Koke

[Gopher Brown]

Do central midfielders even exist any more? You think every team has them, but when you look closely, actually they are No.10s, wide-midfielders or inverted wingers.

Isn't it ironic that the very thing we need is no longer available!?

On a serious point though, there does seem to be a complete lack of suitable midfielders aged 22-25. I speak from casual observations, but it seems the majority of CMs are 29-33.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Do central midfielders even exist any more? You think every team has them, but when you look closely, actually they are No.10s, wide-midfielders or inverted wingers.

Isn't it ironic that the very thing we need is no longer available!?

On a serious point though, there does seem to be a complete lack of suitable midfielders aged 22-25. I speak from casual observations, but it seems the majority of CMs are 29-33.

Is that just because it is a position that suits older, more experienced, players where discipline is more important than youthful energy. Look at the way Gerrard has converted to a more defensive position for example.

 

[Cassidy]

In the matches i've seen Koke very often caught out of position, which is no surprise given that he like to dribble a lot and he is roaming all over the pitch.

So how exactly would you propose we use him? With Carrick as a CM? I don't think that's gonna fly. As for our creativity problem we have Mata to rectify that.

The thing about analysing him playing for Athletico is that you are looking at him in the Athletico system.
You need to just look at his attributes.


1. Excellent passer of the ball and has good vision
2. Very composed on the ball
3. Extremely good engine and can get up and down the pitch, isn't adverse to tracking back and doesn't neglect defensive responsibility

Those are just some, there is absolutely no reason why he cannot play as a CM, especially with a pre-season and coaching of how we want him to fit into our system.

That is the difference for me between the top coaches/managers, they look at players attributes rather than looking at how they play in a specific role for their current team.

We're not going to setup like Athletico.

 

[Sassy Colin]

Did I read something earlier that Barca wouldn't pay €60M for him?

Well now they will:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/barcelona-president-hints-they-will-outbid-united-koke-1450573?

 

[Godfather]

The few times I saw him I was very impressed. Really think we should go and get him. feck Barca. I don't believe they could outspend us.

 

[El-Manos]

Did I read something earlier that Barca wouldn't pay €60M for him?

Well now they will:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/barcelona-president-hints-they-will-outbid-united-koke-1450573?

I think we can outbid them for once, whether he wants to come here is another story.

 

[Varun]

Seriously doubt either club would pay 60mil for him.

 

[Freak]

Has agent de gea started work on this already?

 

[Rykker_4united]

It doesn't matter his clause, I don't think he'll leave Athletico Madrid for quite some time.

 

[SolidState]

It doesn't matter his clause, I don't think he'll leave Athletico Madrid for quite some time.

So lets say we meet his clause, contractually the club would be helpless to keep him. We then offer double or even triple his current wages? hooks up with Juan and Agent De Gea...almost every player at every team is quoted as saying "I am happy at this club and am focused on the world cup".

Its not a stretch of the imagination that IF we meet his clause he will come to us, unless of course Barca are happy to do the same and im pretty sure they will.

 

[Van Piorsing]

Let's take our chances and send them a serious offer. Let the player know that United are rating his talent. Agent De Gea will do the rest.

 

[Rykker_4united]

So lets say we meet his clause, contractually the club would be helpless to keep him. We then offer double or even triple his current wages? hooks up with Juan and Agent De Gea...almost every player at every team is quoted as saying "I am happy at this club and am focused on the world cup".

Its not a stretch of the imagination that IF we meet his clause he will come to us, unless of course Barca are happy to do the same and im pretty sure they will.

It is a stretch of the imagination. This is more than, "I am happy at Athletico" this is "I've been here for most my life and I feel I was born to play here"

 

[pocco]

Koke and Carvalho are/were my no1 picks for midfield this summer. If we got one of them I'd be happy. Koke would be ideal for us.

I'm going to wait for more solid links before I even begin to get excited about this one though. Just seems like another throwaway article with no substance to it.

 

[Adnan]

Koke and Carvalho are/were my no1 picks for midfield this summer. If we got one of them I'd be happy. Koke would be ideal for us.

I'm going to wait for more solid links before I even begin to get excited about this one though. Just seems like another throwaway article with no substance to it.

Just out of curiosity, why is Carvalho amongst your no 1 picks?

 

[RedorDead21]

Just out of curiosity, why is Carvalho amongst your no 1 picks?

Because he is showing the type of game which we have needed in midfield for several years. Is young, a fantastic prospect with great potential and has been the best player in Portugal this season for a CM.....probably along these lines...

 

[Adnan]

Because he is showing the type of game which we have needed in midfield for several years. Is young, a fantastic prospect with great potential and has been the best player in Portugal this season for a CM.....probably along these lines...

I've been following Carvalho since we started getting linked to him under Moyes, and I have to say from the games I've seen him in I've been disappointed.

His shooting technique is quite poor and his technique in tight spaces is quite suspect. I know the Sporting fans will disagree with me but I personally think he's a player that a team challenging for the Europa League would go for, not a team that has aspirations of winning the BPL. Mo Diame at West Ham would be a better purchase and I don't particularly rate him either.

If a team does activate his buy-out clause, then they will be the biggest mugs since Liverpool when they bought Carrol.

 

[Ekeke]

Ha no, the clause seems well over the top but Carvalho looks a good player. Has everything needed to be a better version of Carrick

 

[RedorDead21]

I've been following Carvalho since we started getting linked to him under Moyes, and I have to say from the games I've seen him in I've been disappointed.

His shooting technique is quite poor and his technique in tight spaces is quite suspect. I know the Sporting fans will disagree with me but I personally think he's a player that a team challenging for the Europa League would go for, not a team that has aspirations of winning the BPL. Mo Diame at West Ham would be a better purchase and I don't particularly rate him either.

If a team does activate his buy-out clause, then they will be the biggest mugs since Liverpool when they bought Carrol.

I think your opinion is ludicrous. The boy is a CM and not an AM. Fabregas had a crap scoring record until his final season at Arsenal. claude makelele wasnt great at opening up defences. Barkley's goals and assist record is garbage. Judging Carvalho on his attacking abilities right now is like judging Carricks on his. As for him in tight spaces....he's already far superior to carrick and some believe he's been a great player for us.

 

[BW.k]

We should fire Woody and let De Gea do his magic.

 

[Adnan]

I think your opinion is ludicrous. The boy is a CM and not an AM. Fabregas had a crap scoring record until his final season at Arsenal. claude makelele wasnt great at opening up defences. Barkley's goals and assist record is garbage. Judging Carvalho on his attacking abilities right now is like judging Carricks on his. As for him in tight spaces....he's already far superior to carrick and some believe he's been a great player for us.

Did I say he was a AM?

I said his shooting technique is poor from what I've seen, doesn't mean I'm criticizing him for his attacking capabilities, he's a DM. I don't understand why you are bringing Barkley and Makelele into this.

He's already far superior to Carrick after one good season in the Portuguese League? that is a big statement to make. I don't believe he will ever reach the standard that Carrick has displayed at his peak, and I would take Lars Bender, Ander Iturasspe over Carvalho any day of the week. They're technically superior to Carvalho and have displayed their talents at a higher level also.

 

[northbynorthwest]

I've been following Carvalho since we started getting linked to him under Moyes, and I have to say from the games I've seen him in I've been disappointed.

His shooting technique is quite poor and his technique in tight spaces is quite suspect. I know the Sporting fans will disagree with me but I personally think he's a player that a team challenging for the Europa League would go for, not a team that has aspirations of winning the BPL. Mo Diame at West Ham would be a better purchase and I don't particularly rate him either.

If a team does activate his buy-out clause, then they will be the biggest mugs since Liverpool when they bought Carrol.

I would add credence to your argument. I think carvalho has been overhyped hugely. Now would he be better than what we have at the moment? Yes, but i wouldnt be expecting monumental performances from him. A lot of these players are coming from leagues that arent near as tough as the PL. And to assume he transfers his quality in one league to the PL, may not be true.

United have such high demands that it is rare that a player meets them. RVP did last season, ronaldo did. Vidic did and evra. But even a player like rooney comes in for criticism for his performances.

hes not worth the buy out clause.

 

[northbynorthwest]

So lets say we meet his clause, contractually the club would be helpless to keep him. We then offer double or even triple his current wages? hooks up with Juan and Agent De Gea...almost every player at every team is quoted as saying "I am happy at this club and am focused on the world cup".

Its not a stretch of the imagination that IF we meet his clause he will come to us, unless of course Barca are happy to do the same and im pretty sure they will.

the mail are saying 57,000 a week. Theyd have to offer more than that to get him to sign. Id be thinking the 100,000 mark after tax, would do the trick.

United could offer him, four years in england and then a chance to move back to spain, with a hefty fee of course.

 

[pocco]

Just out of curiosity, why is Carvalho amongst your no 1 picks?

He's young but he's got the ingredients of a really dominant midfielder. He needs a good coach to nurture that talent now and guide him to becoming the player that makes best use of those skills.

I've never been a big fan of throwing huge money at players that are already at the top clubs and have won everything. Our best signings are young and hungry that can go on to become club legends. I'd never consider someone like Fabregas or RVP to be United legends.

 

[RedorDead21]

Did I say he was a AM?

I said his shooting technique is poor from what I've seen, doesn't mean I'm criticizing him for his attacking capabilities, he's a DM. I don't understand why you are bringing Barkley and Makelele into this.

He's already far superior to Carrick after one good season in the Portuguese League? that is a big statement to make. I don't believe he will ever reach the standard that Carrick has displayed at his peak, and I would take Lars Bender, Ander Iturasspe over Carvalho any day of the week. They're technically superior to Carvalho and have displayed their talents at a higher level also.

For his age with a record number of player of the month awards for the portuguese league I can say yes he has the potential to be a better player than Carrick. Already in tight area's I think he's phenomenal unlike your assertions. His passing is one of his strengths, he's a better physical specimen. He's quicker. I say all this knowing it would take a great manager to make him reach the level we require but surely thats why we have Van Gaal. I also dont like his incredible price quotes and I will leave it in the better judgement of Van Gaal. But Carrick at his age for me was no better.

 

[Adnan]

For his age with a record number of player of the month awards for the portuguese league I can say yes he has the potential to be a better player than Carrick. Already in tight area's I think he's phenomenal unlike your assertions. His passing is one of his strengths, he's a better physical specimen. He's quicker. I say all this knowing it would take a great manager to make him reach the level we require but surely thats why we have Van Gaal. I also dont like his incredible price quotes and I will leave it in the better judgement of Van Gaal. But Carrick at his age for me was no better.

I am amazed you think he's phenomenal in tight areas, Iniesta, Messi and Xavi are 3 players I would put in the phenomenal category and I don't believe Carvalho even comes close.

Carrick when he was making his name at West Ham in his early career was a more attack minded cm who displayed much better technique, he was 18 when he made his debut for West Ham in the EPL. Carvalho was on loan to Brugge in Belgium in the 2012/13 season and was very average in his time there. I hope Bento starts him in the World Cup against Germany, that's a game I believe he will get pressed in midfield by the Germans and his inferior technique at that level will be exposed.

Carvalho was a Moyes target I would assume and I'm not surprised we're not linked to him anymore now Van Gaal has been announced as the manager.

 

[Nights]

Has agent de gea started work on this already?

I hope so.

Maybe he's just using Cesc as a smokescreen...

 

[Herman Van Rompuy]

He's young but he's got the ingredients of a really dominant midfielder. He needs a good coach to nurture that talent now and guide him to becoming the player that makes best use of those skills.

I've never been a big fan of throwing huge money at players that are already at the top clubs and have won everything. Our best signings are young and hungry that can go on to become club legends. I'd never consider someone like Fabregas or RVP to be United legends.

It's funny how you crucified me for rating Daley Blind yet you're in here making similar arguments to my own in favour of signing another young, unproven midfielder. Tell me, why isn't Carvalho just some random player you're trying to blow smoke up everybody's ass about? Is it because he was a David Moyes target or because sums up to 37 million have been mentioned in the same sentence? Take your pick.

 

[NMF]

For some reason it's impossible for us to sign a central midfielder.

 

[FCBarca]

My order of preference for Barcelona, in terms of fit, was Gündoğan, Koke & then Pogba. But if they are indeed to splash that much money on a CM, I'd prefer it was Pogba based on upside

 

[itso 7]

He's young but he's got the ingredients of a really dominant midfielder. He needs a good coach to nurture that talent now and guide him to becoming the player that makes best use of those skills.

I've never been a big fan of throwing huge money at players that are already at the top clubs and have won everything. Our best signings are young and hungry that can go on to become club legends. I'd never consider someone like Fabregas or RVP to be United legends.

For close to £40m you'd think we'd be looking for someone more accomplished not a project . Potential, like we saw with Anderson and Nani, is a double edged sword and that outlay is a risk too far .

 

[Raoul]

For close to £40m you'd think we'd be looking for someone more accomplished not a project . Potential, like we saw with Anderson and Nani, is a double edged sword and that outlay is a risk too far .

How much more "accomplished" does a player need to be than Koke ? He just won the league and came within a hair of winning the CL, and is also a full international for the World and European cup holders.

 

[itso 7]

How much more "accomplished" does a player need to be than Koke ? He just won the league and came within a hair of winning the CL, and is also a full international for the World and European cup holders.

Think he was talking about Carvalho ....

 

[Raoul]

I'll get my coat.

 

[Drifter]

Atletico Madrid midfielder Koke has declared: "I am very happy at Atletico, it's my home. I don't think about the future, I only have to live the present and think about Atletico. I have a long contract, and I am happy about it. I am honored about many club's interested, but I want to stay"

 

[Mister_Stubbs]

Put's a stop to that idea then.. off to the erm, Ander Herrera thread?

 

[Rozay]

The clause had to have been agreed by all parties. If Koke was really as untransferable as people are making out, why didn't they just put a 100m or 150m clause in his deal like many other players have?

All parties must have agreed that 60m would have to change everything, regardless of how committed they may be to one another.

 

[RDCR07]

Put's a stop to that idea then.. off to the erm, Ander Herrera thread?

We still have Cesc to go after.

 

[Red Dreams]

so we are using Anderson as (dead)weight...(that's a lot of weight too) to get Koke?

 

[Cal?]

Atletico Madrid midfielder Koke has declared: "I am very happy at Atletico, it's my home. I don't think about the future, I only have to live the present and think about Atletico. I have a long contract, and I am happy about it. I am honored about many club's interested, but I want to stay"

That's all very well, if only he threw in the "Only God knows..." we'd be in full swing.

 

[Sb_16]

Atletico Madrid midfielder Koke has declared: "I am very happy at Atletico, it's my home. I don't think about the future, I only have to live the present and think about Atletico. I have a long contract, and I am happy about it. I am honored about many club's interested, but I want to stay"

Job application rejected. Apply next year when you develop some ambition and cure your home sickness.

We at United prefer hungry, determined players with big cojones. :-)