They have been kidnapping Palestinians for years, they detain thousands of them and a lot of them are children.
Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less
- Thread starter esmufc07
- Start date
They have been kidnapping Palestinians for years, they detain thousands of them and a lot of them are children.
Funnily enough, many of Israels military logistics are in tel aviv city centre.
I know, but that poster is defending their actions.
It is not that clear as you make it sound, and specially with the way Israel is doing it.
https://www.jurist.org/commentary/2...ight-to-self-defense-under-international-law/
Yeah hundreds of Arabs and Muslims has lost their jobs (in the USA and Europe) including famous football players because they showed solidarity with Gaza. Now one Israeli footballer losses his job and you lose your mind?
I am fine, thank you.
In fact, it is vice versa. Even midly pro-israeli post causes beserk reaction in this thread.
If Israel has a right to defend itself by destroying whole Gaza, doesn't that same right apply to Palestinians and Hamas, and couldn't by the same logic 7. October be perceived as the mere defensive action of Palestinians against their occupier?
In the world which sees Israel's actions as defensive, it is literally the same.
In the world which sees Israel's actions as defensive, it is literally the same.
Even mildly pro-Israeli means pro-genocide, that's the thing.
You do like running in circles, dont you? You can repeat it again and again and again. It doesnt change the fact it is just your view.
Not really, someone posted the definition of genocide in this thread a while ago and israel's actions fit perfectly.
I can't even imagine the twisted thought process someone goes through to somehow convince themselves that murdering tens of thousands of innocent civilians is somehow self defense.
Giggsy, you've read this thread. You know this has been posted since mid-October. Surely you can see that it's not been very successful. If it wasn't successful when the death count was 5000, it's not going to be successful when it's >20k. The debunking of all these claims is well-documented. What's the strategy here?
Last edited:
I don't think anyone is indifferent to atrocities carried out by Hamas.
But it seems logical it will get less attention after months of indiscriminate slaughter of tens of thousands of innocent civilians including thousands of children in Gaza by Israel.
Yes, they recognise the ICJ by default as a member of the UN.
The ICC is another court that Israel is not customary to.
Both courts are in the Hague in the Netherlands.
Thanks both for the correction and informative posts
Anyone know to what extent Western journalists have access to Gaza? I know CNN's Clarissa Ward apparently sneaked in if I recall correctly but don't know of other examples.
They can sneak in as Ward did (likely with the assistance of the Emiratis), or they can get in via the IDF’s embed program where their footage is screened for OPSEC before it’s published (but the substance of what they report isn’t censored).
Beyond that, they would need to find another way to sneak in, which would be hard given that most western outlets aren’t going to allow their journos to go into a war zone without security.
After 4 months of this, have Israel actually managed to rescue a single hostage?
As far as I'm aware the only hostages they came across they gunned down themselves.
As far as I'm aware the only hostages they came across they gunned down themselves.
One hostage was rescued alive, a few weeks after the war started. None since. And I doubt anyone else will be rescued alive.
A deal is the only possibility, but that requires a permanent ceasefire which, of course, does not work for Netanyahu as that might be the time people start talking seriously about ousting him.
It's a truly awful situation for them. Never seen such a callous government.
It's terrible. Two days ago Hamas posted a video of three hostages talking, and promised to reveal their fate the following day. Yesterday they did that, showing a video of one of the hostages still alive and talking - and the bodies of the other two, who they claim died in IDF airforce attacks.
This govenment is terrible. Between the political turmoil in Israel in recent years and the war, it's like the perfect storm.
Isn't it terrible that Hamas killed these two hostages?
Killed by air strikes - which isn't hard to believe as the same air strikes have killed 30k others too
Sorry, I don't believe Hamas, they are terrorists, they are 100% responsible for what is happening in Gaza.
Maybe they were killed by airstrikes, maybe not. Hostages can be killed by airstrikes just like everyone else in Gaza. At the same time, Hamas obviously has no problem killing israelis and it might serve a purpose for them as they try to push Israel towards ceasefire.
We can't know for sure, so it's just speculation. Hamas says it was airstrikes, the IDF states clearly that one of the dead hostages was not killed by airstrikes (Not that I understand how they could know that).
Yep, Hamas are to blame for Israel indiscriminately killing thousands of civilians. Look at what they made them do. If it weren't for Hamas' brutality, Israel wouldn't have felt the need to kill 12,000 children, bomb hospitals and refugee centres and murder journalists. If they had just put down their weapons, then there would be peace and Israel could continue building settlements and eating away at Palestinian territories.
I'm not doubting Hamas' capability of killing hostages considering recent events, but it doesn't make sense. As already stated by someone else in this thread, these hostages are far too valuable for Hamas and remain their only leverage in this otherwise asymmetrical conflict. It makes no sense for Hamas to start killing them.
Say what? Are you one of those people that think this war started on October 7th and on that day, Hamas woke up and decided it was a perfect day to commit some terror?
It would have been true if they had far fewer hostages. But they have 136 (of whom about 25 are declared dead by Israel), so they've got a lot of leverage and can easily lose a few.
Right now, the Israeli govenment is showing no signs that it is willing to stop the war in order to release hostages. The deaths of some, however, may push the govenment - or push people in Israel to push the govenment - to compromise before others lose their lives.
Didn't some of the released Israeli hostages claim that Israel air strikes almost killed them? It's really not hard to believe, Israel really doesn't give a shit about the hostages. They're used as pawns for their desire to land grab. If they did care about the hostages they wouldn't be blowing up the city and instead be deploying all their troops on the ground to minimise risk to the hostages.
You'd have to be pretty stupid to think that airstrikes were helping the hostages.
You'd have to be pretty stupid to think that airstrikes were helping the hostages.
That's still not an objectively large number when you contrast it to the sheer number of Palestinian prisoners who Hamas will be looking to broker a release for in exchange for Israeli hostages.
Frankly I think the incident with those half naked Israelis waving a white flag with Hebrew on it only to be gunned down by the IDF, coupled to the friendly fire incidents on October 7th has outlined how feasible it is that Israel has killed many of its own during this campaign.
But again in all this madness who knows who or what has killed them.
About a decade ago, Hamas released one Israeli soldier for about 1,000 prisoners, including Sinwar. In previous deals, Israel always released many more prisoners than the number of people (or bodies) it received. So Hamas has room to maneuver because it's clear the scale will not change here. Also, it's possible that it has other priorities and is willing to accept less than the release of all its prisoners.
He is. Has his own worldview and won't allow facts to get in the way of how he feels.
Even your claim is much more reasonable. "Hamas started this war on October 7th" is very different than "Hamas is 100% responsible for everything that is happening in Gaza."
There is no moral, ethical, practical system anywhere in which "he started it" removes your agency and absolves you of all responsibility.
Last edited:
And yet that is exactly what everyone has done for all the other wars. For example 1 million dead in Iraq, 432 thousand civilians, millions more died of the effects of war i.e. malnutrition etc Note - The numbers may not be accurate but what is accurate is that its a sht load.