Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended

[JustAFan]

I really get the feeling that too many posters in this thread are so busy looking for holes in the story line that they are not actually paying attention to nor really thinking about the scenes they are watching.

Watch the Jaime scene again. To almost every observer they would assume whoever that nut charging Dany was, he is toast. Even Dany would not have seen what happened (her dragon's massive head being in the way and all). The vast majority of those on the battlefield would probably not even have seen what was going on, you know being involved in, you know a battle. And yes Tyrion does seem to be looking for something/someone on the battlefield in the aftermath.

 

[Ish]

I think it makes sense. They are trying to show the irony between Cersei and Dany - how the Mad King's daughter isnt like her father but now we have a Queen who is like the Mad King and isnt afraid to burn down the land if it means she still sits on the throne. Tyrion and Missandei said how they "want" to follow Dany because she gave them her freedom and as a result they are more loyal to her than the Lannister army to Cersei cause they fight for her due to fear. The Lannister army surrendered to Dany. You think the Dothraki would surrender to Cersei if they are captured? They are loyal to Dany and hence would rather burn than serve another king/queen.

Yeah, I think Jon even alluded to it in the previous episode when she asked for his advice, on the way out of the cave. Jon goes on to say if she burns down cities and innocent people for the throne, she's just more of the "same", when in fact people are following her for the hope she brings of being "different".

 

[JustAFan]

Someone gets within a whisker of killing the most important person on the battlefield and no one notices or even decides to look for him? Finding them couldn't be that hard considering they had dozens of horses and a dragon at their disposal. Just didn't feel right or earned to me.

.

What part of Dany thinks, whoever that dumb bastard was, he is dead, is so difficult to understand? What part of all the other people on the battlefield just might have been involved in, you know fighting a battle, to have actually witnessed this part of the event, is that difficult to understand?

It really is not a stretch that they would not spend time looking for someone they most likely is dead. Again I think people worrying about this are being blinded by the things they know because they are viewers and not looking at it from the character's perspective.

Dany also had other issues to deal with. A wounded dragon, who thankfully for her was not a bad wound. Getting her army back under control. Getting the prisoners to bend the knee. But yeah, what she should have said is "feck all this important stuff" everyone look around for that guy who charged me who Drogon most likely turned to ash!"

 

[antihenry]

The Blackwater Rush is, as the name implies, a very fast-flowing river. Bronn and Jaime could have used the current to quickly swim downstream and out of sight away from the battleground.

At least that would sort of explain things. I didn't even consider the possibility of Jaime and Bronn escaping when they took the plunge a week ago.

Jamie would need to lose all that armour he had on to even stay above water, let alone swim across to the other side. I don't know about paying their debts, but those Lannisters are sure great swimmers, Michael Phelps has nothing on this guy.

 

[Sylar]

Jamie would need to lose all that armour he had on to even stay above water, let alone swim across to the other side. I don't know about paying their debts, but those Lannisters are sure great swimmers, Michael Phelps has nothing on this guy.

TBF, Jamie didnt swim. he was pretty much lifted out of the water by Bronn.

 

[kps88]

What part of Dany thinks, whoever that dumb bastard was, he is dead, is so difficult to understand? What part of all the other people on the battlefield just might have been involved in, you know fighting a battle, to have actually witnessed this part of the event, is that difficult to understand?

It really is not a stretch that they would not spend time looking for someone they most likely is dead. Again I think people worrying about this are being blinded by the things they know because they are viewers and not looking at it from the character's perspective.

Dany also had other issues to deal with. A wounded dragon, who thankfully for her was not a bad wound. Getting her army back under control. Getting the prisoners to bend the knee. But yeah, what she should have said is "feck all this important stuff" everyone look around for that guy who charged me who Drogon most likely turned to ash!"

You really think Drogon's head being in the way is something the show took in consideration? Or the writers want us to assume something as important as Tyrion intentionally holding back information from Danny? Watching the video you posted- there's Dothrakhi behind Tyrion witnessing the whole thing and Drogon's head does not block Danny's view when Bronn dives at Jaime.

Tyrion was reacting to all the destruction caused, a set up to his hesitation later in the episode. I doubt he was expecting to find Jaime's body magically appear away from where he last saw it.

Simplest explanation is they wanted a nice blockbuster scene to end the episode on. Most of us, however, expected some sort of resolution/pay off to the scene because that's how it was telegraphed. But it turns out they just did it for the wow factor and Jaime and Bronn escaped because that's what the story line needed.

 

[Sylar]

What part of Dany thinks, whoever that dumb bastard was, he is dead, is so difficult to understand? What part of all the other people on the battlefield just might have been involved in, you know fighting a battle, to have actually witnessed this part of the event, is that difficult to understand?

It really is not a stretch that they would not spend time looking for someone they most likely is dead. Again I think people worrying about this are being blinded by the things they know because they are viewers and not looking at it from the character's perspective.

Dany also had other issues to deal with. A wounded dragon, who thankfully for her was not a bad wound. Getting her army back under control. Getting the prisoners to bend the knee. But yeah, what she should have said is "feck all this important stuff" everyone look around for that guy who charged me who Drogon most likely turned to ash!"

I think most of this is fair. Nobody except Tyrion knew it was Jamie, but at the same time, wasnt Tyrion surrounded by some Dothraki doing nothing? Given Tyrion pretty much saw Jamie didnt die (I assume that since he knew Jamie wasnt dead), you would think those Dothraki would see the same and would want to find the person that just had an attempt on their Queen.

 

[NinjaFletch]

I think it makes sense. They are trying to show the irony between Cersei and Dany - how the Mad King's daughter isnt like her father but now we have a Queen who is like the Mad King and isnt afraid to burn down the land if it means she still sits on the throne. Tyrion and Missandei said how they "want" to follow Dany because she gave them her freedom and as a result they are more loyal to her than the Lannister army to Cersei cause they fight for her due to fear. The Lannister army surrendered to Dany. You think the Dothraki would surrender to Cersei if they are captured? They are loyal to Dany and hence would rather burn than serve another king/queen.

The Lannister army surrendered to her because she was threatening to set them on fire if they didn't. It's hardly the best example of her being different to Cersei.

So instead she's showing how different she is by letting many of her followers fight and die for her when she could win the war in a single stroke.

The logic is incredibly flawed and only is being used because her dragons are so powerful.

 

[Jagga7]

Then you dont understand the difference between Cersei and Dany. With Cersei they follow her cause they fear her. With Dany she wants them to follow her cause they want to not because they are forced to. If she wanted to do what Cersei did, she could have taken Kings Landing by now, no questions asked.

Yeh and it's completely contradicted when she says to the Lannister army bend the knee and die and then burning alive the people who don't.

Add this to the 3 dragons, foreigner army and a recent history of having a mad Targaryen King, the whole idea of getting the people to follow her is pretty poor logic. She needs to take control and the sheep get in line.


The whole idea to go on a suicide mission to get Cerci on board is just as hilariously bad. Tyrion of all people should know she won't give a feck even with proof. She would rather see everyone die then relinquish power.

It's war people are going to die, what kind of conquest is this???

I expect the books to be way better than this.

 

[JustAFan]

You really think Drogon's head being in the way is something the show took in consideration? Or the writers want us to assume something as important as Tyrion intentionally holding back information from Danny? Watching the video you posted- there's Dothrakhi behind Tyrion witnessing the whole thing and Drogon's head does not block Danny's view when Bronn dives at Jaime.

Tyrion was reacting to all the destruction caused, a set up to his hesitation later in the episode. I doubt he was expecting to find Jaime's body magically appear away from where he last saw it.

Simplest explanation is they wanted a nice blockbuster scene to end the episode on. Most of us, however, expected some sort of resolution/pay off to the scene because that's how it was telegraphed. But it turns out they just did it for the wow factor and Jaime and Bronn escaped because that's what the story line needed.

No idea how much the writers put into it, but all I can do as a viewer is watch the scene and look at it not just from my all knowing point of view, but from the view of what the characters in the show are doing/seeing/might be thinking.

And yes you see freaking drogons head, turn in front of Dany, blocking her from view. That shot is meant to be from Jaime's point of view and it is NOT a stretch to imagine that Drogon's huge head was blocking Dany's view. Look at the Jon Snow scene last night, Dany had difficulty seeing what was going on until Drogon moved his head so she could see Jon. Sorry if I pay more attention to the show then you do.

Well at least I am seeming to at least give some thought to the situation from the characters point of view. Where as with most nitpicks, this one seems to have very little thought put into it.

Yes some Dothraki with Tyrion did see the guy charging Dany, but that does not mean they are going to spend time looking for a guy who may have been burnt to a crisp or may have been drowned, but either way let's make finding this random guy who we have no idea who it is, the top priority after the battle is over!

 

[Sylar]

The Lannister army surrendered to her because she was threatening to set them on fire if they didn't. It's hardly the best example of her being different to Cersei.

So instead she's showing how different she is by letting many of her followers fight and die for her when she could win the war in a single stroke.

The logic is incredibly flawed and only is being used because her dragons are so powerful.

Well Cersei really wouldnt give them a choice.

The whole idea to go on a suicide mission to get Cerci on board is just as hilariously bad. Tyrion of all people should know she won't give a feck even with proof. She would rather see everyone die then relinquish power.

Tyrion knows this hence why he got Jamie involved. Jamie is probably the one person Tyrion thinks can sway her on this.

Well at least I am seeming to at least give some thought to the situation from the characters point of view. Where as with most nitpicks, this one seems to have very little thought put into it.

Yes some Dothraki with Tyrion did see the guy charging Dany, but that does not mean they are going to spend time looking for a guy who may have been burnt to a crisp or may have been drowned, but either way let's make finding this random guy who we have no idea who it is, the top priority after the battle is over!

I do like your explanations. But surely its better to be safe than sorry. If youre not sure one of your enemies is dead, you dont just assume they are and go about your business. You would at least do some sort of sweep to ensure youre now in a safe position esp if the one person is somebody that is trying to kill the most important part of this side of the war. Top priority? nah. But it should still be done. Gah,,, overall thats the only thing that annoyed me but for me it was still an enjoyable ep.

 

[JustAFan]

I do like your explanations. But surely its better to be safe than sorry. If youre not sure one of your enemies is dead, you dont just assume they are and go about your business. You would at least do some sort of sweep to ensure youre now in a safe position esp if the one person is somebody that is trying to kill the most important part of this side of the war. Top priority? nah. But it should still be done. Gah,,, overall thats the only thing that annoyed me but for me it was still an enjoyable ep.

They rounded up a good many prisoners after the battle, obviously they swept the battlefield for survivors. SO you are fecking annoyed over something that happened, but have just decided it must not have happened. Pay fecking attention.

 

[NinjaFletch]

Well Cersei really wouldnt give them a choice.



Tyrion knows this hence why he got Jamie involved. Jamie is probably the one person Tyrion thinks can sway her on this.



I do like your explanations. But surely its better to be safe than sorry. If youre not sure one of your enemies is dead, you dont just assume they are and go about your business. You would at least do some sort of sweep to ensure youre now in a safe position esp if the one person is somebody that is trying to kill the most important part of this side of the war. Top priority? nah. But it should still be done. Gah,,, overall thats the only thing that annoyed me but for me it was still an enjoyable ep.

I'm pretty sure the choice of 'fight for me or die' isn't really a choice though.

 

[Tarrou]

In a show about dragons and shit people moan that timelines aren't realistic. Who gives a feck?

 

[kps88]

No idea how much the writers put into it, but all I can do as a viewer is watch the scene and look at it not just from my all knowing point of view, but from the view of what the characters in the show are doing/seeing/might be thinking.

And yes you see freaking drogons head, turn in front of Dany, blocking her from view. That shot is meant to be from Jaime's point of view and it is NOT a stretch to imagine that Drogon's huge head was blocking Dany's view. Look at the Jon Snow scene last night, Dany had difficulty seeing what was going on until Drogon moved his head so she could see Jon. Sorry if I pay more attention to the show then you do.

Well at least I am seeming to at least give some thought to the situation from the characters point of view. Where as with most nitpicks, this one seems to have very little thought put into it.

Yes some Dothraki with Tyrion did see the guy charging Dany, but that does not mean they are going to spend time looking for a guy who may have been burnt to a crisp or may have been drowned, but either way let's make finding this random guy who we have no idea who it is, the top priority after the battle is over!

Freeze the video you posted at second 56, there's no head blocking her view. And it's fecking ridiculous to suggest we have to start freezing videos to truly pay attention and understand what is going on

Someone just tried to kill the queen and was last seen landing inches away from her. But yeah, the battle's 100% over now so he's probably dead; no point in making sure. Not like the Dothrakhi would take offense and try to find the person who came within a whisker of killing their leader.

 

[RDCR07]

The Lannister army surrendered to her because she was threatening to set them on fire if they didn't. It's hardly the best example of her being different to Cersei.

So instead she's showing how different she is by letting many of her followers fight and die for her when she could win the war in a single stroke.

The logic is incredibly flawed and only is being used because her dragons are so powerful.

Yeh and it's completely contradicted when she says to the Lannister army bend the knee and die and then burning alive the people who don't.

Add this to the 3 dragons, foreigner army and a recent history of having a mad Targaryen King, the whole idea of getting the people to follow her is pretty poor logic. She needs to take control and the sheep get in line.

She clearly mentioned the difference between killing soldiers and innocent civilians. She also gave them a choice to bend the knee. She is only killing soldiers who want to kill her. Cersei wouldnt give one thought to saving the lives of the soldiers who went up against her. Hell she wont even give a second thought about her own soldiers let alone soldiers from the other side. And literally every single person knows that Dany could take Kings Landing ANYTIME. But the fact that she still hasnt taken it clearly shows how different she is to Cersei.

 

[RDCR07]

In a show about dragons and shit people moan that timelines aren't realistic. Who gives a feck?

You would think its that easy to convince them wouldnt you?

 

[JustAFan]

In a show about dragons and shit people moan that timelines aren't realistic. Who gives a feck?

They have sped some things up. But the part most people are missing is that in some cases they are not giving us an idea of the actual time that has passed. What we should not do is assume that just because a scene occurs right after another scene, that the events are just hours apart. Take the attack on the wagon train, some thought it happened right after the Bronn and Jaime scene outside Highgarden, when in fact if they paid attention there was actually the passage of some time (IE the mention of the gold train having arrived at Kings Landing).

Same with the Euron Greyjoy fleets, we are not actually given a time line of how many days or weeks have passed.

 

[NinjaFletch]

She clearly mentioned the difference between killing soldiers and innocent civilians. She also gave them a choice to bend the knee. She is only killing soldiers who want to kill her. Cersei wouldnt give one thought to saving the lives of the soldiers who went up against her. Hell she wont even give a second thought about her own soldiers let alone soldiers from the other side. And literally every single person knows that Dany could take Kings Landing ANYTIME. But the fact that she still hasnt taken it clearly shows how different she is to Cersei.

But again that's daft logic attempting to write around the fact that she's got a massive advantage and could win the war in seconds.

They fecked up in allowing her to accumulate too much power and now are desperately trying to piece together bullshit reasons that don't make sense as to why she can't use it.

 

[Freak]

Ok so can someone please kill off Jorah. The dude has been friend zoned so many times yet he persists to the point of being super annoying.

And how can all these characters travel from place to place and the white walkers have yet to reach the wall after all this time?

 

[Jagga7]

She clearly mentioned the difference between killing soldiers and innocent civilians. She also gave them a choice to bend the knee. She is only killing soldiers who want to kill her. Cersei wouldnt give one thought to saving the lives of the soldiers who went up against her. Hell she wont even give a second thought about her own soldiers let alone soldiers from the other side. And literally every single person knows that Dany could take Kings Landing ANYTIME. But the fact that she still hasnt taken it clearly shows how different she is to Cersei.

This is exactly why the whole plot is stupid. She doesn't want her dragons to burn cities to the ground, yet Drogon has shown incredible obedience in the last 2 episodes. She wanted the punish the guys who didn't kneel and handy Drogon kills burns them while everyone in close proximity watches and he doesn't harm any of them. So you're telling me she can't fly up on Drogon to the Red Keep, burn Cerci and just walk into Kings Landing.

The only way this whole plot makes any sense if there is a double agent in the Daenerys camp and they are actively leading her astray.

 

[RDCR07]

But again that's daft logic attempting to write around the fact that she's got a massive advantage and could win the war in seconds.

They fecked up in allowing her to accumulate too much power and now are desperately trying to piece together bullshit reasons that don't make sense as to why she can't use it.

But thats how she has ALWAYS been portrayed on the show. They didnt change her character after she landed in Westeros. Like she isnt evil in terms of wanting to kill everyone and conquer them. She wants people to follow her cause they want to but cause they have to. She even gave the unsullied freedom to leave and go home if they wanted to.

 

[JustAFan]

Going to point out that every single thing that happens to the characters in the show is because the writers (GRRM and/or the show writers) have decided it is what they want to happen to the character to advance the story, build the character, etc. So it is sort of silly to complain about a scene happening just because the writers wanted it to....well duh....congrats on figuring out how TV shows work.

 

[NinjaFletch]

But thats how she has ALWAYS been portrayed on the show. They didnt change her character after she landed in Westeros. Like she isnt evil in terms of wanting to kill everyone and conquer them. She wants people to follow her cause they want to but cause they have to. She even gave the unsullied freedom to leave and go home if they wanted to.

So then why is she fighting at all then? If her whole plan is to be the first democratically elected ruler of Westeros surely any attempt to fight and change the balance of power increases the chance of people feeling like they have to follow her rather than wanting to?

And certainly today's scene saw an awful lot of duress at play when people 'chose' to follow her.

 

[LARulz]

In a show about dragons and shit people moan that timelines aren't realistic. Who gives a feck?

Yeah that used to be my argument too but in a way its not a correct one. You go into the show knowing it has all this (dragons, dead army etc.) but then you expect everything else to be 'standard'. Travelling at the speed of light was not part of the show before but all of a sudden is, so I think it is quite justifiable to think it's stupid.

Of course, I am not bothered because all it means is we get to see mainly the good scenes now, less filler.

 

[Sylar]

They rounded up a good many prisoners after the battle, obviously they swept the battlefield for survivors. SO you are fecking annoyed over something that happened, but have just decided it must not have happened. Pay fecking attention.

Wow, calm down buddy. Youre acting like youre writing the show and are taking this personally.
And No, im not talking about a general sweep which they showed. Im talking about a sweep to ensure the body that made an attempt on her life was dead.
It clearly did NOT happen otherwise Jamie and bronn would not have escaped. Maybe you should 'pay feckin attention' eh?

The way it played out makes it show that Danys side were thinking, yeah hes a goner so lets not worry that he has a small chance of surviving.

In fact this is pretty much the same as what im saying:

Freeze the video you posted at second 56, there's no head blocking her view. And it's fecking ridiculous to suggest we have to start freezing videos to truly pay attention and understand what is going on

Someone just tried to kill the queen and was last seen landing inches away from her. But yeah, the battle's 100% over now so he's probably dead; no point in making sure. Not like the Dothrakhi would take offense and try to find the person who came within a whisker of killing their leader.

It still is minor in the landscape of the bigger picture, but I dont get why youre so annoyed that somebody would find it frustrating.
This isnt like the time jumps which is now accepted and happens every episode (and hell happened in ep1 of s1). This is something youre trying to justify but wouldnt make sense anyway.

I'm pretty sure the choice of 'fight for me or die' isn't really a choice though.

Still more of a choice than Cersei would have provided. Cersei would have just had them all killed. The Tarlys made a choice which ended with their demise (and made up the mind of everybody else remaining).
So far, Dany seems fine with doing this to people that are part of the war, but not those that are seen as innocents (not fighting the war). Once she crosses that line, then she is pretty much the same as Cersei imo.

 

[RDCR07]

I'm pretty sure the choice of 'fight for me or die' isn't really a choice though.

Dafaq? It is a choice. Your army lost. You're at her mercy. She can kill you or take you hostage or feed you to her dragons. She can do anything. Instead she says surrender and I will let you live. That is a choice.

 

[kps88]

Going to point out that every single thing that happens to the characters in the show is because the writers (GRRM and/or the show writers) have decided it is what they want to happen to the character to advance the story, build the character, etc.

Yes. And I'm going to point out that no TV show is perfect and it's possible certain things end up being stupid/poorly executed. No need to get so defensive whenever that is pointed out. Not everyone thinks so highly of the writers as you do.

 

[RDCR07]

So then why is she fighting at all then? If her whole plan is to be the first democratically elected ruler of Westeros surely any attempt to fight and change the balance of power increases the chance of people feeling like they have to follow her rather than wanting to?

And certainly today's scene saw an awful lot of duress at play when people 'chose' to follow her.

Cause the person sitting on the throne doesnt want to give it up?

 

[NinjaFletch]

Dafaq? It is a choice. Your army lost. You're at her mercy. She can kill you or take you hostage or feed you to her dragons. She can do anything. Instead she says surrender and I will let you live. That is a choice.

I think you've missed the point. If your argument is that people follow her out of choice rather than fear, but the choice they are presented is 'fight for me or die' then their 'choice' to follow her is indistinguishable from fear.

Cause the person sitting on the throne doesnt want to give it up?

So ride your big fecking virtually invincible dragon through her window and kill her and save the lives of thousands of your followers? Seems the obvious answer if you're supposed to care about the people who follow you.

 

[Sylar]

Going to point out that every single thing that happens to the characters in the show is because the writers (GRRM and/or the show writers) have decided it is what they want to happen to the character to advance the story, build the character, etc. So it is sort of silly to complain about a scene happening just because the writers wanted it to....well duh....congrats on figuring out how TV shows work.

I agree with most of what you say, but this is a silly point.
So if in the next episode Tyrion just stabs Varys out of the blue, and people on here ask 'why did he do that', your answer would be 'its because the writers decided they wanted that to happen'?
If that was the case, there would be no point of discussion.

Dafaq? It is a choice. Your army lost. You're at her mercy. She can kill you or take you hostage or feed you to her dragons. She can do anything. Instead she says surrender and I will let you live. That is a choice.

Yeah its clearly a choice, one that Cersei wouldnt afford in the same position.

So then why is she fighting at all then? If her whole plan is to be the first democratically elected ruler of Westeros surely any attempt to fight and change the balance of power increases the chance of people feeling like they have to follow her rather than wanting to?

And certainly today's scene saw an awful lot of duress at play when people 'chose' to follow her.

TBF, at first she was fighting because she kept saying it was her birth right.
Now its more for the good of the people as well. Her whole, 'she wants to break the wheel' is because she wants to be loved. And shes seen through the seasons that not everything can be done just through good deeds (eg freeing the slaves of the slave masters, but then some slaves wanting to go back to that, eg that dude in s4 who was tutoring the slave masters children).

Shes obviously in a conflict right now. The stuff she tries to do via her councils methods arent working to plan and thats because shes learning Cersei isnt playing fair (nor does she have to). If it was Dany on her own, she probably would have taken KL already but shes been counselled against that for obvious reasons (mainly not wanting to be like her father).

 

[Sylar]

So ride your big fecking virtually invincible dragon through her window and kill her and save the lives of thousands of your followers? Seems the obvious answer if you're supposed to care about the people who follow you.

I think an issue arises from that. If shes flying onto KL, she will most certainly be attacked. Cersei will not be in the open to just be the only one set upon. She will most likely be surrounded.
Although the image of Drogon flying through a window is quite something

 

[NinjaFletch]

I think an issue arises from that. If shes flying onto KL, she will most certainly be attacked. Cersei will not be in the open to just be the only one set upon. She will most likely be surrounded.
Although the image of Drogon flying through a window is quite something

I'm obviously being slightly flippant, but the arguments against her burning down the Red Keep being 'your dad would have done it' and 'don't be like Cersei' don't make much sense when they result in more drawn out suffering and death and destruction.

At least if you attacked the Red Keep directly you'd pretty much guarantee you'd only kill Lannister loyalists.

 

[JustAFan]

I think you've missed the point. If your argument is that people follow her out of choice rather than fear, but the choice they are presented is 'fight for me or die' then their 'choice' to follow her is indistinguishable from fear.



So ride your big fecking virtually invincible dragon through her window and kill her and save the lives of thousands of your followers? Seems the obvious answer if you're supposed to care about the people who follow you.

Will assume there are a few look outs at Kings Landing looking for a big fecking dragon flying their way and who might give a warning and let Queen C, get out of her room to someplace safer. Plus Dany is really looking forward to sitting on the Iron Throne, so burning down the castle in Kings Landing probably not high on her priority list either.

 

[RDCR07]

I think you've missed the point. If your argument is that people follow her out of choice rather than fear, but the choice they are presented is 'fight for me or die' then their 'choice' to follow her is indistinguishable from fear.

I said there is a difference between soldiers and civilians. Its a huge deal that she even is giving this choice to the very same people that wanted to kill her before the war began. She wants civilians and the other cities to see how different she can be from the past rulers. Hence the whole patience approach.

 

[JustAFan]

I said there is a difference between soldiers and civilians. Its a huge deal that she even is giving this choice to the very same people that wanted to kill her before the war began. She wants civilians and the other cities to see how different she can be from the past rulers. Hence the whole patience approach.

Also a big difference between soldiers who you are freeing (the unsullied) and ones who have just been fighting against you.

 

[Moonred]

Some wretched explanations to defend unexplained shoddy writing in parts.

Lot happened in the episode, I can overlook grievances and still enjoy as the story is moving. Nice bit of A team in action at the end.

 

[Sylar]

I'm obviously being slightly flippant, but the arguments against her burning down the Red Keep being 'your dad would have done it' and 'don't be like Cersei' don't make much sense when they result in more drawn out suffering and death and destruction.

At least if you attacked the Red Keep directly you'd pretty much guarantee you'd only kill Lannister loyalists.

I think it might be because KL has a lot of civilians. When the dragon attacks, there will be resistance when the dragon gets to the borders of KL youd assume.
Meaning the dragon would fire back and theres no guarantee the innocent / civilians wont get caught in the fire.

At least with the episode recently, you knew the dragon would only be attacking / killing those who are fighting for Lannisters.

 

[NinjaFletch]

Will assume there are a few look outs at Kings Landing looking for a big fecking dragon flying their way and who might give a warning and let Queen C, get out of her room to someplace safer. Plus Dany is really looking forward to sitting on the Iron Throne, so burning down the castle in Kings Landing probably not high on her priority list either.

Given the scouting in this show so far I doubt it, but even assuming she does flee where does she go and who supports her? They've lost Casterly Rock (And were willing to give it up because it had no strategic value, so it's difficult to see how they can be a threat from there in the alternative universe where she goes straight for Kings Landing), the Iron Banks support is entirely dependent on her ability to pay, and the family's that are still supporting her are doing so based on her ability to oppose Dany.

If you buy the argument that Dany is different (I'm not sure I do, she wanted to burn down the Red Keep and was talked out of it, and then todays scene - most of this talk comes from Tryrion and Jon it seems more a case of her believing her own BS) then I would be certain Dany will destroy the Iron Throne if she wins anyway. It would be in keeping with the desire to separate from her family's past. At any rate, her being sentimentality attached to a chair shes never seen is one of the weakest arguments for not burning down the Red Keep.

I said there is a difference between soldiers and civilians. Its a huge deal that she even is giving this choice to the very same people that wanted to kill her before the war began. She wants civilians and the other cities to see how different she can be from the past rulers. Hence the whole patience approach.

So she wants them to see she's different by threatening to kill any that don't follow her? I'm, well, baffled by your interpretation here. I'm absolutely certain that scene was supposed to convey that she was acting Cersei-like, and not that it was some kind act of mercy. It was interspersed with scenes of a queasy looking Tyrion imploring her to do something different, and followed by another seen where Tyrion, clearly trying to convince himself, makes the exact argument you are before concluding with 'I am her hand not her head' which Varys counters with 'Thats what I used to tell myself about her father'. They're hardly being subtle that this is an example of Dany acting like her the Mad King.

And lets also be clear about who she's threatening, the show wanted you to know that the Lannister men are common folk who are tired of war fighting for their pay; they dedicated a whole scene to that very point. They've tried their best to humanise the soldiers. The distinction your making is murky.

I think it might be because KL has a lot of civilians. When the dragon attacks, there will be resistance when the dragon gets to the borders of KL youd assume.
Meaning the dragon would fire back and theres no guarantee the innocent / civilians wont get caught in the fire.

At least with the episode recently, you knew the dragon would only be attacking / killing those who are fighting for Lannisters.

KL does, but the Red Keep is quite separate. I can't find the map from the opening credits, and I don't want to link something not from the show, but the Keep is on a rock jutting out to the sea. You could easily attack it without causing any real damage to the City in general and it would be fairly easy to cut it off from support in the city.

There would be innocent people in there too, but access is clearly controlled (see Arya trying to get into Winterfell's keep last episode), and they're at least as innocent as the soldiers they're killing.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

I imagine the next episode has the potential to be the best ever. Should be hardholm on steroids, with the added presence of jorah, ser Davos, gendry and the hounds gang.