25
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 19
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 1
- Yellow cards
- 3
About the same as Ugarte.
Though, crucially, signing him would have required him to actually prefer us over PSG, which may not have been the case. It's not like anyone has reported we actually turned down the chance to sign Joao Neves. And he wouldn't have single-handedly solved our midfield problems either, even if he lives up to his hype.
He's a ball winner. We also felt the need to point out his tackling percentile stats when we announced him. So yea, he isn't going to spray passes around like some people are expecting. He will get around, he will tackle people and win the ball. That will be his game and judge him based on that.
He didn’t stand out as particularly good or bad this game, but he miss an open header at the end of the game, could’ve clinched it there for us.
Will Ugarte get an easier chance to strut his stuff than against fecking Twente? If this limp performance was against Real Madrid, okay. But this was against a minnow, and he still looked shorn of ideas and skill.On top of that members have written him off after 2 games
He is just so obviously a systems player.
He is there to do a job - defend the opposition attack from reaching the back line.
He isn't there to pass the ball around like Carrick.
It's the exact same with Zirkzee - you can't really blame him for not scoring goals like RVP, he is a systems player who is more about interlinking the wider forwards.
Ugarte is about shielding the back line almost like Rice does for England.
Right now we have barely any system so everything and everyone looks crap.
Notice how Rashford plays better with Zirkzee than with Hojlund but Ten Hag turned to Rashford & Hojlund vs Crystal Palace final mins?
Ten Hag hasn't a clue about team tactics through a whole 90 mins.
You can't blame Ugarte yet until he is put up with the right players in the right system.
He is there to do a job - defend the opposition attack from reaching the back line.
He isn't there to pass the ball around like Carrick.
It's the exact same with Zirkzee - you can't really blame him for not scoring goals like RVP, he is a systems player who is more about interlinking the wider forwards.
Ugarte is about shielding the back line almost like Rice does for England.
Right now we have barely any system so everything and everyone looks crap.
Notice how Rashford plays better with Zirkzee than with Hojlund but Ten Hag turned to Rashford & Hojlund vs Crystal Palace final mins?
Ten Hag hasn't a clue about team tactics through a whole 90 mins.
You can't blame Ugarte yet until he is put up with the right players in the right system.
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When he came on in the weekend, his role and passing was very much like Carrick imo.
My description of him is he knows how to play football, has good instincts (how to move off the ball, where to pass when on the ball). However, the way he actually executes this is average. I think that's OK considering he's getting up to speed, but I'm not sure if he's really a upgrade on anyone in the squad.
Surely if Casemiro was told to play it safe like Ugarte, he'd be producing similar level of performances at least?
Surely if Casemiro was told to play it safe like Ugarte, he'd be producing similar level of performances at least?
This is what I see too. He tried 3 or 4 passes last night that were the right ones to split the lines, but failed each time and gave away possession, somewhat dangerously.
He needs someone next to him, but Bruno is always closer to the opposition keeper, and Eriksen wasn't deep either.
We should be having 2 players back there to build, prolly Mainoo or Case with Ugarte.
We should probably aim to have 3 players to build, the AM needs to be more of a midfielder too, especially since Mainoo seems earily capable of being a threat. I don't know who that 3rd midfielder is but I can surely tell you who isn't.
He wasn’t very good yesterday
I think he wasn’t having a great night but then it was made even more difficult because at a certain point Bruno and Eriksen pushed further and harder and Dalot started making more overlaps/ going forward. Martinez was pushing high and Maguire for some reason was staying back so the shape just went to absolute balls.
Then that massive gap that was there last year through the centre of our team appeared again and he was left with no chance. He/we need someone who is going to stay in there with him.
Then that massive gap that was there last year through the centre of our team appeared again and he was left with no chance. He/we need someone who is going to stay in there with him.
I agree that it was a poor performance, but writing him off after two games is just so fecking absurd you just have got to laugh. Do you even take yourself seriously?
He was very poor with the ball, defensively he was alright, but there was that really nice intricate pass to Mainoo in the Twente box, that Kobbie should have done better with. You should take into account that these are completely new team mates and he has had no pre season. Not everyone can be a Mazraoui.
I was always of the opinion that Casemiro is actually an 8, because he does most of his good work higher up the pitch for us. I wouldn't actually mind Ugarte, Case and Mainoo.
His job is to break up attacks. Before Twente scored he had saved the situation after Maguire took himself out with a wild lunge. He recovered the ball with a tackle and gave it to a player who is better with the ball. It is not Ugarte his fault that Eriksen was sleeping and lost the ball again.
Helping the defense and recovering the ball is what Ugarte has to do. He kinda did his job yesterday but otherwise he is fairly limited.
Helping the defense and recovering the ball is what Ugarte has to do. He kinda did his job yesterday but otherwise he is fairly limited.
For now I'd give Ugarte a very limited role as a defensive midfielder with limited offensive duties, and surround him with two players good at progressing the ball. Casemiro, Mainoo, Mount, I don't know the combination, but I truly believe in Casemiro in midfield as long as he's not the deepest in there.
You're not making a case, you're just making your own argument look worse. To repeat: this was possibly the lowest level opposition Ugarte has faced in years, and he did not shine.I agree that it was a poor performance, but writing him off after two games is just so fecking absurd you just have got to laugh. Do you even take yourself seriously?
He was very poor with the ball, defensively he was alright, but there was that really nice intricate pass to Mainoo in the Twente box, that Kobbie should have done better with. You should take into account that these are completely new team mates and he has had no pre season. Not everyone can be a Mazraoui.
Agreed, if he's not exposed defending large spaces, he still has a lot of quality to bring to our midfield.
Here's a case: remember Evra and Vidic? You probably don't remember when we signed them, but you'd absolutely fecking loathe their performances. Thankfully, you were not in charge. Ødegaard was struggling in Eredivisie in a lot of games, now he is one of the best PL players and a top playmaker in the world.
You think football is that easy, huh? They are a professional football team, do you expect him to be magical because they are a much inferior football team than us?
Oh you're clever. But trying to discuss this with you is like trying to get a pig to sing. Ciao.
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Some fantastic tackles and good positioning. On the ball he was very rusty indeed, he needs to just keep his game super simple for now. Get the ball pass it along easy. In the premier league he will be great but last night was a weird one for him. Everyone needs to chill.
What could possibly be the case is the low tempo style united played isn't the best to shine in. No one stood out, they all looked like poor versions of themselves. If he still looks mediocre in a more uptempo game then there's problems.
These Europa league group games are an absolute shit show every season.
Ugarte was by no means the worst player on the pitch. He does not seem to be very good at passing the ball to a teammate, however.
For now I’m not concerned.
We wanted somebody who can win the ball back and he’s doing that. His forward passing might not be great, but mostly he recycled back to defence or midfield, rather than Casemiro who wants that ball pinged forward every time it’s at his feet, and generally badly at that.
Ugarte may become one of them players that is used for certain matches, for his specific play style but for now, it’s players around him that are the problem.
First half today, same against Palace, we had plenty of the ball, and didn’t do enough with it, and that’s not his job. His job is to stop attacks and we conceded 1 goal in two games, and the goal we did concede, he actually stopped it, until one of our ‘ball players’ fecked up
We wanted somebody who can win the ball back and he’s doing that. His forward passing might not be great, but mostly he recycled back to defence or midfield, rather than Casemiro who wants that ball pinged forward every time it’s at his feet, and generally badly at that.
Ugarte may become one of them players that is used for certain matches, for his specific play style but for now, it’s players around him that are the problem.
First half today, same against Palace, we had plenty of the ball, and didn’t do enough with it, and that’s not his job. His job is to stop attacks and we conceded 1 goal in two games, and the goal we did concede, he actually stopped it, until one of our ‘ball players’ fecked up
Yeah, a lot of us have talked about this ad-nauseum over the summer. We all knew what we are getting, a limited DM.
Now a lot of folks here think that's what we need. I thought we needed a more balanced player, and talks of no such player existing is rubbish.
People have already started the "need X player to unlock him", while this just could have been solved by getting midfielders who are comfortable with the ball(#6 or #8).
Neves in Ugarte out, was a masterstroke by PSG.
Neves was my dream signing. He will be one of the world's best midfielders in just a few years. Outrageously talented, and he was there for the taking. €60m or something, wasn't it? He should have been priority over Leny Yoro.
Ugarte vs Twente
59/73 passes completed, 80% accuracy
4 tackles, 2 interceptions
Lost the ball too many times for my liking, I was atleast hoping for a high retention player. Someone with a 90%+ passing accuracy.
59/73 passes completed, 80% accuracy
4 tackles, 2 interceptions
Lost the ball too many times for my liking, I was atleast hoping for a high retention player. Someone with a 90%+ passing accuracy.
I really like his danger sensing, he is at the right place at the right time. He reads the game well. Will be a very good signing this.
I totally agree. Its obvious Mendes had a big role to play in this transfer, dont think this transfer happens if he was not a Mendes client. Sad that it wasnt for Neves instead.
Lets see him play a few more times before completely writing him off though.
Good footballer being played out of position. Pressing monster, one of the best in the world, being played as a CDM and the teams press is shit anyway
I've always felt a lot of United signings are driven by agents sensing opportunities for their clients and the club obliging. I think Mount and Casemiro also fall under the same category despite all the leaks about them being targets for the club from the beginning.
For a player coming into a new team in a difficult role, he was actually pretty good. There were a couple of times he got outmuscled or outfought going for the ball, usually when running back. In situations where he can attack the ball carrier head on, he's extremely good.
Overall I'm happy and expect he will improve as he gets used to things.
Mistake aside, Eriksen had a really good game. A lot of that was down to Ugarte and the inverting Dalot giving him the sort of freedom he wouldn't get with any of our other midfielders.
He really should have been taken off when we were chasing the win though. There isn't much of a point in him when you're playing against a very deep 541 and in need of a goal.
Overall I'm happy and expect he will improve as he gets used to things.
Mistake aside, Eriksen had a really good game. A lot of that was down to Ugarte and the inverting Dalot giving him the sort of freedom he wouldn't get with any of our other midfielders.
He really should have been taken off when we were chasing the win though. There isn't much of a point in him when you're playing against a very deep 541 and in need of a goal.
Ah the old RedCafe hype cycle. New player joins the club and is the solution to all our problems. We don't immediately, magically improve overnight and suddenly he's "no better than Scott McTominay".
There's one major problem with this squad and it's ten Hag. Let's judge them when they have a competent coach.
There's one major problem with this squad and it's ten Hag. Let's judge them when they have a competent coach.
Great at winning the ball but lost it 17 times which is uncharacteristic of him, he typically shows a simple pass and has a high completion rate, it's either the tactics don't give him the support close enough to him or he's just getting to know his new team mates, I think he will come good just needs a bit of time.
Have to agree. Sad really and what happened to the narrative of 'bedding in', it's his first season to the country, league, language, club, coach, team, style of play etc...?
Why would people give players a chance to bed in when it means missing the chance to crow on the internet about being right when they said we shouldn't have signed them?
Instead, do your crowing after two games and then go quiet if/when you're proven wrong.
Yep, why indeed....
This is one of my major bugbears on this forum and I have been a pedant about pulling people up on it.
So many posters say "I wouldn't have signed Player X, I'd have signed..." and then proceed to roll-off the same old crap list of lads who are good on Football Manager / FIFA or whichever piece of EuroTrash is being hyped by 442 podcast that month.
They can do that and never be proved "wrong" because nobody is going back and retrospectively vetting where their signings ended-up.
Massively