A significant pay rise.
John Stones | Everton say they will reject all bids
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
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I'd rather we looked long term and I don't think Otamendi over Stones would make us any more likely to win the PL in truth.
He'd get a move to a big club. A big signing on fee.
But I highly doubt that will happen regardless.
He'd definitely be a long term investment but I feel alongside a more experienced centre half he would also be ready to deliver in the immediate future.
We could do well with someone of Stones composure and passing ability in the backline as well, something Otamendi also would improve but not as much. LvG should be getting wet at the prospect of Stones in our defense.
That's why I'm surprised we are not at the front of the cue, he ticks the LvG boxes for a CB, he likes working with young players, there aren't any truly top level senior CB's on the market and he's also a top English talent which is something United have always tried to cherry pick.
I'm just saying it could be a sweetner for both Everton & Stones - maybe chuck in Evans also.
Stones would be guaranteed a full season of games at Everton & would have a great chance to make the England squad (maybe even start) for the Euro's next summer & then he moves to us. Everton would have a full season with him & not have to freak out too much about replacing him & Evans would replace Distin too..
He'd get a much better contract with another couple of years of regular football, if people think he's worth 30m now, a great season with everton and he's worth 50m, and treble the salary he'd get now from chelsea.
Seconded. And like Shaw, he's the kind of young player who can and should play now in our side.
Of course, we might be skeptical about his age and lack of experience playing against him. However, I guess we can also get over that obstacle after seeing Shaw and Darmian showing huge amounts of composure at a young age.
How old do you think Darmian is? He's 25
I think he'd step straight in, he may lack CL experience but that isn't our biggest concern this coming season, he has good PL experience just like Shaw who I also expect to be the regular LB starter for us.
LvG will be looking for an experienced top-class CB to increase his chances of silverware in his final years of football - which is fair enough, but that's not lookin at the long-term success for us though & Stones would massively increase our chances of success in the future.
If Stones wants to leave then we've gotta be on this big time, but we'd still need someone of Otamendi's ilk to be the leader at the back, which would probably be a problem for Stones coming here - less game time maybe, than he would at Everton..
As i said previously, buy both Stones & Otamendi & if Stones wants to stay at Everton on loan for a season - then fair enough, but if he wants come to us straight away - even better..
If Stones wants to leave then we've gotta be on this big time, but we'd still need someone of Otamendi's ilk to be the leader at the back, which would probably be a problem for Stones coming here - less game time maybe, than he would at Everton..
As i said previously, buy both Stones & Otamendi & if Stones wants to stay at Everton on loan for a season - then fair enough, but if he wants come to us straight away - even better..
It doesn't matter; he already made his mark in Serie A for the last few years. What he learned from elsewhere is helping us well at the moment.
The thing is mate there isn't anything to really show Otamendi is a leader, yes he is older than Stones but he's really only had one good season in a top league and Garay is the leader internationally, hell he wasn't even first choice as recently as last summers WC.
If we were talking Ramos vs Stones then the case is clear cut, but Otamendi has nowhere near those credentials. I know you badly want 2 CB's and believe me I'm with you, but we didn't just hand winkin' and blinkin' new 4 year deals for shits and giggles, and we still have Rojo and the very promising McNair as well as Blind now seemingly in the CB mix. We are only going to get one CB if we get one at all, and I'd rather see us opt for the player that can give us 10+ years than a player with one good season under his belt who isn't even LvG's type of CB.
I'm sold - Stones it is then
Excellent!
Stones and Pedro to complete this window and we'll sort out the other 2 or 3 positions next summer!Excellent!
Yeah, Stones & Pedro in alright & keeping Dave for another season, he might even change his mind at some stage during the season & want to stay too.
That would be a pretty sweet summer - best i can think of tbh. Can you think of a better one man?
..oh & a world-class Striker in too of course ;-)
Oh yeah keeping De Gea is a must, it would be great if we could change his mind but if not it will give us another season to monitor keepers like Leno and Oblak.
As good as that dazzling summer of Obertan, Owen and Valencia?
I'd say the best yes, maybe lacking that one wow factor attacking signing as Memphis is still not the finished article, but overall it would add quality right across the team.Next summer my man!
Oh yeah keeping De Gea is a must, it would be great if we could change his mind but if not it will give us another season to monitor keepers like Leno and Oblak.
As good as that dazzling summer of Obertan, Owen and Valencia?
Next summer my man!
Had to think deep & hard about this one man, but yeah - jusssssst abouuuuut better than that summer of "The 3 Amigo's"..
To be honest man - f*ck the wow factor signing if we dont get one. We had 2 wow factor signings last season & they were shite, so its not a given it'll work out this time either.
I couldnt even be arsed thinkin about who would be great to sign in that category either, because it seems the elite players are beyond reach for one reason or another. If it happens then fantastic, but it would be a big surprise to me if we got one.
We've been extremely practical & commonsensical with our signings this summer. We bought a top-class RB - one that me, you & many on here really wanted.
We've sorted central midfield too & have one of the best in Europe now. Us fans wanted that more than anything i reckon - after being sick to death seeing the same failings over the past number of years in that area.
We just need a CB & Stones should be on our radar. The debate is whether Stones will be able to step up to our level straight away because of his age, but Rio stepped up when he went to Leeds & played in a Champions League semi-final around the same age as Stones, so what's not to say he cant step up in a similar way to that of Rio?!
Ok boss - maybe we'll wait til next summer for the world-class Striker then.. spoil-sport :-)
The three of them standing together being presented was like we'd accidentally changed places with Hull.
I can't really think of a wow signing either, Reus being maybe the only option and in truth there'd be a concern that he's too fragile for the PL like Di Maria.
Yeah, our business has been efficent and smart as well as reasonably priced. We got the RB and midfield sorted out, those were key areas and were attended to properly.
With Stones I think his performance in the derby at Anfield in the Mersey derby last season showed he has the mentality for the big game, and as Fergie used to say when you give young players a chance they'll often surprise you.
Not by choice, it's just gonna take longer for Pep and Lewa to fall out completely. *smirk*
Gimenez apparently has a release clause of 22m euros or so. He is at around the same level of Stones. In fact from all young top CB (Laporte, Varane, Gimenez, Marquinhos and Stones), Gimenez had easily the best season.
Again young and latin we seem to have a bit of a problem there, DDG does ring a bell ..
I think it depends more in the player than in nationality. Look at Valencia, he might be our most loyal player.
Anyway, I would prefer Stones to Gimenez cause of Stones ball playing abilities. In LVG system, a Rio is better than a Vidic.
I would take Stones as a first pick over any other CB . But I haven't lost faith in Smalling and Jones as a CB pairing yet .
But that is purely based on nationality, not on what we need. For example, Laporte is currently better, both have world class potential and Laporte is a left footer which would be an improvement on Rojo for LCB, while Stones at the moment won't be an improvement on Smalling/Hones for the RCB position.
Hummels, Ramos or Pique would be the best solution in any case. Can play in both sides, are world class defenders and are fantastic in the ball.
That's mental, he hasn't shown the same heights as Smalling/ Jones, they were just as hyped early on, and they should serve as good reminders potential is not guaranteed ability, there's a big difference. Stones, while looking great has it all to prove, similar to Jones/ Smalling.
Stones looks far more classy than Smalling/Jones though. Great on the ball, calm as feck.
I agree that Smalling/Jones are currently better, but I would be extremely surprised if that will be the case in a couple of season.
I'm saying compare them all at a similar age, and he doesn't look any better than Jones on the ball at that age at all, or anywhere near Smalling considering he was playing non league football 12 months prior.
Stones is currently better in the ball than Jones/Smalling despite being 2 (respectively 4) years younger.
I'd argue Jones/ Smalling aren't any better on the ball than when they were first picked up by United, during SAF, on the ball ability wasn't a big demand for his CB's, he wanted stone walls like Vidic and smart players like Ferdinand who had good enough vision to intercept the play.
It's all hindsight admittedly but go back and watch Smalling/ Jones at that age..
Ramos would have been a good signing, but thought he was playing United. We need to look at the short and long term, and Stones could be a very good option. Despite what people think, there is a lack of top defenders even at teams like City and Arsenal. Their midfield covers up for their defenders a lot of the times. United showed against City how bad their defense was. Chelsea have Terry who is still class, but i don't think Cahill is better than Smalling. I would rather spend a significant amount of money on Stones and let him compete with Smalling, Jones, Rojo and maybe even Evans if he gets his head right.
Yes, but that's the point isn't it? Cahill (or Zouma) has Terry playing next to him - organising, talking, leading - and making Cahill (or Zouma) a better player. That's what we need.
No one like Terry available. Ramos is not coming, and Otamendi is just fan hype.
How do you know this?
Stones has more potential and talent than either Smalling or Jones did imo. Though they're obviously better right now.
Defensively might not be the finished product but is a very classy footballer. He'd be a fantastic long-term addition if he can be signed.
Yup we should go all out for him. Let's not leave any stones unturned...
Will get out now...
Will get out now...
I'd rather have Stones than any of the young foreign equivalents. The last world class player we groomed fecked us off and gave his best years to Real Madrid. The next player we turned into a world class talent is about to do exactly the same, I'm not interested in grooming another one for them.
Just watching football gives you and idea on how good a player is.
As talented as he is, he's not exactly the profile of centre back we should be after. We need a ready-made, established star who instantly becomes our standout centre back and leader. Stones still has a lot of developing to do and is behind Smalling as it stands too.
That said, if we sign him I'm not opposed. He's a talented, English player and I can't be against them.
That said, if we sign him I'm not opposed. He's a talented, English player and I can't be against them.
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