Fans are turning on Ole faster than they did on Moyes, LVG and Jose

Footy is all about forgetting the painful time.

The Sacked One was deliberately driving the club on the rocks after losing control of the squad and looking for a £25m payout. LVG had been all promises since he almost destroyed Bayern Munich and Holland, his style almost destroyed any spirit left in the club. Moyes was utterly useless, and was our worst ever manager. Giggs tried to restore something in his brief part in the management debacle. Between them they bought over £750m of players, with £420m on show against City and Everton this season! A disastrous financial outcome.

Ole has picked up this mess and at least gave us catching distance of 4th place and a few other moments in what looked to be a horrendous disaster after the Scouse game. He sold Fella but without transfers-in has worked with The Sacked One’s squad. Ok the squad ran out of steam but half a dozen games have shown what he can do. There was a lot against him when he came in and the squad has played to its limits and it’s weaknesses. There is a general consensus of what needs to be done and what needs to change. Whether the board will transition a complete and radical overhaul, again, it’s hard for any of us to be certain.

I never expected anything from this season after toxic bitching started in November, but I am backing Ole for a full season, next season.
 
Results are significantly worse than they were under Moyes, Van Gaal or Mourinho. That probably has something to do with it.

Van Gaal and Mourinho also had a track record of success at big European clubs, which encouraged the (misguided) belief that they might actually know what they are doing. Solskjaer's only experience outside the 23rd strongest league in Europe (UEFA's Norwegian League ranking), was getting Cardiff City relegated.

Having said all that, these aren't his players, and he will be given this summer's window and at least until January/February to show what he can do.
 
Nobody is turning on him, it’s just people are concerned and they have every right to be.

Thought he was a good choice as a caretaker manager to steady the ship and lift moral. I never really considered Ole as a permanent choice because he simply has not got the pedigree at prem level.

Of course people will refer to the amazing start he had, but as enjoyable as it was, I often thought it was mainly due to Ole winging it with a combination of players bounce and few slices of luck. Even a top four finish would not convince me he’s the right man to take us forward, maybe sounds a bit harsh but it’s just my gut feeling.
 
SqueakyWeasel said:
How can the players use their own failure as an excuse for wanting to jump ship?
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An absolute joke! Players failed to help United qualify for top 4, and they want to use that as an excuse to leave? You want to play CL help us fecking qualify then. Even more infuriating when its average players Like Lukaku!
 
beer&grill said:
Very nice, well argumented opinion. Insert one of: idiots, wankers, childs, then go on about "saying all the right things" and "he knows the united way" and you've got yourself a nice post while being a superior fan and also "supporting the club". I've yet to see someone in the Ole's doubters camp to resort to these kind of insults to support their opinions.

Also, what is the point of a forum if not to discuss different opinions? Should everyone just log in just to say how much they support the club and how well the players played even when putting crap performances most of the time? I swear there are some player performances threads where it is an adventure to say something negative no matter how bad they play or for how long.
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He's had half a season with a team which very clearly is already on holiday and a squad not good enough to replace the first team players. Do you really think he's had enough time? I think because he had a very good run, he should be given another season to prove if that is his standard or just a fluke.
 
Hes made a few weird decisions but the recent form is on the players.. When hes spent as much as Jose with no progress, ill judge him then
 
Andycoleno9 said:
To answer on your question. Yes, i am one of those people who turned on him. It is because i don't care is he our legend or not. He is a legend as a player and he will be that always. As a manager, he starts from zero and my opinion about him is based on everything else except "he is our Ole" and "knows the club".

First of all, he didn't have any credentials to be coach of biggest club in England, especially in our situation where we need another rebuilding. Also in 5 months he didn't prove that he is up for this task. No pattern in game style at all, bad reactions during the game and complete lack of results in last 2 months. 5 months is enough to show some kind of progress and he didn't showed that.

Why he should be treated differently than Moyes? Because he scored 100 goals for us? Or than some players when we buy them? Every coach or player deserves support based on how he is doing his job. Man Utd is only important here. Not Ole, Jose, Pogba or Moyes. And my opinion is that he is not right man for us and that he is completely out of his depth for this job. His level is Molde. Sounds harsh, but imo, it is true. I can't "support" someone who is not doing good for my club. No matter is it Ole, Jose or lets say my fav player Andy Cole.

Also, these attacks on us who think that he should go, are out of order. It was normal thing to say what you want about Jose or Lvg from day one( i was in their camp till the last day so i know) but Ole is protected from that?
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So let me get this straight. You were in the Jose and LvG camp till their last day, even though they’ve spent copious amounts of money here, each had two pre-seasons with the club and 9 transfer windows combined between them?

Ole had no pre season, nor he had the opportunity to buy a single player, yet you deemed him incompetent after 5 months?
That’s really unfair on ole, don’t you think?
 
Infra-red said:
Results are significantly worse than they were under Moyes, Van Gaal or Mourinho. That probably has something to do with it.

Van Gaal and Mourinho also had a track record of success at big European clubs, which encouraged the (misguided) belief that they might actually know what they are doing. Solskjaer's only experience outside the 23rd strongest league in Europe (UEFA's Norwegian League ranking), was getting Cardiff City relegated.

Having said all that, these aren't his players, and he will be given this summer's window and at least until January/February to show what he can do.
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Totally agree with most of this post, however we are a little bit in limbo. We wasted the chance to recruite Zidane or Poch, now Very few are available who have all the right qualities. Conte wants the job but it would be a huge mistake, more of the Jose negative defensive football.

At least giving Ole a chance which he lost likely won't take will allow the club to significantly restructure, bring back Meleutsen, get rid of the U23 Manager and let McKenna take over that group. I would love to see Edwin Van De Sar installed as Director of Football and we make the next 3 windows all about a complete overhaul of the first team squad.
 
Woziak said:
Totally agree with most of this post, however we are a little bit in limbo. We wasted the chance to recruite Zidane or Poch, now Very few are available who have all the right qualities. Conte wants the job but it would be a huge mistake, more of the Jose negative defensive football.

At least giving Ole a chance which he lost likely won't take will allow the club to significantly restructure, bring back Meleutsen, get rid of the U23 Manager and let McKenna take over that group. I would love to see Edwin Van De Sar installed as Director of Football and we make the next 3 windows all about a complete overhaul of the first team squad.
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Sensible post and something we should be aiming for. But considering there's a fan mutiny before we even get to the first transfer window of Ole's reign this would be a painful transition to say the least.
 
The rest of them had a lot better rack record as a good manager, Ole doesn't have that, he basically got the temporary job becuase he is a beloved player, so fans are starting from a more skeptical starting point.

Plus fans are just fed up bad ill thought out decisions been made by the club and are worried about going into another season of wondering is the manager gonna last till Christmas.
 
Fans are not turning on Ole. I think many thought giving him the job after a good run of form was ridiculously early and has been proved correct. Since his permanent appointment it has all gone horribly wrong.

Blame the manager, blame the board, blame the players, blame whoever you like. Nothing is right at this club and hiring a very inexperienced manager with no real philosophy other than 'play like United' doesn't fill me with much confidence.
 
Because he doesn't have Jose's masterclass experience of winning trophies and experience of having bad times but coming out of it.

Take away the emotion of him being an ex Man United Legend.. as that has nothing to do with his ability to manage and lead a team.. and able to stand up to the top players and tell Pogba off. That is about his ability to manage, stand up to the top players and also attract the best players which is a worry when even Jose struggled to attract them.. what chance does Ole have? will he have a warchest? etc.

I think many United fans get the huge whiff of "yes Ed" from Ole.. reminds me of the cuckold which was Pellegrini. Nice man.. but lacking in balls.
 
What is lost in all of this is that Woodward has played a blinder here. He is one of the biggest problems at the club but now he has at least two years to hide behind Ole. No matter what happens on the field, Woodward can't be held responsible for giving the fans the legend they want.
 
Infra-red said:
Results are significantly worse than they were under Moyes, Van Gaal or Mourinho. That probably has something to do with it.

Van Gaal and Mourinho also had a track record of success at big European clubs, which encouraged the (misguided) belief that they might actually know what they are doing. Solskjaer's only experience outside the 23rd strongest league in Europe (UEFA's Norwegian League ranking), was getting Cardiff City relegated.

Having said all that, these aren't his players, and he will be given this summer's window and at least until January/February to show what he can do.
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That's just not true. He has a 59% win rate at the moment. Moyes was 53%, LVG was 52% and Jose was 58%. I can definitely recall LvG having a terrible run of form around Christmas time in one of his seasons. Moyes never showed any promise at all. At least Olé had a patch of form.
 
SqueakyWeasel said:
Don't think it's appropriate that Ole is getting this level of crap when he was the one that put us in the position to be disappointed only after one of the best managers the PL has ever seen deemed the season over in mid-December "with this bunch of players".

I think we all need to see what Ole can do with a full season, pre-season and hopefully some input on players staying, going and coming in.

The one thing I can't stomach is reading articles like I've just read from Jamie Jackson in the Guardian piece he just posted saying Lukaku "… will consider departing if United fail to qualify for the Champions League." :eek:
How can the players use their own failure as an excuse for wanting to jump ship?
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Totally agree, he's defied expectations and is using a squad 3 other managers have assembled and largely failed with, give him a pre season and with players who actually give one. You're right about those articles, who does lukaku think he is, it's his lack of application and ability along with a few others that have us in this mess
Sir Scott McToMinay said:
So let me get this straight. You were in the Jose and LvG camp till their last day, even though they’ve spent copious amounts of money here, each had two pre-seasons with the club and 9 transfer windows combined between them?

Ole had no pre season, nor he had the opportunity to buy a single player, yet you deemed him incompetent after 5 months?
That’s really unfair on ole, don’t you think?
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I'm with you and it's posters like the one you comment on that infuriate me, we're still in with a fighting chance of top 4, look where Jose had us, Ole has done a good job and post psg the players have mostly let him down, either through their contract negotiating, just not bothered (lukaku, pogba, martial, Lingard) and players being out of form, (ddg, matic)
 
Ibrahimorich said:
That's just not true. He has a 59% win rate at the moment. Moyes was 53%, LVG was 52% and Jose was 58%. I can definitely recall LvG having a terrible run of form around Christmas time in one of his seasons. Moyes never showed any promise at all. At least Olé had a patch of form.
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We are in the midst of a run of form the likes of which has not been seen at the club for 50+ years. We were never this bad under Moyes/LvG/Mourinho.
 
Sir Scott McToMinay said:
I thought this warranted a separate thread.
I think Ole deserves a chance simply based on the fact that he knows the club, the players failed under the last managers and at this point there’s no shade of doubt that our shortcomings over the last half a decade are mainly due to the players not being good enough.

Whether or not he’s the right man I really don’t know, but the fact that fans are turning on him quicker than before is quite surprising to me.
Is it because of his lack of credentials? is it because the horrific form we’ve been on?
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Because the other managers (bar Moyes) had real pedigree and warranted time.

The only leverage Ole has is he played for United. It really ends there. His only real test was Cardiff and he failed badly as for Molde it is a tier 4 league so you have to take what he did there with a pinch of salt.
 
Tbf even if they are I can sort of understand the logic. It’s the same reason many had more patience with Jose than they did with Moyes. Jose was a proven winner. It’s like when Jose was coming out with pretty defeatist quotes and many said “well Moyes was crucified on here for the same thing!” It’s because Jose was proven as a top class coach. Ole is in the same boat as Moyes in the sense that he’s unproven at this level. Is turning on him fair? Not for me, but I can see why some would have less faith in him than others because he doesn’t have 15 years of top level success assuring people he knows what he’s doing.
 
Infra-red said:
We are in the midst of a run of form the likes of which has not been seen at the club for 50+ years. We were never this bad under Moyes/LvG/Mourinho.
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He also set the club record for consecutive away wins. We were never that good under anyone. Swings and roundabouts.
 
Green_Red said:
Old Trafford singing his songs, even on Sunday, proves that.
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And they should, as long as he's working with the mess he's been handed. I just wonder how patient they'll be if we're in 10th by christmas next season. Not saying that will happen, but it's certainly possible, especially if we really are bringing in a lot of new players. In fact, I believe a Klopp-like first season (finishing outside the top 4, maybe even top 6) might be possible if he's really going to implement an entirely new system. Would the fans accept that? Probably, if some sort of vision for the future is apparent. Would Woody accept that (no CL for 2 seasons in a row)? I doubt it...
 
I was in Manchester in the weekend and not a single one i talked with had "turned" on Ole, and both in the pubs before the match and from the Stretford End, there was mostly Ole songs and AFAIK there was not a single song for one of our current players.

Sure, his stock has fallen quite a bit since that dream start, but even rival supporters i've talked with thinks he deserves at least one window to address the issues and most who follow the EPL will admit that this is pretty fecking far from a vintage United side.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and if you dont think Ole is the right man i fully understand and respect that viewpoint. Personally i think he deserves at least a full season with a proper preseason and two transfer windows before we start bringing out the pitchforks and torches.
 
Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær said:
It's the run of form, combined with most fans being knee jerking idiots.
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Think you'll find the Board are the knee jerking idiots, having appointed a manager with zero credentials after a few decent results against teams Utd should beat every day of the week (barring PSG+Arsenal).
 
Ibrahimorich said:
He also set the club record for consecutive away wins. We were never that good under anyone. Swings and roundabouts.
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Given the catastrophic form since (and Solskjaer's inability to do anything to alter it), people are rightly wondering to what extent he was actually responsible for those wins.

The longer this run goes in, the more those early wins look like a post-Mourinho bounce, and, therefore, an anomaly.

Time will tell - he will be here until at least Jan/Feb next year.
 
Sir Scott McToMinay said:
I think Ole deserves a chance simply based on the fact that he knows the club
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This is it though. The sole reason he was hired - "he knows the club". What difference does that make? Just because he "knows the club" doesn't make him a world class motivator or genius tactician. Just because he was a decent player doesn't mean he's going to be a decent manager.

Having said that, he should be given time, but any manager should. Nobody could work wonders with this squad, he's been fine so far. Will he be a top level manager and what United need in 2 years time? Maybe he will, maybe he won't, but we won't find out unless he gets time.

I never thought Ole was a good idea in the first place. If United had brought in a manager with exactly the same experience as him but didn't happen to be a club legend as a player then all hell would have broken loose on here. He's literally been hired on the basis of what he did as player, had they looked at his managerial record alone he wouldn't have been anywhere near the job. But he's the manager now though, so he needs to be supported.
 
The issue is most fans have seen this movie before. Everton, Wolves and Leicester have less resources than us, lesser players but I can still see some identity to their play. I just don't see it with Ole's team. What is he trying to implement. What is his plan A.
City second half, Chelsea second half, and wolves have highlighted another issue that we don't have any plan B when plan A isn't working.
Finally we come to team selections and substitutions. Atrocious is only word I can use to describe it. Ashley young playing every match is just unacceptable. Sanchez being put on after not playing for months. MC Tominay sidelined while playing well for Fred and Matic. Not dropping De Gea.
Combination of all of this has fans rightly worried as Ole doesn't have a CV to fall back on.
 
The difference between fans and supporters.

Give him time. Some of the players are coming up short in the basics, that is not the fault of the the head coach/manager.
 
Sir Scott McToMinay said:
I thought this warranted a separate thread.
I think Ole deserves a chance simply based on the fact that he knows the club, the players failed under the last managers and at this point there’s no shade of doubt that our shortcomings over the last half a decade are mainly due to the players not being good enough.

Whether or not he’s the right man I really don’t know, but the fact that fans are turning on him quicker than before is quite surprising to me.
Is it because of his lack of credentials? is it because the horrific form we’ve been on?
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It warranted another thread to point out that we are infested with childish fecking idiots?
 
Sir Scott McToMinay said:
So let me get this straight. You were in the Jose and LvG camp till their last day, even though they’ve spent copious amounts of money here, each had two pre-seasons with the club and 9 transfer windows combined between them?

Ole had no pre season, nor he had the opportunity to buy a single player, yet you deemed him incompetent after 5 months?
That’s really unfair on ole, don’t you think?
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I don't want to talk about Lvg and Jose because it would be 2 pages post with lots of pros and cons. That is why i turned my back to them when things really went down the drain.
The reason why turned my back to Ole is because i don't see anything in our game which can prove me that things will be better. 5 months is a lot to make opinion about player or manager. Same was with Moyes. I am not saying that i am right or that i know more about football than you or somebody else, it is simply my feeling and my opinion that he is average manager. Sure that after pre-season, our game will be better but not much. I don't see him as a coach who will beat tactically any other good coach. I don't see him as a coach who can win game by some smart tactical move, good sub or tactical switch during the game.
I am sorry. I am sorry that i don't share your optimism and your faith. Believe it or not( i guess after my posts lately it is hard to believe) i am football optimist. After every season, my thoughts were that we will be champions next year. Before WC, i thought that we will be champions of the world( soooo close;)). Now i don't have any good feeling about next season with Ole in charge.
 
Infra-red said:
Given the catastrophic form since (and Solskjaer's inability to do anything to alter it), people are rightly wondering to what extent he was actually responsible for those wins.

The longer this run goes in, the more those early wins look like a post-Mourinho bounce, and, therefore, an anomaly.

Time will tell - he will be here until at least Jan/Feb next year.
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So when they win its all down to the players and when they lose its the Managers fault. Look at the fixture list we have had a very difficult set of fixtures and still through all this we are 3rd inform team in the league. Mourinho has cost us the Champions League place not Ole.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
To answer on your question. Yes, i am one of those people who turned on him. It is because i don't care is he our legend or not. He is a legend as a player and he will be that always. As a manager, he starts from zero and my opinion about him is based on everything else except "he is our Ole" and "knows the club".

First of all, he didn't have any credentials to be coach of biggest club in England, especially in our situation where we need another rebuilding. Also in 5 months he didn't prove that he is up for this task. No pattern in game style at all, bad reactions during the game and complete lack of results in last 2 months. 5 months is enough to show some kind of progress and he didn't showed that.

Why he should be treated differently than Moyes? Because he scored 100 goals for us? Or than some players when we buy them? Every coach or player deserves support based on how he is doing his job. Man Utd is only important here. Not Ole, Jose, Pogba or Moyes. And my opinion is that he is not right man for us and that he is completely out of his depth for this job. His level is Molde. Sounds harsh, but imo, it is true. I can't "support" someone who is not doing good for my club. No matter is it Ole, Jose or lets say my fav player Andy Cole.

Also, these attacks on us who think that he should go, are out of order. It was normal thing to say what you want about Jose or Lvg from day one( i was in their camp till the last day so i know) but Ole is protected from that?
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While you have the right to your opinion and people should accept differences of opinion, I have to say there are gaping holes in your arguments.

Of course Ole should be treated differently than Moyes - it is so obvious I shouldn't have to even deal with it but as you clearly have no idea, then here we go. Moyes inherited a title winning team in a stable Manchester United that gave him incredible support and control.

He blew it, by not asking for assistance, by screwing around with the team and instead of using its strengths undermined it by trying to put his mark on United through an amateurish I will do it my way attitude. Moyes sacked the coaching staff that was inseparable from United's success - again out of an insecure notion that the club and team had to be 'his'. But he didn't have anything to replace this successful formula with.

Things started to spiral downwards from Moyes' inability to deal with the job. Then there were the next two managers who looked fantastic compared to Moyes but were still not suitable for different reasons. At least they won silverware and actually had some management philosophies that enabled them to do so.

As for the players, lack of character has distinguished too many of them. These are the players Ole has to deal with. And he will. They are not anything remotely resembling the champion team Moyes inherited. There are significant talents such as Pogba and Ole would be able to get the best out of him if he could get better players.

There are no leaders that bind the team, few players who actually are what we used to call Manchester United players. No Andy Cole who just wanted to win and would work with his team-mates tirelessly for that purpose even when he didn't get along with them or even speak to them a la Teddy Sheringham.

And you're saying Ole should be sacked because just like the young Alex Ferguson those years ago, he needs time to turn it around? Unbelievable and illogical.
 
Fergie's Man said:
The difference between fans and supporters.
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Fans are stupid and fickle, supporters are stupid and loyal?

Our problem has fek all to do with the manager. It's the structure of the club. Why is this so hard to grasp?
 
I think if we keep a poll now, a solid 70% would still be in favor of Ole. So I don't agree with the OP as the fans who have turned against Ole are a minority.
 
He doesn't have a CV to fall on argument is silly. Does that mean that 4 months he should get dogs abuse and people calling for his sack?
Not to mention Wolves and Leicester having a style and whatnot. It's as if things are being made up and use as a stick to beat him with.
 
SqueakyWeasel said:
Don't think it's appropriate that Ole is getting this level of crap when he was the one that put us in the position to be disappointed only after one of the best managers the PL has ever seen deemed the season over in mid-December "with this bunch of players".

I think we all need to see what Ole can do with a full season, pre-season and hopefully some input on players staying, going and coming in.

The one thing I can't stomach is reading articles like I've just read from Jamie Jackson in the Guardian piece he just posted saying Lukaku "… will consider departing if United fail to qualify for the Champions League." :eek:

How can the players use their own failure as an excuse for wanting to jump ship?
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Don’t think that it was appropriate for Ole to get the job in the first place....A ridiculous decision that will cost us heavily over the next few years(Moyes 2.0)....
 
Nikelesh Reddy said:
Unless we fail to qualify for the CL,I think he”ll end up getting the job and quite rightly so...
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Nikelesh Reddy said:
Don’t think that it was appropriate for Ole to get the job in the first place....A ridiculous decision that will cost us heavily over the next few years(Moyes 2.0)....
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You did qualify the first one with champions league qual, but you've gone from it being "quite rightly so" in the original wave of euphoria we all felt, to it suddenly being not appropriate and a ridiculous decision!

It's pure hindsight!
 
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