Yeah this could be what's delaying things
Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24
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Yeah this could be what's delaying things
Klopp, 8th, 4th, 4th, no trophies
Arteta 8th, 8th, 5th, FA cup title
ETH 3rd, 8th, League cup and FA cup titles.
It's a stupid comparison considering Klopp and Areteta both came in mid season
My Utd supporting quiz mate from Manchester thinks he will get the job, never have I prayed for him to be totally wrong about something but fear the worst.
Are you just going to pretend that these stats don't show klopp's gradual improvement that led to a league and champions league while we are going the other way?
Irrelevant. Cherry picking one season is stupid. I can cherry pick Klopp's full 7th season. Worse than Ten Hags current season.
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86 games is an awfully long time to be just lucky or clueless.
Liverpool won the league in Klopp's full 4th season..
also, how is it irrelevant to compare second full seasons when that comparison would clearly show how Arteta and Klopp improved while Ten Hag collapsed?
oh wait, that is not what you want to be shown..
I did say I might be wrong however on some of the Man United Runours sites that occasionally get things right they are doubling down on Brailsford wants to sack him and Jean Claude Blanc wants to keep him which might mean that Berada is aligned with J C Blanc, well know soon but Someone probably told Sir Jim you just won your first major trophy in football as a Co Owner after 3 months of owning Man United When you won nothing after 8 years with FC Lausanne team and 5 years with Nice.
Because football is trajectory? Sir Alex 11th, 2nd, 12th, 13th. First 4 seasons.
7th not 4th, I corrected it.
We desperately need the Houllier smiley back.
Ah yes let's compare Klopps 7th season, after he won the CL and PL, to Ten Hag's second and then also claim that finishing 5th is worse than finishing 8th..
Jesus fecking Christ, is this really the level of argumentation going on here?
This piece is quadratic.
You can see I was answer the gradual improvement point the poster was making. Sir Alex 11th, 2nd, 12th, 13th, where was Sir Alex's gradual improvement?
If you can not argue in good faith, there is no point continuing this discussion. Have a good night sir.
You're a good poster so I'm just going to probe here - the insinuation is not that Eric Ten Hag is SAF. The insinuation is more that when a manager comes to United as a club specifically (where egos are big and pressure is even more so), and when they're in a mess, and needs a cultural, ego and systematic reset whilst making room for his own errors, there is likely to be vast volatility in initial league standings. Do you disagree with that sentiment?
Whats wrong about the post?
Liverpool had a well functioning system to support the manager, where they consistently managed to identify key players in key positions. It gives the manager a preferable foundation to build on, compared to the shitshow at Manchester United.
It is quadratic to think improvement must be gradual. Resetting a squad may make turbulences in football. Specially if you lose many extremely important players in the process of resetting the squad.
His second line, he is not discussing in good faith. I really do not have time for childish comments.
As per his 1st line, he did not provide a reasonable excuse to why he is cherry picking specific seasons.
There was a huge improvement in Ten Hag's first season compared to our last. More than any of us expected. And while this season has been a disappointment, he has still delivered 2 trophies in 2 seasons, something Arteta and Klopp didn't achieve. It's interesting that Klopp is mentioned since he got Dortmund to incredible heights and his team collapsed in his final season because of injuries (similar to us). Klopp also finished 5th last season despite record breaking seasons before that... again because of injuries. My point is that I consider Klopp the best manager in the world but even he is not immune to dips in performances when it comes to not having your players. Only SAF could work magic with limtied players and I doubt there will be another like him in our lifetime.
Ten Hag has achieved a lot in his first 2 seasons and has laid the grounds for an amazing team with the up and coming talents like Mainoo and Garnacho we have. You lot are forgetting where we are coming from. We are not United of old under SAF were we used to win titles like candy, the United Ten Hag inherited was utter shambles, bouncing up and down, barely winning any trophies (last time was under Mourinho's first season before he completely imploded). We have just won 2 under Ten Hag's seasons, reaching 3 finals and quite frankly last season we were up there challenging until an onset of injuries and the ridiculous reds Casemiro got.
Have patience, people. Rome wasn't built in a day. We can't expect to just sack managers left and right and expect a miracle to happen, especially when there are no worthy managers worth sacking him for.
I give up.
What Klopp did, what Arteta did, what Ferguson did blah, blah, blah is all irrelevant.... one thing is not linked to the next, there is zero correlation, this is not a closed system, there are so many differences to use one thing to try to form a prediction is simply ridiculous... it has about as much relevance as saying Maresca and ETH will be great managers because the bear some physical resemblance to Pep!
Anyway thing is who cares about the above figures? if what you want from football is facts and figures, I'm glad for you but I have seen every one of those seasons and irrelevant of any number pro or against I can hand on heart say that this last season under ETH was so bad compared to the others it does not even come into the same conversation.
What we produced for all of last season barring the 1st Chelsea match and the FA cup final was the worst Utd I have seen since I started watching football in the mid 80s I would go as far as saying that it was the worst whole season in the top flight I have seen from any team including those relegated, and before anyone says how can that be, I do not mean results (which we were very lucky with) I mean actual performances, I have never seen such ridiculous performances as we put out across not just one or two matches, across the whole season, and it wasn't about quality, it was disorganised, disjointed, ill disciplined... it was like somebody had thrown 11 players who had never seen each other before together each match day and then given them no actual game plan, actually it was worse, they were given a game plan, just one that could never work.
Maybe ETH stays and maybe he does turn it around but it will not be because Klopp did, SAF did or Arteta did
3 players out of 11 not bad. I can admit his transfers haven’t all been good but now he’s getting people behind him to help him with that. What good does changing managers every couple of years do for anyone? The players are obvs still playing for him and like him.
Love this! People are so impatient
Jim & Co really should have had this sorted by now.
Their first big club decision and they're dithering.
Their first big club decision and they're dithering.
Watching the FA Cup Final, absolute masterclass I think he needs a good structure around him including identifying the right players, keeping players fit and I think we will do well
2800 pages in and we're still going in circles with the fecking SAF comparisons
Convenient that goals isn't included in this graphic.
with more trophies
Would it change anything?
What has Arteta shown in his first two seasons? If we ignore the league position, it was absolutely shit football with nothing to be positive about. Look, I am not comparing ETH to any great manager that he will turn out like them, I am just making the case, that 2 seasons is very little to make conclusions specially if we take into consideration his very good first season and his extremely injury infested squad in 2nd season.
Not really. We'd still be 8th with negative goal difference, after spending 400 million.
Convenient.
Well we're not going to learn another over the weekend, I just hope Monday comes and we get some sort of answer.
You'd like to think there's more certainty and joined up thinking behind the scenes....
You'd like to think there's more certainty and joined up thinking behind the scenes....
I can give him the benefit of the doubt when it comes to injuries as we seen the difference Martinez and Varane make and I can give him the benefit of the doubt that the experienced attacking players let him down so he has had to rely on young inconsistent forwards.
What I can’t forgive is the waste of money on average players and the fact we get walked through in midfield like an amateur side
What I can’t forgive is the waste of money on average players and the fact we get walked through in midfield like an amateur side
You’re right… you might be wrong.
And the Glazers don’t have more control… it’s a footballing matter (the manager/players), it’s down to Jim. He’ll take input and consider it… he is… we’ll get a decision soon.
It’s all conjecture, maybe stay off United ITK Twitter sites. They arent in the know, they’re guessing and hoping to be right so they can link a tweet and say “I was right”, same as most journalists
Well, we finished 8th but 8 points behind 4th.
Under Moyes we finished 7th but 15 points behind 4th
If that matters.
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