Jeez. I thought you were making it up - absolutely clueless.
Graeme Sourness | Retires from “punditry”
- Thread starter Bubz27
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Jeez. I thought you were making it up - absolutely clueless.
Agreed it's all just clickbait. As a teenager and in my early twenties i used to consume all the pre match and post match talk an "expert" opinions. As you get older you understand agendas and ratings and how those "experts" are either consciously playing characters or are on TV because they project a convenient viewpoint for the broadcaster. Commentators are the same, would love a crowd noise only option for the football.
I totally agree. When I was younger and heard a ex pro discuss football, I thought it was gospel. Now I’ve realised it’s all crap. It’s just an opinion like everyone else.
Yeah the minute he tried to make Greenwood the star man of the game I knew he was peddling his Pogba agenda again. Greenwood had a fine game, don't get me wrong but Pogba and Bruno were undoubtedly the stars of the game, more so Pogba than Bruno in my view, but either way, I knew he was doing that on purpose before Richards even mentioned the 4 assists.
I cannot get over the feeling that Graeme Sour-ness is a bigoted xenophobic cnut. You can say all you like about Pogba’s performances on the pitch, but off it Pogba is a model professional with a fantastic attitude. Micah Richards rightly called Sourness out and the bitter cnut couldn’t handle it and showed his true colors.
Jack G it could be argued is not too removed from Pogs but profiled very different by fans and media alike. That said, what Souness is saying isn't too dissimilar to what I've read on here at times.
10's if not 100's thousands of fans, unfortunately.
Was half expecting the Caf to petition Sky by now following the art competition success.
Neville enjoys it now that finally people listen to him (whether they want it or not). I bet in the dressing room, no one was listening to him. As I wrote in another post, you can see Keane's reaction whenever Neville goes on about something.
Now it is just plain stupid and I expect more balance from a pundit. Otherwise, you're just a fan commentating.
Is that 100+ pages in the same way that Pogba is a 100m player according to Souness?
Also, you don't get to tell anyone what should and should not be ignored. Football pundits do have personalities and they are fair game on a football forum.
I’m trying to understand here what he said was racist? Can you explain that to me since you’re the one that raised it, you must have heard something racist being said or done?
It was a joke. He can't have said anything racist or he'd have been sacked already.
Not saying people should have the capacity to think for themselves but trust me, these are the kind of things that influence those small minded fans to target black players in this way. Whilst he's entitled to have a view, he is in the public eye and should be aware of how his view has influence or perceived. That's probably why many think it's racist as most would be conscious of what they say to ensure it's not seen that way. These perceptions feed the narrative e.g Lewis H gets portrayed as a cheat by Red Bull.....receives monkey emoji's......
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Thought you were out as you don't care about the pundits anyway?
Then please don’t throw it out there even in joke. What it does is distract from real examples of racism
It depends how you view the game. Pogba had 4 briliant moments, got 4 asists. Other than that not everything was A+. I was pulling my hair out as he again engaged in numerous unecessary ball holding and loosing the ball duels in the middle of the pitch from him. Those are becoming his trademark somehow. Most of them totally unneeded. Just release the ball to other players. But he got 4 assists. You cannot put that as bad performance. The most frustrating part is for example James doing feck all and wasting everything - but you are used to this as his ceiling is low. But in Pogba's case you know that all the needed talent is there. He just doesn't play up to his potential most of the time. Almost as if he is able to coast through being an close to elite premier league player on 50% of his capacity most of the time.
I don't think anyone is like Pogba, especially in England. The social media profile, the dancing and carefree enjoyment of life - we don't encourage that in anyone in England and it's very much a "foreign' thing and for someone like Souness who is a caricature of the 70's and 80's hardman, who has absolutely no intention to get with times, he'll always find it egregious.
The closest I can think of to Pogba would be Neymar, but he's a forward plus doesn't play in England so I doubt he'd have the same hard-on to go after him as he does Pogba, who would have been a direct opposing player to Souness if they played in the same era.
I think if you went through Souness's praise output for black players outside of Pogba since he returned to England, there wouldn't be anything untoward to point out - his 'thing' with Pogba is personal, specific and downright stalkerish for his inssecence.
He could have just said Bruno was his man of the match or something but I think he slyly wanted us to know he was having a go at Pogba without actually saying his name. Luckily for us, Lord Micah is there now calling out all the bullshit
Although I'm sure Sky will be showing Micah a video of why Evra isn't called back anymore and next week, Micah will just sit and nod with everything.I never read the post you are referring to but I 100% think this. He's like the kid that got bullied in school (or was just invisible) and then became a cop to assert his authority. You can see how embarrassed he looked during the Euro's when the presenter bought up the Nev/Keane/Vieira tunnel bust up.
I didn't give any examples, so I wasn't actually accusing him. Lighten up
Looks like that surely. Even during his time as a player, you saw what kind of personality he was. A real shame when former City and Liverpool players talk the most sense as pundits (and with Pool I obviously mean Carragher).He could have just said Bruno was his man of the match or something but I think he slyly wanted us to know he was having a go at Pogba without actually saying his name. Luckily for us, Lord Micah is there now calling out all the bullshit
I never read the post you are referring to but I 100% think this. He's like the kid that got bullied in school (or was just invisible) and then became a cop to assert his authority. You can see how embarrassed he looked during the Euro's when the presenter bought up the Nev/Keane/Vieira tunnel bust up.
I’m sure you’re smart enough to realise that racism isn’t always explicit. As has been pointed out on here, a lot of people think Souness leans into racist tropes, and for people who are often on the end of that in the real world, it’s uncomfortable to watch. This dismissive attitude that it distracts from real examples of racism (whatever that means) is pretty dangerous.
Why? They’re playing into everything that Souness wants. Just don’t comment and then it wouldn’t even be an issue.
People discuss this more than the actual sport!
If he has coined him as a British transfer record player then sure.
But ultimately he was what, 10% off the actual fee. The point he made is that Pogba came for a world class, club record fee. Whether he uses those words or gets the figure slightly wrong, is besides the point.
He made more bullshit errors in judgement that need calling out before getting pedantic about numbers.
That's idealistic, in reality Souness and Neville's words are transposed to the minds and voices of those who want to ramp up their arsenal of slights to denigrate Pogba with.
It's easy, lazy but pays off and creates echo chambers we see all over the site whenever Pogba's name is mentioned.
Souness and co. are catalysts for so much of the grief Pogba receives and they should be called out on it every time they bring it up on national TV.
You were accusing him. Though supposedly it was joking.
another poster: hey guys please don’t bring racism into it
You: we didn’t, Souness did
your literal words. Now I accept that you were joking but please dont attempt to turn it around on me
Look I don’t disagree with the overall point but think about it from our point of view. We can’t moderate unless it’s something that is out there. Otherwise we are assuming that people are thinking. Which is where it’s becoming a problem for us because it’s now happening in more and more threads and taking over threads. Is Souness racist? I don’t know, but is this board libel for people throwing that stuff around? Yes
The whole thread is full of people saying he does it because he "must be racist" or uses racist tropes . My comment was touched in cheek and based on the fact that there were 70+ pages of people saying worse things than I did. So ill ask you to treat everyone fairly and not solely accuse me of calling him racist when it was obviously a joke and worse things have been said, if you've bothered to read all the comments.
Oh ok, I see where you’re coming from. I didn’t see it from that point of view.
From my perspective, I’m not accusing Souness of being an outright racist, I do think he shows prejudice in his analysis though.
With regards to the libel part, i again see your point, but I remember you once calling Ian Wright a bigot for mocking Keane’s accent, so can you see why it looks a bit strange to be so adamant regarding this situation?
It does feel like when people try and discuss racism towards black people it gets shut down on here with quickness, yet I never see the same energy when people are accused of prejudice towards the British or Irish.
Don't think souness is behaving the way he does with Pogba out of racism. I just think he genuinely hates Pogba. He hates all the hair cuts, his dancing, joking around ect. It makes his blood boil and it's funny.
If it was out of racism then you'd expect him to be consistent with other players in slating them. He just hates Pogba. Simple
If it was out of racism then you'd expect him to be consistent with other players in slating them. He just hates Pogba. Simple
The majority of people didn't say Souness is a racist, people have pointed out that the language and the direction the criticism has taken from various people in the media, which includes Souness, has an element of underlying codified racisim to it.
This post has summerized it pretty well:
If pundits have double standards in their critism and their criticism is full of questionable substance than it's completely normal for people to assess the potential factor of racism. Yet when done, there's always the same crowd - as exhibited in this thread - that shouts "Don't bring racism into it" "Don't play the race card". Quite telling, really.
He is salty because Pogba was very popular before his transfer. I'm pretty sure that we have all acted like that toward a player or are currently acting like that. For me it's Van Dijk and Naby Keita.
Suarez. Hate him
Just his face is enough to attract hate towards him
I know exactly what you mean, I spent the whole of last season pretending not to rate Partey
This was the weirdest thing. Almost begged for a City bid.
Look I’ve just started in this thread. You accused someone of being racist. I asked you to teach me because i thought id missed something. You then said you were joking which I accepted. It’s you dragging this out, not me.
how can I treat anything about racism as a joke? Every time we have to look into it. So I’m not taking it lightly no
I don’t remember that but fair play I accept that. I don’t even remember what he said.
libel laws seen tighter than ever before so we just need to remind people
Yesterday he was saying Pogba has never given interviews to say his agent speaking on his behalf is out of order. So that's the standard he sets for Pogba. Agent says Pogba would be open to leaving United. Pogba must shoot it down explicitly or the non-stop campaign to attack him and vilify him is justified.
Meanwhile, as you say, Kane, the player himself, does an hour long interview with Neville about how he wants to leave and how much he could potentially be worth in the current market. That guy is a saint to Neville though, and he leaps to his defence against anyone who dares to criticise what Kane is doing.