Liverpool : General discussion

Twigginater said:
Some of you compare out performances to some kind of magical Liverpool.

They're not as good as us. At all.
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Nothing magical there, really. I read somewhere (cannot find the link anymore) that today Liverpool as a team ran 5 miles more than Chelsky. A difference of 3 miles is usually already considered huge.

That's outperforming Klopp style. If they keep performing like that, they are a threat to anybody. And Klopp's Dortmund has shown they can do it for a whole season. Those four more matches in England don't matter that much, IMO.
 
steve9 said:
Nothing magical there, really. I read somewhere (cannot find the link anymore) that today Liverpool as a team ran 5 miles more than Chelsky. A difference of 3 miles is usually already considered huge.

That's outperforming Klopp style. If they keep performing like that, they are a threat to anybody. And Klopp's Dortmund has shown they can do it for a whole season. Those four more matches in England don't matter that much, IMO.
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Mikel was playing.
 
SirBobbysCombover said:
Aguero
Sterling
Depay
Silva
Hazard
Fabregas
Company
Martial
Costa
De Bruyne
Shaw
Sanchez

I would say the players above are top 10 & would walk into any team, league, worldwide.

BPL overrated, please stop talking shite to try and back up your faltering points, we have the strongest most competitive league and lower tiered leagues in the world.
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I find that discussion entertaining, hence I'll continue it. But please stay cool, this is just a football discussion, nothing life threatening.

OK. Let me repeat my point: I doubt that any of the best 10 players in Europe is playing in the BPL. So, in order to prove my point I only have to name you 10 players that are better than those you have named above, right?

Aguero -- Yep. He could be in the conversation, I admit. Although I think Suarez is still better.

Sterling -- seriously? A striker who has scored 22 total league goals over his carreer is in the top ten of Europe according to your findings? For your consideration I just name Marco Reus or Mario Goetze here -- they do actually score! And many others.

Depay -- same point. Yound and unproven. Not even in the top 30 yet. We are talking about the top ten in Europe today, not maybe some time in the future. I just name Robben here because they are countrymen.

Silva -- nice but cannot even hold his place in the Spanish national team. Let's take Neymar, because the difference is so huge.

Hazard -- nice too. What has he achieved so far? Less than Iniesta, I think.

Fabregas -- oh, yes, he was once nice. But he was never near as good as Messi on one leg and with a blind fold.

Company -- this one is not serious, is it? I could come up with 10 better defenders, but for now I leave it to Boateng, Ramos, and Mascherano.

Martial -- young and promising. But do you want to compare him already to someone like Thomas Mueller? Or any other striker we should consider among the top ten strikers in Europe?

Costa -- any day, and especially between Monday and Sunday I'd take Lewandowski over him. Benzema too. Even an aging Ibra is another class.

De Bruyne -- he's good, no doubt. But as good as James Rodriguez? Or Pogba?

Shaw -- who's that? I have just googled him: https://www.google.co.uk/#q=shaw+football -- I'm still wondering. Check it out!

Sanchez -- He's great. But apparently already at Barcelona there were three better strikers than him. Otherwise they wouldn't have sold him, right?

Again: Please take it easy. We are here to discuss about football, not to start personal fights. Keep some humour.
 
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Tommy said:
Agree wholeheartedly. You actually mention the positions I said we needed to upgrade the most. I'll repost my initial thoughts...

Sturridge
Coutinho Firmino Lallana
Hendo Lucas
Moreno Sakho Skrtel Clyne
Mignolet.

Lucas is upgrade priority #1. He's just a walking foul nowadays, which is a shame... Skrtel & Lallana also need upgrading, but I've no issue with AL continuing as a squad/rotation player as I do think he's a good enough AM. We also definitely need another good quality CM as backup/competition for Henderson... We're so shallow in that part of the field it's unbelievable.

Moreno is a weird one. Shite defensively, good going forward... Will he replaced? I don't know.
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You have always had it in for Lucas and it's bizarre. He's been our best midfielder this season and has stepped his game up even more under klopp.
 
B20 said:
You have always had it in for Lucas and it's bizarre. He's been our best midfielder this season and has stepped his game up even more under klopp.
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You're right. He's been really good.
 
PickledRed said:
You're right. He's been really good.
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B20 said:
You have always had it in for Lucas and it's bizarre. He's been our best midfielder this season and has stepped his game up even more under klopp.
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He could become Klopp's Sven Bender. A work horse, technically limited but making miles for the team and closing holes. Stupid fouls are not part of the plan, though.

EDIT: Bender played all the important matches for him.
 
B20 said:
We've looked a lot more stable under klopp. I no longer feel nervy when we don't have the ball.

Sakho is looking immense.
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Sakho is a very good defender, but dear lord I don´t understand why people don´t press him every time he has to handle the ball. He takes forever to get his feet organised and to plan his next pass. Think every 3-4 games you could draw a perfect scoring opportunity out of him.
 
JustFootballFan said:
Sakho is a very good defender, but dear lord I don´t understand why people don´t press him every time he has to handle the ball. He takes forever to get his feet organised and to plan his next pass. Think every 3-4 games you could draw a perfect scoring opportunity out of him.
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hes weird. with time on the ball he is a quite good passer. agree about the pressing though.
 
B20 said:
hes weird. with time on the ball he is a quite good passer. agree about the pressing though.
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Did you Liverpool fans somewhere find that stat about the distance ran/covered from today? I read it only in a comment on a website from some international viewer. What I find strange is that I cannot google it anywhere. That stat has some meaning in Germany, and I'm pretty sure Klopp will be happy about it.
 
Been impressed with Lucas the last couple of games. Moreno is a bit of a liability though.

Top 4 looking much more likely now.
 
golden_blunder said:
@steve9
The last team to break the monopoly in the premier league was Blackburn and they did chuck lots of money (relatively speaking)

This notion that good coaching will make up the gap is a bit of a stretch, going by the evidence
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I am not a Dortmund fan, Hence, I am talking seriously here, not out of any fandom. I have watched Klopp for more than 10 years very closely, becasue he's fascinating. He is one of a kind. And now I do believe that he is a difference maker, big time.

Does that mean that his style will work in England? Does that mean he will win them the league? I have no idea.

The only thing I know is that he is capable of doing it. I had my own experience: First I thought he was just mouth. Then I thought he was a one-hit-wonder. Then I thought he would get exposed. Then he finally struggeled, but pulled himself out of it again. He's just good. After many years of denying him, I'm an admirer. Truth said.
 
ShadesOfTomato said:
The weakness of the Liverpool squad is overplayed. We are as well stocked as anyone bar City going forward (which is the most important thing for me - goals = points), and I'm slowly beginning to gain confidence in the defence - which seems to have improved vastly under Klopp. The midfield needs some quality but I believe it is functional enough to get us top four.

Still very early days, but we're improving. Sakho, Lucas and Lallana have impressed me the most in recent weeks.
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I agree, main problem for you will be the number of injuries you're accumulating.

Frustrating how many United fans enjoyed seeing Liverpool win though
 
B20 said:
You have always had it in for Lucas and it's bizarre. He's been our best midfielder this season and has stepped his game up even more under klopp.
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He's lucky to have stayed on the pitch today. We need someone a little pacier than Lucas who can win the ball back and play it from midfield instead of being a walking foul. Had a good game today, but still, lucky...

He's not a bad player, but it's the position I feel we need to improve on the most. Well, I'm still iffy on Moreno... Going forward I love him. Otherwise, he's pretty naff, ain't he?
 
Damien said:
I agree, main problem for you will be the number of injuries you're accumulating.

Frustrating how many United fans enjoyed seeing Liverpool win though
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I'm German, and therefore not so familiar with the Liverpool vs United rivalry. Maybe you guys can updated me.

Actually, these days, I would think, that your two clubs have a lot in common: A real pedigree.

Your clubs seem to have at least a little bit of freedom over those plastic clubs in City or Chelasa. Am I right? Or is it falsly too romantic, perceived by a German footboll romantic, who is always hoping for the good?
 
Think there are too many people knee-jerking in here. Good win over Chelsea but before that they have been pretty average. Still not convinced they'll finish above us or anything. If they can keep Benteke fit then they will have a chance though.
 
ZDwyr said:
Think there are too many people knee-jerking in here. Good win over Chelsea but before that they have been pretty average. Still not convinced they'll finish above us or anything. If they can keep Benteke fit then they will have a chance though.
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this, we are lacking creativity and a decent attack, but have a solid defence at the moment
 
Been impressed with both Sakho and Lucas since Klopp took over. Neither would ever get a look in under Rodgers if he had a healthy side to choose from.
 
Dumbstar said:
Tougher away games played this season now:
Arsenal (1 pt)
Spurs (1pt)
Utd (0pts)
Everton (1pt)
Chelsea (3pts)

6 out of 15 points which doesn't look great, but the key here is that apart from Utd we've ensured all those teams have dropped at least two crucial points at home each too.

Now looking forward to sequence of games which aren't interjected by those nightmare fixtures (City and Palace aside).
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And just as importantly, in the second half of the season we won't have ANY away matches to the 6 most dangerous teams (inc. Everton for us), all will have to come to Anfield. Maybe by then even the midfield will leave been strengthened by January transfers.
 
steve9 said:
OK. Let me repeat my point: I doubt that any of the best 10 players in Europe is playing in the BPL. So, in order to prove my point I only have to name you 10 players that are better than those you have named above, right?

Silva -- nice but cannot even hold his place in the Spanish national team. Let's take Neymar, because the difference is so huge.
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Your logic is truly baffling. Just because you name one player better than one on the list (in your opinion) that does mean the other isn't also in the Top 10 ...especially when you don't compare like to like as in Neymar to Silva. It's like saying a Ferrari is faster than a Maserati therefore the Maserati is not one of fastest Top 10 cars. Mind bendingly illogical.
 
B20 said:
You have always had it in for Lucas and it's bizarre. He's been our best midfielder this season and has stepped his game up even more under klopp.
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Agree. But we can do better and we are just an injury to Lucas away from a midfield disaster.
 
B20 said:
hes weird. with time on the ball he is a quite good passer. agree about the pressing though.
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Mamadou Sakho made the most passes (76) and posted the highest passing accuracy (92.1%) of any player today.
 
Tommy said:
He's lucky to have stayed on the pitch today. We need someone a little pacier than Lucas who can win the ball back and play it from midfield instead of being a walking foul. Had a good game today, but still, lucky...

He's not a bad player, but it's the position I feel we need to improve on the most. Well, I'm still iffy on Moreno... Going forward I love him. Otherwise, he's pretty naff, ain't he?
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It's interesting to note though that virtually all pundits agreed with the ref. in leaving him on. THAT foul wasn't a particularly bad one, it was just the accumulation effect that had the Chelsea players acting like cnuts. And Clattenberg had missed the Costa studs on Skrtel so maybe he was just evening it up.
 
steve9 said:
I'm German, and therefore not so familiar with the Liverpool vs United rivalry. Maybe you guys can updated me.

Actually, these days, I would think, that your two clubs have a lot in common: A real pedigree.

Your clubs seem to have at least a little bit of freedom over those plastic clubs in City or Chelasa. Am I right? Or is it falsly too romantic, perceived by a German footboll romantic, who is always hoping for the good?
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It's far more than just football. It's historical competition for jobs and business ever since the Manchester Ship Canal was built. Probably the most vitriolic rivalry in football. The fact that we are the two most successful teams in English football, and English teams in Europe, just emphasises the competition between us. But at the end of the day it's still just football and most people can put it aside when real life intervenes.
 
Man of Leisure said:
It'll be a real fight for 4th between them and Spurs. And God forbid, maybe us as well. :nervous:
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It's interesting looking at the next 10 fixtures (which takes us just over half way through the season) for the Top 7 teams (plus Chelsea). Spurs and Liverpool seem to have the easiest fixtures, United, Arsenal & Chelsea next and City & Leicester the toughest. After another 10 games I can see there being very little at the top between City, Arsenal & United but with Spurs and Liverpool having closed up somewhat, Chelsea will have made ground and I think they'll be just outside the Top 5/6. Leicester will have dropped back and West Ham will be out of the Top 8.
 
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Tommy said:
He's lucky to have stayed on the pitch today. We need someone a little pacier than Lucas who can win the ball back and play it from midfield instead of being a walking foul. Had a good game today, but still, lucky...

He's not a bad player, but it's the position I feel we need to improve on the most. Well, I'm still iffy on Moreno... Going forward I love him. Otherwise, he's pretty naff, ain't he?
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He's nowhere near the priority to be replaced. He's responded to Klopp better than anyone. I'm pretty sure he's the first name on the team sheet. You talk as if he gets sent off every other game. What's more, to focus on his fouls today is to ignore how he won Liverpool the midfield battle. Also, the pace thing isn't an issue with Lucas - he's never had pace but still competes well as he reads the game so well. I saw a stat that said he's won most tackles per game this season than any player in the league. He's currently vital.

I'm not saying he's the best there is but to suggest he's the first to be binned is odd given we have an average keeper and a centre back or two in the squad who haven't overly impressed.
 
Rafateria said:
Sturridge : 8th Nov 15
Henderson : 21st Nov 15
Flanagan : 19th Dec 15
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If you avoid other bad injuries, you have good chances to finish in top 4.

Why does Benteke start the games on the bench, fitness or tactics?
 
Treble said:
If you avoid other bad injuries, you have good chances to finish in top 4.

Why does Benteke start the games on the bench, fitness or tactics?
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Benteke himself said that he wasn't at full fitness, after missing most of pre-season training and niggling injuries, and that he was just starting to get close.
 
Tommy said:
He's lucky to have stayed on the pitch today. We need someone a little pacier than Lucas who can win the ball back and play it from midfield instead of being a walking foul. Had a good game today, but still, lucky...
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The fact that's what you choose to accentuate just shows how badly biased you are about him.

He wins 1.5 tackles per game more than the second most most successful tackler in the league. He's doing a very good job of it.

He's not a bad player, but it's the position I feel we need to improve on the most. Well, I'm still iffy on Moreno... Going forward I love him. Otherwise, he's pretty naff, ain't he?
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On recent evidence, there are plenty other positions to improve on more than Lucas'.
 
I'll seemingly have to agree to disagree with everyone else regarding Lucas :D Never mind, eh? I'm genuinely glad he's doing well at the moment, but I don't see it lasting. If he had that little bit of extra pace he had before his series of injury troubles, and broke up the play without giving away a free kick (this isn't just a reactionary response from yesterday - this is something he's struggled with for seasons now), he would be one of the first names on the team sheet.
 
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