Manuel Ugarte | Romano - he’s signed | Awaiting Club announcement
- Thread starter WeePat
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Now I see why you rate Berge, if you think Henderson is elite.. Henderson is not an awful player, he is a very good player and a key member for Liverpools PL team, he was great in Klopps system, but i will never call him an elite player, not what i mean see as an elite player anyway..
I actually think Ugarte and Casemiro would be a good pair as well.
Ugarte will be the deepest midfielder in any set up.
And will allow Casemiro / Mainoo to play slightly further forward as an 8. And I think that would suit both of them.
Looks like all sides want this deal (in some form) to happen. The unknown is whether or not it's dependent on selling McTominay (perhaps an outright purchase is but a loan with obligation is not?).
It will be stupid if the club accepts PSG unreasonable demand of €70m for Ugarte, anything above 50m in total is too much and not worth it
According to Laurie Whitwall Napoli director Giovanni Manna is in England to hold discussions with us over the transfer of Scott McTominay
Tell him they can have Sancho and Lindelof thrown in, we don't need any money, and just give us Osimhen who wants to leave anyway.
Of course it is that easy, whaddyamean?
Inject some more South American steel into the midfield please
Will this get done in time for Brighton?
Think Brighton game will be immaterial even if he joined tomorrow. I strongly doubt he is in actual contention for a starting role for 1-2 weeks *after* joining.
He has not featured in the last 2 PSG pre-season games, been completely dropped. Will need to build up his own fitness, get used to these players too. Ten Hag also took his time with Casemiro when he signed.
Ye but that’s the point I made though. You don’t have to be elite to win trophies you can be an alright player and play very good in a system or understand your role a lot better than someone who’s elite can.
The Brighton game will probably be the reason why it gets done. If we lose
I see your point, but I think Casemiro's passing is erratic, as is his all around play at the moment (to say nothing of my expectation that his better performances will probably become fewer and farther between these days). I expect Mount, fitness permitting, will likely fill in for Mainoo in games as well.
I know we can't fix all our problems in one window, I'm just concerned about how our midfield shapes up over the course of the season.
Ahh that's annoying
My guess is there are a couple of conditions that could speed up this loan proposal, however whether we are willing to agree to them is another matter
I think another member put it correctly. He was one of the best midfielders in the league, and a key player for Liverpool when they were at their best in their "modern era peak", so ~2017-2022.
I'd rate Berge as a good PL player who can be a rotational piece for a top 4 contender team.
Ok then. Maybe he was the wrong example but my point was you don’t have to be elite to win titles. You just have to be very good at a specific role in a specific system.
Are you saying we could do with another midfield signing as well or have I misinterpreted
Sales of Eriksen and McTominay permitting, yes I think 2 midfielders in would be great. I suppose the main concern would be the level of quality we could expect at this point with our supposed funds available. I just think proper cover/rotation for Mainoo is important for him to grow into the league and not get overused.
Can't see us kidnapping Nasser Al-Khelaifi
I guarantee you if he is, most here would be clamouring for an upgrade come next season when Casmiro is sold.
He's the shiny new toy, the flavour of the month, so you're overhyping him. Seen it time and time again.
Yeah the options available in our situation is pretty much Rabiot, part of me says we should wait until we can afford better but another part says we desperately need rotation for Kobbie now
I agree with that. However, I just don't see a long-term key role for Ugarte in any system that wins league titles and Champions Leagues. That's why I don't think it's a good idea to spend a lot of money on him as well as give him high wages.
I think Rabiot would be a good shout tbh, but depends on the wages and length of contract. 2-3 years at a reasonable wage would give a good rotation option who will naturally be phased out as Mainoo grows. I suspect, however, that he's going to want a longer contract for security and the wages will likely be far too much for a team looking to tidy up their wage structure.
Signing him would also go down like a lead balloon here.
For me it was more the system that made Henderson great than it was Henderson that made the system great.. but either way I agree that he was one of the best, but dont see him as elite player..
For Berge i totally disagree, I dont think he is good enough for a top 4 team, thats why he never has played for one.. but its not important, we dont just want top 4, we want top 1, and he is not good enough for a team like that
Yep. I think we have to take a midfielder with good defensive capabilities in whatever guise we can get it with Casemiro playing the way he is.
Yeah I'm convinced the wages and length of contract ruled him out ages ago, so think Ugarte could well be the last deal for this window
How about him and Rabiot? 2 upgrades in midfield and 2 different type of players. I think Ugarte will improve us as he’s an upgrade on Mctominay and him and Casemiro with Mainoo/bruno/Mount is decent enough options. I think we’re at least another 2 years from a proper title challenge anyway… our front line lacks goals. Not clinical enough so until we get a deadly ST and not one with potential then we won’t challenge.
I also see why they were interested in Berge tbh. A player who may well have accepted a more rotational role, with some versatility, probably not on big wages, and may have had sell on value down the line if he was signed on a reasonable contract. I couldn't speak to his quality as a player, but he seemed to fit the bill as a squad option and someone who could fill out depth as other players move on.
Another lead balloon though.
As I say, I don't expect everything is going to be sorted this window, and I wonder if they make a push for a player like Wharton next year. It's the quality of depth that concerns me when Urgate sets done, especially as Casemiro pushes on and as much as I like Mount he's a square peg being bashed into a round hole.
Who is that deadly ST we need then, the Rabiot boat will keep sailing unless his demands become somewhat reasonable. The lack of interest in the guy tells you clubs aren't biting at the current ones.
Inject some more South American steel into the midfield please
Fecking sign him already!
Prepare yourself for a bit of a wait
I wonder will he play sometimes with Case or it will be one or another situation.
Very valid concerns.
Ideally we need to be bringing in two midfielders. Especially since we are likely losing Mctominay, have already lost Amrabat and are probably okay to let Eriksen leave as well as per reports.
Perhaps ETH has a lot of faith in Collyer to step up and take a lot of mins. Alongside playing Mount in a deeper role like you mentioned (but I have my reservations about that - don’t think he is suited for that. Maybe we can make it work).
I actually feel Bruno could be an effective 8 as well if we start playing Zirkzee in the 10 role. But will need Ugarte to cover a heck of a lot of ground to make that work.
We don't need to challenge this year.
We need the Europa Final or win it, and get top 4. We need Mainoo, Garnacho and Amad to develop more as players as they get more professional experience.
We also need the entire team to adapt to the system ETH is transitioning to and what RVN and Rene is coaching, lead by the likes of the technical director in Wilcox.
We need that system to become instinctive and automatic. Eg making the right runs, passes, going into the right shape and structure and having a visceral feeling of just knowing what to do.
That takes time to develop, it's just just buy a striker or we need a DM. We need coaching and the right players and profiles is part of that.
This year is about laying the ground work for future success. Having a solid back four, DM and the team being progressive, aggressive and winning the ball back plus retaining possession is the major goal this year.
If all goes well we can go big next year on major world class signings when more deadweight eg Lindelof on his last year, Eriksen if he isnt moved on is removed from the squad. Then we get more energy and technical ability in the squad.
We can't solve all of this in one window.
Ugarte is more than enough, bonus points for another player.
United need to get high up the pitch and suffocate the opposition with high pressing and energy which is why we chase Ugarte.
Then Onana can play to his strengths too, I think if we're higher up the pitch we score more and we concede less anyway.
Definitely need two if we sell McTominay and Eriksen but there's no noise about a second midfielder
Good post. Agreed.
I think Casemiro will have his best season for us this year honestly, fans are really fickle and this time next year people will be raving again about him. Hes has already showed some moments of class in the last games.
The caveat is to be forward thinking, I do think he will need to be moved on after around 2 or 3 years though. Injuries will be a big problem around 33 or 34. At that stage being out months and the chances of injury are much greater.
Its also the big reason I doubt City will win the league this year, if they do get Gundogan he's 33, KDB is the same they're going to show signs of age now.
Yeah, both will play against the likes of City, Arsenal and Liverpool.
Could even say Villa, Spurs and Chelsea too
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