Evra to Juve?

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HabeasC said:
Why are we selling all of our experienced defenders/legends in one go?

I know LVG likes young talent, but this is mental. I guess best of luck to Paddy, but definitely going to miss him. He's up there with my favourite players of all time - he's got united in his blood.

If we get Vidal out of this then I could accept it, but is that really all that likely?
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With Luke Shaw in the fold it was not like he was going to play much anyway.
 
The Mitcher said:
No, not this year. We need his leadership and he had a good world cup, why sell now when he can still perform for us albeit more limited. I can still see him and Shaw getting an equal number of games rather than one playing more than the other. I would not mind him leaving next summer, but I find the prospect of Juve gaining 3 of our players in 3 years disturbing.
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I get Pogba and Evra, is the third Tevez or am i missing something?
 
Why are people saying it's the clubs decision?

This is pure and simple Evra who wants to leave. The club extended his contract because they wanted him to stay.
 
If this does go through I'll be upset. Evra has been arguably my favorite player over the years and it's clear he loves the club so much. Would have been great to see him end his career with us :(
 
Unless Vidal is involved, Juventus can cough up £10m or take their broke asses somewhere else.

Seriously though he can't go for less than fecking Buttner.
 
Evra leaving in particular doesn't bother me too much, I just think buying another left back is a bit of a ball ache. Pat staying another year as cover would have been a great scenario going into the new season. We need another left back, certainly.
 
I like to see him in United colours for one more season.
Also I would be happy to see nani as part of Vidal deal than Evra.
 
The wages he'll be on don't make sense, for a back up player. It's best for both parties he moves on.

Yes, it leaves us needing a replacement. Finding someone willing to take 50k a week for sitting on the bench for us really shouldn't be very hard though.
 
Age doesn't necessary translate into experience. If lets say a 33 year old fullback constantly decide to throw caution to the wind by bombarding the flank while exposing a weak defense then his experience is worth nothing and Id rather have a young but mature full back then him.

An experienced head is desirable but not strictly necessary. Let us not forget that United's defense has been exposed to CL football year after year.
 
devilish said:
Age doesn't necessary translate into experience. If lets say a 33 year old fullback constantly decide to throw caution to the wind by bombarding the flank while exposing a weak defense then his experience is worth nothing and Id rather have a young but mature full back then him.

An experienced head is desirable but not strictly necessary. Let us not forget that United's defense has been exposed to CL football year after year.
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Quite. It's nice to have an experienced head in the dressing room but those suggesting losing his experience leaves our defense weaker, as if Evra is a shining example of how to defend, are at odds with reality.
 
#07 said:
Another leader leaves the dressing room. Guess it's a good thing we've the leadership of Van Gaal to compensate. The Vermaelen rumours are starting to make sense. He can play CB and be an emergency left back, but won't moan if we 'rotate' to deal with his injuries.
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The problem with injury prone players is that they tend to feck off in the treatment room when you need them the most. Owen and Hargreaves are clear examples of the that.

If VG feels that we need experience well and good. However let us bring someone who can actually stay on the pitch.
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Quite. It's nice to have an experienced head in the dressing room but those suggesting losing his experience leaves our defense weaker, as if Evra is a shining example of how to defend, are at odds with reality.
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In my opinion both Evra and Rio failed to adapt to their age and turned into a burden rather then an asset. You only have to read Rio's tweets to understand that age does not neccessary translate into maturity or experience
 
devilish said:
In my opinion both Evra and Rio failed to adapt to their age and turned into a burden rather then an asset. You only have to read Rio's tweets to understand that age is does not neccessary translate into maturity or experience
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A bit different with Rio. He did the job on the pitch (as best as his body could manage, which towards the end wasn't too great). I'm sure he could offer good advice on how to defend. Sadly, he seems to be a bit of a pillock who vastly overrates his opinions on things he's not really qualified to talk about.
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
A bit different with Rio. He did the job on the pitch (as best as his body could manage, which towards the end wasn't too great). I'm sure he could offer good advice on how to defend. Sadly, he seems to be a bit of a pillock who vastly overrates his opinions on things he's not really qualified to talk about.
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I rate Rio as the best defender we had throughout the entire SAF era and the best defender of his generation. However I agree with what SAF said in his autobiography that he was uncomfortable in adapting to his new circumstances.

I always believed that a defender needs first to be able to do his job (ie defend well) and that the rest is just a bonus (experience, leadership, technique, crossing etc). Once he fails to do his core duties on a regular basis then he should be on the way out.
 
devilish said:
I rate Rio as the best defender we had throughout the entire SAF era and the best defender of his generation. However I agree with what SAF said in his autobiography that he was uncomfortable in adapting to his new circumstances.

I always believed that a defender needs first to be able to do his job (ie defend well) and that the rest is just a bonus (experience, leadership, technique, crossing etc). Once he fails to do his core duties on a regular basis then he should be on the way out.
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Yeah, I'd agree with all that.
 
If Evra was instructed not to go forward and purely focus on his defending then his performances as a defender would have been a lot better. We cannot expect a player this old, who goes up and down the pitch, to be at 100% during the defending. It's impossible, SAF and Moyes asked too much from him.
 
kouroux said:
If Evra was instructed not to go forward and purely focus on his defending then his performances as a defender would have been a lot better. We cannot expect a player this old, who goes up and down the pitch, to be at 100% during the defending. It's impossible, SAF and Moyes asked too much from him.
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Was he instructed to do that though or is it part of his game?
 
devilish said:
Was he instructed to do that though or is it part of his game?
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It's part of his game and clearly he was given the freedom to do it. I cannot accept Evra having tough time going back to a defensive possession as not an accepted consequence from his allowed freedom.
 
kouroux said:
If Evra was instructed not to go forward and purely focus on his defending then his performances as a defender would have been a lot better. We cannot expect a player this old, who goes up and down the pitch, to be at 100% during the defending. It's impossible, SAF and Moyes asked too much from him.
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They should have gotten rid of him. For about four years he's been relying on cynical fouls, when he hasn't the pace to get back.

Best attacking left back I've seen much of, at his peak. I feel the need to add this, lest I look too much like I have something against him.
 
kouroux said:
It's part of his game and clearly he was given the freedom to do it. I cannot accept Evra having tough time going back to a defensive possession as not an accepted consequence from his allowed freedom.
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Some players cant adapt to new situations or style of game. If evra was truly given freedom to do what he wants then the rumored spat between him and Vidic wouldnt have made sense. Also both Moyes and SAF would have proven to have limitations in term of tactics. As you said no 33 yr old should be playing like evra does
 
devilish said:
Some players cant adapt to new situations or style of game. If evra was truly given freedom to do what he wants then the rumored spat between him and Vidic wouldnt have made sense. Also both Moyes and SAF would have proven to have limitations in term of tactics. As you said no 33 yr old should be playing like evra does
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You said it yourself, there were rumors and even if true we don't know what they were really about. We can only safely talk about what we see.
Under Moyes, Evra was asked to cross it more and therefore to attack as much as possible, it was clear to see him. Yes a player has a natural instinct but those instincts can be controlled with some coaching. It is naive to think the managers had little to do with him attacking so much. They've been asking an old player to play a very physically demanding game, it's impossible to expect great performances then.

DiseaseOfTheAge said:
They should have gotten rid of him. For about four years he's been relying on cynical fouls, when he hasn't the pace to get back.

Best attacking left back I've seen much of, at his peak. I feel the need to add this, lest I look too much like I have something against him.
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They should have bought a quality back up to rest him regularly.He's played a ridiculous amount of time in the past few seasons, it couldn't have helped. Each rare times Evra had a rest, he's always played very well.
 
kouroux said:
They should have bought a quality back up to rest him regularly.He's played a ridiculous amount of time in the past few seasons, it couldn't have helped. Each rare times Evra had a rest, he's always played very well.
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Fair point.
 
kouroux said:
You said it yourself, there were rumors and even if true we don't know what they were really about. We can only safely talk about what we see.
Under Moyes, Evra was asked to cross it more and therefore to attack as much as possible, it was clear to see him. Yes a player has a natural instinct but those instincts can be controlled with some coaching. It is naive to think the managers had little to do with him attacking so much. They've been asking an old player to play a very physically demanding game, it's impossible to expect great performances then.

.
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As said if SAF or Moyes demanded such physically demanding game out of a 33 yr old defender then they were tactically wrong.

However, there are a number of cases where a player simply refused to adapt to his new circumstances. Ability to reinvent himself and adapt to new circumstances is a skill that very few players have and is something that is usually separate on whether a player was WC or not.

Regarding Moyes I feel that it was more about caution thrown to the wind as the team was heading to a humiliating season. A player like Evra whose so used to go forward and do some serious damage would find it tempting to do so in a team which had poor guidance, little tactical awareness, creativity and respect towards the manager and saw his team sinking without a trace.
 
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devilish said:
As said if SAF or Moyes demanded such physically demanding game out of a 33 yr old defender then they were tactically wrong.

However, there are a number of cases where a player simply refused to adapt to his new circumstances. Ability to reinvent himself and adapt to new circumstances is a skill that very few players have and is something that is usually separate on whether a player was WC or not.

Regarding Moyes I feel that it was more about tactics going haywire and the players frustrations (and ego) getting hurt in every single game. A player like Evra whose so used to go forward and do some serious damage would find it tempting to do so in a team which had poor guidance, little tactical awareness, creativity and respect towards the manager and was heading to a humiliating season.
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Let's forget Moyes, do you honestly think SAF would have let Evra play if he refused to follow his instructions ? SAF got rid of better players when he felt he just couldn't work with them anymore. I'm actually surprised you would even slightly think there is a chance Evra would do whatever he wants regardless of SAF's wishes. No way Evra was allowed this freedom without SAF's ok, it's impossible.
 
Should atleast hold out for more than 2 million euros if we are gonna sell him. Makes little sense unless it is part of Vidal negotiations in some way.
 
kouroux said:
Let's forget Moyes, do you honestly think SAF would have let Evra play if he refused to follow his instructions ? SAF got rid of better players when he felt he just couldn't work with them anymore. I'm actually surprised you would even slightly think there is a chance Evra would do whatever he wants regardless of SAF's wishes. No way Evra was allowed this freedom without SAF's ok, it's impossible.
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Well...

We're talking about the only man in the planet who seriously believed that a CM made up of two nearly 40 year old midfielders, a player whose suffering with a chronic illness, a squad player and a fat Brazilian was good enough for United. A person who believed that Young can replace Ryan Giggs, that Cleverley was as good as Thiago Alcantara and that a former player who got 4 games experience in his belt as manager can replace him.

SAF had mellowed alot in his later years and the least said about his last years with United the better.
 
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