He's already told us to lower our expectations that we cant demand to score a goal. Not win a match but score a goal.
Like United are now basically?
What we have now is a severe lack of talent forcing us to play three Academy players and a midfielder in defense. No wonder we've been leaking set piece goals when half the team have had barely more than a week to play with each other. That's very different from players turning back on the manager.
If other top teams weren't so inconsistent this year we'd be down in 7th or a little lower too. I'm no supporter of Moyes but I just can't see any difference between LVG United or Moyes United.
Not for the last 10-15 games.. We won 3 of the last 10 games and 5 of the last 15.. With our best team. Playing so much youth is down to one man and that is lvg. He likes to work with a small squad but this is just crazy. This has been going on for much longer than the last 2 games, we are basically as fecked as last season but only with fewer proven players..
Really? I'd say transfer wish there's a huge difference. I see Van Gaal building a team, Moyes had no idea where to start.
Van Gaal needs 1 or 2 players that fit his system & we'll then become a major force. Could you have said that of Moyes United? And if you look at how we handled Rooney under Moyes, no way he gets a long fat contact with the ruthless one in charge.
No one can prepare a squad for losing two center backs and four full backs along with three midfielders and a striker. That's either poor medical department or rot luck.
According to a Mitten article on the Norwegian United page, Woodward thinks Peps future is already decided and its not United.
Dont know if Mitten knows anything, but interresting article.
Dont know if Mitten knows anything, but interresting article.
If he comes here, he'll stay for 3 years then move to Juventus. He'll stay at Juve for another 3 years then move to PSG. It's obvious he's trying to mark his card at the premier club in each of Europe's top leagues.
I don't want United to be associated with that kind of short-termism. Immediate success is nice and all, but I want us to be a family club with stability that builds towards sustained success.
I don't want United to be associated with that kind of short-termism. Immediate success is nice and all, but I want us to be a family club with stability that builds towards sustained success.
It happens EVERY SINGLE YEAR. Doesn't matter if it's Ferguson, Moyes, or LvG. It doesn't take a fortune teller to know that our players will, usually around the halfway point, start dropping like flies. I think it's more to do with players now-a-days being more pampered and happy to take a week or two off for a slight knock, whereas players in the past just went on with it. I'm obviously referring to minor injuries, but I think that the crazy valuations of modern footballers makes clubs reluctant to push the players outside their comfort zones.
All LVG has ever needed is 3 very good players yet he's spent £200 million on either rubbish players or failures. He's building nothing and completely wasted every single penny he's spent. On rooneys contract I take it you've missed every United game because LVG loves Rooney so it's entirely possible he'd give him a contract.
A better manager would've had us challenging for every honour we could by now not putting in terrible performances week after week and not failing one of the easiest champions league groups
He loved RVP also so I'd not be so sure.
I hope he manages the Spanish NT one day, he could work miracles with the players we have.
United could do much worse than appointing this guy.
United could do much worse than appointing this guy.
I think you're a bit deluded if you think short term management is not the way of the world now. Forget a manager being in place for 25 years like Fergie, it won't happen. We have to get used to three year cycles with the occasional one maybe stretching it to five.
That doesn't mean we have to follow suit. We clearly treat our managers differently from most European clubs and that's very much to the credit of our traditions. Vive la difference.
United has lost its identity enough as it is. I don't want us to become a Spanish club with an English accent.
I read his article in Eurosport and he suggests that unless Van Gaal drastically changes the playing style and results or wins a cup of some magnitude he is unlikely to finish his contract given the managerial options that will come available this summer.
No we don't. Posts like this are silly. We're not a special club. We are no different to other clubs out there. We were different with SAF. But since he's retired, we're the same as other clubs.
There is no SAF 2.0
Either adapt or fall behind. We won't find another manager that stays at the helm for 20+ years. Pep's the best manager in the world and we should do whatever we can to bring him in.
Different? 9 of our 23 managers have lasted two years or less. What are these traditions you talking of? Busby and Fergie?
You're absolutely right about injuries, but that was the last 2 games. What is the reason for the shite that is being served week after week though?
I think he's been let down by a few players, Schweinsteiger, Rooney and Memphis to be precise, he then turned to Lingard and while he hasn't entirely shit the bed, he's not nailed himself down either and terrible finishing on some match winning chances haven't helped his cause. Just like last season, with some luck in terms of injuries with Smalling, Jones, Blind and Herrera, he'll likely settle down to a more stabilized 11 of players from now on and go on a decent run of results. He ditched the 1 DM formation to accommodate Schweinsteiger especially which in hindsight seems like a bad move.
Will that be enough to win the league, I don't know and that will take an immense share of luck having lost Rojo, Valencia and Shaw for the rest of the season. If he can secure a striker and a full back in January or Rooney somehow shows a modicum of form, that will go a long way to stabilizing the team.
The fact we've only had 22 managers since 1892 tells its own story.
Yes, thanks to the two of greatest managers to grace the game. Roughly 45% of our managers have lasted two years or less. This suggests those traditions that you talk of aren't true. Imagine giving Moyes, O'Farrell, Wilf longer stints at the club. Not every manager is a potential Fergie or Busby. Moyes wasn't. Nor is LVG - and I suspect the board knows this.
All three of those followed immediately in the footsteps of Busby/Fergie. They'd all taken on poison chalices to some extent. The manager who follows LvG will have a better chance of making his own impression on the club and, uniquely, will be given the chance to do so.
Put it this way: if van Gaal had performed this way at Real, Barca, Bayern, Juve, PSG, Liverpool, etc. he'd have been sacked ages ago. At United, the board will likely allow him to see out his contract. I doubt he'll go sooner unless he himself decides to quit.
If they allow him to see out his contract does that mean they'll give him loads of cash to spend this summer? will they trust him to purchase well for the next manager?
Pep 3 years and I'm off. No thanks.
We've got to accept that we are going to go through a few managers before we find one who will stay for a long time - and even then, its unlikely that we're ever going to have another Fergie who will stay for a generation or more.
Pep is the original 'chosen one', let's not forget (That famous dinner date in New York)
It was just bad timing that caused us to end up with Moyes.
Pep is the original 'chosen one', let's not forget (That famous dinner date in New York)
It was just bad timing that caused us to end up with Moyes.
I think he's a poor manager overall but a very good squad builder. As much as I dislike him, I wouldn't begrudge him having money to spend in the Summer. His 'philosophy' ensures that all his players have certain fundamentals which the next manager can exploit more fully.
For example, LvG likes his midfielders to sit deep and be technically good under pressure. So, at Bayern, he put Schweinsteiger there and got the side playing good possession football within certain constraints. When Heynckes took over, he took one look at Schweini and realised he could do so much more. Over the next few years, BS developed into the best box-to-box midfielder of his generation. As a result, Bayern pushed on and won the treble.
A similar thing happened at Barca. Van Gaal left a functional side which was naturally good at the basics. Then Riijkard came along, loosened the reins and won them the CL.
LvG is going to leave us with a squad full of philosophy-moulded players who are capable of being better than they'll ever show under the current regime. I hate the fact that we'll have to endure shit-on-a-stick football until the next manager, but I don't mind waiting for him to see out his project. We'll be the better for it.
Be a good fecking 3 years though!
Also, Moyes wasn't here for 3 years, and LvG might not be either. So 3 years could well be an improvement...
Also, Moyes wasn't here for 3 years, and LvG might not be either. So 3 years could well be an improvement...
Jesus Christ.
There is a fantastic podcast on BBC Radio 5 LIVE from yesterday that discusses Pep's grand plan, the journalist quotes members of Guardiola's internal circle saying that they have said Pep is in love with Manchester United and this is the club that he wants to come to next. If Man Utd don't sit up and take note of that then there is something seriously wrong at the club.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02nrsln/episodes/downloads
It's the European Football Show podcast that has the discussion. Well worth a listen!
Sir Alex needs to step in and throw is weight around on this.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02nrsln/episodes/downloads
It's the European Football Show podcast that has the discussion. Well worth a listen!
Sir Alex needs to step in and throw is weight around on this.
Agreed. Dante's generally a good poster but this is just not true.
Van Gaal's second period at Barca was chaotic, and they were well and truly in the wilderness by their standards when Laporta gambled on Rijkaard. A giant club fighting for and in the UEFA cup.
Van Gaal is a great coach. Nobody can take away from his successes. Let's not turn his failures into successes too.
Yet lvg kept playing him while being absolutely useless and never mentioned it but slagged off many other players for a hell of a lot less than Rooney did.
1 or 2 players that he may get in and ruin like the rest of the team!
Feel dirty for dumping on United's manager (again) in another thread, but wrt to the Rijkaard loosening the reins bit after inheriting a functional side:
Valdés - Played 10 games under Louis.
Oleguer - Promoted to the first team by Rijkaard.
Márquez - Bought by Rijkaard.
van Bronckhorst - Bought by Rijkaard.
Edmílson - Bought by Rijkaard.
Deco - Bought by Rijkaard.
van Bommel - Bought by Rijkaard.
Giuly - Bought by Rijkaard.
Ronaldinho - Bought by Rijkaard.
Eto'o - Bought by Rijkaard.
Belletti - Bought by Rijkaard.
Sylvinho - Bought by Rijkaard.
Motta - Got his debut under Carles Rexach and became an important player, played 10 games under Louis.
Iniesta - Played 5 games under Louis.
Larsson - Bought by Rijkaard.
The side Rijkaard inherited was far from functional and he had to purge 80% of the squad/ loan players (Rochemback, de Boer, Christanvel, Overmars, Kluivert, Enke, Enrique, Andersson, Reiziger, Garcia, Bonano, Cocu, Geovanni, Riquelme). It's wasn't a transition, but a complete revamp of the team. As for the playing style, the biggest credit goes to Michels and Cruyff dating backing to decades before Rijkaard was appointed because they set the template for the future.
PS: One player whose influence in underrated was Edgar Davids, who arrived on loan from Juventus. If not for him, maybe Rijkaard would have been fired, and maybe Xavi wouldn't have become the playmaker he became because too many defensive duties were being placed on him, and Davids' arrival allowed him to flourish as the team's prime mover. David might played a small role in creating the history of Barcelona and Spanish football by liberating Xavi.
Valdés - Played 10 games under Louis.
Oleguer - Promoted to the first team by Rijkaard.
Márquez - Bought by Rijkaard.
van Bronckhorst - Bought by Rijkaard.
Edmílson - Bought by Rijkaard.
Deco - Bought by Rijkaard.
van Bommel - Bought by Rijkaard.
Giuly - Bought by Rijkaard.
Ronaldinho - Bought by Rijkaard.
Eto'o - Bought by Rijkaard.
Belletti - Bought by Rijkaard.
Sylvinho - Bought by Rijkaard.
Motta - Got his debut under Carles Rexach and became an important player, played 10 games under Louis.
Iniesta - Played 5 games under Louis.
Larsson - Bought by Rijkaard.
The side Rijkaard inherited was far from functional and he had to purge 80% of the squad/ loan players (Rochemback, de Boer, Christanvel, Overmars, Kluivert, Enke, Enrique, Andersson, Reiziger, Garcia, Bonano, Cocu, Geovanni, Riquelme). It's wasn't a transition, but a complete revamp of the team. As for the playing style, the biggest credit goes to Michels and Cruyff dating backing to decades before Rijkaard was appointed because they set the template for the future.
PS: One player whose influence in underrated was Edgar Davids, who arrived on loan from Juventus. If not for him, maybe Rijkaard would have been fired, and maybe Xavi wouldn't have become the playmaker he became because too many defensive duties were being placed on him, and Davids' arrival allowed him to flourish as the team's prime mover. David might played a small role in creating the history of Barcelona and Spanish football by liberating Xavi.
I'm absolutely gob smacked that people are still supporting him after making us worse after spending 250 facking million pounds, Leicester haven't spent anywhere near that but they are top of the league and playing great football and making lvg look like the fool he is, 3 years for philosophy to work its magic yet Claudio only started at the start of the season and they destroy teams while we fu,ck about with possession for possession sake.
If he can deliver three years of success, then that would be absolutely fine. Ideally you'd hope he gave it a bit longer, but that might not be the case. Think about the top managers across football, and consider how many you could actually look at and consider as long-term options.
Ancelotti hasn't really stuck around at anywhere for particularly long since his AC Milan days. LVG's said he'll probably only give us three years. Mourinho's a short-term coach.
Klopp's probably an example of someone who'd stick it out for a bit longer, but that ship has sailed. Simeone would be a possibility.
In essence, though, many managers just aren't interested in staying in a job for a long, long time, and that's fair enough. Managing a top side is hard work, and I can see why many like a change every so often. The vast majority of people who we'd expect to be long-term options (like Giggs, and previously Moyes) are managers who generally probably aren't at the level we're looking for, and thus would hypothetically stay for a long time because it's a job above their station. Of course, it wouldn't work out like that, because like in the case of Moyes, under-performing managers with long-term ambitions get sacked regardless.
Apparently Roman has thrown him a blank cheque 
I like van Gaal, and wouldn't want him sacked (well, that's not completely true, I wanted him sacked last weekend), but if Pep is available then promise him £500m in transfer funds and whatever he wants in terms of salary.
Bringing England's greatest club back to the zenith of domestic and European football is a challenge that should appeal to him. If he can successively accomplish this, he will go down as the greatest manager in history (alongside the likes of Ferguson, Michels, Paisley, Clough, etc). I mean, he's already at that level (maybe not the Michels level), but he can surpass it imo considering his age.
Getting Pep to United would be worth billions in the long run. No doubt in my mind. There's not a single other manager in world football players would rather play for. World's best manager + world's richest club which needs rebuilding = potential legend in the making.
The board need to make this happen.
Oh and as good as Mourinho is (yeah, everyone thinks he's shit now, but that's nonsense), Pep will always be remembered in a better light because he plays better football. Mourinho is/was a master tactician and a winner (had that ruthlessness of Fergie), but Pep is a tactical innovator. Christ, I want us to sign him badly.
Bringing England's greatest club back to the zenith of domestic and European football is a challenge that should appeal to him. If he can successively accomplish this, he will go down as the greatest manager in history (alongside the likes of Ferguson, Michels, Paisley, Clough, etc). I mean, he's already at that level (maybe not the Michels level), but he can surpass it imo considering his age.
Getting Pep to United would be worth billions in the long run. No doubt in my mind. There's not a single other manager in world football players would rather play for. World's best manager + world's richest club which needs rebuilding = potential legend in the making.
The board need to make this happen.
Oh and as good as Mourinho is (yeah, everyone thinks he's shit now, but that's nonsense), Pep will always be remembered in a better light because he plays better football. Mourinho is/was a master tactician and a winner (had that ruthlessness of Fergie), but Pep is a tactical innovator. Christ, I want us to sign him badly.
We need to finally realize that this is normal and all top clubs operate this way. There are no managers willing to build a dynasty and stick around for 20 years, Ferguson was one of a kind and there won't be another.
Except Rijkaard won the CL with a completely different side after getting rid of 80% players.
The only chance we have of Pep is through the respect and admiration he has for Sir Alex. We can't compete with what City can offer in terms of strength of squad and unlimited investment in every aspect of the club. Chelsea can offer similar but with a current squad not as strong as City's.