meant to be the physical one.
You don’t get sold by Juve and Bayern if you’re a top player imo.
He got absolutely bullied by the kid last night, and he’s meant to be the physical one.
You don’t get sold by Juve and Bayern if you’re a top player imo.
I can see why Juve and Bayern were not very desperate to keep him. There are massive flaws to his game.
At least we didn't break the bank, he's here to be part of the CB collection. Yoro is the stud that will elevate things.
Brains.
Steve Bruce was slow, but he had brains and anticipation, he could read the game superbly and that made up for his lack of pace. What a player he was for his time.
Maguire with pace would be worse than David Luiz.
I think its a poor partnership to start with. Both are aggressive, they aren't the quickest and they are both 'suited' to be the ball playing CB. De Ligt is better in air. The last time I checked his header ability is within the Saliba territory though. That means he's not a Jarrad (whose superb in air) let alone an aerial beast like Maguire is. That's a problem because Martinez is rubbish in aerial duels
Bruce played in a different time and with a manager who was a tactical genius. Maguire in Brucey's time would probably be among the top 2-3 CB in the EPL.
He's lucky he has the hipster cloak of protection.
Not a hope.
He doesn't read the game well enough and back then defenders were more exposed in 1v1 situations.
De Ligt has only played about 5 games and already people have forgotten just how bad Maguire was at times. Remember the day against Spurs where he dragged his own player down in the box to allow a shot on goal.
Enough about him, he shouldn't still be at the club, but here we are again, the less he plays the better he gets.
You didn't had to read the game well enough in the EPL back then because most played a deep line. Maguire distribution of the ball would look stellar among the late 80s EPL CBs as well. De Ligt has nothing to do with that particular conversation. I am referring to Maguire and the late 80s-early 90s EPL CBs
Can't agree with that.
He's be around the same level as Richard Dunne in my book, good player, but not good enough for a top team.
Even around 10 years ago you had players like Carvalho & Terry who weren't blessed with blistering pace, but still had the brains to know how to defend without it.
He is too slow to play LB.
Maybe try him as a DM..I mean Martínez.
Certainly looks that way. He looks terrible.
I'd take Maguire every day of the week from what I've seen so far.
Maguire with pace would absolutely be an elite level CB.The Caf and wild agendas
"One of the greatest defenders of all time".
Obviously it's a pointless hypothetical, but I think you could make a decent argument that Maguire with prime van Dijk pace would have been in the conversation for best CB in the PL.
Well I was responding to the ridiculousness of such a claim.
Re the VVD/Maguire conversation: It's definitely not a conversation I would want to touch tbh.
Doesn't have to be an out and out, traditional full back role. His qualities in possession warrant a place for him in the team IMO, just ideally not at CB, but at LB or as part of a back 3.
Yeo that was Jaap Stam, he was ridiculously quick for such a big man
And this is an absolute, as United fans we ridicule this guy constantly but he’s been a loyal servant whose only crime was being a player that the club paid double his true market value in fees and wages, but he also made two team of international tournaments. Maguire with any fit quick CB would be fine and he can play a high line if three of the other four defenders all have pace.
Right now I see a huge lack of leadership in our defence and squad. A new coach will automatically shut up shop and either change formation or change style to be a more compact flat 433.
If Tuchel is sounded out over international break and he comes in as he’s currently available then he will switch to 343 pragmatic system.
He doesn’t rate De Ligt as he hardly used him as a starting CB at Bayern, even Eric Dier was preferred and you can bet that he would pick Maguire as his main CB in the middle of L Martinez and L Yoro when fit as a 3.
If we can’t get TT, I could see Marco Silva also getting the job and he had HM at Hull, there are so many options that would be an upgrade on ETH and as soon as those fans still supporting him realise this, the club will start to heal.
Harry right now deserves to start if fit and organise the defence.
Basically at this point, every signing this team makes should be questioned. It's just statistical probability at this point. That being said, I thought De Ligt showed some promising moments in his first few games, but yesterday was a disaster.