But he "knows the club". The most overused and pointless phrase on here
Inzaghi, Seedorf and Gattuso all knew or knows the club.
Fans are turning on Ole faster than they did on Moyes, LVG and Jose
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Inzaghi, Seedorf and Gattuso all knew or knows the club.
I know no United fans like the OP adresses in real life. I think only on the internet you will find the type of fan who
- Thinks Man United is more important than anything but has no clue what Man United is
- Will form a sacking opinion based on ten games
- Has no knowledge about what a manager actually does, but will form a dead set negative opinion based on this nothing
- Whatches the games but doesn’t understand football, yet thinks she or he does
This is classic cheap rhetoric post. Empty phrases meant to abuse and diminish someone who has different opinion than you.
Yes the negotiations would have been going for a while before his appointment, I just see it as him having the final approval (kinda tough to do anything but appprove tbh at that point)
He wasn't even permanent manager and that was before the PSG game. So I don't think the decision to make him permanent manager was already done.
I have this feeling, granted based on nothing concrete, that he was thought as permanent from the start. That the fans and the media were made to believe that a due process was engaged when it really wasn't.
Like I said, just me being my skeptical self.
I really doubt that. In any case these are all small details. I mean he has sidelined Fellaini, Valencia and to an extend Darmian. He has dropped Lukaku, Sanchez. His options are limited and he has already made few good decisions. I believe there will be lot of players who barely contribute will be shown the door.
Also I'm guessing we can't clear everything in 1 summer so people will moan about that.
Even if he had those, it wouldnt be fair to judge him without a transfer window and preseason. All the other managers got those.
We'll find out more about him in the summer anyway. He needs to be very strict and even give them instructions on how they should behave during their holidays as preseason will be hell (hopefully)
I would look past the caf and social media bubble. The keyboard warriors are just clueless pricks.
Yeah, we will know more about him next season.
Bold part, this is something he said it isn't it, that how they come back from holidays is very important.
Surely we're still allowed to be concerned now and expess such concerns even if he deserves that time before he's ultimately judged?
All a bit cult/religious in here being told we just need to have belief and any criticism is blasphemy. There's two sides of the same coin here the idiots who want him sacked and those who are unwilling to even consider that Ole wasn't a well considered appointment.
I didn't know, very happy that he will focus on it. If we are meant to improve our fitness, our starting point should really not be that low.
I have faith. There’d be knee jerk reactions no matter who we appointed. If it was Poch people would bang on how he hasn’t won titles (yet).
I am willing to give Ole a chance to clear out some deadwood and sign players of the ilk required.
I am willing to give Ole a chance to clear out some deadwood and sign players of the ilk required.
Its pointless thinking about it at this point.
A) He's proven he can get the team playing well for a period. So we know he can do that
B) He hasnt had a proper chance with no pre-season and transfer window where we've spent on his player or players. Even Moyes got a Fellaini and later on a Mata
This is exactly why I was thinking we needed to suffer through Mourinho till the end of the season. Because any manager coming in to replace him needed to be given the best atmosphere and situation to do so and have a real chance of turning it around.
Seems like Ole did too well too soon and now people have unrealistic expectations. He's shown he can get more from Mourinho's players and pre-season than Mourinho did this season, now we just have to give him the chance to see what he can do with his own team. And that comes next season.
I will be disappointed if after the good start we dont get 4th. But its not the end of the world because Ole did well to get us even thinking about that
I think people have every right to be concerned about Ole's lack of management credentials, that his permanent appointment was announced too early as a fig leaf to the fans and indeed that any manager, let alone a relative managerial rookie, would struggle to turn this club around after years of mismanagement at many levels. People who are expressing those type of points in a rational, collected manner should not be shouted down as traitors failing to do right by a United legend.
That said I tend to agree with the below viewpoint, that Ole is planning to show much more steel than some are thinking:
Now he has had chance to work with this squad through good times and bad and has made his recent comments about the players, putting aside his fan serving lines about the history and character of the club, I think it's clear he knows a clear-out and injection of quality is sorely needed. Whether he's the right man and/or whether he'll given proper backing to carry it out is debatable, but I'm backing him to the hilt this summer.
That said I tend to agree with the below viewpoint, that Ole is planning to show much more steel than some are thinking:
Now he has had chance to work with this squad through good times and bad and has made his recent comments about the players, putting aside his fan serving lines about the history and character of the club, I think it's clear he knows a clear-out and injection of quality is sorely needed. Whether he's the right man and/or whether he'll given proper backing to carry it out is debatable, but I'm backing him to the hilt this summer.
Those are today's fans for you.
He has a fecking contract. The club trusted him. Give him a chance and let him do his work. He has been in the job for half a season now, while it hasn't been very good, it hasn't been worse than the 3 managers before him.
I read at the begining of the thread: how do we know he is gonna sign the right players ? well, how did you know LVG/Moyes/Jose were going to ? they certainly didn't, and LVG and Jose were some of the big names in Football.
How do you know Poch would sign the right players ? you don't know, he barely signed players for Spurs and he had his shares of bad signings as well.
Stop moaning people and give him a chance. if only just because you gave one to Moyes and several to Jose and LVG. evaluate after a year and see where we are.
In addition to all that: What do people that moan and are turning on him win from all this ? there's just more negativity around the club and pressure on him and the coaching staff. Is he gonna be sacked this summer ? definitly not. So why all this negativity around him ?
Anyway, have a good day people!
He has a fecking contract. The club trusted him. Give him a chance and let him do his work. He has been in the job for half a season now, while it hasn't been very good, it hasn't been worse than the 3 managers before him.
I read at the begining of the thread: how do we know he is gonna sign the right players ? well, how did you know LVG/Moyes/Jose were going to ? they certainly didn't, and LVG and Jose were some of the big names in Football.
How do you know Poch would sign the right players ? you don't know, he barely signed players for Spurs and he had his shares of bad signings as well.
Stop moaning people and give him a chance. if only just because you gave one to Moyes and several to Jose and LVG. evaluate after a year and see where we are.
In addition to all that: What do people that moan and are turning on him win from all this ? there's just more negativity around the club and pressure on him and the coaching staff. Is he gonna be sacked this summer ? definitly not. So why all this negativity around him ?
Anyway, have a good day people!
I haven't turned on him but I did say right out the outset that I was worried he is "too nice." Also, I was pissed off at the club for once again seemingly only looking at one candidate - having categorically said they would wait until the end of the season. When you don't learn from your mistakes...
Match going fans would have been singing Jose's name even now if he was still our manager and getting us relegated. Match going fans have taken what Sir Alex said about getting behind your manger too seriously. There is nothing any manager can do now that will make the match going fans turn.
the day he was appointed! not really, but I knew he was not the right man for the job
Football fans are fickle and emotional, so when a team loses, the reaction is knee jerk rather than thought out, hence the matchday thread. I am sure that at least a few people who are slagging off players who have just gifted the ball back to the opposition, will think in a more measured way two days after the event!
But in terms of Ole, lots of people say they don't know what he wants. I disagree, you saw what he wanted when he first turned up, but the team wasn't able to keep it up, the change happened mid season, so he has been forced to play differently to get through to the summer. As others have mentioned your sudden rush of injuries was no coincidence.
Also lots of people saying the United way, why does he keep harping back to an outdated style of football? Ole has said himself that football has moved on and what was successful when he was playing won't work now. Ole's "United way" is about attitude not tactics. And if you are going to play a high intensity counter attacking style, you need that attitude, in fact any tactic that Ole plays will benefit from a good attitude, the only thing wrong with this in a way is calling it the United way as all clubs would like to be the strongest, the fastest, having top youth come through the ranks etc!
If you look at pool and city, how the team plays is more important than the individual, city admittedly have great players all over the pitch and the bench, but pool don't, think henderson or wijnaldum, milner, but their system has them in the right places to press, intercept and force mistakes. That's hellishly hard work on the players to do that and again switching a team to it mid season is always going to cause issues. So don't read too much into your dip in form at this end of the season.
Klopp took time at pool to get the system working, pep took time at city, give Ole a bit of time too, getting rid now or next season would be pointless as you'll go back to square one again.
The only mistake here if there is one is the club announcing it Ole so early, if you say you're going to wait to the end of the season wait, dont make an emotional press led decision, stick to your guns!
But in terms of Ole, lots of people say they don't know what he wants. I disagree, you saw what he wanted when he first turned up, but the team wasn't able to keep it up, the change happened mid season, so he has been forced to play differently to get through to the summer. As others have mentioned your sudden rush of injuries was no coincidence.
Also lots of people saying the United way, why does he keep harping back to an outdated style of football? Ole has said himself that football has moved on and what was successful when he was playing won't work now. Ole's "United way" is about attitude not tactics. And if you are going to play a high intensity counter attacking style, you need that attitude, in fact any tactic that Ole plays will benefit from a good attitude, the only thing wrong with this in a way is calling it the United way as all clubs would like to be the strongest, the fastest, having top youth come through the ranks etc!
If you look at pool and city, how the team plays is more important than the individual, city admittedly have great players all over the pitch and the bench, but pool don't, think henderson or wijnaldum, milner, but their system has them in the right places to press, intercept and force mistakes. That's hellishly hard work on the players to do that and again switching a team to it mid season is always going to cause issues. So don't read too much into your dip in form at this end of the season.
Klopp took time at pool to get the system working, pep took time at city, give Ole a bit of time too, getting rid now or next season would be pointless as you'll go back to square one again.
The only mistake here if there is one is the club announcing it Ole so early, if you say you're going to wait to the end of the season wait, dont make an emotional press led decision, stick to your guns!
I don't think people know what they want, it's just chaotic from top to bottom right now including the fan base. If we hadn't installed a manager before the summer then we would have no plans on player recruitment - which players would we have signed, who would have decided on the players, and how would the club have sold joining Utd as an attractive option? Who would have then been appointed, and what if whoever was brought in made a shit show because the recruitment was wrong. Would they be deemed ready for the chop at the first sign of issues on the pitch?
We did the right thing in hiring Ole. The only other outstanding candidate was Poch, who will not join Utd from Spurs as Levy simply wouldn't allow such a move.
This will take time and we will lose more games, but everyone can agree that the club needs major surgery to fix it again. I believe that Ole will be looking at good young players, and players with the right character to play for United, not ones coming for the payday like we have seen countless times over the past 6 years. Fergie would always comment on the character of players, and by and large he got that right.
We are where we are right now. The table isn't lying to us - we've been piss poor most of the season. I for one shall be rallying behind Ole and backing him to turn this around, but it will take time to do so.
We did the right thing in hiring Ole. The only other outstanding candidate was Poch, who will not join Utd from Spurs as Levy simply wouldn't allow such a move.
This will take time and we will lose more games, but everyone can agree that the club needs major surgery to fix it again. I believe that Ole will be looking at good young players, and players with the right character to play for United, not ones coming for the payday like we have seen countless times over the past 6 years. Fergie would always comment on the character of players, and by and large he got that right.
We are where we are right now. The table isn't lying to us - we've been piss poor most of the season. I for one shall be rallying behind Ole and backing him to turn this around, but it will take time to do so.
Certainly not against the Ole appointment, but you you can have someone lined up and work on their targets etc without announcing it before the summer
Isn't that good? The blind and undeserved loyalty a lot of our fans bestowed on Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho is one the biggest causes of our decline.
I've got this weird tin foil hat conspiracy theory that Ole is the fall guy for five years of mediocrity while they re-build the club. They have to throw around 6 or 7 earners in to the bin and almost destroy the entire playing group and I see that as the only real scenario to rebuilding the actual footballing infrastructure. It doesn't make sense to re-build it through a period of dominance.
There are some proper weirdo's though if they turn on Ole. The club will never turn it around if fans turn on Ole.
There are some proper weirdo's though if they turn on Ole. The club will never turn it around if fans turn on Ole.
How is that the cause of our decline? How many fans here and match going are responsible for:funds,decision making,tactics etc?
It's absurd to say 'our blind loyalty,' is one of the causes. We show support, yes but you'd expect that from any fan
The Café are all football experts with extensive management experience of running big football clubs. How dare you make such a remark!?I’ll sing Ole’s at the wheel at the ground but that doesn’t mean I wont criticise him. I wont pretend that he is a better manager than the last either.
Moyes is the worst of the lot, but many people were patient with him as he had Ferguson's recommendation, who in their eyes could do no wrong. Plus, I suppose nobody expected the downslide to be that bad as they hadn't experienced it before.
LvG and Jose had minor successes initially and so earned a bit of a long rope. As far as Ole is concerned, there has always been a hesitation because we fear the Moyes era could repeat. The patience is less because of all we have been through, it has made us more cautious and apprehensive.
LvG and Jose had minor successes initially and so earned a bit of a long rope. As far as Ole is concerned, there has always been a hesitation because we fear the Moyes era could repeat. The patience is less because of all we have been through, it has made us more cautious and apprehensive.
7 losses in 9 games - even LVG didn't have such a horrible run. This coupled with the fact that Ole hasn't achieved anything at top level and, if anything, has failed at Cardiff make fans wonder whether his appointment wasn't premature. The board should have waited to see how he would deal with adversity once the honeymoon period was over.
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I've always said that Ole wasn't IMO the right man for the job and I've always wanted Pochettino. I'm not going to be critical of Ole until he's given the time & money to put his own stamp on the team but my biggest concern is and always has been will he be able to tempt the right players? Even with the lure of Champions League football I've always thought that would be a big task when we would be competing with City, Liverpool, Tottenham who are all far less chaotic that us, so without it the job becomes ten fold harder to entice the right players to improve the squad. The players we've been linked with recently just don't seem like that's ever going to happen and now were being linked with the likes of Richarlison etc and these just simply don't cut it for me.
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His appointment was absolutely too soon in my eyes, we should have waited until the end of the season to see where we were going to be as this is what we initially said was going to happen, Ed pulled the trigger too quickly but on the back of ex pro's and pundits begging for him to get the job. I understand a lot of the fans that say that he hasn't done anything in the game at the top level as its simply a fact. I understand why he got the job but it was without question too early and IMO the wrong appointment but I will back him fully.
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Being a good supporter is also about knowing what's good for your club. Blind faith in especially Moyes and Mourinho kept them in their jobs for much longer than necessary, which has proven to be irreversibly damaging.
At clubs like Madrid where the fans really do know what's best for their club, both managers would've been hounded out a lot quicker. That's why they never sink to our depths and are far more successful than we could ever hope to be.
He just picks the team and hopes for the best, obviously. Not like managing in the Norwegian league is anything like the massive demands of Barcelona's reserves or the German second tier, and his Europa League success must have been another fluke. I cannot believe he single handedly relegated the great Cardiff side that was destined for success.Lack of tactics? What does that even mean is he just sending players out on the pitch drawing their names from a hat and telling them to "sort it out for themselves?" Care to elaborate? And also - lack of coaching experience? That's a false premise if ever I've heard one. Maybe you should read up on him if you think he just magically appeared from hiding under the stands having laid there dormant ever since he retired - because that's pretty far from the case
Answer these questions:
- Is our squad better than City, Liverpool or Spurs? No
- Is Ole a better manger than pep, klopp or poch? No
So we have a 2nd rate team (or 3rd rate if you're being pedantic) and a manager who is a class below the top managers in the PL - just how on earth do we expect to get back to the top then? Throw money at it? I have no idea tbh
- Is our squad better than City, Liverpool or Spurs? No
- Is Ole a better manger than pep, klopp or poch? No
So we have a 2nd rate team (or 3rd rate if you're being pedantic) and a manager who is a class below the top managers in the PL - just how on earth do we expect to get back to the top then? Throw money at it? I have no idea tbh
As much as I want him to be a success, I don't think he will be.
His counter attack football just isn't what todays football is about, but 'maybe' with the right players, it'll work.
All I actually care about is we buy good players who fit around modern football, so if he does end up leaving, the players are useful.
The Likes of Lukaku and Matic for example just aren't built for pressing, 90mins of work, getting round the pitch quickly
His counter attack football just isn't what todays football is about, but 'maybe' with the right players, it'll work.
All I actually care about is we buy good players who fit around modern football, so if he does end up leaving, the players are useful.
The Likes of Lukaku and Matic for example just aren't built for pressing, 90mins of work, getting round the pitch quickly
Absolutely, he just got some talented players playing well after a horrid time with a control freak of a manager. He's not experienced at this level in any way, so when the shits hit the fan he's been unable to cope.
And it's not that fans are turning on him, a lot of fans didn't want him as the permanent appointment in the first place. It's yet again a decision by an estranged board that pretends they're even interested in football when in reality they don't have a clue about what United needs. Que a summer of average players only signed because others showed interest, or big name buys that they throw the money bucket at. It's just gone on too long now this shite. Need a DOF immediately, or a huge change at the top.
Blind faith didn't! The board makes those decisions not fan pressure
Don't think it's appropriate that Ole is getting this level of crap when he was the one that put us in the position to be disappointed only after one of the best managers the PL has ever seen deemed the season over in mid-December "with this bunch of players".
I think we all need to see what Ole can do with a full season, pre-season and hopefully some input on players staying, going and coming in.
The one thing I can't stomach is reading articles like I've just read from Jamie Jackson in the Guardian piece he just posted saying Lukaku "… will consider departing if United fail to qualify for the Champions League."
How can the players use their own failure as an excuse for wanting to jump ship?
I think we all need to see what Ole can do with a full season, pre-season and hopefully some input on players staying, going and coming in.
The one thing I can't stomach is reading articles like I've just read from Jamie Jackson in the Guardian piece he just posted saying Lukaku "… will consider departing if United fail to qualify for the Champions League."
How can the players use their own failure as an excuse for wanting to jump ship?