Liverpool 2014/15 | WARNING: Contains strong amounts of Scouse nonsense

The Suarez question I would be asking is whether this was a purple patch that he cannot maintain, and the 12-15 goals is the real Suarez, or if this is his level and he will keep it up.
I have no idea, but nobody seems to entertain the idea that hes been playing out of his skin for about 18 months and it wont last. If so, selling him was a great move.

I have a feeling now he has 'made it' to Barca the old diving, moaning, selfish all for glory and mcuh less effective player who was at liverpool for a couple of seasons will return.
 
Poor Southampton! They're soooooo getting relegated.
 
AltiUn said:
But an infinitely worse manager, now we have a better manager.
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Better manager in a new league and has a new team that need picking up from a horror show season. An automatic improvement looks a big ask.
 
redman5 said:
You had better players than us last season too.
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And a very average manager.. Now, we've got a top manager with some top players. Saying you'll be surprised (not you, another poster) if United finish ahead of Liverpool is just an insane thing to say. We've drained the poison of last year; the United this coming season won't resemble, in the slightest, that of last season.
 
PickledRed said:
Better manager in a new league and has a new team that need picking up from a horror show season. An automatic improvement looks a big ask.
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Losing your best player who contributed to nearly half your goals, buying a lot of very average players that need time to bed. An automatic continuation is a big ask.

But that's none of my business.

I know whose shoes I'd rather be in out of van Gaal and Rodgers.
 
ShadesOfTomato said:
Point is you need to stop the slump first and foremost.



No, we had a pretty good season last year. This year's about building further on that, whereas it'll very much be about creating a foundation, for United.
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Do you honestly think you have any chance of "Building" upon a 2nd place achieved with a super star player playing out of his skin, a lack of fixture congestion, a Chelsea playing without a proper striker, a United with Moyesie?
You're stockpiling mid table players.

If you don't think we've already hit utter rock bottom relatively speaking you might be disappointed.
 
Grinner said:
Yes, that's clearly ridiculous. You've got no CL football which is a big advantage. You will definitely do better than 7th.
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Of course. Can't say for sure how much better, but I'm pretty sure Van Gaal won't have us losing so many farcical home points.
That Fulham 2-2 home game said it all about poor Moysie. Something like 50 chances to 2.
 
TooBias said:
Amazing. Just amazing. We have better players and a better manager than Liverpool - Liverpool being the team that has just lost its best player and signed some only-just-above-average ones - yet you'd be surprised if we finish above Liverpool. Incredible reasoning.
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How do you know they are average, how much have you seen of Can and Markovic?

What is amazing is you write us off before a ball has been kicked.

Better players? You need defenders and lack pace. If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
 
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I was dead against Lovren when we were first linked but I've come around to the idea now. Still don't think he's worth what we'll pay(though not as overpriced as Lallana) but I'm not sure who we could get that would be better. Shame Agger will probably be moved on though, think I'm in the minority of Liverpool fans that thinks he's our best centre back, even if he's made of glass.

Overall still disappointed with the transfer window though, and I think it'll be who we get at left back that makes or breaks it, not our next forward acquisition(if we get one). If it's Bertrand I'll be furious, someone decent and it'll make the window look a lot better.
 
johnny boy said:
How do you know they are average, how much have you seen of Can and Markovic?

What is amazing is you write us off before a ball has been kicked.

Better players? You need defenders and lack pace. If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
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Pot calling the kettle. All your fans on here are also writing us off, with the exception of you, being fair.

And Moyes was the reason evidently as the only new additions were Fellaini, Mata and Januzaj the rest of the team were league champions, no way you can say the squad wasn't good enough, poor management on Moyes's behalf the players didn't play to their abilities last season but every fan in England knows how dominant they can be when they are, being in denial about it won't change a thing and won't re-write that the same team who also finished 7th won the league the year before. What was the difference? The manager, so I think that excuse can be very well justified.
 
TooBias said:
Amazing. Just amazing. We have better players and a better manager than Liverpool - Liverpool being the team that has just lost its best player and signed some only-just-above-average ones - yet you'd be surprised if we finish above Liverpool. Incredible reasoning.
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United finished 20 points behind Liverpool last season. That's a massively solid reason and cannot be simply explained away with reference to Moyes on the one hand and Suarez on the other. You have some better players than Liverpool, but also some worse ones. And right now United lack both depth and experience in defence, whilst your midfield options remain comparatively weak, even assuming that Herrera proves to be a hit.

Yes, there are several other factors, like Liverpool's European commitments whilst United have none, but all in all it wouldn't be surprising - as things stand right now with several weeks left in the transfer window - if United finish below Liverpool again.
 
Bob Loblaw said:
I was dead against Lovren when we were first linked but I've come around to the idea now. Still don't think he's worth what we'll pay(though not as overpriced as Lallana) but I'm not sure who we could get that would be better. Shame Agger will probably be moved on though, think I'm in the minority of Liverpool fans that thinks he's our best centre back, even if he's made of glass.

Overall still disappointed with the transfer window though, and I think it'll be who we get at left back that makes or breaks it, not our next forward acquisition(if we get one). If it's Bertrand I'll be furious, someone decent and it'll make the window look a lot better.
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I think Agger is a lot better than Skrtel and if anyone should be moved on it's him, he was lucky not to cost you a lot of penalties last year.

There's worse players you could sign than Bertrand, Moreno would have been an ideal first choice but quite steep at £20m I suppose.
 
redman5 said:
You won the treble 2 years after Cantona retired. Fergie didn't 'replace' him as such, but United went on to becoming a better side without him.
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Exactly, Cantona retired, losing your best player in his prime rocks the ship somewhat, it's further enhanced if you replace him with good to middlers.
United had Paul Scholes already primed as Cantona bowed out, you've got what's essentially Danny Wellbeck with a run of games to fill the Suarez void.
 
Grinner said:
Yes, that's clearly ridiculous. You've got no CL football which is a big advantage. You will definitely do better than 7th.
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Huge advantage . If united doesn't move upwards from 7 th, the mgr should be sacked on the spot.
 
AltiUn said:
I think Agger is a lot better than Skrtel and if anyone should be moved on it's him, he was lucky not to cost you a lot of penalties last year.

There's worse players you could sign than Bertrand, Moreno would have been an ideal first choice but quite steep at £20m I suppose.
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Yep. I can see the logic in selling Agger if we get a good bid just because he's so injury prone that he can't be relied on to string games together. Other than that he should be the last player we sell, our defensive record is much, much better when he starts compared to when Sakho starts (maybe Sakho and Agger would have been even better but Rodgers obviously didn't want to have to two left footed centre backs).

Alberto Moreno isn't really worth £20m but I'm not sure why we were happy to overpay for our first choice in other areas i.e. Lallana, but not in our most problematic area. I'd rather overpay for Alberto Moreno than end up stuck with a player in Bertrand that will leave us in the same situation of needing an upgrade next window.
 
johnny boy said:
How do you know they are average, how much have you seen of Can and Markovic?

What is amazing is you write us off before a ball has been kicked.

Better players? You need defenders and lack pace. If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
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I've seen Can a few times, actually. He's nothing special, but he is young, so I'm not going to write him off, but he'll hardly be an important cog in the Liverpool machine next year anyway. Markovic - no, not seen him. Read a few things. The consensus: one for the future. Again, I don't think he'll be a driver this year, either.

Pace is overrated. City have little in their strongest XI, yet won the league. We're going to sign a defender, that's for sure.

I'm not saying our players are so good, but come on, our team last year was definitely better than 7th. That much is obvious. United, with pretty much this bunch of players has won the league numerous times, finishes SEVENTH. It was as clear an anomaly as I've ever seen. Tottenham under Sherwood finished above us - have they got better players? No. There was known discontent within the group. We had a manager who was tactically deficient. Massive disruption after Fergie's, and his staff's, departure etc. etc.

Then, United sack out-of-his-depth manager, sign a renowned, multi-trophy winning manager, reinvest in the summer. The kinks in the chain have been somewhat remedied already. A few more signings and we're ready.

Liverpool, meanwhile, loses its best player, signs 'possibly/potentially/could be/should be' good players, not to mention their now most important player is hanging on to his legs.

I just don't understand why in a season with two remarkable outliers, people are using it as a benchmark for the future. Last season was extraordinary, and unlikely to be repeated.
 
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GlastonSpur said:
United finished 20 points behind Liverpool last season. That's a massively solid reason and cannot be simply explained away with reference to Moyes on the one hand and Suarez on the other. You have some better players than Liverpool, but also some worse ones. And right now United lack both depth and experience in defence, whilst your midfield options remain comparatively weak, even assuming that Herrera proves to be a hit.

Yes, there are several other factors, like Liverpool's European commitments whilst United have none, but all in all it wouldn't be surprising - as things stand right now with several weeks left in the transfer window - if United finish below Liverpool again.
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I can think of about two players I'd take from Liverpool - Sterling and Coutinho. If we don't sign another midfielder, then maybe Henderson. I'd be surprised - well I wouldn't really, actually - if Liverpool fans would turn down Rafael, Evans, DDG, Rooney, RVP, Herrera or Mata. Hell, I'm pretty sure they'd prefer Shaw over Enrique. Smalling and Jones are better than Skrtel and Agger.
 
johnny boy said:
If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
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The moyes 'excuse' is a pretty good explanation to be fair.
Your right though, without signings were in a battle for fourth spot. A title challenge just isn't realistic with our current squad.

I think your underestimating what a total and utter clusterfeck moyes was though.
His formations, tactics and man management were farcically bad.
Mata on the wing isn't a great player, put him behind a striker and he is.
Kagawa barely played, if he did he was out of position.

All our midfielders were poor, really, really poor.
But moyes insisting they stay behind the ball and sit 2 yards in front of our cb's was idiotic and blatantly a terrible idea.

Smalling on the wing was stupid. Picking valencia and young every bloody week was stupid.
On the few occasions he stumbled to a good performance he'd drop half the team and change the formation the following game.

I dont know what happened to the guy who did a pretty good job with everton for a decade but the guy managing us last season was a total clown.
 
johnny boy said:
How do you know they are average, how much have you seen of Can and Markovic?

What is amazing is you write us off before a ball has been kicked.

Better players? You need defenders and lack pace. If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
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A lot of these players have won PL titles. Something that Liverpool haven't managed in more than 20 years. I think it's fair to say that Moyes at the helm had a lot to do with the collapse, as I'm sure we'll all see next season under a top class manager again.

I can't wait.
 
I can see United battling for the title and I'm not even a United fan.

As mentioned earlier Moyes was so bad you almost couldn't hire a saboteur to do worse.

Even in the one preseason game you can tell there's a completely different aura around this team. It's not going to be 7-0 all the time but I rather doubt we'll see any repeat performances of Fullham or Olympiakos 1st leg from 2013-2014.

The squad still has weaknesses and certain injuries could hamper United a great deal, but I think the easier schedule will allow United to regain its confidence that it had under Fergie and put a lot of pressure on Chelsea and City.

I think Rodgers is a good coach but I think Liverpool is in for a bit of let down from losing Suarez and having Champions league matches.

I would be surprised if Liverpool finishes ahead of United ( Absent serious injuries to key players). This is a great litmus test to see how good of a manager, Rodgers is and can be. If he gets Liverpool in the top 3 then he should be coach of the year.

I just think the league keeps getting stronger and stronger and losing Suarez is more about not being able to keep up with what Pool's rivals are being able to do.
 
Lovren is a decent signing, was good last year. A bit error prone and at times he can look utterly clueless however that was more during his time in France so perhaps he has stopped it. I still do not rake Sahko, Agger or Skrtel. All three are very average for me. Even with Lovren the defence is still pretty average and signing players like Bertrand won't help that.
 
There is a decent chance Liverpools defence next year could be----Johnson-Sakho-Lovren-Bertrand----- Would be poor if thats the case with all the money they have had to spend.
 
Spiersey said:
Lovren is a decent signing, was good last year. A bit error prone and at times he can look utterly clueless however that was more during his time in France so perhaps he has stopped it. I still do not rake Sahko, Agger or Skrtel. All three are very average for me. Even with Lovren the defence is still pretty average and signing players like Bertrand won't help that.
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I think Agger is good but he rarely stays healthy for a full season. Skrtel, Sakho and Toure are utter crap though. If they can play with Lovren and Agger for a good part of the season they will be fine. Its still amazing how they plundered Southampton for any and all players they could get their hands on.
 
Sandikan said:
If you don't think we've already hit utter rock bottom relatively speaking you might be disappointed.
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You think you've hit rock bottom and it's time to come back already? My God, you are in for a rude awakening during your growing years. I know, I've been there.
 
Dumbstar said:
You think you've hit rock bottom and it's time to come back already? My God, you are in for a rude awakening during your growing years. I know, I've been there.
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I love how Liverpool fans constantly compare their own fortunes to United. Just because your club fecked up and spent years trying to get back to where you once were and still are doesn't mean that United will make the same mistakes. Moyes was shite and we swiftly sacked him for a top manager that's already having a big impact on the players. We've also done some top business so far in the window with Herrera and Shaw who will improve us in both positions that needed improving. I know you'd love last season to repeat time and time again, but it was a rarity.
 
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BigDunc9 said:
There is a decent chance Liverpools defence next year could be----Johnson-Sakho-Lovren-Bertrand----- Would be poor if thats the case with all the money they have had to spend.
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Defences that work well often have the support of a solid and protective midfield. I maintain that defensive personnel was not the problem last season, it was more to do with the open way Liverpool set-up.

Regarding the issues at the back. It's odd in some ways. A lot of managers start their 'turn around' from back to front. They sort the defence and then work from that solid platform. Rodgers has taken an innovative approach here. He went on record at the start of last season saying that you need 70+ goals to get into the CL. He then proceeded to set-up his team to be aggressively offensive - essentially blowing teams off the park before they've put their boots on. And it worked and then some.

What Rodgers has yet to do is get his defenders and midfielders to defend. His team doesn't look disciplined yet. However, we are two years in. Final judgements are premature. If you think back to the team he took over. It couldn't score and was prone to lapses at the back. By sorting 50% of that he can now get his defence right.
 
PickledRed said:
Defences that work well often have the support of a solid and protective midfield. I maintain that defensive personnel was not the problem last season, it was more to do with the open way Liverpool set-up.

Regarding the issues at the back. It's odd in some ways. A lot of managers start their 'turn around' from back to front. They sort the defence and then work from that solid platform. Rodgers has taken an innovative approach here. He went on record at the start of last season saying that you need 70+ goals to get into the CL. He then proceeded to set-up his team to be aggressively offensive - essentially blowing teams off the park before they've put their boots on. And it worked and then some.

What Rodgers has yet to do is get his defenders and midfielders to defend. His team doesn't look disciplined yet. However, we are two years in. Final judgements are premature. If you think back to the team he took over. It couldn't score and was prone to lapses at the back. By sorting 50% of that he can now get his defence right.
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If Liverpool signed a proper DM and played him over Gerrard, your defence would massively improve. It is however up for debate whether that is worth losing what Gerrard offers in attack.
 
johnny boy said:
Better players? You need defenders and lack pace. If the players are so good explain the performances last season, without the Moyes 'excuse'.
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We have/had obvious weaknesses in central midfield and out wide. A good manager would either correct those weaknesses or devise a system to lessen their impact. Moyes did the exact opposite; he instructed our midfielders to stay behind the ball (highlighting their lack of creativity) and made the wide areas the vocal point of our attacking play (where we lack quality). He then played our most important players out of position and failed to get the best out of them.

Brendan Rodgers did the exact opposite with you. He removed the deadwood (Carroll, Downing, Adam) who couldn't play his style of football and brought in Coutinho and Sturridge who could play the quick, technical link-up play that would bring out the best in Suarez. Players like Henderson, who weren't highly thought of before last season, are now seen in a greater light because they were given the perfect environment to shine in.

You can't ignore the managers contribution because it's absolutely crucial. Our performance last season was a classic example of a manager not getting the best out of his players just the same as your season was a great example of the reverse. To say otherwise is blatantly incorrect. Our squad was much, much better than results last season would imply. I'm sure of it and confident that Van Gaal will prove that this season.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
I think Agger is good but he rarely stays healthy for a full season. Skrtel, Sakho and Toure are utter crap though. If they can play with Lovren and Agger for a good part of the season they will be fine. Its still amazing how they plundered Southampton for any and all players they could get their hands on.
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Agger has been a shite defender for the past two seasons. Sakho is a very good defender and Skrtel isn't awful either.
 
Shark said:
I love how Liverpool fans constantly compare their own fortunes to United. Just because your club fecked up and spent years trying to get back to where you once were and still are doesn't mean that United will make the same mistakes. Moyes was shite and we swiftly sacked him for a top manager that's already having a big impact on the players. We've also done some top business so far in the window with Herrera and Shaw who will improve us in both positions that needed improving. I know you'd love last season to repeat time and time again, but it was a rarity.
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Herrera and Shaw are about as uninspiring as it gets. Yet they're hailed as some God sends. Shouldn't we be seeing some Pogbas and Vidals soon? Not to mention the Hummels? RvG has proved sweet FA in this league. Same as Rafa had when he won two serie As.

I recognise the 'can't happen to us' euphoria you're going through. Won't end well.
 
This is where our business thus far looks smart. We shouldn't miss Lallana massively now, we have plenty of options. It's a shame though, he's missing all of preseason.
 
Dumbstar said:
You think you've hit rock bottom and it's time to come back already? My God, you are in for a rude awakening during your growing years. I know, I've been there.
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Your still there, one season where your finest asset causes enough chaos to see you take advantage of 3 top clubs suffering managerial change changes nothing.
That asset has since set sail and you've replaced him with a now injured Lallana.
 
Dumbstar said:
Herrera and Shaw are about as uninspiring as it gets. Yet they're hailed as some God sends. Shouldn't we be seeing some Pogbas and Vidals soon? Not to mention the Hummels? RvG has proved sweet FA in this league. Same as Rafa had when he won two serie As.

I recognise the 'can't happen to us' euphoria you're going through. Won't end well.
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Uninspiring? My word, if Liverpool signed one of the hottest English talents around and Herrera I'd hardly say you'd be whistling the same tune. Funny you've the cheek to say that when your own signings have been as uninspiring as it gets despite selling one of the worlds best players. I think it's you guys who are in for the rude awakening.

Our best signing has been LVG anyway who I'm sure will have no problems doing the business in the PL.
 
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