Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[Real Name]

I’m trying to explain using nuance. I forgot that this is the Caf, and if you don’t have an opinion that is polarized to one side or another, a mouth breather will pop in and call you an idiot because your view is not black or white but rather shades of gray.

So cause differential Xg isnt good we should say he's doing good things at the club and improvement is there for all to see?

Sure, we're struggling with the goals but I hate seeing people analyze games only according to Xg and now differential Xg. What do you think will happen, we'll catch up the Xg or we'll go bobbins cause that differential cant be like that for long?

 

[norm87cro]

Shaw looked a better CB in that game that Maguire or Lindelof have in years. Play the best players instead of shoehorning in lower quality because they are “actual CB’s”.

When we conciede from a header Im gonna qoute this. Look Shaw is a LB and thats his

You can be right us not winning the league in the next 3 years and still be completely wrong about now, which you clearly are.

If you thought anyone was coming in after last season’s absolute clusterfeck and doing better than a 60% win rate in the league, I suggest you check your mental health.
Just check out Pep’s first season at City, or Klopp’s at Liverpool for example, and both took over sides who amassed more points than we managed in 2021-2022.

So now we know the two best managers in the game couldn’t manage it, and from a better starting point, I must ask, what would be a “brilliant” first 6 months be to you after last season’s 58 point clusterfeck? Would it be expecting a title challenge? A 70% PL win rate. A points per game total to match SAF’s final season?

In all honesty I think we gathered more points than we deserved judging on the quality of football and some rightfully questionable ETH decisions. I hoped for a bit more entertaining football under ETH with a top 4 challenge which we are in currently.
People crucified Jose in a season we had 81 points and finished second and ETH really hasn't done that much in the game in comparison to Jose in 04 so I really dont feel he should be free of criticism as some fans feel at this point.

The Pep and Klopp examples are different. Pep took over City after Bayern and in reality he never took a weaker squad after leaving Barca. He still hasnt won the CL after Barca despite having two extremley strong squads for some 10 years at his disposal. One word: overrated.

Klopp built a team (had a few though seasons) won the PL and CL and put the f... Dippers back on the map of football. Playing proper football btw not the tiki taka BS. So I really hope he takes over at Bayern, Germany or possibly (fingers crossed) England. This country deserves some joy.

But as I said earlier its hard to judge ETH at this point since if he cant sign players he wants come January and the summer transfer window its not him but the Glazers.
Casemiro and Eriksen were spot on (despite my opinion that giving a player with heart problems a 3 year contract isnt smart bussines but thats not down to the manager and I really hope Eriksen stays healthy not just for football reasons).

Questioning my mental health wasn't really respectful of me and I hope you didnt get those boring warning points in the heat of the debate (as I did because of my comments of Lindelof once).

PS: I think we can win the League in some three years. But not next season or the one after that. Fingers crossed

 

[DSG]

So cause differential Xg isnt good we should say he's doing good things at the club and improvement is there for all to see?

Sure, we're struggling with the goals but I hate seeing people analyze games only according to Xg and now differential Xg. What do you think will happen, we'll catch up the Xg or we'll go bobbins cause that differential cant be like that for long?

I agree. xG and differential should be one of many factors when reviewing performance. The xG isn’t in his favor but so many other things are… I don’t like using just xG either and we shouldn’t.

I personally think he will continue to build on performances and we now have a platform for success, mostly due to his command of the team, clarity in tactics, his summer transfer window and professionalism. I do think that Newcastle are legit top 4 contenders, and when you throw Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea in there, it’s going to be a dogfight. If we finish outside the top 4 it will make for a more difficult summer window.

Long term, I think he’ll come good. We’ve had some luck with results and I think we still don’t have a striker, so…. I am cautiously optimistic for this season and optimistic in general long term as long as he is here.

 

[Real Name]

I agree. xG and differential should be one of many factors when reviewing performance. The xG isn’t in his favor but so many other things are… I don’t like using just xG either and we shouldn’t.

I personally think he will continue to build on performances and we now have a platform for success, mostly due to his command of the team, clarity in tactics, his summer transfer window and professionalism. I do think that Newcastle are legit top 4 contenders, and when you throw Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea in there, it’s going to be a dogfight. If we finish outside the top 4 it will make for a more difficult summer window.

Long term, I think he’ll come good. We’ve had some luck with results and I think we still don’t have a striker, so…. I am cautiously optimistic for this season and optimistic in general long term as long as he is here.

Yeah, I see what you're getting at, fair dos.
I think we can only get better and he's done a great job so far. Fight for top 4 will be fierce and what do we do and dont do regarding transfers might bethe difference.

 

[golden_blunder]

I appreciate your reply.

There are other members before who have replied to my post who have corrected me on the role Fletcher plays. I was wrong. My apologies.

Fair enough fella

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

So cause differential Xg isnt good we should say he's doing good things at the club and improvement is there for all to see?

Sure, we're struggling with the goals but I hate seeing people analyze games only according to Xg and now differential Xg. What do you think will happen, we'll catch up the Xg or we'll go bobbins cause that differential cant be like that for long?

There's nothing to catch up with, really. According to xG, we have both scored and conceded about as many goals as we should have, and we also have as many points as we statistically deserve midway through the season.

It would have been a worrying trend (shades of LvG), had we been 2-3 seasons into ETH's tenure. Given the state of the squad he inherited, that fact that he's also new to the league, and that United - as an organization - still seems to be operating under the assumption that the manager should be able to have an answer to every problem, ETH is doing well. Players are improving, team spirit seems high, and the team shape and movement is obviously better.

The stats indicate that we're doing well defensively. Fifteen of the twenty goals we have let in came in the 4 defeats (Brentford, Brighton, City, AV) we have suffered. Five goals in the other eleven games is as good as it gets. It can be a sign, though, that when we are forced to take some risks, for whatever reason, with our positioning, we are still vulnerable.

Offensively, there's still work to be done. Going back to Solskjaer's days, United didn't have a problem converting low probability chances. The quality to finish is there. But, as DSG argued, we do have a problem creating high probability ones. What we lack are the "easy" goals, if you like. So, yes, our xG ratio leaves a lot to be desired regarding our game in the final third. The "eye test" can make you feel as good and optimistic as you'd like, but United have scored 13 (not counter-attacking) goals in 15 matches from open play and just one from set-pieces. That's not subjective, it's a fact. And it's midtable quality. Newcastle have 21 goals from open play and Spurs have already scored 10 from dead-ball situations.

But, as mentioned, it's still early days. We are a work in progress and there's a lot of room for improvement. You can tell that we're still trying to strike the right balance between treating the ball well in possession and getting the best out of a frontline that is more suited to a direct game.

But it begs the question, since Gakpo chose the scousers over us, what kind of forward do we need? The majority on here are arguing in favour of an out and out forward. The stats indicate that conversation isn't our main issue. Some will point towards Haaland, but City have the engine to support any player. What about Newcastle, Arsenal and Liverpool then? Let's see who we'll get next summer.

 

[Escobar]

I like that he has SAF vibe. His man management, discipline, no nonsense, tactics, training, nutrition, psychology, improving players and etc are similar to SAF. Hope this is the guy that finally will lead us back to where we belong.

Also, pray that the fecking Glazers will be gone by 1st quarter of 2023. And new owner who are willing to invest comes in and further support ETH.

Hope this is the light at the end of tunnel.

Smart owners will build on ETH. You can see he is building up somethibg special, and 2nd, you dont want to upset the fans as they clearly love him already

 

[Real Name]

There's nothing to catch up with, really. According to xG, we have both scored and conceded about as many goals as we should have, and we also have as many points as we statistically deserve midway through the season.

It would have been a worrying trend (shades of LvG), had we been 2-3 seasons into ETH's tenure. Given the state of the squad he inherited, that fact that he's also new to the league, and that United - as an organization - still seems to be operating under the assumption that the manager should be able to have an answer to every problem, ETH is doing well. Players are improving, team spirit seems high, and the team shape and movement is obviously better.

The stats indicate that we're doing well defensively. Fifteen of the twenty goals we have let in came in the 4 defeats (Brentford, Brighton, City, AV) we have suffered. Five goals in the other eleven games is as good as it gets. It can be a sign, though, that when we are forced to take some risks, for whatever reason, with our positioning, we are still vulnerable.

Offensively, there's still work to be done. Going back to Solskjaer's days, United didn't have a problem converting low probability chances. The quality to finish is there. But, as DSG argued, we do have a problem creating high probability ones. What we lack are the "easy" goals, if you like. So, yes, our xG ratio leaves a lot to be desired regarding our game in the final third. The "eye test" can make you feel as good and optimistic as you'd like, but United have scored 13 (not counter-attacking) goals in 15 matches from open play and just one from set-pieces. That's not subjective, it's a fact. And it's midtable quality. Newcastle have 21 goals from open play and Spurs have already scored 10 from dead-ball situations.

But, as mentioned, it's still early days. We are a work in progress and there's a lot of room for improvement. You can tell that we're still trying to strike the right balance between treating the ball well in possession and getting the best out of a frontline that is more suited to a direct game.

But it begs the question, since Gakpo chose the scousers over us, what kind of forward do we need? The majority on here are arguing in favour of an out and out forward. The stats indicate that conversation isn't our main issue. Some will point towards Haaland, but City have the engine to support any player. What about Newcastle, Arsenal and Liverpool then? Let's see who we'll get next summer.

Good post. Agree with everything. As for our forward play its still a work in progress and as you said not only scoring but creating chances is a problem but that is on a upward trajectory too. As for striker, its more the fact we need backup to Martial then the overall forward play imo, in the sense that our depth in forward line is not really good. Add that kind of player and a backup or a starter instead of Eriksen and its automatically a lot better picture.
In any case ETH is doing a great job with the team at his disposal.
Not that its a bad team, far from it, but a team that still needs work and additions.

As for comparisons with other teams, Liverpool is a well oiled machine, Newcastle is doing a good job overall and Arsenal has been coming, they've been doing on this since Arteta came. To be close to Liverpool and Arsenal at the moment is a good job and it can only get better. Especially when you count in us dragging Ronaldo along till recently and problems with injuries.

I dont think Gakpo chosed Liverpool over us, maybe we werent as keen or maybe finances were the problem. It wasnt straightwise us or them imo.

 

[Tony247]

We had a 0 goal difference before the Forest match, now it’s +3. We are struggling a bit to score goals and create chances. That’s what the data says.

I’m optimistic with ETH at the helm, the eye test is that we are playing much better than last year. He’s turned Dalot into quite a player. All that being said, given our goal difference and xG, results wise we are out performing our stats.

Do you want me to use one syllable words so you can understand?

We are low on goals because we lack consistently goal scoring striker, not because ETH set up the team incorrectly. Given this situation we still have a healthy win ratio. And that credit goes to ETH and his staff.

 

[NLunited]

Why do we need another wide player? We don’t have a true striker. That should be our focus along with a backup RB and beefing up the midfield.

last I checked we had Rashford, Sancho, Antony, Elanga, Garnacho on the wings and Bruno can play there as well.

Gakpo can play left winger , cf and striker. He is tall, developing him into a world class striker is definitely possible.

 

[redcucumber]

We made no offer because of ownership issues. Fan protests biting us in the ass, at least short term.

Blaming fan protests for us not signing Gakpo is weird.

 

[croadyman]

Gakpo can play left winger , cf and striker. He is tall, developing him into a world class striker is definitely possible.

Yeah I fear Klopp will develop him too

 

[DJ_21]

United fans need to move on from SAF. I don't even know how one looks at Ten Hag and his football and thinks SAF

I agree. The only similarities are probably the no nonsense approach. Do as you’re told or you’re gone! Can’t say they have same tactics as football as changed massively since fergies time. Football nowadays is more about tactics and the small details that can win you a game. Fergie was a manager that would set you out to win in whatever way he could. Obviously Ten Hag wants to win every single game but he’s mentioned time and time again that there’s a certain way he wants to win and wants to play. It won’t always be pretty wins but he’s trying to implement a good style so we blow teams away more often.

 

[NLunited]

I agree. The only similarities are probably the no nonsense approach. Do as you’re told or you’re gone! Can’t say they have same tactics as football as changed massively since fergies time. Football nowadays is more about tactics and the small details that can win you a game. Fergie was a manager that would set you out to win in whatever way he could. Obviously Ten Hag wants to win every single game but he’s mentioned time and time again that there’s a certain way he wants to win and wants to play. It won’t always be pretty wins but he’s trying to implement a good style so we blow teams away more often.

Ten Hag is more pragmatic than Guardiola. What we have seen so far is that he sets us up with tactics to have the best chance of winning, regardless of playing style.

Up to now, that often means playing in transition which gives us the most created chances against teams that try to press us, without giving away many chances.

Control through possession seems to be a long term goal. We aren’t good enough to do it consistently. There are good passages of play where we ping the ball around with intent, and more to come.

I don’t think we ultimately will look like Ajax under Ten Hag. We don’t have the players to set up exactly like that. I think we will be more direct, which actually fits this club better.

 

[Rolaholic]

 

[DJ_21]

Ten Hag is more pragmatic than Guardiola. What we have seen so far is that he sets us up with tactics to have the best chance of winning, regardless of playing style.

Up to now, that often means playing in transition which gives us the most created chances against teams that try to press us, without giving away many chances.

Control through possession seems to be a long term goal. We aren’t good enough to do it consistently. There are good passages of play where we ping the ball around with intent, and more to come.

I don’t think we ultimately will look like Ajax under Ten Hag. We don’t have the players to set up exactly like that. I think we will be more direct, which actually fits this club better.

Guardiola wasn’t exactly full on attacking on his first season with city. He didn’t have the players. He had to sell the majority and buy his own. Seen something before that shows Ten Hag has done a lot better in his first 15 games in the prem then what guardiola did by playing more of the top 6 teams aswell. Once Ten hag has got the players required to play his style of football then we’ll see it a lot consistently.

 

[FrankDrebin]

The only elephant Hag has in the room at the moment is Anthony.
Its quiet but no one wants to admit that Hag may have made a major financial c*ck-up on that one, especially as Gakpo has gone for a pittance and we are in desperate need for a solid forward this window.

 

[phelans shorts]

The only elephant Hag has in the room at the moment is Anthony.
Its quiet but no one wants to admit that Hag may have made a major financial c*ck-up on that one, especially as Gakpo has gone for a pittance and we are in desperate need for a solid forward this window.

It’s only an elephant in the room if you ignore context all together. We needed a right winger. Gakpo isn’t a right winger. Antony is. Ergo Antony was more important.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

Please, let's just not go there again. No more meaningless comparisons with Klopp and Pep. We seem to have appointed a manager with a high ceiling this time. We'll see how far he can take us. You know who else had 70% win percentage in his first 23 games, right?

The only elephant Hag has in the room at the moment is Anthony.
Its quiet but no one wants to admit that Hag may have made a major financial c*ck-up on that one, especially as Gakpo has gone for a pittance and we are in desperate need for a solid forward this window.

I believe he'll turn out to be a good signing in the end. Not 100 million quid good, but he'll eventually do the job ETH wants him to do. There's always the question: "what should 100 million buy you" in the market, but the club is being run so badly that you kind of expect us to overpay to fill roles on the pitch for which we should really have done our homework and have alternatives.

 

[Gator Nate]

Please, let's just not go there again. No more meaningless comparisons with Klopp and Pep. We seem to have appointed a manager with a high ceiling this time. We'll see how far he can take us. You know who else had 70% win percentage in his first 23 games, right?

I was gonna post that latter bit, too, but held back.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

When we conciede from a header Im gonna qoute this. Look Shaw is a LB and thats his

Ah yeah just like Martinez was going to be a flop in the PL because he's short right?

 

[DSG]

There's nothing to catch up with, really. According to xG, we have both scored and conceded about as many goals as we should have, and we also have as many points as we statistically deserve midway through the season.

It would have been a worrying trend (shades of LvG), had we been 2-3 seasons into ETH's tenure. Given the state of the squad he inherited, that fact that he's also new to the league, and that United - as an organization - still seems to be operating under the assumption that the manager should be able to have an answer to every problem, ETH is doing well. Players are improving, team spirit seems high, and the team shape and movement is obviously better.

The stats indicate that we're doing well defensively. Fifteen of the twenty goals we have let in came in the 4 defeats (Brentford, Brighton, City, AV) we have suffered. Five goals in the other eleven games is as good as it gets. It can be a sign, though, that when we are forced to take some risks, for whatever reason, with our positioning, we are still vulnerable.

Offensively, there's still work to be done. Going back to Solskjaer's days, United didn't have a problem converting low probability chances. The quality to finish is there. But, as DSG argued, we do have a problem creating high probability ones. What we lack are the "easy" goals, if you like. So, yes, our xG ratio leaves a lot to be desired regarding our game in the final third. The "eye test" can make you feel as good and optimistic as you'd like, but United have scored 13 (not counter-attacking) goals in 15 matches from open play and just one from set-pieces. That's not subjective, it's a fact. And it's midtable quality. Newcastle have 21 goals from open play and Spurs have already scored 10 from dead-ball situations.

But, as mentioned, it's still early days. We are a work in progress and there's a lot of room for improvement. You can tell that we're still trying to strike the right balance between treating the ball well in possession and getting the best out of a frontline that is more suited to a direct game.

But it begs the question, since Gakpo chose the scousers over us, what kind of forward do we need? The majority on here are arguing in favour of an out and out forward. The stats indicate that conversation isn't our main issue. Some will point towards Haaland, but City have the engine to support any player. What about Newcastle, Arsenal and Liverpool then? Let's see who we'll get next summer.

Yes.

It is a nuanced issue. Martial, on his day, is a fine no. 9. However, this poses two problems for us. One, he is really inconsistent and some matches doesn’t show up. Secondly, and more importantly, he is frequently injured. Suddenly, you’re back to playing Rashford as a striker. He’s not useless as a no. 9, but he’s better as a LW and significantly so.

I see the reports of ETH being angry that Liverpool signed Gakpo was more symbolic than anything else. He lost Ronaldo, he wants a replacement, and it’s up to the board and CEO to go get him an adequate replacement, budget be damned. Gakpo isn’t truly a no. 9, he’s another wide player and we have loads of those…

 

[DSG]

We are low on goals because we lack consistently goal scoring striker, not because ETH set up the team incorrectly. Given this situation we still have a healthy win ratio. And that credit goes to ETH and his staff.

Never criticized ETH on setup, team selection or tactics. Merely pointed out that our Goal difference and xG are low given where we are in the table and the points we’ve managed. I tend to agree with you, the reason is because we aren’t creating a lot of high quality chances and we aren’t finishing those chances. Some would say it’s because we don’t have a world class no. 9, and sure, that would solve a lot of our problems, but there are plenty of examples in world football where a team doesn’t have a class no. 9, but the team manages to score a lot of goals. Liverpool for one, Bayern being another. We just need to score more goals.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Please, let's just not go there again. No more meaningless comparisons with Klopp and Pep. We seem to have appointed a manager with a high ceiling this time. We'll see how far he can take us. You know who else had 70% win percentage in his first 23 games, right?

Who?

 

[SalfordRed18]

The only elephant Hag has in the room at the moment is Anthony.
Its quiet but no one wants to admit that Hag may have made a major financial c*ck-up on that one, especially as Gakpo has gone for a pittance and we are in desperate need for a solid forward this window.

Crazy how opinion has changed on him. He was performing quite well before his injury and one bad game he's suddenly a concern.

 

[DSG]

Gakpo can play left winger , cf and striker. He is tall, developing him into a world class striker is definitely possible.

Rashford has all of those qualities as well, yet 9 is not his best position. Still. At this point, wouldn’t we rather cash our chips in on Ramos or another true no. 9? Osimhen, Vlahovic, hell even a flyer on Icardi or Jovic, possibly Leao…. Frustratingly, Julian Alvarez goes to City for 20m to back up Haaland, and we are left with the oft-injured Martial.

you’re right, we could turn Gakpo into a striker. But haven’t we been down this road before?

 

[NLunited]

Rashford has all of those qualities as well, yet 9 is not his best position. Still. At this point, wouldn’t we rather cash our chips in on Ramos or another true no. 9? Osimhen, Vlahovic, hell even a flyer on Icardi or Jovic, possibly Leao…. Frustratingly, Julian Alvarez goes to City for 20m to back up Haaland, and we are left with the oft-injured Martial.

you’re right, we could turn Gakpo into a striker. But haven’t we been down this road before?

I would go for an out and out striker as well, not Gakpo.

 

[Flexdegea]

The only elephant Hag has in the room at the moment is Anthony.
Its quiet but no one wants to admit that Hag may have made a major financial c*ck-up on that one, especially as Gakpo has gone for a pittance and we are in desperate need for a solid forward this window.

Zero elephant at all. Been one of our better players, great mentality as well.

But if you focus on money then he is never going to live up to the fee.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

Yes.

It is a nuanced issue. Martial, on his day, is a fine no. 9. However, this poses two problems for us. One, he is really inconsistent and some matches doesn’t show up. Secondly, and more importantly, he is frequently injured. Suddenly, you’re back to playing Rashford as a striker. He’s not useless as a no. 9, but he’s better as a LW and significantly so.

I see the reports of ETH being angry that Liverpool signed Gakpo was more symbolic than anything else. He lost Ronaldo, he wants a replacement, and it’s up to the board and CEO to go get him an adequate replacement, budget be damned. Gakpo isn’t truly a no. 9, he’s another wide player and we have loads of those…

I have no doubts that we will get someone. It's also true that we can't rely on Martial to lead the line. I was arguing more about the type of striker ETH will go after because i don't think that an out-and-out forward suits the rest of the gang in the final third. We don't want Rashford up front sandwiched between the centre-halves, but we also don't want him stationed out wide, hitting crosses in the box or trying to beat defenders from a standing position. Bruno thrives in chaos, he wants movement around him and he also likes to attack the box when the forward has drawn defenders away. Antony can dribble, but he's too one-footed to go 1v1 all the time. He needs players around him. Sancho, even more so. If we persist with the 4231, i think the onus will be on the three players behind the forward to score the majority of goals. And in that context, the job Martial does between the lines is invaluable when it comes to opening up spaces for others. But we'll see. I won't deny that, from a tactical perspective, an out-and-out forward who does the job can simplify things.

Who?

Solskjaer's win percentage, in his first 23 games in all comps, was the same. That's why we were quick to give him the permanent gig. During the next two seasons, we had people posting stats and comparing Klopp and Pep's first couple of seasons to ours as proof that all the pieces will eventually fall into place for Solskjaer. Sadly, it doesn't work that way.

 

[SAF is the GOAT]

Who?

He was 1 time "at the wheel"

 

[DSG]

I have no doubts that we will get someone. It's also true that we can't rely on Martial to lead the line. I was arguing more about the type of striker ETH will go after because i don't think that an out-and-out forward suits the rest of the gang in the final third. We don't want Rashford up front sandwiched between the centre-halves, but we also don't want him stationed out wide, hitting crosses in the box or trying to beat defenders from a standing position. Bruno thrives in chaos, he wants movement around him and he also likes to attack the box when the forward has drawn defenders away. Antony can dribble, but he's too one-footed to go 1v1 all the time. He needs players around him. Sancho, even more so. If we persist with the 4231, i think the onus will be on the three players behind the forward to score the majority of goals. And in that context, the job Martial does between the lines is invaluable when it comes to opening up spaces for others. But we'll see. I won't deny that, from a tactical perspective, an out-and-out forward who does the job can simplify things.




Solskjaer's win percentage, in his first 23 games in all comps, was the same. That's why we were quick to give him the permanent gig. During the next two seasons, we had people posting stats and comparing Klopp and Pep's first couple of seasons to ours as proof that all the pieces will eventually fall into place for Solskjaer. Sadly, it doesn't work that way.

I would argue that Martial, when fit and on form, actually DOES operate as a classic 9. His hold up play is excellent, his movement in the box is decent, and his passing / balls into space to Rashford and the RW are borderline sublime at times. You could argue for a Firmino type, more of a withdrawn striker, I think that could work too. But let’s be honest, putting a Kane or a Haaland or a Lewandowski or a Benzema in at 9 in our team and everyone would score bags of goals. Those are complete 9s, conventional 9s, whatever you want to call them. I think the key thing is to get another quality option besides Martial, be it a true 9 or a Firmino type.

 

[berbatrick]

Ole's first 23 games: 16 wins, 70%
(including wins vs Spurs, Arsenal, Chelsea, PSG).

 

[NLunited]

I have no doubts that we will get someone. It's also true that we can't rely on Martial to lead the line. I was arguing more about the type of striker ETH will go after because i don't think that an out-and-out forward suits the rest of the gang in the final third. We don't want Rashford up front sandwiched between the centre-halves, but we also don't want him stationed out wide, hitting crosses in the box or trying to beat defenders from a standing position. Bruno thrives in chaos, he wants movement around him and he also likes to attack the box when the forward has drawn defenders away. Antony can dribble, but he's too one-footed to go 1v1 all the time. He needs players around him. Sancho, even more so. If we persist with the 4231, i think the onus will be on the three players behind the forward to score the majority of goals. And in that context, the job Martial does between the lines is invaluable when it comes to opening up spaces for others. But we'll see. I won't deny that, from a tactical perspective, an out-and-out forward who does the job can simplify things.

At Ajax he had Haller performing really well, making loads of typical striker goals. I really think we need a different type to Martial/Rashford instead of getting another winger who can play striker.

Not getting the type of players needed might stop the progress we are making.
Ronaldo left, so get Hag a fecking replacement.

 

[Marcus]

I am loving the fact that we go into games with a manager who always has ideas and knows what to do in different situations. Not looking glum and defeated when things don't chance our way, staring deeply into the iPad with no proper response.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

At Ajax he had Haller performing really well, making loads of typical striker goals. I really think we need a different type to Martial/Rashford instead of getting another winger who can play striker.

Not getting the type of players needed might stop the progress we are making.
Ronaldo left, so get Hag a fecking replacement.

I hear you. I am aware that he had turned Haller into a goal-scoring machine at Ajax. I just don't know how compatible he would be with the rest of the players we have here. It's certainly easier when you can have someone like Benz, Lewa or Zlatan (whose game creates spaces for others, too), but how many forwards of that ilk are available?

I will agree with the notion that we should prioritise an attacker who can operate in the central channels. Having said that, i never thought of Martial as a wide player, but more of a forward who likes to drift towards the left half-space. While Rashford, on the other hand, wants to start his moves wide and then cut inside.

I found it interesting that ETH referred to Rashford the other day as a player who, besides the counter attacks, poses a great threat "in and around the box". Not exactly the definition of a wide player (especially the way the Dutch school perceives them), but one i agree with.

You could say that this was my gripe when people were saying that are set for a decade with Rashford, Martial and Greenwood. No matter their individual qualities, they're three attackers. They read the game mostly in "touch and shoot" terms. In my opinion, it was overkill. We need more balance and we also need to add some nuance in our attacking game.

So, i wouldn't be surprised if ETH wanted (someone like) Gakpo because he believes that, when our possession game allows us to get players from the second line in the box more often than not, we'll see that we already have enough goals in the team. I believe that he already sees Rashford as a player who can give him 20 league goals, and i also think that he has communicated that to Rashford, thus the latter's resurgence.

I get that, right now, we're a more direct and counter-attacking side and that makes the absence of a real main man upfront look like a black hole. I often find myself screaming for someone to get in the box. It really depends on how ETH sees this team going forward and what he thinks the next step should be. And it's the little things that usually make the difference. When Klopp realized that he couldn't have a Lewandowski at Anfield, he didn't break the bank for a striker. He looked at his team and he understood that the goals where already there. His job was to create the tactics for the players to flourish.

 

[DJ_21]

What does ETH mean when he says we might have to be creative when signing a striker in January?

 

[DJ_21]

This is only good if we can carry it on. The others started of bad but then improved massively. We don’t want to go the other way round.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

What does ETH mean when he says we might have to be creative when signing a striker in January?

Sell players to fund, loan with option to buy, stop gap loan, punt on cheap young promising talent or cheap older experienced striker. Definitely not an expensive proven striker in his prime.

 

[DJ_21]

Sell players to fund, loan with option to buy, stop gap loan, punt on cheap young promising talent or cheap older experienced striker. Definitely not an expensive proven striker in his prime.

A loans alright but if it’s only a stop gap loan then the player it self isn’t gonna be motivated or be bothered about his performances if he knows he won’t be here next season. Loan with option to buy is a good one. Keeps the player performing well to try and get us to sign him permanently… the only player I’ve seen us linked with though is Felix and we ain’t paying what they want for a short loan.

 

[moodyred]

What does ETH mean when he says we might have to be creative when signing a striker in January?

Maybe promote a youth player or utilise a long forgotten player and say "it's like a new signing". That would be trying to be creative