Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

That has to be one of the most naive posts ever on the caf. In every single war soldiers commit crimes, no matter what side they are on and what orders they got.

And which of the things he said are any sort of indication to crimes committed?
 
If you work in the public sector or for public institutions in Germany and paint the cruel murder of civilians, especially Jewish ones, as something without alternative, you‘re done. Within seconds. And rightly so.



Do you think he will face any consequences? He seems to be a businessman but with some activities with a party currently in your central government.
 


Do you think he will face any consequences? He seems to be a businessman but with some activities with a party currently in your central government.

He'll face none.

I wouldn't consider him as some FDP (the party you mentioned) big wig, but your political allegiance in Germany doesn't really matter when it comes to Israel.

Say one word against Israel and your career is over, not that there's a lot of German politicians who sympathize with the Palestinians anyways. You can safely say that that it's a topic on which every German party agrees, and the pro-Israel propaganda in the mainstream media is off the charts.
 
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They’re no different to the nutters on Russian telly dehumanising Ukrainians.

I think the sociopathy fostered in their ancestral lines is more entrenched and therefor you see this satanic expression everywhere within the zionist elite. Check out the latest Chris Hedges interview where he speaks to Miko Peled about the indoctrination of a genocidal collective mind.
 


They were there for 70 days but that weasel Miller didn't know what was under the University.
 
He'll face none.

I wouldn't consider him as some FDP (the party you mentioned) big wig, but your political allegiance in Germany doesn't really matter when it comes to Israel.

Say one word against Israel and your career is over, not that there's a lot of German politicians who sympathize with the Palestinians anyways. You can safely say that that it's a topic on which every German party agrees, and the pro-Israel propaganda in the mainstream media is off the charts.
How can a country be always on the wrong side of history?
 
So you see no point in connecting zionist ideology with what has been going on in the region for the last 100 years or so?

Well, I guess that's one way to look at the world.
 
So you see no point in connecting zionist ideology with what has been going on in the region for the last 100 years or so?

Well, I guess that's one way to look at the world.
And the point of making that connection is...? To remind us that Israel's history has a dark side? Or to suggest that Israel is eyeing Gaza & West Bank to integrate into official Israel?
 
And which of the things he said are any sort of indication to crimes committed?
It shows us his mindset. When you think you're on some sort of holy crusade, you're not gonna bind yourself to rules.
 
If you talk to each soldier, you'll get a variety of opinions. At the end of the day, these guys follow orders. It's the people who decide the orders you should be looking at.

You are right that those are more important. And as far as i read from netanyahu to the minister of defense seems to be aligned with him.

But saying "who cares.." i think is insensitive
 
And the point of making that connection is...? To remind us that Israel's history has a dark side? Or to suggest that Israel is eyeing Gaza & West Bank to integrate into official Israel?
I think that it's just a reminder that Zionism always had a colonialist flavor and was never in favor of compromise when it came to land appropriation or drawing borders, be it by "gentle" or tougher means, as its founder clearly stated. It's essential to understand the logic behind Zionism, the 75 years long and still ongoing colonization of Palestine, and the end goal of this ideology. There is no Palestinian state for Zionists and will never be, not in what they consider as Israel.

It's something either downplayed or deliberately not mentioned by western medias and governments which heavily contributes to the skewed view of their audience about the conflict.
 
And the point of making that connection is...? To remind us that Israel's history has a dark side? Or to suggest that Israel is eyeing Gaza & West Bank to integrate into official Israel?

To help us possibly predict what is going to happen in future.

There were many people arguing mere two months ago that it would be so below Israel to bombard Al-Shifa hospital, only to not mention it anymore now that there are no more hospitals in Gaza, all destroyed by Israel.

Why would it be problematic to suggest that "Israel is eyeing Gaza & West Bank to integrate into official Israel"? That's exactly what Netanyahu, Ben Gvir and some others have been saying.

We shouldn't criticize it until it actually happens?
 


I will not compromise on full Israeli security control over the entire area west of Jordan - and this is contrary to a Palestinian state.

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To help us possibly predict what is going to happen in future.

There were many people arguing mere two months ago that it would be so below Israel to bombard Al-Shifa hospital, only to not mention it anymore now that there are no more hospitals in Gaza, all destroyed by Israel.

Why would it be problematic to suggest that "Israel is eyeing Gaza & West Bank to integrate into official Israel"? That's exactly what Netanyahu, Ben Gvir and some others have been saying.

We shouldn't criticize it until it actually happens?
There is an unnecessary combativeness in your posts. Did I say it was problematic? I asked for @Idxomer to elaborate on his post.

I don't share the same assessment by the way. Politicians say many things. That doesn't mean we can't criticize their rhetoric, and Israeli politicians sure as hell aren't helping themselves including "Mr Security" himself. But on this particular matter, I'm skeptical about it being translated into a policy of integrating Gaza & WB into official Israel. I'll see if I'm proven wrong.
 
You are right that those are more important. And as far as i read from netanyahu to the minister of defense seems to be aligned with him.

But saying "who cares.." i think is insensitive

Sorry if I'm blunt, but I feel too much time here is spent posting Twitter stuff that take attention away from the things that actually matter and make a difference.
 
There is an unnecessary combativeness in your posts. Did I say it was problematic? I asked for @Idxomer to elaborate on his post.

I don't share the same assessment by the way. Politicians say many things. That doesn't mean we can't criticize their rhetoric, and Israeli politicians sure as hell aren't helping themselves including "Mr Security" himself. But on this particular matter, I'm skeptical about it being translated into a policy of integrating Gaza & WB into official Israel. I'll see if I'm proven wrong.

Out of curiosity, where you proven wrong on hospital bombings? Won't bother to check your posts, just asking. I'm actually fine with you not taking them seriously, you are not decision-maker after all, but it is problematic when people who have the power act like they wouldn't do it. With all the genocidal evil Israel have done, I wouldn't take anything they say lightly, especially if I had any power to stop them. That is, if I was Biden for example, and I stood for values I said I stood for.
 
Out of curiosity, where you proven wrong on hospital bombings? Won't bother to check your posts, just asking. I'm actually fine with you not taking them seriously, you are not decision-maker after all, but it is problematic when people who have the power act like they wouldn't do it. With all the genocidal evil Israel have done, I wouldn't take anything they say lightly, especially if I had any power to stop them. That is, if I was Biden for example, and I stood for values I said I stood for.
I can't find it anymore but I could swear that shortly after October 7th when Israel started their bombing campaign I posted that Israel would stop at the 10,000 casualties mark because international pressure would be too big. Evidently, I was wrong on that. Israel's bombing campaign and the sheer destruction they've inflicted on Gaza was beyond what I thought they'd dare to do.

Despite that, I'm still of the opinion that they aren't interested in integrating Gaza & WB into official Israel. But they'll continue to try to avoid a Palestinian state, as they've done before. They seemed content with playing different Palestinian groups off against eachother and turning the conflict "frozen" while normalizing with other Middle East countries.
 
How far can you stretch the "let's vandalize everything because hamas may use it". For Israel i guess nothing is sacred in Gaza. How this punishment of a people hasn't been stopped yet i cannot fathom.
I really want to know what the Biden administration is thinking behind closed doors. For example, do they think that they'll lose the 2024 election if they do anything against Israel, like stopping military aid?
 
I really want to know what the Biden administration is thinking behind closed doors. For example, do they think that they'll lose the 2024 election if they do anything against Israel, like stopping military aid?
Biden is the most pro Israeli politician in the US and Israel is a core partner for the US. There’s really nothing more to it.
 
There is an unnecessary combativeness in your posts. Did I say it was problematic? I asked for @Idxomer to elaborate on his post.

I don't share the same assessment by the way. Politicians say many things. That doesn't mean we can't criticize their rhetoric, and Israeli politicians sure as hell aren't helping themselves including "Mr Security" himself. But on this particular matter, I'm skeptical about it being translated into a policy of integrating Gaza & WB into official Israel. I'll see if I'm proven wrong.

The larger point is that Zionism is a settler colonialism movement that has both violence and land grabs as two of its foundations. Neither of those two things are going to change. You can't ignore what they say as politics because they have turned that into reality in one way or another for the last 75 years.

And yes of course they want to take over Gaza and the West Bank, they have already stolen a lot from the latter over the decades and they aren't exactly stopping. The former has been mostly turned into a rubble with most of its features gone.
 
How far can you stretch the "let's vandalize everything because hamas may use it". For Israel i guess nothing is sacred in Gaza. How this punishment of a people hasn't been stopped yet i cannot fathom.

In a day or two we’ll hear Hamas have tunnels under the cemetery. Hollow earth theory is well and truly alive over there.
 
I feel the same way.

Well, part of the stuff that matters is that 3 big decision-makers from the Israeli government including the PM have come out strongly today against a Palestinian state.

I like it because it exposes the facade of the 2 state solution the EU and especially the US like to parrot. It has always been nothing more than just a line when both know the zionists never have the intention to move towards.
 
Well, part of the stuff that matters is that 3 big decision-makers from the Israeli government including the PM have come out strongly today against a Palestinian state.

I like it because it exposes the facade of the 2 state solution the EU and especially the US like to parrot. It has always been nothing more than just a line when both know the zionists never have the intention to move towards.

Certainly not with Netanyahu around. And that's been the case for 15 years now.