Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[Toshey]

Is it possible that certain sponsors put pressure on the club to play Ronaldo?

 

[Frank Grimes]

Choosing de beek over playing Fred and playing Eriksen further forward was a bad decision.

Didn't like the Ronaldo captaincy choice either. His worst performance of the season. Light 3.

 

[frostbite]

You think that one change would've won us the game?

Im not sure. But I would be surprised if VDB gets another try out.

Maybe. I said that the problem wasn't just one player, the problem was three players. Garnacho is too young to play back to back, Ronaldo is too old, DVB is useless. Perhaps he could have selected one of these three, maybe two, but not all three. The rest of the team was more or less given.

For example, with Fred in place of DVB, and Eriksen impersonating Bruno, perhaps we'd have a chance.

 

[Sarni]

Having VDB in a league game was obviously a mistake, he should have also been subbed earlier. With Ronaldo it’s quite clear he prefers to play him rather than deal with his antics so with six months left on his deal we are probably in for a bit more of that. Fortunately he is going to be 38 soon and I doubt he will extend here.

 

[MUFC OK]

arsenal are managing fine as they aren't going thru injuries especially in the attacking half....

we're dealing with missing martial, sancho and antony so we are having to start a 37yr old who's past it, rashford and a young kid with only his second start as well as a young kid in Elanga as our only option

arsenal put out sako, gabriel and martinelli...their starting forwards so i'd say it's massively different

Okay well why are we getting injuries whilst they aren’t?

They hardly have a bigger or imo a much better squad and have had the same fixture contestion. I personally think ETH can be criticised for not rotating enough against omonia and sheriff.

 

[MUFC OK]

Is it possible that certain sponsors put pressure on the club to play Ronaldo?

No. He’s the only recognised striker who has been fit. Rashford has always been a LW rather than a 9 despite having played there a fair bit.

 

[Guapa]

When we signed Eriksen to play CM, I thought he would play CM for home games but when we play away from home Ten Hag would play Fred to be more solid.

We've now been orangutaned in midfield away from home a few times. Yet Ten Hag persists to play Eriksen in the role. Even before the game I thought this was a CLEAR game for Fred to come in. I'm not a Fred fan and it's not often I feel a call to give him a start. But away from home against a mobile midfield who were going to be up for it in front of a new manager that was nothing short of naive and stupid from Ten Hag.

I winced at the team sheet of Eriksen and VdB in front of him. Eriksen should have been played as a number 10 in front of Fred and Casemiro today for the mobility and defensive cover needed. Eriksen would have covered nicely for Bruno.

Yes, the players selected didn't play well enough but Ten Hag didn't have to select VdB over Fred today. Neither did he have to play Luke Shaw every game for the past month.

Malacia, Fred, even AWB have been completely underutilised to give other players a break.

Ten Hags mistake today had cost us. He'll now look for a reaction midweek in the carabao Cup and probably play too strong of a team. Which weakens us for a must win game Vs Fulham before the World Cup break.

Today was a stinker from us but Ten Hag needs to take it on the chin rather than blame player attitude. He chose those 11 and set them up for this game naively.

Good post

 

[Ballache]

When we signed Eriksen to play CM, I thought he would play CM for home games but when we play away from home Ten Hag would play Fred to be more solid.

We've now been orangutaned in midfield away from home a few times. Yet Ten Hag persists to play Eriksen in the role. Even before the game I thought this was a CLEAR game for Fred to come in. I'm not a Fred fan and it's not often I feel a call to give him a start. But away from home against a mobile midfield who were going to be up for it in front of a new manager that was nothing short of naive and stupid from Ten Hag.

I winced at the team sheet of Eriksen and VdB in front of him. Eriksen should have been played as a number 10 in front of Fred and Casemiro today for the mobility and defensive cover needed. Eriksen would have covered nicely for Bruno.

Yes, the players selected didn't play well enough but Ten Hag didn't have to select VdB over Fred today. Neither did he have to play Luke Shaw every game for the past month.

Malacia, Fred, even AWB have been completely underutilised to give other players a break.

Ten Hags mistake today had cost us. He'll now look for a reaction midweek in the carabao Cup and probably play too strong of a team. Which weakens us for a must win game Vs Fulham before the World Cup break.

Today was a stinker from us but Ten Hag needs to take it on the chin rather than blame player attitude. He chose those 11 and set them up for this game naively.

Very good post. I don't understand why some think that he is beyond criticism...I'm all for ETH, I think we've improved a lot under him and I am certain that once we strengthen, we will look like a proper team again. Today was on him though, we looked extremely open and tired in midfield (not for the first time) and paid the price. His lack of rotation is also a factor, if we can't beat the likes of Sheriff and that Cypriot team without our starting 11 then we have bigger problems than a loss away to Villa.
Onwards and upwards though, hopefully he learns from this and adjusts.

 

[MrSingh2002]

Very good post. I don't understand why some think that he is beyond criticism...I'm all for ETH, I think we've improved a lot under him and I am certain that once we strengthen, we will look like a proper team again. Today was on him though, we looked extremely open and tired in midfield (not for the first time) and paid the price. His lack of rotation is also a factor, if we can't beat the likes of Sheriff and that Cypriot team without our starting 11 then we have bigger problems than a loss away to Villa.
Onwards and upwards though, hopefully he learns from this and adjusts.

Yeh he seems strong enough to deal with issues and personalities but he needs some self analysis now to stop the pattern repeating away from home.

Today was an avoidable loss against a very average Premier League 11. We should have gone level with Spurs today and would have had a game in hand to go clear in 3rd. Pisses me off.

 

[Guapa]

Yeah this was a poor showing from E10H today but hopefully he'll learn from it and move on.

 

[TheGame]

Hinted ? There's nothing in his post that says we should sack him, just that we shouldn't blindly follow him. Other posts in this thread have talked about asking questions if we failed to get top 4 which is a legit comment, only to be faced by people saying he should stay regardless of how this season pans out!

No one is blindly following anyone. He’s 4 months into this reign FFS and we are 5th with us playing well as a whole. Sacking a manager if they get top 4 or not is silly, managers should be measured on the progress they make with the team. Ideally we need to take the chance to make the top 4 this season as the teams around us are struggling as well.

 

[MUFC OK]

When we signed Eriksen to play CM, I thought he would play CM for home games but when we play away from home Ten Hag would play Fred to be more solid.

We've now been orangutaned in midfield away from home a few times. Yet Ten Hag persists to play Eriksen in the role. Even before the game I thought this was a CLEAR game for Fred to come in. I'm not a Fred fan and it's not often I feel a call to give him a start. But away from home against a mobile midfield who were going to be up for it in front of a new manager that was nothing short of naive and stupid from Ten Hag.

I winced at the team sheet of Eriksen and VdB in front of him. Eriksen should have been played as a number 10 in front of Fred and Casemiro today for the mobility and defensive cover needed. Eriksen would have covered nicely for Bruno.

Yes, the players selected didn't play well enough but Ten Hag didn't have to select VdB over Fred today. Neither did he have to play Luke Shaw every game for the past month.

Malacia, Fred, even AWB have been completely underutilised to give other players a break.

Ten Hags mistake today had cost us. He'll now look for a reaction midweek in the carabao Cup and probably play too strong of a team. Which weakens us for a must win game Vs Fulham before the World Cup break.

Today was a stinker from us but Ten Hag needs to take it on the chin rather than blame player attitude. He chose those 11 and set them up for this game naively.

As others have said good post and in hindsight that would certainly have been a better shout.

Just to play devils advocate and guess ETH’s thinking, perhaps he thought that by playing both DVB and Eriksen we would have more creativity than opting for Fred. We’ve hardly been creating loads of chances in the last few games.

Also, I know we shouldn’t be comparing ourselves to city at this juncture but pep has consistently played with only one defensive holding mid. Then again, the likes of Bernardo, gundogan are incredibly mobile and put in a defensive shift.

 

[Matt851]

No. He’s the only recognised striker who has been fit. Rashford has always been a LW rather than a 9 despite having played there a fair bit.

Rashford is a much better striker than Ronaldo these days and the team is much better without Ronaldo in

 

[Frank Grimes]

When we signed Eriksen to play CM, I thought he would play CM for home games but when we play away from home Ten Hag would play Fred to be more solid.

We've now been orangutaned in midfield away from home a few times. Yet Ten Hag persists to play Eriksen in the role. Even before the game I thought this was a CLEAR game for Fred to come in. I'm not a Fred fan and it's not often I feel a call to give him a start. But away from home against a mobile midfield who were going to be up for it in front of a new manager that was nothing short of naive and stupid from Ten Hag.

I winced at the team sheet of Eriksen and VdB in front of him. Eriksen should have been played as a number 10 in front of Fred and Casemiro today for the mobility and defensive cover needed. Eriksen would have covered nicely for Bruno.

Yes, the players selected didn't play well enough but Ten Hag didn't have to select VdB over Fred today. Neither did he have to play Luke Shaw every game for the past month.

Malacia, Fred, even AWB have been completely underutilised to give other players a break.

Ten Hags mistake today had cost us. He'll now look for a reaction midweek in the carabao Cup and probably play too strong of a team. Which weakens us for a must win game Vs Fulham before the World Cup break.

Today was a stinker from us but Ten Hag needs to take it on the chin rather than blame player attitude. He chose those 11 and set them up for this game naively.

I concur with others, good post.

 

[el3mel]

No one is blindly following anyone. He’s 4 months into this reign FFS and we are 5th with us playing well as a whole. Sacking a manager if they get top 4 or not is silly, managers should be measured on the progress they make with the team. Ideally we need to take the chance to make the top 4 this season as the teams around us are struggling as well.

On what basis is progress measured ? If the team is improving regarding play style, it should be translated into better results on the pitch. Progress = improvement in results. If he fails to achieve results, questions need to be asked, that's hardly a ridiculous claim here.

Yeah we know he's 4 months into his reign. No one wants him to get sacked tomorrow. He's not bullet proof that's all anyone of us is saying. However whenever he has a poor game, gets his tactics wrong or makes bad mistakes and people start pointing it out, some here jump on to defend him relentlessly and start spouting memorized nonsense about fans being entitled, impatient, wanting him gone after few months and all this bollocks, when in reality we're just criticizing him, no one wants him gone after 2-3 months, think he's a bad manager or anything like this.

The same thing happened under the previous managers as well. It's United's fans problem, ultimately. United fans think of managers in a different status than any other football club around us. It's expected since we're used to have Ferguson who was pretty much Manchester United personified, but the reality is managers get sacked all the time because of bad results or poor run of form all the time. They're just employees hired to do a job and will stay/get fired based on how they do this job.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Just a terrible performance all around.

Everyone had a stinker.

Ronaldo/Van De Beek should never play together(or at all).

 

[sdb4884]

We took about two steps backwards today in terms of progress and that is completely on the manager, I wouldn't be losing too many more games like that in the near future, Moyesey had a six year contract remember there Erik.

 

[chb23]

Guys, I played FM 2022

I can confirm there is zero squad depth.

 

[MUFC OK]

Rashford is a much better striker than Ronaldo these days and the team is much better without Ronaldo in

I wouldn’t say much better, but I tend to agree in that his lack of mobility costs us. He looks so rigid these days. It’s sad to see.

 

[TMDaines]

People complaining about the squad can’t be familiar with the benches of the other Big Six teams. United aren’t hard off in comparison.

Also, the lamenting of injuries is getting a bit daft. We haven’t been a big outlier in terms of injured players.

 

[MUFC OK]

People complaining about the squad can’t be familiar with the benches of the other Big Six teams. United aren’t hard off in comparison.

Also, the lamenting of injuries is getting a bit daft. We haven’t been a big outlier in terms of injured players.

Thank you. I agree with both points. Regardless of tiredness/injuries that was an unacceptable showing from Utd today. The fact we have a performance like today, Brentford, city in us is not a good sign at all.

Ten Hag takes a share of the blame today. How we perform against Fulham will be a measure of how good of a job he is doing. Really do not want us to limp into the break with more dropped pts.

 

[Ballache]

As others have said good post and in hindsight that would certainly have been a better shout.

Just to play devils advocate and guess ETH’s thinking, perhaps he thought that by playing both DVB and Eriksen we would have more creativity than opting for Fred. We’ve hardly been creating loads of chances in the last few games.

Also, I know we shouldn’t be comparing ourselves to city at this juncture but pep has consistently played with only one defensive holding mid. Then again, the likes of Bernardo, gundogan are incredibly mobile and put in a defensive shift.

He assumed that we will play all the game in their half and picked his side accordingly.
Naive from ETH and Emery capitalized on that. Their forwards were running at our defenders at will at times.
Watch Bernardo against Fulham and you'll understand why Pep can do that, him and KDB were monsters in covering space in order to offsetthe loss of Cancelo. We neither have the same mobility, workrate nor the technical level required to play like that.

 

[Remember the geese]

I was desperate for us to appoint ten Hag and there have been some really promising signs so far. However, he needs to learn a few things about this squad.

1) Rashford on the right is a big fat no. Always has been. Always will be.

2) Donny the friendly ghost can't be allowed to suddenly appear in the 11 and scare the shit out of everyone with his ineptitude.

3) Ronaldo. I loved the way ten Hag was managing him, but since Ronaldo disobeyed him, he has completely bowed down to him. The preening peacock is done. I hope ten Hag isn't being forced to play him. I honestly can't think of any other reason why he's in the team. Feck him off!

 

[MUFC OK]

He assumed that we will play all the game in their half and picked his side accordingly.
Naive from ETH and Emery capitalized on that. Their forwards were running at our defenders at will at times.
Watch Bernardo against Fulham and you'll understand why Pep can do that, him and KDB were monsters in covering space in order to offsetthe loss of Cancelo. We neither have the same mobility, workrate nor the technical level required to play like that.

I tend to agree with most of that to be fair. KDB was simply sensational and dragged them on Saturday.

I suppose a counter question is why can’t Eriksen/VdB put in a similar shift to a Bernardo or gundogan? In fairness VdB hasn’t played much football but on the point of technicality both he and Eriksen have that in abundance.

 

[Bluelion7]

Arsenal have been VERY lucky on the injury front. Like, a legendary amount of good fortune considering the fixture congestion and the amount of minutes they pile on a lot of their players.

The jersey has never gone out out and win anything. If you have a less than stellar squad going out things can happen. In this weird World Cup year it’s best to chalk it up and move on. Unlike with Moyes, Ole and others, I can see a clear direction and identity in United’s future. Protest the owners by all means, because selling off even a voting share would help you. But you look to have found your guy going forward in the mgr seat to me.

 

[TheGame]

On what basis is progress measured ? If the team is improving regarding play style, it should be translated into better results on the pitch. Progress = improvement in results. If he fails to achieve results, questions need to be asked, that's hardly a ridiculous claim here.

Yeah we know he's 4 months into his reign. No one wants him to get sacked tomorrow. He's not bullet proof that's all anyone of us is saying. However whenever he has a poor game, gets his tactics wrong or makes bad mistakes and people start pointing it out, some here jump on to defend him relentlessly and start spouting memorized nonsense about fans being entitled, impatient, wanting him gone after few months and all this bollocks, when in reality we're just criticizing him, no one wants him gone after 2-3 months, think he's a bad manager or anything like this.

The same thing happened under the previous managers as well. It's United's fans problem, ultimately. United fans think of managers in a different status than any other football club around us. It's expected since we're used to have Ferguson who was pretty much Manchester United personified, but the reality is managers get sacked all the time because of bad results or poor run of form all the time. They're just employees hired to do a job and will stay/get fired based on how they do this job.

You could argue he is still transforming the squad and that will take more than one season. If you look at Arteta for example, many were calling for his head and he didn’t make top 4 however now they seem to be playing well once he’s brought his own players.

I agree the manager isn’t immune to criticism, he’s allowed to be criticised if people think he got something wrong. I myself have said he got his selection wrong today. No one should be exempt from that unless they are winning every game.

 

[Marwood]

Ok. So explain the sub of bringing on Martial to replace Dony in the hole, leaving Ronaldo who had done nothing all game on the pitch playing CF instead of bringing an actual midfielder in Fred to replace Dony and have Martial play as CF replacing Ronaldo.

Because we needed goals.

As bad as Ronaldo has been he's still a better shout at getting one than Fred or Elanga.

 

[AndyMUFC]

We usually play rubbish when Ronaldo is up front. We usually play rubbish when Donny is our number 10. We usually play rubbish when Rashford plays on the right.

Today we had all 3 so it is was an uphill battle from the start. I get the team selection with the injuries and wanting to give Garnacho another go but the drop off when we lose players in certain positions is huge.

 

[Ballache]

I tend to agree with most of that to be fair. KDB was simply sensational and dragged them on Saturday.

I suppose a counter question is why can’t Eriksen/VdB put in a similar shift to a Bernardo or gundogan? In fairness VdB hasn’t played much football but on the point of technicality both he and Eriksen have that in abundance.

Eriksen is the closest thing we have to them technically in midfield (still a tier below Bernardo and 2 below KDB) but VDB is nowhere near...the rest of the team isn't exactly blessed either.
As for workrate, I don't know. Maybe it's something ETH is working on, maybe it will take more time, maybe it's the lack of rotation...I don't know.

 

[Frank Grimes]

People complaining about the squad can’t be familiar with the benches of the other Big Six teams. United aren’t hard off in comparison.

Also, the lamenting of injuries is getting a bit daft. We haven’t been a big outlier in terms of injured players.

Now put forwards in your algorithm.

 

[Matt851]

We usually play rubbish when Ronaldo is up front. We usually play rubbish when Donny is our number 10. We usually play rubbish when Rashford plays on the right.

Today we had all 3 so it is was an uphill battle from the start. I get the team selection with the injuries and wanting to give Garnacho another go but the drop off when we lose players in certain positions is huge.

I think your first point is particularly pertinent. We could have played rashford up top, garnacho and elanga out wide woth erikson in the Bruno role. That would have been a significant drop off in quality out wide but would have allowed us to press and retain some sort of structure to our team.

Instead eth shoe horned players into roles and in vdb and Ronaldo played players that offer neither workmate or quality

 

[bosskeano]

Okay well why are we getting injuries whilst they aren’t?

They hardly have a bigger or imo a much better squad and have had the same fixture contestion. I personally think ETH can be criticised for not rotating enough against omonia and sheriff.

man injuries just happen and who knows why some don't and some do get injured

i'll say this though....put in the WC along with the fixtures piling up, arsenal will get theres. the workload will eventually catch up to you

 

[MUFC OK]

man injuries just happen and who knows why some don't and some do get injured

i'll say this though....put in the WC along with the fixtures piling up, arsenal will get theres. the workload will eventually catch up to you

Seriously, are many of their XI even starting for teams at the WC? Swear it’s only Saka partey and xhaka which is crazy to think.

 

[MUFC OK]

Eriksen is the closest thing we have to them technically in midfield (still a tier below Bernardo and 2 below KDB) but VDB is nowhere near...the rest of the team isn't exactly blessed either.
As for workrate, I don't know. Maybe it's something ETH is working on, maybe it will take more time, maybe it's the lack of rotation...I don't know.

Could be PEDs. Nandrolone and or inhalers. That KDB performance was something abnormal.

 

[bosnian_red]

Okay well why are we getting injuries whilst they aren’t?

They hardly have a bigger or imo a much better squad and have had the same fixture contestion. I personally think ETH can be criticised for not rotating enough against omonia and sheriff.

Antony and Sancho are ill, bit different. Martial has struggled with fitness for the past 2 years. Varane has struggled with his fitness for years now. The rest have been fit! It's just unfortunately a situation where 2 injury prone players are important and don't have cover. Or at least, don't have adequate cover. And then players getting sick in the fall, it happens.

 

[bosskeano]

Seriously, are many of their XI even starting for teams at the WC? Swear it’s only Saka partey and xhaka which is crazy to think.

the main one you are missing is Jesus

 

[MadDogg]

So you're saying sacrificing an extra midfielder in a game we were struggling to control is the way to go if you want to get back in a game? Surely you know that's not true.

Ten Hag has before subbed out a striker (Ronaldo himself) to chase a goal (against Newcastle), so the chasing game part isn't an excuse.

There were two very understandable options for ETH to do. Get an extra attacker on to give us more goal scoring options, or get an extra midfielder on to try to get more control. ETH chose the former, as many other managers would also have done. It doesn't have to be some big sign that Ronaldo has 'won'. It's worth noting that against Newcastle we were drawing so we weren't chasing the game as much, plus taking the #10 off for a striker is completely different when it's Bruno (who is more likely to score/assist than most of our attackers).

If you're right, Ronaldo will continue starting and playing the entire matches when our other attackers are fit. If I'm right, he'll go back to how he was used earlier in the season where he starts some (normally the easier games), comes off the bench in others, and have the occasional match where he stays on the bench. We won't know for sure until we have some of our attacking options back, so why make up your mind and criticise ETH as if he's already made that decision? Especially when the other option is surely the most likely one.

 

[croadyman]

Worst week at the club since Brentford/Brighton

 

[mav_9me]

People complaining about the squad can’t be familiar with the benches of the other Big Six teams. United aren’t hard off in comparison.

Also, the lamenting of injuries is getting a bit daft. We haven’t been a big outlier in terms of injured players.

No but our attack was short in numbers to begin with. We started the season with Ronaldo, Martial, Rashford, Sancho and Antony as 5 first teamers for 3 positions with Elanga as a youngster. That's the basic problem. To add to that Ronaldo is finished and martial kept getting injured. We are down to just 3 first choice attackers. 2 of whom have been unavailable for last 3 games. You see our problem now?

As for comparing to the big 6, other squads are in similar situation. Liverpool are down to 3 first choice attackers. And they are having a difficult time. Spurs to 2 out of 4, also suffering. Chelsea have numbers but lack quality, so their attack is suffering too. Arsenal also lack great depth but they haven't had any injuries.

 

[NLunited]

We don’t have the depth in the selection yet to deal with these injuries. Combine that with not starting sharp, and Villa overperforming, and we are in trouble.

The players we do have available need to do much better. Hag will crack the whip.