Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

[berbatrick]

Is that not the case though, when it comes to Hamas?

I mean, they're not as explicit about it as the Houthi's but...

This is an extract of article 7 of the Hamas Charter and this is about as defining as it gets when it comes to motivations that come from ancient hatreds (and I mean ancient, try 1300 years ago ancient)

1. Hamas has a new charter
2. There has been violence from Palestinians towards Jewish settlers for about 100 years now, long before Hamas existed. For many reasons, I believe the bulk of that violence, including Ovt 7th, is motivated by the 2nd rather than 1st characteristic. (And conversely that most of the violence by these settlers against Palestinians is driven by their characteristic as existing inhabitants on that land, rather than being Muslim).
3. This statement is in the context of Holocaust remembrance day. Hitler and other Europeans did the Holocaust after many different European entities carrying out centuries-long violence repression of Jews, dwarfing the repression seen in the Middle East.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

Is that not the case though, when it comes to Hamas?

I mean, they're not as explicit about it as the Houthi's but...

This is an extract of article 7 of the Hamas Charter and this is about as defining as it gets when it comes to motivations that come from ancient hatreds (and I mean ancient, try 1300 years ago ancient)

No. I'm not sure why you'd take a charter seriously.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

The 2020 Democratic Party platform (let's call it their 'charter') says "protest is among the highest forms of patriotism." It later claims that "Democrats are committed to following the rule of law and will uphold the First Amendment right to peaceably assemble."

Do Democrats actually believe that? Of course not. It's just words, propaganda, etc.

 

[Adisa]

Apartheid state and should be treated as such.

 

[Sweet Square]

TBH I've said all along that I understand and would probably agree with those who vote for him as a lesser of two evils, but after this speech, feck him. Rot in hell. Irredeemable piece of shit. "Motivated by ancient hatreds" and "protestors are anti-semitic."
Trump will end my career aspirations in the US in multiple different ways, but he might put Biden in jail for some Hunter-related BS, and that's a small measure of justice in this world.

Biden would be comfortable with wiping out every Palestinian in Gaza. His brain is the most racist magic 8 ball imaginable.

 

[berbatrick]

they're burning alive trapped kids and have buried alive trapped hospital patients



...

 

[Idxomer]

 

[MDFC Manager]

they're burning alive trapped kids and have buried alive trapped hospital patients

It's fine, they're only eliminating ancient hatred

 

[VorZakone]

 

[neverdie]

they're burning alive trapped kids and have buried alive trapped hospital patients



...

All 14 public universities, according to media reports, have been destroyed. What Israel has done here will go down in infamy as will all tethering their careers and whatever legacy they think they could/would have to this Israeli regime.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/internati...s-it-s-a-war-against-education_6592965_4.html

12, not 14, but the point remains.

 

[Smores]

What I find mad is you look at tweets talking about US objections to the worst IDF acts and you see countless Israelis accusing Dems of being Hamas supporters.

Despite all the backing and arms sales they still want complete impunity to murder at will.

 

[Suv666]

I don’t get why people are worried about the Tik Tok ban.

The reason why the platform appears “pro-Palestine” is because young people are on it.
If its banned and they shift to a different social media platform it would become similar.

Which I think would actually do more good. Its all millennials and Gen Z on Tik Tok, if they migrate to say Instagram (probably the natural choice) you’d at least get less of an echo chamber.

Their views might reach some boomers and conservatives and just might help in changing attitudes.

 

[Idxomer]

I don’t get why people are worried about the Tik Tok ban.

The reason why the platform appears “pro-Palestine” is because young people are on it.
If its banned and they shift to a different social media platform it would become similar.

Which I think would actually do more good. Its all millennials and Gen Z on Tik Tok, if they migrate to say Instagram (probably the natural choice) you’d at least get less of an echo chamber.

Their views might reach some boomers and conservatives and just might help in changing attitudes.

Personally, I don't care that much about it. I don't use TikTok, and very likely never will. It clearly rattled some feathers in the US because of the overwhelming support of Palestinians on it. It didn't have, as far as I know, the same suppression of pro-Palestinian voices that has been happening on Meta and X.

 

[Raoul]

I don’t get why people are worried about the Tik Tok ban.

The reason why the platform appears “pro-Palestine” is because young people are on it.
If its banned and they shift to a different social media platform it would become similar.

Which I think would actually do more good. Its all millennials and Gen Z on Tik Tok, if they migrate to say Instagram (probably the natural choice) you’d at least get less of an echo chamber.

Their views might reach some boomers and conservatives and just might help in changing attitudes.

I don't think it would make a difference in either case. The legal case would take years to adjudicate in US courts, during which Tik Tok will still be available. Nevermind all the other social networks that will continue to get used by protestor (Hamas have a Telegram account that they use for their official communications). If a non-Chinese company emerges to buy Byte Dance over the next 12 months, then Tik Tok won't be going anywhere at all.

 

[Idxomer]

 

[Ish]

All 14 public universities, according to media reports, have been destroyed. What Israel has done here will go down in infamy as will all tethering their careers and whatever legacy they think they could/would have to this Israeli regime.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/internati...s-it-s-a-war-against-education_6592965_4.html

12, not 14, but the point remains.

I’m sure all those universities were just there for show, to conceal underground hamas tunnels. There’s no way the most moral army in the world would systematically & intentionally destroy a populations future like that!

 

[Idxomer]

The images today and yesterday from Rafah and Gaza City are as harrowing as anything we've seen before in this genocide.

 

[Idxomer]

I’m sure all those universities were just there for show, to conceal underground hamas tunnels. There’s no way the most moral army in the world would systematically & intentionally destroy a populations future like that!

There's a video of them shooting at empty tents today.

 

[Ish]

There's a video of them shooting at empty tents today.

Yep and nothing will happen to them, sadly. No accountability.

 

[Frosty]

David Lammy tells US Republicans he can find ‘common cause’ with Trump

In Washington DC speech, shadow foreign secretary says Labour ‘will always work with US, whoever wins’

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ns-he-can-find-common-cause-with-donald-trump

Worth reading the whole article, but Lammy gave his perspective of Labour's official position if elected:

Asked about the protests on campuses over the Israeli treatment of Palestinians in Gaza, he said: “There is a difference between peaceful protest of the kind Mandela would have advocated, and violence and rioting.” He added that he was concerned that the bandwidth of western democracies was growing slimmer. “I am outraged at what is happening to ordinary folk in Sudan, in the Democratic Republic of Congo, in Yemen, in Haiti. Why are we really not up in arms about these issues as well?

“I say gently to those who concentrate singly on a very ancient and terrible, terrible war that is taking place in Gaza: but let us not crowd out a lot of people suffering in our world today and underlining that the US and UK have to stand firm on so many fronts today.”

 

[maniak]

David Lammy tells US Republicans he can find ‘common cause’ with Trump

In Washington DC speech, shadow foreign secretary says Labour ‘will always work with US, whoever wins’

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ns-he-can-find-common-cause-with-donald-trump

Worth reading the whole article, but Lammy gave his perspective of Labour's official position if elected:

Asked about the protests on campuses over the Israeli treatment of Palestinians in Gaza, he said: “There is a difference between peaceful protest of the kind Mandela would have advocated, and violence and rioting.” He added that he was concerned that the bandwidth of western democracies was growing slimmer. “I am outraged at what is happening to ordinary folk in Sudan, in the Democratic Republic of Congo, in Yemen, in Haiti. Why are we really not up in arms about these issues as well?

“I say gently to those who concentrate singly on a very ancient and terrible, terrible war that is taking place in Gaza: but let us not crowd out a lot of people suffering in our world today and underlining that the US and UK have to stand firm on so many fronts today.”

Is he talking about the mandela who said this?

Force is the only language the imperialists can hear, and no country became free without some sort of violence.

 

[Sweet Square]

Asked about the protests on campuses over the Israeli treatment of Palestinians in Gaza, he said: “There is a difference between peaceful protest of the kind Mandela would have advocated, and violence and rioting.”

“Violence was the only weapon that would destroy apartheid.” - Nelson Mandela

I think Lammy might be confusing Mandela with Martin Luther King Jr. Which would be very on brand for Lammy. Also

Lammy really is the perfect liberal

 

[RedTiger]

B

David Lammy tells US Republicans he can find ‘common cause’ with Trump

In Washington DC speech, shadow foreign secretary says Labour ‘will always work with US, whoever wins’

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ns-he-can-find-common-cause-with-donald-trump

Worth reading the whole article, but Lammy gave his perspective of Labour's official position if elected:

Asked about the protests on campuses over the Israeli treatment of Palestinians in Gaza, he said: “There is a difference between peaceful protest of the kind Mandela would have advocated, and violence and rioting.” He added that he was concerned that the bandwidth of western democracies was growing slimmer. “I am outraged at what is happening to ordinary folk in Sudan, in the Democratic Republic of Congo, in Yemen, in Haiti. Why are we really not up in arms about these issues as well?

“I say gently to those who concentrate singly on a very ancient and terrible, terrible war that is taking place in Gaza: but let us not crowd out a lot of people suffering in our world today and underlining that the US and UK have to stand firm on so many fronts today.”

A fecking ancient war?

 

[maniak]

Western politicians losing their fecking minds over israel.

 

[VorZakone]

 

[Idxomer]

They didn't actually withhold this type and the IOF have been using dumb bombs anyway.

 

[4bars]

They didn't actually withhold this type and the IOF have been using dumb bombs anyway.

And it is basically using civilians as human shields. If you don't give us what we want, we will kill even more civilians

 

[berbatrick]

They didn't actually withhold this type and the IOF have been using dumb bombs anyway.

this was back in december:

Nearly half of the air-to-ground munitions that Israel has used in Gaza in its war with Hamas since October 7 have been unguided, otherwise known as “dumb bombs,” according to a new US intelligence assessment.

The assessment, compiled by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence and described to CNN by three sources who have seen it, says that about 40-45% of the 29,000 air-to-ground munitions Israel has used have been unguided. The rest have been precision-guided munitions, the assessment says.

 

[VorZakone]

 

[Sir Matt]

The fact that Biden is saying this publicly and not through leaks seems pretty big, assuming he stands by it. The administration finally tired of Netanyahu and Israel constantly torpedoing any possible hostage deal in their desire to level all of Gaza.

 

[Idxomer]

It does seem significant; let's see what will happen with the negotiations in the next few days.

 

[the_cliff]

The fact that Biden is saying this publicly and not through leaks seems pretty big, assuming he stands by it. The administration finally tired of Netanyahu and Israel constantly torpedoing any possible hostage deal in their desire to level all of Gaza.

I wonder what made him say this, there's a clue if you see his full quotes.

 

[Shez]

I don't think it would make a difference in either case. The legal case would take years to adjudicate in US courts, during which Tik Tok will still be available. Nevermind all the other social networks that will continue to get used by protestor (Hamas have a Telegram account that they use for their official communications). If a non-Chinese company emerges to buy Byte Dance over the next 12 months, then Tik Tok won't be going anywhere at all.

Have a word with yourself - putting the hamas point in brackets immediately post protestors is disingenuous conflation

 

[MDFC Manager]

They didn't actually withhold this type and the IOF have been using dumb bombs anyway.

The Israeli bloodlust is truly incredible.

 

[Adisa]

I do fear we have gotten lost in this war(if you can call it that) mass killing and genocide is more appropriate.
Some have forgotten what led us here. And that’s apartheid. The West Bank is not even being discussed (understandably). 21st century apartheid, segregation and Jim Crow rolled into one. I fear once there’s a ceasefire, everyone takes a sigh of relief and says can we all go home now.
I have no respect for anyone that defends this shit in any way.

 

[Idxomer]

Have a word with yourself - putting the hamas point in brackets immediately post protestors is disingenuous conflation

And it makes no sense unless they mean that Hamas sends subliminal messages to the protestors through their channels or something.

I missed it, but I try to avoid as much nonsense as possible in these forums. If ever a post needs a quality control label.

 

[FrankDrebin]

I do fear we have gotten lost in this war(if you can call it that) mass killing and genocide is more appropriate.
Some have forgotten what led us here. And that’s apartheid. The West Bank is not even being discussed (understandably). 21st century apartheid, segregation and Jim Crow rolled into one. I fear once there’s a ceasefire, everyone takes a sigh of relief and says can we all go home now.
I have no respect for anyone that defends this shit in any way.

That was a great post/vid. Thank you.

 

[Idxomer]

I do fear we have gotten lost in this war(if you can call it that) mass killing and genocide is more appropriate.
Some have forgotten what led us here. And that’s apartheid. The West Bank is not even being discussed (understandably). 21st century apartheid, segregation and Jim Crow rolled into one. I fear once there’s a ceasefire, everyone takes a sigh of relief and says can we all go home now.
I have no respect for anyone that defends this shit in any way.

Don't forget occupation and colonization, and they have a government led by their people who also contribute to this oppression. A sort of Vichy government for Palestinians as Edward Said described it. All the tested forms of oppression from the last century have been applied to these people.

Unfortunately, it's what most were comfortable with before.

 

[Idxomer]

Some politicians are going crazy because Biden is doing less than the bare minimum after 7 months of supporting the mass killing of children.

 

[Idxomer]

Sick people who were supposed to get out are dying.