Yeah, it smells a little fishy to me, too.
Gun control
- Thread starter ukbob
- Start date
"Because the Peshawar shooting occurred very close to the anniversary of the Sandy Hook massacre, she included a picture of a child from the latter event, namely Noah Pozner, along with pictures of Peshawar victims"
How does the writer know this? It may well be true, but I see no evidence other than the fact that the writer has said it to be the case.
OK Dylan Avery.
How about you read this - http://forward.com/opinion/327111/time-to-crack-down-on-shameless-sandy-hook-rampage-truthers - an article written by the parents of the murdered child that you're now mentioning. These people have had something monstrous occur to them, and now they have people "seeking the truth!" come up to them and accuse them of either conspiring in the murder of their son, or to have made up his existence entirely. You are actually now party to that. You perpetuating this infantile delusion that you know more than almost every other person on the planet, that you have superior perception because you recognise "the truth!" when you see it, contributes to an atmosphere where the parents of murdered children are harassed about it.
Your company is made up of people that deny the holocaust.
Get a grip, find something productive to do.
What's the alternative possibilities? The US government has a folder of pictures of children to use as "victims" in these fake incidents, and this particular time they were careless and forgot that they had already used one of them, and then sent it to some people in Pakistan to post on Facebook and make posters of to hold in the street?
Ubik, what a strangely dramatic take on my posts in this thread that is.
There are lines of thinking like that, yeah. I have no particularly strong willingness to commit to any opinion regarding what happened with those photos, but thought it was an interesting thing to share either way.
It's absolutely idiotic. I mean, there wasn't even any meaningful change in gun laws following Sandy Hook! If there was some massive conspiracy, wouldn't that kind of be the top priority?
This was covered in the UK press ages ago and if you read the link Olly posted you can clearly see the explanation...
The poor parents who lost their kids must be unbelievably disgusted and sickened to the core when they read these ridiculous theories. Instead of the focus being on the fact a Muslim lady from Pakistan posted an American child in a homage poster to remember children killed at school in two continents, and the fact that could be used to help strengthen US/Muslim relations, no, the focus is completely about it being just another in a long line of massive conspiracy theories about the American Government or the NWO, although the aim of which is not really apparent. It's ridiculous to the extreme.
There are some great conspiracy theories out there, many are feasible, intelligently researched, and some could possibly be true. This is just like a really sick joke and was originally used to make money by some self righteous, sanctimonious cnut who moans his book was removed from sale from Amazon. Hiis book is the main cause of all the vitriol directed at the parents of the kids, he should be feckin ashamed of himself and I hope that thought haunts him for the rest of his days.
Yeah, of course, but they (conspiracy theorists) will just say it was all staged by the NRA to gain more gun sales or the Republicans so they could get armed guards in schools.
Chat shit, get banged.
Doesn't seem to have been for a lack of trying. Here are the Wheelers - who again are literally actors - carrying out the President's Weekly Address and pleading with the public about this very issue.
"We have to convince the senate to come together and pass common sense gun responsibility reforms."
Here is David Wheeler in 'Faithful':
And here is Francine Wheeler doing...this:
To be honest, anyone who does something like that to Mozart needs to be looked into.
As for other families, I think I'm right in saying that several of the families have lobbied up and down the US since Sandy Hook (Pozners, Parkers, etc). You could say that if something like this did happen then that would be understandable, though that is the very issue that has been so widely debated.
I have already responded to that. I don't see the person's evidence for why Noah Pozner was included.
Please watch "We Need to Talk About Sandy Hook" and "The Life of Adam" before passing judgement on that. You seem to be asserting here that the majority of this has come from Jim Fetzer, when really the Sandy Hook event has gone so viral in this sense that I'm not sure if there are very many that compare.
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what proof do you have that the picture was used in Pakistan for any other reason?
Feck just seen his joke about Mozart and winking smilie.. Just gonna out this ignorant piece of filth on ignore.
I don't understand why I would need to prove that. I specifically said the following:
It's a strange story connected to Sandy Hook, so I thought it worth mentioning.
I'm not finding any of this outrage in here to be particularly sincere, to be honest.
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you can't just produce an email out of nothing. case close. clear conspiracy. i even saw some kids on the drive in to work today. no one died.
secret government official 1: shall we go with something from 'looking happy folder 5-7 years', maybe child 3?
secret government official 2: not him, i used him in that drink driving crack down ad run before christmas. child 6 hasn't had a run out since 9/11.
secret government official 1: now that was good coverup. some of my finest work.
secret government official 2: pakistan want to know if we have any photos of a pakistani looking american boy. they have an agenda they wish to push and need a fake child victim to gain media and public traction. as we clearly own the rights to all fake child victim photos for government conspiracies the world over, they can't just take a picture of an actual pakistani boy and use that.
secret government official 1: sandy hook, second row, 4th from the right? he looks a bit terrorist.
secret government official 2: bingo.
We need guns to protect ourselves from the conspiracy theorists. /thread.
Jesus fecking Christ.
Who'd have thought a casual tea break browse into the gun control thread would have me wanting get one and blow my own brains out.
Who'd have thought a casual tea break browse into the gun control thread would have me wanting get one and blow my own brains out.
If you're so convinced that this is a massive cover-up why don't you go to Sandy Hook and talk to the parents of these dead kids and find out what the truth really is? You could break the story of the century.
This article I read on Vice is relevant to the current discussion I think.
http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/sandy-hook-truthers-what-kind-of-person-calls-a-mass-shooting-a-hoax
http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/sandy-hook-truthers-what-kind-of-person-calls-a-mass-shooting-a-hoax
They actually want bodies exhumed? No decent person would side with these individuals would they?
Thankfully the chances are slim individuals like those in the article and our own conspiracy windbag will ever have the misfortune to be treated this way.
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It's obvious why people would be outraged. Anyone with a modicum of empathy, and motivated by a genuine desire to seek the truth rather than a narcissistic self-justification of their own 'enlightenment', would make damn sure any outlandish "investigations" that openly disparage the grieving parents of tragedy victims were concretely irrefutable before irresponsibly spreading them, half formed, all over the internet.
Hiding behind the veil of "hey, I'm just putting it out there, I don't have to prove it" isn't truth seeking. Truth seeking has feck all to do with any of this. You've already admitted that you had no interest in "this case" (i.e. the infamous violent deaths of school children) until it became a potential candidate for outlandish sinister government activity, so your confirmation bias meter was already ticking over nicely. And your random bump of this thread to post a screed of one sided conspiracy videos undermines your claim to have done any actual "looking into" this, when the presumably less 'enlightened' Caf have managed to provide eminently reasonable answers and opposing evidence, not to mention heartbreaking testimony from the "fake" parents themselves, without even trying.
So you can quit the disingenuous truth seeking bollocks, or the cop out that you don't necessarily buy into any of it (which is more damaging and irresponsible if anything - a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, etc) because your real motivation for spreading this nonsense, like many of the more outlandish 'theorists', is merely to convince yourself that you're the hero in your own silly X-Files spin off. The potential devastation it causes to the very real and long-suffering people involved be-damned because I'M FOX MULDER!!!.
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Well said.
I remember these kind of tactics from the posts about aliens years back. The refrain that "people always start acting weird when I mention the evidence", yeah because they think you've been drinking petrol.
Post of the year!
The thing that irks me most is this idea that just "putting it out there, because it's interesting" is somehow a bulletproof defence for being a nasty, accusatory mentalist. Sure, if that evidence is something innocuous like the moon landings, or the loch ness monster, but when it's the idea that tragedy victims are hoaxing the death of their own children, "just putting it out there" is actually worse than coming up with some kind of plausible, evidence backed narrative, because it's disseminating the information on the flimsiest of circumstantial evidence, that you yourself don't even 100% know what to make of, just 'cos.
That's what tabloids do. And only the very worst tabloids at that. It's the News of The World accusing Christopher Jeffries of raping and killing a student because he looked a bit weird, only worse. It's diabolically irresponsible, and you'd have to be a certified sociopath to not think twice about it.
KingEric may not be harassing the bereaved to exhume the bodies of their dead children himself, but by spreading this half baked shit willy nilly, for no other reason than wanting to be the one to do so, he's creating, and encouraging the people that do. Then absolving himself of all responsibility.
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No, I admitted that I had little interest in the gun control issue in America.
Whatever you may think of me Mockney, I would like the human race to succeed and am passionate about trying to make a difference in this respect. I find it worrisome and, to be honest, disheartening, that society has become something of a self-regulating organism that seems to automatically resist whatever does not fit in with the status quo. It is one of many things that could lead to an utterly Orwellian society.
I posted the Robbie Parker video initially as I find it to be a potentially massive piece of evidence of both media complicity and duplicity. If that is what it looks like, and it does indeed look very, very much like an actor getting into character in front of the media, then the implications of that could be absolutely enormous. I talked previously about Ubik's indignation here as a barrier to truth, but herein lies another: the actual truth may well be so horrifying and so different that it is easier for some to take the news at face value than it is to accept that their entire outlook on society might be off the mark. There is a lot of talk about cognitive dissonance, denial, delusion, etc and conspiracy theorists, but it is very easy to turn that the other way.
And, for what it's worth, I wasn't just putting the Robbie Parker video or what looks to be a Gene Rosen rehearsal out there: I think these are some very serious pieces of footage that need examining if we are to be trusting of the media. Due to the nature of my lifestyle, I spend great periods of my life detaching from assumptions and beliefs, and there comes a point in that process whereby you realise just how much you assume the truth of what is said on television. I post these videos because I think people have become far too attached to their own belief system, and as a result I think that things need shaking up a bit.
This is not about being superior or a hero in my own X-Files episode as you put it; it is about starting from the bottom with something I see as suspicious and trying to work up from there. If I have seemed disingenuous, insincere or anything else, it is because these are extremely difficult discussions to have, and because sometimes they have to be approached in different ways. There are times when you simply cannot speak your mind on an issue in this world, and when that happens you can sometimes get a little lost in what you are trying to do.
So, if everyone in here is genuinely offended or sickened - and honestly I have my doubts about that - then that is unfortunate. However, if there is an agenda to try and remove the American people of their guns, and a certain level of media complicity to facilitate that, I think that is a very important thing to discuss.
Here is another example of something that could be deemed suspicious; this time from the LAX incident:
"You're looking at live footage right now... police officers clearly escorting people.."
So what is going on with this one? Is it footage of a drill, contrary to what the reporter has said? Do people believe that what was in the wheelchair was actually human? It absolutely does not look life-like to me.
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Here's some basic thoughts I had that I bet not on conspiracy theory idiot will want to think about. It is basically the complexity of pulling this off.
It would require the entire Sandy Hook school district and all the people living in it to be in on it. Well maybe not all but certainly a large percent. Especially with the claims that these children never existed and the parents are just actors. The other students , the teachers, parents of all the districts students, the people at the local shops, the neighbors of the families victimized in this shooting all would be in on it. Otherwise you would have a town full of people who would have no idea who these families were or that these children existed.
Then the extended families would have to be in it also. Grandparents, aunt's and uncle's, cousins, etc. The friends of the families involved. People they knew in the past. And probably even more people I am not thinking about.
But no we have idiots who have not looked at any real evidence just some YouTube clips that don't indicate a damn thing out there a Mockney put it "playing Xfiles"
It would require the entire Sandy Hook school district and all the people living in it to be in on it. Well maybe not all but certainly a large percent. Especially with the claims that these children never existed and the parents are just actors. The other students , the teachers, parents of all the districts students, the people at the local shops, the neighbors of the families victimized in this shooting all would be in on it. Otherwise you would have a town full of people who would have no idea who these families were or that these children existed.
Then the extended families would have to be in it also. Grandparents, aunt's and uncle's, cousins, etc. The friends of the families involved. People they knew in the past. And probably even more people I am not thinking about.
But no we have idiots who have not looked at any real evidence just some YouTube clips that don't indicate a damn thing out there a Mockney put it "playing Xfiles"
And then after all that work they went and risked it all by pushing a dummy around in a wheelchair in front of millions of people.
Too many people involved to be any conspiracy but I believe some parents saw the tragedy a way to make money which I don't believe a true parent will do that, if the guy created a charity fund (about the video of the guy laughing) I would make sure he wouldn't touch that money if I was the authorities.
A lot of money certainly did go into Sandy Hook after that event. There was a chapter in "We Need to Talk About Sandy Hook" actually that laid out all the money that is supposed to have gone to the families, the police, etc, and if accurate it's a pretty enormous figure.
They completely demolished the school afterwards from what I can tell, and reportedly $50m was sent to Sandy Hook to fund a new one. Fetzer says he researched the average cost of an elementary school and found the figure to be closer to about $7m. I don't know how true that is, but $50m does seem excessive.
Alongside money, you'd obviously need quite an extensive level of threats, blackmail, planning, etc... In Project MK-Ultra it seems that people were led into situations so compromising that they couldn't really say anything no matter what was done to them, so maybe tactics like that could've been enforced. There are instances in which people have been silenced successfully (CIA,NSA, etc employees), and I would agree that it would take a very large amount of this sort of thing all at once for it to have worked. It is worth considering though that if Operation Northwoods was a real proposal, then the view has existed at high levels of government that false flags can be pulled off. We live nowadays in a society of greater surveillance and access to information, but if this is true then it stands that this sort of thing has been considered in the past.
As for the students, teachers, etc... it seems that a big point of debate is whether the school was even in use or not, which is I think one of the things Halbig has been trying to establish through FOIA requests. I've seen it suggested that there were no oil stains in the car park, but I'll have to look and see what other evidence there is to support that.
They completely demolished the school afterwards from what I can tell, and reportedly $50m was sent to Sandy Hook to fund a new one. Fetzer says he researched the average cost of an elementary school and found the figure to be closer to about $7m. I don't know how true that is, but $50m does seem excessive.
Alongside money, you'd obviously need quite an extensive level of threats, blackmail, planning, etc... In Project MK-Ultra it seems that people were led into situations so compromising that they couldn't really say anything no matter what was done to them, so maybe tactics like that could've been enforced. There are instances in which people have been silenced successfully (CIA,NSA, etc employees), and I would agree that it would take a very large amount of this sort of thing all at once for it to have worked. It is worth considering though that if Operation Northwoods was a real proposal, then the view has existed at high levels of government that false flags can be pulled off. We live nowadays in a society of greater surveillance and access to information, but if this is true then it stands that this sort of thing has been considered in the past.
As for the students, teachers, etc... it seems that a big point of debate is whether the school was even in use or not, which is I think one of the things Halbig has been trying to establish through FOIA requests. I've seen it suggested that there were no oil stains in the car park, but I'll have to look and see what other evidence there is to support that.
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On that note actually, have a look at the following:
Start at about 5:15. I find that to be pretty uncomfortable viewing, to be honest.
you're a moron as is whoever made that video.Did KingEric7 get his tagline in response to the last few pages or has he his tin foil hat on regularly.
I think it was slightly different before but has been touched up a bit to reflect current events. I may however be completely wrong as a result of the lizard people experimentally messing with my memories.
Time will tell.
Well, when you produce damning evidence like that..... Feck it, i'm convinced.