Well the earlier seasons had a similar pacing to the Brexit negotiations to be fair - it remains to be seen whether we will see things speed up to the pace of the current season as we approach March 2019.
That would have been a lot more out of character. GoT = Tits + Dragons. It isn't the Brexit negotiations.
Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended
- Thread starter ha_rooney
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What is his true nature? I thought he wasn't bad.
Re. Brienne there is nothing "padded". You can only beat what you're up against and it's blazingly obvious she would be holding back on Arya during a sparring session. The moment she stepped it up half a notch Arya landed flat on her arse and it was game over.
I found that whole scene really weird also
If I had to guess, I would say Tyrion will do at last minute betrayal of Danny... maybe to save someones life. Rather than full on switching sides
His point was that only a few people actually know about his death so to the majority of people his oath remains unfulfilled.
March 2019? That long.
@van der star thanks mate. Good, quick read.
Are we really going to have to wait until 2019 for the final season?
So Little Finger...
7 years of build up, slightly underwhelming end?
7 years of build up, slightly underwhelming end?
Cheers for that. I'd rather see a prequel about the Valyrians' ancient conquests and first arrival in Westeros than Robert's rebellion.
I watched that and felt somewhat disappointed. Not merely because of the last episode but because of the direction the series has gone in. I mean, GoT is a very good show and will be regardless of what happened in season 6/7 or will happen in season 8. But I've developed a few issues with the show that keep me from genuinely loving it now (and over the last 3 seasons, I guess).
For one, the "main" characters are all too weak. They're all fairly bland, can't really act and pale in comparison to the strong supporting cast. The ones who aren't so (Cersie and Jaimie) are complete shitbags one of which has been given far too much importance/master tacticianness. Tyrion has over the seasons become more and more irrelevant. I've always felt that while killing off important characters made a big impact, I thought it left big vacuum both in terms of the story as well as the personalities you were watching. Short term impact but long term loss IMO.
The other is that essentially game of thrones has gone from being fantastic, gritty and deep show, to what now really resembles a Hollywood blockbuster dressed in top quality drama clothing. It's still very good just nothing special anymore.
As for the last episode, like episode 6, the writing is just average. The whole dragon pit scene was extremely clumsy and showy, and had very little depth. I've seen the term fan-fiction being said about this season a lot. And it's bang on the money. There's a lot of punchlines in place of good dialogue. A lot of unions that are supposed to make you make fans go 'yaay'. A lot of last minute saves that entire scenes are set up merely to ensure happen so that a main character survives/looks good. And then there's a predictability. Most people knew (almost) John's heritage. And did we need to see the marriage happen to show us the genuineness of the parents relationship? The Little Finger shit was predictable and people saw it coming 5 episodes ago.
All of the above is fine because it wont change that it's an excellent show that I will always watch. It just reduces the level a good notch or two.
For one, the "main" characters are all too weak. They're all fairly bland, can't really act and pale in comparison to the strong supporting cast. The ones who aren't so (Cersie and Jaimie) are complete shitbags one of which has been given far too much importance/master tacticianness. Tyrion has over the seasons become more and more irrelevant. I've always felt that while killing off important characters made a big impact, I thought it left big vacuum both in terms of the story as well as the personalities you were watching. Short term impact but long term loss IMO.
The other is that essentially game of thrones has gone from being fantastic, gritty and deep show, to what now really resembles a Hollywood blockbuster dressed in top quality drama clothing. It's still very good just nothing special anymore.
As for the last episode, like episode 6, the writing is just average. The whole dragon pit scene was extremely clumsy and showy, and had very little depth. I've seen the term fan-fiction being said about this season a lot. And it's bang on the money. There's a lot of punchlines in place of good dialogue. A lot of unions that are supposed to make you make fans go 'yaay'. A lot of last minute saves that entire scenes are set up merely to ensure happen so that a main character survives/looks good. And then there's a predictability. Most people knew (almost) John's heritage. And did we need to see the marriage happen to show us the genuineness of the parents relationship? The Little Finger shit was predictable and people saw it coming 5 episodes ago.
All of the above is fine because it wont change that it's an excellent show that I will always watch. It just reduces the level a good notch or two.
Very underwhelming. I dont think he deserving a strong send-off or anything like that. The character had gotten stale a long time ago IMO. But the issue is in how predictable the whole thing was.
Better Call Aegon.
Hey, I'd love a big sappy reunion but a combination of poor writing for Arya and Maisie Williams' acting has hurt the character.
Have a heart...
Maybe seeing Jon again will actually remind her to appreciate the family she still has and to give up being a murder-obsessed smug assassin.
I wouldn't mind her being the murder-obsessed assassin but just more badass. They appear to have confused her background story with Bran's. She's become bland as a brick.
He needed to die trying to take the crown off of Cersei, not failing to manipulate Sansa.
Shocking display last night
I'm a little disappointed we didn't get Cleganebowl
We're getting it!
They're not.
The part when Sansa kept repeating after him/responding to him like a child was just so bad. As if he had hypnotized her with the annoyingness of his voice.He needed to die trying to take the crown off of Cersei, not failing to manipulate Sansa.
Shocking display last night
That along with John and company's telemarketing AD, cracked me up.
For those who have read the books or know about them - when did the show divert from the books? That might explain a lot.
The books stopped at season 5.
Agreed. It was the usual the apprentice becomes the master. But the Starks killing him was a fitting end given the amount of Starks died because of him. Sansa didn't mention that he helped her escape Kings Landing either, but then he did sell her off to the Boltons afterwards. Taking her from one Lions den to another.
It seems a shame that all of his plotting was found out by someone who could go back in time. Seems a bit of a shit way o be outed.
Not for me, he just ran out of room to maneuver. His weak spot has always been Catelyn and when he couldn't have her he went for Sansa. When he agreed to commit the Knights of the Vale against the Boltons, everyone and his dog knew that he had shot himself in the foot. When Jon was named King in the North he lost his emergency exit plan too. And this was last season...
If you look at it from Sansa'a perspective, it's makes better sense. Since their secret meeting (with Brienne present) the tables have actually turned and Sansa is playing him like a fool because she knows what he desires and she also knows how to use this against him. It gives the "i'm a slow learner but i learn" line more gravitas too imo.
Finally, Arya and Sansa discussing Ned's teachings was, for me, the best ending to that particular story arc. LF got what he deserved.
It all adds up. Well not quite, but to an extent.
Also, how fecking great has Sansas character development been? Probably one of the best developments in the series for me.
I think littlefingers death was perfect if you look at it from the daggers perspective.
It's been good but I still feel the actress isn't doing it justice. The lannisters were All a cut above this episode, good to see Tyrion back to his best.
You think so? I don't think the actress is strong enough to pull it off. No matter what you write, there's such a difference between the acting that, for me, the character development of Sansa pales in comparison to that of, say, Tyrion (season 1-4) because the latter dwarfs (hee hee) the former as an actor.
Agreed, I was quite satisfied with this scene, it was nice to see Sansa get this win.
Always been a big fan of Sansa and it's been brilliant to watch.
The line "I'm a slow learner, it's true. But I learn." was absolutely perfect for her.
I don't get the criticism of her acting either, she has come on leaps and bound while Arya's actress has regressed.
So Danaerys and co marched their entire army down to Kings Landing, in full armour, just so they could stand around outside while they had a 10 minute meeting, and then ordered the army to all march all the way back up to the north? I reckon I'd be slightly fecked off if I was an army guy.
My main issue with the last two seasons is that the writing just doesn't fit the characters anymore. Where it does it's just become cliché rather than clever. The Hound is a good example. It's like he's become a parody of himself. It's still amusing when he's on screen but there's no depth to the character anymore. He's just there to be a miserable git and tell people to feck off so it can be funny.
The show spent years building up this idea, for example, that Tyrion was the smartest one of the Lannisters. That was his thing and how he made up for being a dwarf who couldn't fight. Everything he did was based around being able to survive by being smarter than everyone else. Now, for no real apparent reason, he seems to be the dumbest one of the three, while Cersei has become some kind of master evil genius.
All three of the Lannister siblings were great characters to start with. Now Tyrion is a pointless idiot, Cersei is a comic book villain and Jamie is a goodie two shoes. It looks like they're going to make Tyrion even more of an idiot in the last season as well.
It's gotten to the stage where people are mistaking poor writing for the characters, with the characters having ulterior motives, or with changes to the characters themselves. It is also where a lot of the complaints about the acting are coming from I think.
It's a TV show so not all of the acting is going to be top notch...but it sticks out more when the actor is having to try to force you to buy into a character doing something that is actually out of character for them.
My main issue with the last two seasons is that the writing just doesn't fit the characters anymore. Where it does it's just become cliché rather than clever. The Hound is a good example. It's like he's become a parody of himself. It's still amusing when he's on screen but there's no depth to the character anymore. He's just there to be a miserable git and tell people to feck off so it can be funny.
The show spent years building up this idea, for example, that Tyrion was the smartest one of the Lannisters. That was his thing and how he made up for being a dwarf who couldn't fight. Everything he did was based around being able to survive by being smarter than everyone else. Now, for no real apparent reason, he seems to be the dumbest one of the three, while Cersei has become some kind of master evil genius.
All three of the Lannister siblings were great characters to start with. Now Tyrion is a pointless idiot, Cersei is a comic book villain and Jamie is a goodie two shoes. It looks like they're going to make Tyrion even more of an idiot in the last season as well.
It's gotten to the stage where people are mistaking poor writing for the characters, with the characters having ulterior motives, or with changes to the characters themselves. It is also where a lot of the complaints about the acting are coming from I think.
It's a TV show so not all of the acting is going to be top notch...but it sticks out more when the actor is having to try to force you to buy into a character doing something that is actually out of character for them.
He needed to die trying to take the crown off of Cersei, not failing to manipulate Sansa.
Shocking display last night
But Catelyn and Sansa have always been his main weakness. I think it's appropriate that that's where his fatal mistake lay. There was far more at stake emotionally than if he'd just been another of Cersei's victims, both for that reason and for Sansa's development as a character. As she said, he did love her.
I've watched the dragonpit scene again and I still think the stageiness suits the almost-medieval setting. It was a time of display and grand gestures.
It might have been wiser to stop the wight a couple of feet earlier, though, in its charge towards Cersei.
Edit: 'wight' was auto-corrected to 'wright'
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All valid, though it's probably important to bear in mind, even though it's no excuse, a guy like Peter Dinklage/Sean Bean and most of the "support/other" cast members have had a ton more acting experience on their CV, compared to when the likes of Arya/Sansa and the young 'uns were cast for their roles, what 7-8 years ago?
So, IMO, the weakest or least experienced cast members have been required to grow into and carry their roles more. And for some, the gap in quality is obvious.
Totally agree with that.
Their army was already south and near Kings Landing.
A lot of that is down to what the characters writing and their situations. Tyrions always had that sarcastic witty nature which makes his writing more interesting and gives the actor better lines to get his teeth into.
Sansa's been an unhappy mess for 5 seasons. It's only since getting to Castle Black has she felt remotely safe. Being sad and miserable for 5 seasons doesn't give the actor much room to showcase their ability. It's the same with Daenerys, she's been in serious driven mode for the entire show. It's a bit unfair in some ways to compare a character like Tyrion with Sansa or Daenerys given the material the former has.
But if you look at the character arc of Sansa and think back to what she's been through. It's a pretty amazing arc really to where she is now. Doubt anyone would have predicted back in Season 1 that it would be Sansa that takes down Littlefinger in Season 7.
1. They had a whole segment of an episode depicting how the unsullied do what they are told. They are the most disciplined army in all of westeros. The dothraki are just happy on horseback wherever they go, so I can see why they wouldn't really bother about being outside kings landing just waiting. The dothraki watched danaerys emerge unscathed from flames, and as mentioned the unsullied are loyal to their ruler. Both do as they are told.
2. The hound has literally been the same character throughout the show, it's Only since he came back in season 6 that more people have started listing him as one of their favourite characters, so he gets scrutinized a bit more. he literally hasn't been out of character in any scene in the show.
3. The Lannisters are the best 3 actors left on the show. How anyone can criticize them especially after that episode is beyond me.
Noodle, I used that exact phrase myself when talking to my wife about the Hound - he has become a parody of himself. Hard to criticise it too much though as he never fails to make me laugh.
Her argument is if Tywin Lannister was alive, then the High Septon wouldnt have dared to show his face and the faith wouldnt have become so powerful. Since one thing lead to the another, and the High Septon was a fecking cnut to everyone involved, Cersei had to take actions against him and the consequence of that action was Tommen committing suicide.
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True, but then they've made the conscious decision to thrust those inexperienced/weak actors into the forefront (or at least the book did). I mean, if I'm used to watching Tyrion or Ned being brilliant on screen and instead now I have to deal with Dany/Jon/Sansa ham it up or show little range, it has an impact.