You're not alone, chief!
Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Votes can now be changed
- Thread starter Cheimoon
- Start date
You're not alone, chief!
It's probably wise!
Fecking hell, i missed the "if" in that tweet too 
The club is in a hysterical situation, so even if you manage to ignore the fans, it's difficult to just pretend everything is rosey. The fact we haven't won a game since Barnsley is crazy. I remember under Ole there were moments among the hysteria where you could find at least some comfort. We were scoring goals, we were a basic counter attacking team that could get results against the right opponent. I don't even feel that energy at that moment.
You’d hope the club are keeping him because there is some sort of belief in what he is doing or in his ability. But they don’t appear to have had that any stage since the takeover, he was effectively kept on by default in the summer.
The reason(s) to keep him now seem to be because, it’s expensive to sack him, or it’s too early in the season or they don’t know who to replace him with etc. That’s a real concern because they should have seen this coming, extending his contract was pointless because the only thing that mattered were results improving. Even if he’d got a new 4 year contract we’d still be talking about him getting the sack because he was starting the season as one of the favourites for it regardless.
The reason(s) to keep him now seem to be because, it’s expensive to sack him, or it’s too early in the season or they don’t know who to replace him with etc. That’s a real concern because they should have seen this coming, extending his contract was pointless because the only thing that mattered were results improving. Even if he’d got a new 4 year contract we’d still be talking about him getting the sack because he was starting the season as one of the favourites for it regardless.
The last PL game we won was Southampton, I mean we haven't even come close to winning. We have not scored a goal in 3 PL games, crying about 1/2 chances as what ifs. We should not be crying about 1/2 chances in a game when we should be good enough to create 5/6.
There is no energy left in me, I know what to expect in every game we go. People who say Ten Hag doesn't have a style is also fake. he has a style of play, the game model is to keep the ball with the CB's as long as possible, pass back to Onana and go long. Lost the ball and restart from pressing, pretend to high press and if the opponent is semi decent, they will string 4 passes, Bruno Zirkzee, Garnacho, Rashford will all throw their hands up and watch their runners run past our midfield into our defence, thereafter its hope that the opposition makes a mistake and we can recover the ball.
It's got nothing to do with last season. Ten Hag should be gone, there's no arguments there, but I wasn't responding to our form was I?
The poster replied that Ten Hag will only be judged off the Leicester and Brentford game and the other results won't figure in the clubs assessment of how Ten Hag is performing as there will be no expectation for us to beat the likes of West Ham. To be frank, calling it nonsense was doing it a disservice, it's absolute drivel.
Before you reply to me again, take some time to comprehend what's actually written, instead of replying to what you think has been written.
Our biggest problem is midfield and having no control over how games go nor being able to kill anything when we're ahead via control and possession, imo. All the other problems stem from the involuntary chaos of being passengers in games rather than dictating them.
Our attack isn't great, but they are mostly getting half chances on a scramble, not seamless openings that eventually forge a sense of calm via frequency; you have young, wet behind the ears forwards expected to be seasoned finishers thriving in chaos and that's just not realistic.
A good manger makes lemonade from what is at his disposal, and that's the bare minimum he should be expected to do.
The poster is the key, you're clearly very new around here.
This is a good assessment actually. He has a style of play, it's just shit and not in any way suited to Premier League football.
Aye, the midfield is an issue, but nowhere near as bad as last season. Still not perfect, but improving. Low hanging fruit and such. Still.
The attack, however, has become progressively worse. As you state, we create chances and subsequently waste them. The whole point of the game is to win and we cannot do so without goals.
We can blame the midfield, coach, stars, injuries, the moon, you, me, everything in between and the rest of Miranda July's impressive oeuvre, but our attack is whack and you know it.
No point sacking Bald to appoint another manager who can't make Razzmatazz prolific, or Zirkzee another expensive Ineos chemical spill.
I think there's a madness and hysteria in uncertainty and we see various exhibits of coping mechanisms, or not, as the case may be. THE WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE! rhetoric slips by me, but tidbits of what there's little reason to think aren't feasible, are worth processing.
In terms of balance, where is the tilt? Currently it's more negative than positive, but the big problem is, pur form is literally worse than Everton's, and due to that, there is an element of blind faith to believing this guy can or will turn things round. That's a big problem that lines the thread and won't change until he proves otherwise.
It's not just a tilt though, and I don't think the amount of people who actually have blind faith in the manager actually exist.
Is ETH still on holiday? Is it possible that they’re waiting to sack him in person?
As we've seen, that's OK with majority of the fanbase. Because "football is played for trophies". It doesn't matter if it's second or third rate trophies that do not in any way indicate where we stand as a club. Imagine if we had a manager who fluked a CL win like Di Matteo. He would be unsackable for a decade at least.
He's probably booked into the hotel for six months to stick it out.
so almost a week later after what many assumed was a pivotal week that would lead to some reckoning and nothing has actually changed. radio silence from the club (regardless of all media / fan hysteria) having spent a lot of time at the beginning of the week having strategic reviews etc, ETH on his hols, and now a few more injuries. another week to our actual next game, you can imagine the heat in the press conferences pre match, and everything dialled up a notch if we dont win, which going on form for the last 18 mths is more likely that it should be (not far off evens on man utd -1) ). then you do wonder what the long game is, because once the snowball starts rolling it aint gonna stop, unless theres a massive turnaround, which the vast majority of us dont this is likely at all.
Complete fallacy;
We are not creating good chances, unless Rashford, Garnacho or Amad run past 3+ players we create nothing, and then it is either them shooting or a cross fired across the area too hard to be capitalised on, there is no point having striker in ETH's system because they are just not utilised unless playing in a 10 position, where he already has at least one midfielder operating.
There is attacking talent and creativity in this squad, but the system and tactics employed by ETH are stunting this, or are we saying that Eriksen, Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford, Mount and Garnacho who have all shown decent ability to create assists and score throughout their careers suddenly cannot do it? or that Hoijlund, Amad and Zirkzee who have likewise shown this albeit in lesser leagues are incapable, most teams outside of the top 4 do not have half the creative talent we have, but the system is junk, absolute trash, I could set a team up to neutralise it and exploit the defence and I have never managed a football team before.
The big difference between a manager like ETH and a good manager, or even great manager, is that ETH has a system, maybe a variation or 2 but a system and he basically sticks players into and expects it to work, a good manager or better looks at the players they have and moulds their system and tactics to get the maximum they can out of the team as individuals and as a whole,
Look back to SAF, he constantly changed systems and tactics to suit his players and the opposition, and despite popular belief SAF did not have 22 superstars, players we would look on with scorn in the current set up like Fortune, Cruyff, Johnsen, Wallace, Beardsmore, Blomqvist, Smith, and there are dozens more, are they really better players than those we have in this squad, no not at all but SAF didn't ask them to do something that they were not capable, he just got the best out of them, that is why even in his last season he was able to get a title out of a squad that was certainly not the best in the league.
Look at Pep even he has always promoted ticca-tacca shite but how he has done it has changed team to team, squad to squad, when Silva left, when De Bruyne is injured he changes the system, he does it in game, Barcelona played different to Bayern, and likewise both different to City, why? because Pep has different players and the opposition in the league is different, if he picked up the Barcelona model and dropped it into the city team next game it would not work, or at least as well as his current tactics do .
ETH has just tried to pick up what he did with Ajax and plonk it down at OT, squeezed the players he has into his vision without any regard to whether it is getting the best out of them or whether it will work, trust the process, if I keep doing the same thing time after time sooner or later it must work!! oh and then occasionally he will revert to the system he inherited Ole-ball and lo and behold will pull a result out of the bag.
I am confident that any manager we could pick, even a dinosaur like Warnock could get this team back to basics, playing to strengths, tighten up the midfield and defence and get us scoring more goals, ok long term we want more, but for anyone to suggest that ETH is getting the maximum out of this group of players and therefore changing him would be pointless is simply ludicrous.
One thing is certain sure even if ETH somehow got his model working for a season it would not provide sustainable success, ETH too inflexible, and that is the biggest issue, opposing managers can easily set up against us, they know in advance that we will attack only down the flanks or on the break so can block those areas off.... nothing is coming through the middle unless it is from a defender because our midfielders are too advanced, the opposition know they can play out because of the huge gap between our midfield and defence, so there is always an out ball, add in that the right wing will always be open because for some reason Dalot is playing almost in the opposition penalty area.... even if you had 11 perfect players the system is still there to be exploited, you cannot get 9 out of 10 performances from each player each match, and that is what you need for ETH's system to stand any chance, it is a chimera of other systems and as a result has massive holes, which for some reason he cannot see, despite every pundit in world football pointing them out.
Liked that old computer football game where if you ran away from the referee he couldn't send you off
A long way of saying 'just blame EtH for everything'.
Not saying he's blameless, he clearly isn't, just we desperately need to claim collective responsibility at some point.
We simply do not have the relevant goal-scorers in our team.
Accepting this does not let EtH off the hook, but it's a real fallacy to think, past an ephemeral manager bounce, we can hire a new manager to 'unleash' the likes of Amad, Zirkzee or Hojlund. It isn't there.
He got you eventually.
Who said McCarthy would fix it?! That’s fighting talk!
We don’t know exactly why things aren’t working. What we do know is that Ten Hag is all about details, what you say makes sense.
The players can’t perform consistently. It seems to me that Ten Hag is putting down very high markers and demands that can’t be met by the players yet.
Other top teams manage it; dumbing down or going for an easier strategy won’t make us competitive with them.
No its not... go have a look at the Poll on sack v keep ten Hag, unless I ama mistaken the higher number is for majority of fan base and it is in favour of sacking the manager.
Ah, back to the players being the problem then. 
Delusional bollocks.
Delusional bollocks.
Why does there need to be one singular problem?Ah, back to the players being the problem then.
Delusional bollocks.
I think it’s comments suggesting posters actually know these things to be true which irritate as no one has a clue. It’s all speculation.
Like we apparently we have proof he can do whatever and won’t be sacked. It’s just nonsense really. There’s zero proof of anything. People are just impatient.
I suspect Berrada and Ashworth know he’s not the man to take us forward and it’s now a matter of timing and ensuring a smooth transition to the next coach, who’ll they will want to ensure is exactly the right fit.
These kind of things won’t just happen overnight and can be far more complex.
Several issues being identified:Ah, back to the players being the problem then.
Delusional bollocks.
- Players are not able to execute his perfect tactics
- Ashworth not being able to deliver him the players that he needs to execute his vision
- Assistant coaches once again being unable to help with the game plan and take the burden off him
I don’t think anyone is saying that.Ah, back to the players being the problem then.
Delusional bollocks.
Who suggested the tactics are perfect?
I think explaining what the plan is to fans (if he stays) might be helpful.
Whether folks agree or not is irrelevant, stating “We are doing this because our objectives are…” in very simple terms can only be a good thing?
I expect us to do that against Brentford as a victory in that game, coming out of international break, will be vital. Leicester should be relatively straightforward especially in the cup.
We do this every single time. The default answer is always "it's the players!". These are his players, these are players he's managed in several different teams. If they aren't receiving the "very high markers and demands" who the feck can? It's a load of rubbish. If some older players aren't performing, replace them with the signings he's made. If Rashford isnt doing the defensive duty, don't play him. He has that power, he's the Manager.
Sorry, it's a load of bollocks. The players are fine, the squad is significantly better and should not be performing as a mid table club.
Ironically he's showing himself up to be a hypocrite by pointing the finger at the players (and I'm guessing EtH too) and therefore blaming several different people which is precisely what some of you (including himself) are laughing at in the Ajax General thread. I.E. claiming United is fecked and everything's rotten.
Right on cue, the ridiculous excuses and explanations are creeping back. Now that Ten Hag FC feel safe again, they're beck to peddle more shit. Tactics too complicated now? Give me a break.
Clearly you need one.
I'm done, people allowed to freely troll in this thread.
I get the sentiment but I don't think theres a single root cause of the issue, and I think player psychology is one of the issues, irrespective of whether he's brought a new bunch in or not.
Melissa Reddy has been briefed the same, that there's some issue with the player psychology of that dressing room and it needs to be addressed.
Of course the players are better than midtable, this manager is too. He's finished below expectation for the first time in his career last season. That's neither here nor there when youre 7 games in. If after another 5 games it's mid November and we're where we were under Ole, sure I get it. But I don't think the true level is where we are at currently.
By the way no one is saying there's one problem and that's the players. But you also can't ignore that we've created plenty of chances in certain games that just havent been put away, and there is a responsibility on our forward line to be more clinical than they are.
The tactics, devised by the only Dutch man who struggles to speak English, are so clever that none of our idiot players can understand them. If only he’d bought players he’d worked with before that he knew could match his genius.
They are basically the only ones performing though. Not consistently enough in most cases but over the last 2.5 years the players who have at different times dragged us through the games with their individual performances were Maguire, McTominay, Rashford and Bruno. I think aside from Casemiro's first season (not even full season) I don't think we can make a case for any of the players we've acquired over the last 3 years being consistently good.
That would require us to pick up 9 points in the next 5 games, which I think pretty much everyone on here would be very happy with.
Also, the chances we created but couldn't finish were in Fulham game (which we won anyway) and Liverpool game (which we only created because they stopped caring at 3-0) and Palace (a game which in the end they could have won as well, though probably only game this season which we would have won had we been more clinical).
We created nothing in Spurs/Villa games really, we created nothing in Liverpool game until they stopped bothering, we created very little in Twente game etc. and Brighton game we pretty much scored what we should have scored. I don't think our offensive displays have been nearly as impressive as some are suggesting, definitely doesn't feel like we are a striker away from greatness. It's all very disjointed and chaotic.