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Homophobia in football
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) review both the Everton and Bodø/Glimt victories at Old Trafford. Listen to the guys discuss 2 wins and 7 goals in the last week, analyse of the Amorim formation, focus on Amad and how he is playing, and also take a look at Hojlund, Rashford & Zirkzee – who starts v Arsenal?
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Ah good old religion uniting the world as ever
It isn't a protest for their cause. There isn't a cause as it is recognised as part of society in this country that you do not discriminate based on, among other things, sexuality. It is, literally, the law. The armband is supposed to celebrate that and indicate that this where we are as a society. No different to wearing an anti racism armband.
The second part of your point is why I would understand if he spoke to his club and they withdrew him from the game. Him playing in it and not wearing the armband is in effect a protest against not being homophonic, amd what you are doing by defending it or saying its not a big deal, is asking people to tolerate that.
No one can control another person's beliefs or dictate their reasoning, but if someone in this country, for whatever reason, doesn't want to support equal rights for others, it is up to them to tolerate that the place they live does, not the other way round.
I hope he'll be embarrassed and ashamed when he eventually meets his god and the almighty says "um, couldn't you think for yourself on this one? Why would supporting LGBT folk be wrong? Really should have made sure you got my words down properly when we made that book but I didn't expect you to be such massive dafties. " Or something.
Not much point wearing it if you don’t mean it. He’s got to take the criticism that comes with it though.
We didn’t hear a peep out of him when the betting shirts were being handed out. I’m sure there’s been times where they’ve made an exemption with a blank shirt for any Muslim players who objected. I want to say Papiss Cisse was one?
We didn’t hear a peep out of him when the betting shirts were being handed out. I’m sure there’s been times where they’ve made an exemption with a blank shirt for any Muslim players who objected. I want to say Papiss Cisse was one?
Have no issues with Marc. He’s balancing an inclusive message in society with his own religious beliefs, why should we get to decide which one is more important than the other? And why do they have to be mutually exclusive? Living in a tolerant society is respecting both points of view IMO.
He’s from a country where being gay is illegal, and adheres to a religion that considers it sinful. If he gets that far, then he’s getting nothing less than a well done.
Religious beliefs do not dictate what is accepted and what is not accepted within UK society. Religious folk and their views are imposed upon every day, and we’re all the better for it.
Hey Siri, what is irony?
Just dont feel like it, just like I wouldn't put a BLM flag, nor any other protest. I dont know why many think footballers must stand for certain causes or whatever, they play football thats it. Forcing them to support certain movements doesnt seem right.
I mean, it's not though, is it? Stonewall themselves have said it's an optional thing (as it should be).
Forcing everyone to wear the armband would just create a load of Jordan Henderson-sized hypocrites. It's great that 19/20 of the PL captains showed support, but that only means anything if they're also free not to.
I always thought the armband was more trying to push homophobia out of football (and sport in general) where there has always been more of a homophobic culture compared to general day to day lives I'd say. Make the sport more inclusive to LGBTQ+. So its a "cause" and a "protest" that people are supporting by choosing to wear it, similar to the anti-racism band because while of course it's part of law and society, racism (like homophobia) is still a big problem in society. But anyway, that's just semantics I guess.
Each to their own I guess. For me I don't see it as a huge deal if somebody chooses to join in on it or not, would be better if everybody did but if I can accept others not doing it as their choice. I don't think not wearing the rainbow armband makes them bad people and I'd disagree that he shouldn't be forced to miss games in this instance, but maybe someone else just wearing the armband with an explanation of "the cause means something significant to them so they lead the team on the day" would go a long way to just avoiding any issues. I'd expect the clubs to step up for that though.
Is homophobia still a thing in football grounds? I think most fans these days wouldn't give a shit if their team had Liberace up front if he could bag them 20 goals a season.
I'm sure casual homophobia is still a thing in some chants (Chelsea rent boy) but also in particular lots of other countries it's still very prevalent. Probably not as bad in the UK as others.
i fully support his stance. if we start allowing homosexuality in football, then all us fans watching are going to be thinking about is their warm, floppy penises, nestling in their shorts when they play. oh how it would bounce gently as they jostled at a corner kick. how a bead of sweat would roll suggestively towards the tip, before being wicked away by their cotton briefs. how we would almost smell the musk of their nooks. how rigid we would be for 90 minutes, being forced to go into the pub toilets for a release, again and again. as a completely straight man, this would be unacceptable.
You’re basically trying to find an excuse for him, but ironically those kind of issues are one of the reasons why the promotion of inclusion is so important.
I’ll probably leave it there otherwise this will tip into a debate about religion.
I don't think you really need to do what he did though to prove you love Jesus or are a Christian.
He’s just keeping everyone happy. He’s probably doing that for himself as much as anyone else.
It really bugs me when some people say a certain thing is against their religious freedoms, and thus this thing shouldn’t be allowed, etc. It was said a lot here in the US when same sex marriage was legalised, for example.
As someone who is Secular, I don’t feel my Secular freedoms (only joking with this term) are being offended if I drive past a church and see people walking in, or see football players looking to the heavens before kick off in every match, or see these huge signs for Jesus plastered here and there in town, of which there are many. But as soon as a rainbow gets put up somewhere, religious freedoms are being assaulted in the most nasty, evil ways.
As someone who is Secular, I don’t feel my Secular freedoms (only joking with this term) are being offended if I drive past a church and see people walking in, or see football players looking to the heavens before kick off in every match, or see these huge signs for Jesus plastered here and there in town, of which there are many. But as soon as a rainbow gets put up somewhere, religious freedoms are being assaulted in the most nasty, evil ways.
So by that argument, not taking the knee means you are definitely racist
Religious messages are not allowed under the rules but whatever, I don't really care about that.
As captain he's the club's representative. If he doesn't want to represent the clubs values then fair enough but he shouldn't be captain, at least for the games where the club wants to support the Rainbow Laces thing.
I'm a big Guehi fan, I think he's a solid dude and an excellent player but writing a Christian message across this particular armband (he doesn't do it normally) is a bitch move. I'd have more respect for him if he refused to wear it.
If you didn’t take it because a book you like told you that black people were bad, then yes.
Does that make you a one-handed tosser?
You 100% did not understand what you replied to. But whatever. And while you are at it actual laws of which 'freedom of religion' is one of many determines what is or isn't right in UK society. Not the feelings of people who think their values are superior to others.
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Thanks for proving my point.
I'm lost on how this is a debate tbh. You're not free to go around being homophonic. It's not comparable to Jordan Henderson at all. That's a stupid and/or disingenuous comparison.
You're free to go around having homophonic beliefs in the same way you are free to go around being racist or believing it's OK to abuse women, etc.
No one who is willing to make a public stand against equality, on whatever grounds they or you want to defend that with, has any business being captain of a Premier League football team.
We know that footballers are still very rectangular to be open about their equality, and now we are finding out why.
Definitely agree with this. The guy can think what he likes or choose to participate in wearing the band or not IMO, but the club should be aware of their views and know if they would support these causes or not and it's a pretty important part of being a captain to set an example for all.
Sounds like something from the Maguire thread
Because one of these things is critical to living in a compassionate and inclusive society and the other is a load of divisive fairy stories from ancient books?
1. I am absolutely against forcing players to send any kind of messages no matter how "noble" those messages are. Supporting something should always be a personal choice. Especially at work (and playing football is a job).
2. Are these two (slightly?) homophobic? Probably yes.
3. I struggle to see a law based on which they can punish Guehi. If they do punish him, he should sue them on all possible courts.
2. Are these two (slightly?) homophobic? Probably yes.
3. I struggle to see a law based on which they can punish Guehi. If they do punish him, he should sue them on all possible courts.
Funny thing is I was watching the Overlap yesterday and I reckon Giorgio Chiellini has a squarer head than Maguire!
“Thanks for coming in Marc. We’d love to offer you the captaincy, we just need to ask you a quick question: what do you think about the gays?”
I think there's some grey area between being an activist or a bigot. I don't think it has to be one or the other like you're trying to say. The Henderson point was about how enforced activism from people who clearly don't believe in the cause is just pointless.
Framing the Morsy situation as some kind of "protest against equality" is daft. By that measure, I suppose Wilf Zaha was doing some sort of pro-racism protest when he stopped doing the knee thing?
On 3. there are rules about messages on undershirts and kit etc that have been around for a while now, that's probably what he was falling foul of
They aren't the same thing, though. Watching other people show support for something and being forced to show support yourself are different issues.
Similar scenarios would be you being forced to go into a church or forced into praying with other people that are also praying.
Which is nonsense really. It’s like they’re afraid of them expressing themselves like the human beings they are, and would prefer them to just stick to football so they can keep earning them money.
Well yes, clubs exactly can and should do that. "We are club which will promote this, this and this. Will you represent club in these projects?".
It is and it isn't, whilst players should have the right to express themselves, some of the messages will just cause trouble, it's better overall to just have a blanket ban, religion and politics should be kept out of football as much as possible
I have a little sympathy with the Ipswich player, he comes from a country where, based on religious beliefs, homosexuality is a crime, openly supporting the opposite view would possibly cause him problems in his homeland
Ah good old religious bigots. If your religion requires you to hate others because of their sexuality then it's shit and has no place in a modern society.
they're afraid of players expressing themselves beyond the point they are willing to tolerate, so it's easier to make them understand the rules from the start.
you wouldn't want your athletes to promote peaceful and anti war messages on their armbands.
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