I brought this up a couple of years ago and nobody agreed with me, but I'd still personally have the FA Cup winner get a CL place. Surely winning it should be properly rewarded. And it's the CHAMPIONS League. They want Champions in it. Winning the FA Cup seems a bigger claim than just finishing 4th in the league.
Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24
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He did pay the price. He won us our second trophy in 2 years
It is pretty difficult to play a style of football that fans enjoy, against quality opposition, when large parts of your team our missing in many games. When many players have not been available in training to be developed, because they are either injured or training to simply get fit again. And, when your squad is very thin, there is no really talent to come through and continue playing the football style you crave.
We've had one striker all season. A young kid that has given his all, but little support. We've had our "star" player of last season, Rashford, bang out of form. Maybe too much is expected from him, when we don't yet have the big personalities and great players around him to take the heat of Rashford, and Rashford has simply lost all confidence. We have to rely on players like McTominay, who has got the odd goal, but is sadly nowhere near good enough to help control a midfield. In and out of possession, he is often nowhere to be seen, he just manages to hide in the background of every game, unless he pops up for a goal every now and then. Wan Bissaka is one of the best defenders in the world against pacey wingers. But, if you are a side that wants to play nice attacking football, he really is not the answer. He's also a player that seems really quiet, and I'm not sure he inspires confidence in those around him.
I agree with your view on Martinez, or certainly the potential for that to be the case. But, it isn't just his football ability. When he plays, it is like he immediately makes all his team mates around him feel 10 foot tall (and not just because he is only 4ft tall himself). He has such a calming influence on the side, and a real leader.
But, Utd need more like Martinez. More characters like that. Players who are brave, and actually want to go into 50/50 challenges. Players that like the battle, and whether they win the ball or not, the opponents know they are in for a challenge.
Try telling that to Aesene Wenger!
And if that was how things should work, Alex Ferguson would have been sacked years before the Premier league even started.
If INEOS are simply the types of owners that purely focus on short periods of time, then Man Utd is no better than Watford or Chelsea. And, those are not clubs I admire.
I tend to think that even if they stick with ETH. Due to long term football strategy
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That’s not what anyone is arguing. You’re being deliberately obtuse. Have a good day.
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/manchester-united/ausfallzeiten/verein/985So how can you post this link while asserting with a straight face that their injury problems are 'not near to ours'?
At this point one can only laugh at the level of disingenousness at work in your posting.
Because then compare to ours given squad size and profile/ levels of replacements.
At no point in the season did Chelsea go as long as we have without a specialist in any position.
Chelsea have had a lot of injuries. It also likely contributed to their underperformance this season and it also wasn’t at the same level and impact as ours were.
Our run to the final:
Wigan
Newport
Forest
Liverpool
Coventry
Sorry but no, that shouldn't give anyone a chance to enter the CL.
They don't want champions in it. They want the best teams with the biggest names.
I said it recently but sticking with ETH or appointing Southgate are the two red flag decisions for me. And they apparently want to do both in the long run
I was one of the few who was backing the INEOS bid from the start and I'm glad they won out. I'd rather be mediocre under INEOS than spending insane amounts of money to try to win things as a sports washing project. But this hasn't been a good start for them so far, and they aren't looking like they really do have their shit together at all. Not to mention some of the questionable things SJR has said, such as whether gardening leave was even legal, or something to that effect. I'm just a layperson, who knows a fraction of what he does about business, but that struck me as odd that he was even questioning something like that. As though he wasn't even aware of it. Not to mention genuinely believing that the UK should build us a new stadium, which is clearly nonsense.
They won the FA Cup. They literally came out on top out of every team in England in a competition where everyone fielded their strongest XI. It is an incredible achievement.
Winning it is a bigger achievement than 4th in my opinion
Is beating two teams really an "incredible achievement", especially in a competition where luck of the draw is a big factor and where you may end up playing your important games at home? For top 4 you need consistent performances throughout the year.
Not sure if you're being serious? Neither Liverpool or City had their strongest XI, and obviously we didn't either as we were missing Shaw. Liverpool had most of their youth team out by the time we turned the game.
And nobody gives a shit about the FA Cup other than the team who wins it. It's not one of the major trophies.
Blame the League Cup, it's worn down the FA cup's standing over time. Should make League Cup Olympic style rules for PL clubs.
I struggle a bit with that. The FA Cup is the oldest competition in Football, it's a major trophy but it's not a substitute to league performances. It's an enjoyable achievement while not being a great one or one that should dictate your mid to long term strategy.
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It's like an 'icing on the cake' type of cup, for me. Doesn't define a season like obviously the PL or CL, but if you do well in the league, and get the FA Cup, then it's usually a decent season.
Like nobody talks about 'the great Man United/Arsenal/Liverpool FA Cup team of 'x' year', like they do about great league or CL winning sides.
I'm sorry but why question someone, when you make claims that are not true?
Liverpool's starting line up when we played them:
Kelleher, VVD, Quansah, Gomes, Robbo, Endo, Macallister, Szoboslai, Salah, Nunez, Diaz. The bold part is completely false because Bobby Clark was the only one from the youth team to be brought on. Connor Bradley might be youth but also played a few PL games before that.
I mean you clearly have no idea about the FA CUP, it is a major trophy otherwise the "treble" wouldn't be a treble, like if City won a treble with Carabao over FA cup, it wont be the "treble".
FA cup might be the biggest cup competitions in Europe actually.
I agree with that but it's still a major trophy. It's an historic competition.
If City had won the Carling cup last year (or us in 99), it would have been dubbed the "quadruple". So by that logic the Carling cup is also a major trophy.
It's not major in my opinion, major is PL and CL to me. I see it as only slightly better than the League Cup these days. It's been a bit of a damp squib for years now, but was obviously once a big spectacle a couple of decades ago. Just my opinion.
The FA Cup is a major trophy by any metric so your opinion doesn’t really impact that.
Right, in response to a post where I said he’s a good/very good defender I was told I was ‘obsessively disliking’ and ‘criminally underrating him’. That seems fair.
Martinez is my favorite United player, but people really shouldn’t just hang onto every word that comes out of these managers’ mouths. I get it, but these dudes aren’t infallible nor are they always sincere. Pep called Matheus Nunes one of the best players in the world only to then come out and say “He’s not. I overexaggerated.”
People really should just form their own views/opinions rather than leaning on these dudes’
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Agreed here.
It’s absolutely lovely to win and it is a major trophy. But not something you judge the long term prospects of a club by.
Totally agree.
I can see him staying at this point given the alternatives available.
Good points and I agree. Your middle paragraph I put down to him not showing much respect to some opposition teams in the prem. him thinking some of the games are to easy so he goes to attacking. When we’re forever being cut open by lesser opposition. I think he underestimates some teams but this is something he should have learnt after a few games of doing it yet it seems he didn’t change anything. I’ve said it numerous of times that the only 2 teams he changes tactics for are city and Liverpool and he knows they’ll destroy us if we play to open.
Here is body language to try and read:
https://x.com/united_f85525/status/1794644680870867187?s=46&t=eB1DZwht3DhHe-XHokR_JQ
No, please read what I said. If a team won PL, CL and league cup, it wont be the same feat as winning the FA cup as the cup instead of league cup.
I'd argue the complete opposite. I can't see him staying given the alternatives available
Ok not necessarily direct promotion from the youth team for that game, but more unfavoured youngsters. Quansah, Clark, Bradley. Most of these players had only played 'a few PL games before that' because of their injury problems. These are still youngsters with not much experience in big games. And look who they took off - Salah, Diaz, Robertson, Szoboszlai, Gomez (who had kept Garnacho in check, whereas Bradley struggled). This wasn't anywhere near a 'first choice XI'.
It's the treble because the FA Cup is the biggest domestic cup competition. As somebody else pointed out, the quadruple invludes the League Cup - are you going to tell me that a big trophy too?
Not sure what to make of all of this but surely the longer this goes on the less the chances for him to stay?
I mean what else do they need to look at? They have been watching Ten Hag, games, training for months now. What more are they going to learn about him?
I might be wrong but just the way SJR treated Ten Hag post the cup final, he didnt seem too excited when he shook his hand but gave Pep a hug, no mention of the manager in his post congratulating the team. All this just points to a decision to sack has been made, they probably want to wait a few days so its not the same as LVG and they can say we carried out a review etc...
I mean what else do they need to look at? They have been watching Ten Hag, games, training for months now. What more are they going to learn about him?
I might be wrong but just the way SJR treated Ten Hag post the cup final, he didnt seem too excited when he shook his hand but gave Pep a hug, no mention of the manager in his post congratulating the team. All this just points to a decision to sack has been made, they probably want to wait a few days so its not the same as LVG and they can say we carried out a review etc...
I hate how this is what United fans are, it's exactly the sentiment on Blue Moon of entitled fans who think they are above the main domestic up on offer (or at least say they are because they lost).
Every season there are 2 big prizes, PL and CL, then you have your Tier 1 domestic cup (FA cup) and Tier 2 domestic cup (Carabao). If you're in the EL/drop into the EL, you aren't going to be challenging for the league (has this ever happened, I can't think of it) so the FA cup is always the 3rd best cup you can realistically win and in all the years it's been going I can only think of one joke run to the final (City's first FA cup under Pep), otherwise you have to beat at least 1 or 2 good teams to win it, and often more.
I kind of get playing down the Carabao, you see weakened teams very often there and it's not taken as seriously but not the FA cup.
You could be right. But I keep seeing this point and I'd like to know what alternatives people want to see? Some of the best managers, not named Pep or Klopp, are available right now. I can't think of anyone, bar Ancelotti, who would make this list any better. Am I forgetting anyone? Or, if there is nobody, then do you just want ETH for as long as he'll stay/another Fergie or Pep arrives in 10 or 15 years?
I'm sorry guys the FA Cup is an after thought if your not in the final your likely to forget it's on.
It's like the Europa or Comference league finals only people in it care.
It's big in England as a secondary to the league but I seriously doubt anyone outside of the UK gives much of a toss justvlike we don't give a toss about the Polkal or Spanish cup.
It's like the Europa or Comference league finals only people in it care.
It's big in England as a secondary to the league but I seriously doubt anyone outside of the UK gives much of a toss justvlike we don't give a toss about the Polkal or Spanish cup.
I think he was definitely going to sack him, but I think they're shitting themselves because of all the lunatics coming out of the woodwork.
Yes it is. Champions League itself is a cup competition. I'd rather see a team who has won a major cup in it than a team who has squeeked into 4th, like Villa have
Did i really need to say strongest available XI. Thought that was obvious
Yeah I'd like a re-jig. FA Cup deserves more respect and I said that even when we hadn't just won it.
Us against the world it seems. I knew people would have different opinions but I thought some would agree.
I would like you to go review this one more time. Quansah started 10/15 of the last PL games for Liverpool, Bradley started 10/12 PL games when Trent was injured.
Alot of teams who play extra time make personnel changes. A team that started with their strongest 11, ofcourse they cant start their strongest 11 on paper due to injuries.
Its like saying Manutd didnt take the PL seriously this season because they had Kobbie, Kambwala, Garnacho playing so Manutd didn't take the PL seriously?
Maybe look into viewership figures. If it's consistent with how it used to be, I think you'll find the FA Cup Final is incredibly more popular.
Now make up some more contradicting ITK stuff, Dad
Well what does strongest available XI matter? When you're nowhere near full strength, it doesn't mean shit. Every team plays their strongest available XI every week.
By that logic, ETH took us to 8th with a negative GD with his strongest available XI every week. Should be fired out of a cannon.
The options are so poor to replace him, not a good fit out there in my opinion, at the moment available. Last year was not good enough, football was diabolical. Lovely end winning the cup but we had so few good performances or results. It's a strange situation but Ineos must decide soon, so much to do. Can't be fecking around in June, decisions need to be decisive.
The issue I have now is this, does any of the names mention shout guarantee. To high level winning football, long-term and silverware. Odd situation we are in.
The issue I have now is this, does any of the names mention shout guarantee. To high level winning football, long-term and silverware. Odd situation we are in.
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