Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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It's funny because, when the excuses were being rolled out last season and some were trying to make out our manager was responsible for nothing, others were joking about us bringing in more managers to do the coaching for him. And now here we are, bringing in two head coaches to help him :lol:
 
pocco said:
It's funny because, when the excuses were being rolled out last season and some were trying to make out our manager was responsible for nothing, others were joking about us bringing in more managers to do the coaching for him. And now here we are, bringing in two head coaches to help him :lol:
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You might be referring to myself. It doesn’t seem to me that we are hiring more coaches here, just replacing the ones that may have let ETH down in previous seasons. I wasn’t even trying to be facetious when I said that either, I genuinely think it is our to give him the coaches he needs to address whatever deficiencies he might have, and hopefully the two new ones coming in might be able to do that.
 
Freak said:
The softies in the squad are going to get found out very fast - hopefully this guy makes the team tougher mentally.
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I think what you are hoping for here is a a wrong thing to hope for but given how much we as a fan base despise our own players it doesn’t surprise me to see this.

I also don’t think that is what he will be here for.
 
Sarni said:
I think what you are hoping for here is a a wrong thing to hope for but given how much we as a fan base despise our own players it doesn’t surprise me to see this.

I also don’t think that is what he will be here for.
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It's the right thing to hope for - we cannot afford to carry players who are weak mentally if we want to get back to the top.
 
Nickelodeon said:
It would be 3 head coach level people. Seems worrying because we know our players respond to proper coaching by going into their shells and getting managers sacked.
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Indeed let's not forget this lot have got 4 managers sacked. But Ratcliffes are onto them.
 
Freak said:
It's the right thing to hope for - we cannot afford to carry players who are weak mentally if we want to get back to the top.
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So basically you think our key issue is that our players are weak mentally and that we have finally hired a coach that will scream at them a lot so they become stronger mentally.
 
Hake was Ten Hag‘s assistant at Go Ahead Eagles, and now plaice attacking pro-active football there. Clearly he isn‘t hired to batter our players and be a pain in the bass, but to coach them and to improve e-fish-iency.
 
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Sarni said:
So basically you think our key issue is that our players are weak mentally and that we have finally hired a coach that will scream at them a lot so they become stronger mentally.
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Hahaha.
That isn't going to work.

Many of our players are mentally weak though. In several matches when we went a goal down, it was essentially game over.
 
NLunited said:
Hake was Ten Hag‘s assistant at Go Ahead Eagles, and now plaice attacking pro-active football there. Clearly he isn‘t hired to batter our players and be a pain in the bass, but to coach them and to improve e-fish-iency.
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Of course, that’s why I find it funny that people’s reaction to this appointment is hoping that he can scream at our players and degrade them, because there’s one video doing rounds of him doing that at his former club. If anything this is actually the part of his work that he will have to iron out here.
 
sunama said:
Hahaha.
That isn't going to work.

Many of our players are mentally weak though. In several matches when we went a goal down, it was essentially game over.
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I don’t think it’s individual mentality. Most of these players have shown at one point or another that they have it in them to fight. It is more of a collective team issue, they struggle with adversity as a team.
 
Doubling down on the Dutch thing from the looks of the moves this Summer. With how notoriously stubborn they tend to be I have no doubt that Ten Hag will be much more adaptable this season and won't play dumb as feck tactics for 50 games in a row before trying something different.
 
Sarni said:
I don’t think it’s individual mentality. Most of these players have shown at one point or another that they have it in them to fight. It is more of a collective team issue, they struggle with adversity as a team.
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Every single player on earth can show fight at one point or another. Showing it consistently and when it matters is what counts. Blaming the team is just absolving weak players from responsibility.
 
sunama said:
Hahaha.
That isn't going to work.

Many of our players are mentally weak though. In several matches when we went a goal down, it was essentially game over.
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Sarni said:
I don’t think it’s individual mentality. Most of these players have shown at one point or another that they have it in them to fight. It is more of a collective team issue, they struggle with adversity as a team.
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I actually thought our main issue has been we've thrown away some big games while leading/in good position. I remember we had a number of games where we fought quite well. Not sure if this "match over when we went down" is a thing?

It also looked like ETH was a dead man walking in last phase of the season, and yet the team seemed to be putting effort.
 
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Desert Eagle said:
Every single player on earth can show fight at one point or another. Showing it consistently and when it matters is what counts. Blaming the team is just absolving weak players from responsibility.
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Who are these mythical players? Whenever this is raised it almost always comes down to Rashford and McTominay, two players who are so weak mentally that they drag our whole team down and two players that have got all the managers sacked, one of whom doesn’t even start all that frequently in a normal season. Sometimes Bruno but not as frequently as those two.
 
Nickelodeon said:
Our recent history and my eyes.
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OK fair enough. Personally I think we don't have enough insights to make that claim, certainly don't think I'd say "players going into their shells" is a problem for us.

Let me ask you this, do you watch England play at Euro? Don't you get that feeling those players also hide into their shells under Southgate "coaching"?
 
stevoc said:
Nothing.
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I think we have examples of players doing well at other clubs, and in much more "sophisticated" football style, and yet when they come to United they seem to don't understand the instructions, or fall with the manager.

And we're blaming the players for that, saying they are "uncoachable"?

In our whole squad I'd say we have 3 players who are difficult to coach. Rashford definitely, Bruno (he's too chaotic) , and maybe Hojlund (quite limited skillset).

The first one was the main reason first season was a reasonable success, the second was made captain and seems to be considered key player, and third was the big money signing. For all the others we have evidence they are perfectly coachable.

I'd say the players react badly to shit coaching or bad ideas, and who can blame them really? Having said that, I really don't think the team in general has downed tools or anything, so it's kind of a silly claim to make.
 
Sarni said:
Who are these mythical players? Whenever this is raised it almost always comes down to Rashford and McTominay, two players who are so weak mentally that they drag our whole team down and two players that have got all the managers sacked, one of whom doesn’t even start all that frequently in a normal season. Sometimes Bruno but not as frequently as those two.
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Not exactly mythical if you just named three are they. And McTominay starts plenty in every season, just go look at the stats.
 
Borys said:
OK fair enough. Personally I think we don't have enough insights to make that claim, certainly don't think I'd say "players going into their shells" is a problem for us.

Let me ask you this, do you watch England play at Euro? Don't you get that feeling those players also hide into their shells under Southgate "coaching"?
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I think there’s a decent enough amount of evidence to suggest it for a bunch of players. Rashford has had alternating seasons where he’s scored 20+ goals under Ole to being dropped and then from 30 goals with Ten Hag to another poor season. Many others like Maguire, Shaw, Lindelof, Mctominay, Wan Bissaka have been through our mediocre recent history. Our squad show that they are decent when a new manager comes in and crumble when it’s time to take the leap from top 4 finishers to title contenders. And the fact they don’t even retain a similar level to maintain top 4, under various managers, is another damning indictment of their capability.

Specific to England, I think it’s clear that the manager has no tactical vision that the players can believe in. Through a combination of luck and some gritty defensive performances, England under Southgate have over delivered on results in major tournaments. Especially compared to their performance levels. Now they are just waiting for the cycle to end.
 
Same things happened that happened under Ole. The coaches getting a lot of stick. But McKenna went on to get back to back promotions to the prem from league 1 and Carrick didn’t do to bad either at Middlesbrough.
 
NLunited said:
Hake was Ten Hag‘s assistant at Go Ahead Eagles, and now plaice attacking pro-active football there. Clearly he isn‘t hired to batter our players and be a pain in the bass, but to coach them and to improve e-fish-iency.
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Yes but let's hope he gets them to show a bit more poisson!
 
Desert Eagle said:
Not exactly mythical if you just named three are they. And McTominay starts plenty in every season, just go look at the stats.
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It’s three players in a squad of 25 and I don’t really agree with Bruno. Rashford is a bit of a confidence player indeed and McTominay is simply not very good.
 
Sarni said:
It’s three players in a squad of 25 and I don’t really agree with Bruno. Rashford is a bit of a confidence player indeed and McTominay is simply not very good.
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You just name three. You could easily add Maguire, AWB, Shaw, Lindelof, Sancho, Mount etc to the list.
 
Desert Eagle said:
You just name three. You could easily add Maguire, AWB, Shaw, Lindelof, Sancho, Mount etc to the list.
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So basically we just presume anyone who’s been here for more than 2 years is extremely weak mentally by default, only the players signed/promoted by ETH (with the exception of Mount) are mental monsters.

Maguire is actually the opposite for me. To go through all the abuse and hatred he got from his own fan base and still play at a good level last season is sign of strength.
 
pocco said:
I'd like to think he has already. I mean, what's Ten Hag doing if not? I'd be embarrassed to have to hire another guy to discipline my players.
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Judging by some posts here, you'd think player performances are simply a function of how much the coaches yell at and berate them.
 
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