F1 2021 Season

dinostar77 said:
Honda may have lost a few horses.

https://t.co/ICaUQq8CnW

‘Mercedes think FIA directive has slowed down Honda’

....They say “there are reports from the Mercedes corner that Honda have been slowed down by a directive from the FIA. Allegedly, there have been disagreements for four months about how the Japanese [manufacturer] operate their energy management”....

Honda deny this

https://racingnews365.com/honda-deny-theory-that-a-technical-directive-has-curtailed-their-power

However it could be like Ferrari of 2019 when they were doing something funky with their Oil/Fuel and we will never know.

One way to fond out for sure is how fast the RB is will be the long straight at Spa.
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something was 100% different after the summer break with them, sadly we will never know.
Maybe caugh cheating with fuel/oil admitted it, but on the understanding it was not announced, I dont know, just a theory.
Mercedes would not have put it out, if there was not something in it, but again we may never know.
The FIA are said to have denied any such directive, although this “doesn’t necessarily mean much” because “as a rule, corrections to the engine are not made public”.
 
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pauldyson1uk said:
something was 100% different after the summer break with them, sadly we will never know.
Maybe caugh cheating with fuel/oil admitted it, but on the understanding it was not announced, I dont know, just a theory.
Mercedes would not have put it out, if there was not something in it, but again we may never know.
The FIA are said to have denied any such directive, although this “doesn’t necessarily mean much” because “as a rule, corrections to the engine are not made public”.
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When was something different according to you? Summer break is now right?
 
I enjoyed this one so I might as well post it up here, got to love Raikkonen.

 
Adrian Newey has described next years car as the biggest changes in F1 in 40 years. Other than the powertrain everything is new. A formidable challenge. I honestly think we could see a "Brawn" appear next season and a shock potential WC, while the likes of Merc and RB try to catch up.
 
dinostar77 said:
Adrian Newey has described next years car as the biggest changes in F1 in 40 years. Other than the powertrain everything is new. A formidable challenge. I honestly think we could see a "Brawn" appear next season and a shock potential WC, while the likes of Merc and RB try to catch up.
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Let's hope so.

Having Newey onboard is such a massive plus for Red Bull, he has vast experience of making ground effect work in the past and yes obviously there are plenty of engineers out there that have the same among the teams but Newey is the king.

It's exciting as I think the style of racing will change too.
 
McLaren team principal Andreas Seidl took a gentle dig at his opposite number at Red Bull, Christian Horner, for his ongoing complaints about the impact of damage on Formula 1 teams in the cost cap era following the expensive Hungarian Grand Prix.

Horner announced the cost of Max Verstappen’s crash at Silverstone as $1.8 million and was then further annoyed by the repair bill from the race in Budapest, when both Red Bulls were damaged after Valtteri Bottas’ error at Turn 1. Both McLarens also took big hits — Lando Norris was forced to retire after contact with Bottas and Verstappen, while Daniel Ricciardo was caught in a separate crash with Lance Stroll and Charles Leclerc — but Seidl said that dealing with the extra cost when there are budget restrictions is simply part of F1.

“No (it doesn’t need addressing), not at all,” Seidl said. “I definitely will not go in the direction that Christian is going, mentioning every second sentence the cost cap and how much it will be hurt by it by an accident on track. In the end, it’s part of the game we’re in. It’s down to us to manage the budget in the right way.

“It will be a challenge to make sure now we have enough parts of the new specification available for Spa, but on the other hand, we have a great team back home in production and the engineering side, so I am confident we can recover from what happened.

“I don’t see that it affects anything of our plans, to be honest. It is quite simple and straightforward. At the beginning of the season, based on the experience of previous years, you simply have to account for certain crash damage per year. That’s what you have to figure in, and that’s what we have in the budget and that’s the challenge that we are in. It’s the same for everyone.”
 
pauldyson1uk said:
McLaren team principal Andreas Seidl took a gentle dig at his opposite number at Red Bull, Christian Horner, for his ongoing complaints about the impact of damage on Formula 1 teams in the cost cap era following the expensive Hungarian Grand Prix.

Horner announced the cost of Max Verstappen’s crash at Silverstone as $1.8 million and was then further annoyed by the repair bill from the race in Budapest, when both Red Bulls were damaged after Valtteri Bottas’ error at Turn 1. Both McLarens also took big hits — Lando Norris was forced to retire after contact with Bottas and Verstappen, while Daniel Ricciardo was caught in a separate crash with Lance Stroll and Charles Leclerc — but Seidl said that dealing with the extra cost when there are budget restrictions is simply part of F1.

“No (it doesn’t need addressing), not at all,” Seidl said. “I definitely will not go in the direction that Christian is going, mentioning every second sentence the cost cap and how much it will be hurt by it by an accident on track. In the end, it’s part of the game we’re in. It’s down to us to manage the budget in the right way.

“It will be a challenge to make sure now we have enough parts of the new specification available for Spa, but on the other hand, we have a great team back home in production and the engineering side, so I am confident we can recover from what happened.

“I don’t see that it affects anything of our plans, to be honest. It is quite simple and straightforward. At the beginning of the season, based on the experience of previous years, you simply have to account for certain crash damage per year. That’s what you have to figure in, and that’s what we have in the budget and that’s the challenge that we are in. It’s the same for everyone.”
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If he was fighting the Mercs for a world championship it would be a different story,, 1.8 million may be a small chunk in the 145m cap bit it could be the difference in who gets to develop the car towards the end of season
 
christy87 said:
If he was fighting the Mercs for a world championship it would be a different story,, 1.8 million may be a small chunk in the 145m cap bit it could be the difference in who gets to develop the car towards the end of season
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Thats not the point though. Point is that when RB were doing their budget work they should have a margin for on track incidents. If there was no budget cap we wouldnt hear a word about this issue.
 
Will the teams be penalised if they spend too much?
Put simply, yes. There are three categories of potential breaches. The first is a procedural breach, such as a team submitting their accounts late or inaccurately. The second is a minor overspend breach, when a team’s report shows they have exceeded the cost cap by less than 5 percent or the Cost Cap Administration finds they have exceeded that percentage. The third is a material overspend breach, where a team’s submission of their accounts or an investigation by the panel shows they have exceeded the cost cap by more than 5 percent.
Once a breach has been identified, three forms of penalty are possible. The first is a financial penalty. The value of the fine will be determined on a case-by-case basis. The second is a minor sporting penalty which could be a combination of a reprimand, deduction of constructors and/or drivers points, a ban for a certain number of races, limitations on testing – both CFD and on-track – and/or a reduction of their cost cap.
The third is the material sporting penalty, which is the most serious as it can involve all of the above plus exclusion from the World Championship.
 
pauldyson1uk said:
OK not F1 but worth watching.

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That was interesting. Aquaplaining coming into bus stop chicane from 190mph would make anyone scared. Going through Eau Rouge in that weather with a car stopped on Eau Rouge itself is simply reckless. The car that spun at Eau Rouge had that come in for wets? Was it cold tyres? Or just too much water for the wets to handle?
 
Watch some indi car highlights over the weekend, didn't fully understand the rules but I think if you cause a yellow flag that interrupts someone else's qualifying lap then your top lap time is deleted. Was an interesting idea, can see some positives and negatives of it.
 
pauldyson1uk said:
I have seen that, was just about to post it, the summer break could bring a few upgrades from some teams.
Merc and Red Bull I think may have some, but most teams are concentrating on 2022, we shall see soon enough.
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The Ferrari PU updates are interesting as it could bring them into contention of the front of the grid at GPs again. That will have an impact on the championship and their race with Mclaren for 3rd in constructors.

Also im not sure if the PU design is being carried over to next season as i had read reports that ferrari have gone in a different direction to Honda and Mercedes as their was potential for significant gains for the PU for 2022.

Honda tried this a few seasons back and failed and switched over to Mercedes PU design. Ferrari tried going down a different route with its push rods /pull rods which didnt work. They tried to down a different route with channelling the airflow off the front wing which didnt work. So they are happy to take risks. Though with the budget cap in place, the 2022 Ferrari PU has to deliver.
 
I never knew these were a thing.
227794394_806643030047205_7706419819073220338_n.jpg
 
pauldyson1uk said:
McLaren team principal Andreas Seidl took a gentle dig at his opposite number at Red Bull, Christian Horner, for his ongoing complaints about the impact of damage on Formula 1 teams in the cost cap era following the expensive Hungarian Grand Prix.

Horner announced the cost of Max Verstappen’s crash at Silverstone as $1.8 million and was then further annoyed by the repair bill from the race in Budapest, when both Red Bulls were damaged after Valtteri Bottas’ error at Turn 1. Both McLarens also took big hits — Lando Norris was forced to retire after contact with Bottas and Verstappen, while Daniel Ricciardo was caught in a separate crash with Lance Stroll and Charles Leclerc — but Seidl said that dealing with the extra cost when there are budget restrictions is simply part of F1.

“No (it doesn’t need addressing), not at all,” Seidl said. “I definitely will not go in the direction that Christian is going, mentioning every second sentence the cost cap and how much it will be hurt by it by an accident on track. In the end, it’s part of the game we’re in. It’s down to us to manage the budget in the right way.

“It will be a challenge to make sure now we have enough parts of the new specification available for Spa, but on the other hand, we have a great team back home in production and the engineering side, so I am confident we can recover from what happened.

“I don’t see that it affects anything of our plans, to be honest. It is quite simple and straightforward. At the beginning of the season, based on the experience of previous years, you simply have to account for certain crash damage per year. That’s what you have to figure in, and that’s what we have in the budget and that’s the challenge that we are in. It’s the same for everyone.”
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Very fair point, well made by him. That is exactly what should be accounted for in budgets.
 
Just listening to a two parter of Beyond the Grid special about Ferrari. Interviewing Mansell at the moment. I'd forgotten that Mansell was the reason id got into F1 as a kid. Gilles Villeneuve was before i was born, but apparently he and Mansell are two of the most exciting drivers to watch in F1 history. Balls to the wall brave or some would say suicidal.

Best of Mansell overtakes below. Its hard to appreciate what he did. As you forget there was no power steering, no fly by wire brakes, manual gearbox and a screaming v10 with 15,000 rpm naturally aspirated.

 
Mansell was a bloody monster, take away a couple of unfortunate DNF's and he's probably a 3 time world champion in an era with Piquet, Senna and Prost in top cars.
 
pauldyson1uk said:
McLaren team principal Andreas Seidl took a gentle dig at his opposite number at Red Bull, Christian Horner, for his ongoing complaints about the impact of damage on Formula 1 teams in the cost cap era following the expensive Hungarian Grand Prix.

Horner announced the cost of Max Verstappen’s crash at Silverstone as $1.8 million and was then further annoyed by the repair bill from the race in Budapest, when both Red Bulls were damaged after Valtteri Bottas’ error at Turn 1. Both McLarens also took big hits — Lando Norris was forced to retire after contact with Bottas and Verstappen, while Daniel Ricciardo was caught in a separate crash with Lance Stroll and Charles Leclerc — but Seidl said that dealing with the extra cost when there are budget restrictions is simply part of F1.

“No (it doesn’t need addressing), not at all,” Seidl said. “I definitely will not go in the direction that Christian is going, mentioning every second sentence the cost cap and how much it will be hurt by it by an accident on track. In the end, it’s part of the game we’re in. It’s down to us to manage the budget in the right way.

“It will be a challenge to make sure now we have enough parts of the new specification available for Spa, but on the other hand, we have a great team back home in production and the engineering side, so I am confident we can recover from what happened.

“I don’t see that it affects anything of our plans, to be honest. It is quite simple and straightforward. At the beginning of the season, based on the experience of previous years, you simply have to account for certain crash damage per year. That’s what you have to figure in, and that’s what we have in the budget and that’s the challenge that we are in. It’s the same for everyone.”
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Christian Horner winges about pretty much everything. My understanding was that all the teams accepted the need for a budget cap as a means of levelling out.

What Seidl says is quite right. It is all about assessment of the risks when allocating the budget.
That is what any good business would do.
 
Leg-End said:
Mansell was a bloody monster, take away a couple of unfortunate DNF's and he's probably a 3 time world champion in an era with Piquet, Senna and Prost in top cars.
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Off the track, he could be boring.
On the track, he was anything but. Always trying. Always pushing. Always something happening. And never afraid of anyone. Loved to watch him.
 
pauldyson1uk said:
Will the teams be penalised if they spend too much?
Put simply, yes. There are three categories of potential breaches. The first is a procedural breach, such as a team submitting their accounts late or inaccurately. The second is a minor overspend breach, when a team’s report shows they have exceeded the cost cap by less than 5 percent or the Cost Cap Administration finds they have exceeded that percentage. The third is a material overspend breach, where a team’s submission of their accounts or an investigation by the panel shows they have exceeded the cost cap by more than 5 percent.
Once a breach has been identified, three forms of penalty are possible. The first is a financial penalty. The value of the fine will be determined on a case-by-case basis. The second is a minor sporting penalty which could be a combination of a reprimand, deduction of constructors and/or drivers points, a ban for a certain number of races, limitations on testing – both CFD and on-track – and/or a reduction of their cost cap.
The third is the material sporting penalty, which is the most serious as it can involve all of the above plus exclusion from the World Championship.
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They should just make the penalty be a cap on the total points you're able to score. For example, if Red Bull exceeds the cap by 20%, their points total will be decided by 1.2.

That'll keep the big boys compliant to the budget quickly.
 
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