Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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*insert aggressive clapping gif*

Good post, agreed.

I will add that I have been infuriated at times with his in game management, his stubbornness in picking Anthony, his cautious/weird at times approach to Amad (who has looked fantastic when he has played). However, despite that I would much rather stick with ETH than flip a coin and hope for the best with the famously volatile Tuchel, the totally underwhelming Poch and the fully unproven McKenna. Won’t even bother suggesting Southgate, assume he’s a Liverpool fan windup.

I also really want ETH to stay and stick one to all the pundits who have written him off and partly to INEOS for treating him like a mug. The latter potentially will come with him managing a rival club and outperforming us, which will be a fecking kick in the nuts but I hope he proves them wrong at United, obviously.

This bolded bit is a good example of why people think there is a generally unhealthy obsession with managers on here.

If someone were to say that the Glazers treated Elanga like a mug, I really want him to prove them wrong by going on to be the next Ronaldo at a rival club, would that be a sensible thing to say?
 
Before the final I actually didn't mind if he got sacked or not. But the FA Cup win and the way players celebrate it with shows that they are all on good terms and are backing the manager which gave me a wholesome feeling. Yes, this season was a big disaster, but towards the end it looked like Ten Hag has finally pinpointed the weakness in the team and was on to something with the shift in formation, which resulted in the win against City. This is why I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt and keep him for another season. I really think it would be shameful to part ways like this. Post-Fergie we didn't maintain managers for more than 2 seasons due to lack of results. But this approach clearly does not workout so why not break the trend and keep the manager in place this time and trust in his process to turn it around? As long as the players are still behind him, he should be kept on board despite this season garbage finish.
 
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The problem is whatever 'style' EtH is providing has led to trophies across two seasons. Any new manager could provide a brilliant, innovative style of sumptuous passing but deliver nothing.

This is Ineos' real problem:

How does their guy ensure trophies continue?

I do fear Ineos will appeal for their appointment to be given time, but that really won't wash if they sack a trophy winning manager who succeeded from the off.

Also, if their chosen boss fails, will there be any repercussions at an executive level, or will they be paying themselves millions to fail upwards?

There is a serious danger of us talking ourselves into an Arsene Wenger phase of pretty-passing and 'trophy for fourth'.

Let's see.

Wenger was consistently making top four whilst Arsenal were selling players and getting outspent by clubs like Bolton. United are signing the likes of Mount and Antony for combined £150m. Plus Wengers football was outstanding; completely different situations. Don't be ignorant.
 
Ten hag has taken us through an incredibly challenging season with grace, humility, and professionalism. He has had to handle the antics of players like Sancho and Rashford, as well as coping with a number of injuries to key players such as Shaw, Mount, Martinez, Varane and Casemiro. Moreover, he has had to endure relentless media scrutiny and constant calls for his dismissal. Despite all this, he has delivered two trophies in two seasons, against the best and most dominant team in the world currently.

Yet the media still comes for him and doesn't recognise his achievements. How much more obvious is it that they're terrified he will bring United back to the top for decades to come? The club would be wise to show patience with Ten Hag. Consider Arteta's situation. Ten Hag needs time to implement his vision and establish a sustainable winning philosophy. He is the ideal coach for the current squad, with the potential to build around key players like Bruno, Kobbie, and Garnacho. Replacing him would mean starting from scratch once again, disrupting the progress made under his leadership. Ten Hag is a proven top manager, and if INEOS were to make the regrettable decision to sack him, they would undoubtedly rue it in the long run.

It's our worse premier league finish ever and to top it off a negative goal difference yet he's ideal? It's a deranged view :lol:

People have spent so long slagging the team off and now they're putting a cup win all on Ten Hag rather than recognising the players. Of course doing so would undermine the narrative that Ten Hag didn't have the squad to do any better.

Our league finish is on Ten Hags tactics, they were shite and he deserves the sack for it. You can't and don't get a pass from such underachievement.
 
Why would we be looking to replace a manager now that Ten Hag proved he can beat Man City in a cup final? They are the yard stick.
Because a much better gauge on how we're doing it looking at the other 38 + 6 games. Every manager that we've had has had some good wins against top clubs. It's not proof or an indicator of anything. In fact, it is really silly and short sighted.

I wonder how low in the league table would we have to be for people to consider that a domestic cup is not enough. Ironic that people don't want to see us become Wenger like "top 4 trophy team" and yet they're happy with us being a cup team underdog.
 
Ten hag has taken us through an incredibly challenging season with grace, humility, and professionalism. He has had to handle the antics of players like Sancho and Rashford, as well as coping with a number of injuries to key players such as Shaw, Mount, Martinez, Varane and Casemiro. Moreover, he has had to endure relentless media scrutiny and constant calls for his dismissal. Despite all this, he has delivered two trophies in two seasons, against the best and most dominant team in the world currently.

Yet the media still comes for him and doesn't recognise his achievements. How much more obvious is it that they're terrified he will bring United back to the top for decades to come? The club would be wise to show patience with Ten Hag. Consider Arteta's situation. Ten Hag needs time to implement his vision and establish a sustainable winning philosophy. He is the ideal coach for the current squad, with the potential to build around key players like Bruno, Kobbie, and Garnacho. Replacing him would mean starting from scratch once again, disrupting the progress made under his leadership. Ten Hag is a proven top manager, and if INEOS were to make the regrettable decision to sack him, they would undoubtedly rue it in the long run.


Why are you conviently forgetting the quite frankly horrible season until the final match and instead opting for nothing but praise and create a conspiracy theory that the criticism he has received is solely due to them being terrified of us getting back to the top? The final win was fantastic, but in no way can it completely overshadow how bad we have been since February 2023. It's like putting lipstick on a pig. I just cannot fathom anyone coming to your conclusion based on what we have witnessed this season.
 
2018/19 = Eredivisie title, KNVB Cup
2019/20 = Season voided because of COVID
2020/21 = Eredivisie title, KNVB Cup
2021/22 = Eredivisie title, runner up KNVB Cup
2022/23 = Carabao Cup, runner up FA Cup
2023/24 = FA Cup

Basicly ETH won at least 1 title since 2019 except 2020 because of COVID. If Ineos decide to part with ETH he's going to be alright at another football club.
 
Said I'd stick with him prior to the cup final and stand by that. I think next season is going to be another period of transition OFF the pitch. The likes of Berrada, Ashworth, Wilcox will need time to gel. Add in a new manager on top of that and there's lots of uncertainty.

Keeping ten Hag for this season before going for McKenna makes much more sense imo.
 
Wenger was consistently making top four whilst Arsenal were selling players and getting outspent by clubs like Bolton. United are signing the likes of Mount and Antony for combined £150m. Plus Wengers football was outstanding; completely different situations. Don't be ignorant.

With your last title win and the arrival of Chelsea under Abramovich, the investments you made with the new stadium, you gradually started falling downwards. Yeah, you maintained top 4 but this was in a period where the top 4 was pretty much reserved for 4 teams. Performance wise you were miles away from actually competing.g
 
Lets hope so mate.

But other than that you are spot on with the outgoings, agree 110%.

The players i want in are:

LB - Maatsen (release clause)
New creative winger - Olise
Striker - Guirassy (cheap&experienced)
RCB - Todibo
CB Backup - Tosin (free)
CDM - Scalvini
CM - Joao Neves or Wirtz

Good list, I'd prefer someone else to Todibo as I don't think he's an improvement on Varane other than being injured less. But there seems to be alot of talent available this summer. Even in midfield with Neves, Y. Fofana and A Onana available to play in a double pivot.

A competent recruitment team could clean up.
 
It's our worse premier league finish ever and to top it off a negative goal difference yet he's ideal? It's a deranged view :lol:

People have spent so long slagging the team off and now they're putting a cup win all on Ten Hag rather than recognising the players. Of course doing so would undermine the narrative that Ten Hag didn't have the squad to do any better.

Our league finish is on Ten Hags tactics, they were shite and he deserves the sack for it. You can't and don't get a pass from such underachievement.
This may come as a shock to you.
Football existed before 1992
Stop listening to pundits who have won less than f' all
 
True. I want him to stay as well. Why get another manager and start the damn process again. He gave us garnacho and kobbie. Let him have a season with a fit squad and then let's judge him.

He keeps getting us trophies as well. I honestly don't see the problem.

No, we don't start the process "again". We will start it for the first time since SAF left. I don't know why people are having hard time grasping this.

For the actual first time in over a decade we are trying to implement some kind of structure and thought into what we are doing as a team. Several times we spent hundreds of millions trying to facilitate the way a manager wants to play, only to have to move a number of players afterwards. If INEOS decides that we need a change, they should sack EtH on the spot and we should back them. The ideal scenario here is to seamlessly change managers if needed, not having to change your damn team every 2-3 years.

EtH has not done enough to deserve another season in my book. We were on steady decline ever since the LC win. I feel like the cup win has wiped the minds of many supporters. Terrible performances in many matches, non-existent game management, bad tactics, questionable signings, being extremely easy to play against.

When we win it is because of his genius, if we win - others have better team, injuries etc...
 
Wenger was consistently making top four whilst Arsenal were selling players and getting outspent by clubs like Bolton. United are signing the likes of Mount and Antony for combined £150m. Plus Wengers football was outstanding; completely different situations. Don't be ignorant.
Wenger was doing that in a piss easy PL era
 
Putting this is here aswell cause it’s how I feel about ETH and don’t mind sticking my toes in once in awhile to unsettle the lynch mob.

Since Ferguson left, I can remember an awful lot more bad than good. And as bad as things have been this season , the Barca the last year, and the FA cup chaos run (semi final and all) and beating the strongest team in the world in the final by outplaying them (not flucking) when everybody had written us off. Well it’s been some of the fondest and most rewarding games I’ve watched in a long time. Helping derail Klopps sendoff in that FA cup game is particularly sweet. Forlan is fondly remembered for just scoring against Liverpool, I’d like to think ETH navigating us past a pep and Klopp team to victory will get proper recognition, as he’s gotten none from a lot of people.

People talking about standards are kind of really talking sh/t. United are not a super club on the field since Ferguson left. Spending lots of money doesn’t make you a super club on field , I’d of thought Chelsea under Boehly and Woodwards Disneyland , half arsed Galactico transfer policy would have thought people that.

Some fans simply haven’t woken up to the reality of where we are at. If you can’t really enjoy those moments under ETH , why bother following football ? Constantly over focusing on the negatives and some weird relentless aggressive mob lynching going after the manager. It’s part of the culture of the sport , I get that, but people really lose the run of themselves.

Our manager won the FA cup really against all the odds. Everything that could go wrong , had gone wrong this season. We made it to the FA cup final in a similar “seats of your pants” way United got to and won the CL in 1999: ironically it’s closer to the Fergie football of that time cause it was chaos , beautiful chaos. (I’m not saying it’s anywhere near as strong a squad , I’m comparing the drama).

I’d like to see ETH stay. Some people said “a manager can’t come back from this or turn things around” , well the FA cup run says otherwise.

There’s been a lot of mitigating reasons why this season was so poor and while some could argue he could of played his hand better, it doesn’t change the absolute sh/8show he’s had to manage. ABUs and bias media understandably and ignorantly dismiss it out of spite and clickbait motive , but to why objective observer ETH has been given a raw deal in the 2 years he’s been here. And in my view he’s handled it with dignity and confidence that I want from all our managers.

He took over a toxic , divided dressingroom and had to navigate drama after drama from day 1. He’s really popular with most of the squad. He’s helped nurture multiple really talented looking players. He’s won a cup both years he has managed us. He’s been a part of some savage memorable moments. He’s also left us in a really good spot relative to when he took over. Lots of potential and despite the whinging about his signings they are more hit than miss. Only a moron judges an injury plagued player against a manager.

And he seems like a decent enough bloke , not charming full of sh/t manager that people seem to crave. He’s just a football man, not a character which seems to sway the popularity.

I hope he stays and we see what he can do with an injury less season and a proper bunch of professional adults helping him with recruitment and all other aspects that have been neglected under the Glazers.

Whatever happens , I will be fond of him cause he’s been a breath of fresh air.
Absolutely spot on, poster. Take a bow; said far more eloquently than I could. Don’t forget fecking up the Klopp love in, repeatedly. Cracking post.
 
Why do people defending him only acknowledge his successes and ignore his shortcomings? It's not ETH's fault where we ended up in the league; it was due to injuries, the structure, the ownership, and the players. Winning the FA Cup is credited to his brilliant tactics. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but please be reasonable and not brainwashed.

Facts are, we finished 8th in the leauge, had Xg Pts of 15th place, finished last in an easy CL group, negative GD, 17th in shots against, which all corresponds to how horrendueos the games have been. Also, add the wasteful spending of over 400m which will never be recuperated. All of these are and should be sackable offenses. We've hade one of our worst seasons ever. Ten Hag's fingerprints are all over the crime scene. Not sacking ETH after the Palace thrashing has backfired now that public opinion has turned. I hope INEOS remain steadfast in their beliefs and aren't swayed from doing what they think is best for Manchester United.
 
I'm in the ETH out camp and personally I think he's handled these situations well.

As much as I think showing favourtism to his own signings is a criticism, it's something I do understand and is a perfectly human thing to do.

I am old enough to remember the Veron saga at United. Veron came to Manchester to escape a potential criminal case in Italy that could have seen him banned for months if not worse. Things boiled off as soon as he signed with us and problems started cropping out. Many EPL fans wouldn't know what was going on but people who have access to the Italian media remember how Veron criticized the EPL game back in the day and its audacity to expect playmakers to drop deep and tackle.

Anyway towards the end it became evident that the Veron deal wouldn't work. Rumors of Chelsea were persistent and someone had the audacity to ask SAF about whether Veron is staying or not. SAF went ballistic. It was like someone had just asked him why prime Keane wasn't working out for United and if he was set to leave. No question followed and a month after Veron was sold.

That's how great managers tackle players with giant egos who are not producing the goods. They do so not out of respect towards the player himself but towards the player's price. TBF ETH seem to have finally learnt his lesson with Rashford.
 
With your last title win and the arrival of Chelsea under Abramovich, the investments you made with the new stadium, you gradually started falling downwards. Yeah, you maintained top 4 but this was in a period where the top 4 was pretty much reserved for 4 teams. Performance wise you were miles away from actually competing.g

With clubs like Villa, Spurs, Everton under Moyes; top 4 wasn't a guarantee, especially as most these clubs outspent Arsenal during that period. Also, between 2007-2011 we were involved in three title races. So again, more ignorance.
 
I fecking hate that they(owners and people in charge) haven't just come out and cleared the air about what is happening to ETH and everything around his position. Because I despise seeing all these rumours about who might take over after him.
 
To be honest McKenna, De Zerbi, Tuchel. I don’t care as long as we decide to go in a new direction.
 
Starting to think if he's not gone by the end of the day he will be here in September.

If that's the case (pray not) the club should state it unequivocally. I don't want ETH anymore, but if he stays he and anyone he deals with has to know he stays.
 
Starting to think if he's not gone by the end of the day he will be here in September.

If that's the case (pray not) the club should could out stating it unequivocally. I don't want ETH anymore, but if he stays he and anyone he deals with has to know he stays.
He’ll be gone by the weekend I reckon
 
With clubs like Villa, Spurs, Everton under Moyes; top 4 wasn't a guarantee, especially as most these clubs outspent Arsenal during that period. Also, between 2007-2011 we were involved in three title races. So again, more ignorance.

Villa, Spurs and Everton in that period, well that's a fecking good one. No, just no.

Three title races within 2007-2011, jesus. Points wise you were close in 2007/08, but it was hardly much of a race, that's the only time in this period you were actually close to it.
 
I fecking hate that they(owners and people in charge) haven't just come out and cleared the air about what is happening to ETH and everything around his position. Because I despise seeing all these rumours about who might take over after him.

Relax mate, the club already briefed the media that they are doing end of season review before deciding on next steps.
 
Under the old ownership, the sentiment behind the FA Cup final victory would have secured ETH at least another season and a few more contract renewals.

INEOS will be taking a much more objective and pragmatic approach and the numbers tell us that 8th simply isn’t good enough, even if we beat the champions in a one-off game.

ETH is almost certainty gone, I imagine.
 
Similar value? They've spent €1100 on transfer fees alone in the last two years.

The entire team wasn't poorly set up, we went from being comfortable against Bayern, Copenhagen and Galatasaray to completely losing our shit and playing without any confidence whatsoever, the players are fragile, it's hardly uncommon. Mistake here, mistake there, players get nervous. Remove individual mistakes directly related to goals, and there was an abundance of those, and we qualify comfortably.
Ten Hag inherited a team full of players who went for large transfer fees and spent an additional £400m odd on it. Our team value won't be far off Chelsea's, but it's immaterial because you don't need to spend that much money to compete anyway as many others have demonstrated.

We'll have to agree to disagree there. Our inability to control games is the reason we lost most of those games. Players making mistakes regularly is a symptom of the lack of structure and organisation and that translated to all competitions. There were several clear instances this season where even the players looked confused and that's down to poor tactical instruction.

You can say we would qualify comfortably but the proof's in the pudding. We finished bottom of the group. We lost at home to second string Newcastle in the Carabao. We deservedly finished 8th with a negative goal difference.
 
Good list, I'd prefer someone else to Todibo as I don't think he's an improvement on Varane other than being injured less. But there seems to be alot of talent available this summer. Even in midfield with Neves, Y. Fofana and A Onana available to play in a double pivot.

A competent recruitment team could clean up.

Todibo might be 40 million cheaper than Branthwaite and such but i get your point.

I like Fofana and Onana also but Scalvini is on another level mate. Very similar playstyle as Rodri.
 
Are anyone really excited about any of the potential replacements? I remember in the lead-up to us signing Ten Hag, I was quite excited about it as I thought he was the right kind of profile. Whether it's Pochettino or Tuchel or De Zerbi I have serious reservations.

If we were to fire ETH and sign someone else, it would all just be a bit 'meh'. Yet another restart. I'm not saying it couldn't be the right call to make, but starting over almost seems a bit exhausting.
 
If you grade a manager like you grade an exam, I.e x% from PL position, x% style of play and performances, x% player development, x% CL position, x% other Cup competitions etc, one would think the logical deduction is still a low grade for EtH.

I believe many of us here said that he should go regardless of result before the FA cup final.

The only reason he should stay is if INEOS finds out that the injury crisis was a freak occurrence and not related to his training/ playstyle; EtH gives assurances that he has learnt from trying to implement his chaos ball style and will adapt; EtH is willing to work in a new structure with less say in transfers and be open to take onboard help in progressing our play
 
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I’d rather stick with ETH. Don’t rate De Zerbi at all.
I’ve watched Brighton a lot over the last two years due to having close friends connected to the club.

Even without mentioning his sensational 22/23 season, in 23/24 Brighton finished with an xGpts of 8th while dealing with similar injuries to us. And losing 150m worth of midfield talent without replacing them in Caicedo and Macallister. Their squad this season is very poor.

He also improved and raised the technical level of players like Veltman, Gilmour, Dunk, March and Welbeck in his time at Brighton. While heavily relying on youth like Buonanotte and Hinshelwood.

Brighton kept up their style of football, averaging the 4th highest possession, only behind City, Spurs and Liverpool. 10th in xG created, 8th in xGA. All higher underlying stats than Ten Hag’s Utd. Also has gotten the better of Ten Hag in every match up statistically including dominating Utd at Old Trafford with his B team earlier this season, winning 1-3 comfortably.

Since joining, he’s beaten every top 6 team bar City. And last season, beating Arsenal 0-3 at the Emirates. Arsenal fans will tell you that’s the best away performance they’ve seen from a team at their ground in a very long time.

Hopefully @The Boy can back up this statement. A lot of my Brighton friends didn’t want De Zerbi to go.
 
Relax mate, the club already briefed the media that they are doing end of season review before deciding on next steps.

Did not see that... just got heated up when I saw Southgate and De Zerbi yet again linked to us. Sick of it, kinda ruins the aftermath of that wonderful and emotional FA Cup victory.
 
True. I want him to stay as well. Why get another manager and start the damn process again. He gave us garnacho and kobbie. Let him have a season with a fit squad and then let's judge him.

He keeps getting us trophies as well. I honestly don't see the problem.
The academy gave us Garnacho and Kobbie, their potential levels couldn't go ignored. It was easy to bed them into the team as they play in positions we desperately need quality and bodies.
 
That's never made sense to me, he wanted Casemiro. He's admitted that recently.

Maguire and Evans can play a high line, Martinez isn't fast and Van Dijk isn't a United player.

So if he was committing to this system regardless of personnel why is the back 4 sitting so deep leaving a chasm where our midfield should be. When obviously the defence should be pushing up. It all makes zero sense.

Ironically persevering with this setup wasted the season, put us back further and is likely to lose him his job.
Yeah he seems to have greatly misjudged tye entire situation alright. He needed to be more adaptable.

He didn't want Casemiro, he wanted de Jong. Casemiro was a stop gap last minute opportunistic Glazer buy that lasted even less time than he had hoped. He was a bad transfer after one season and the only sense he wanted him was that he was better than nothing. What's ETH gonna say? No I never wanted him? That's not how classy people behave.

Maguire and Evans can't play a high line. What are you smoking? We've seen them sit deep week after week and when they do push up they get skinned alive by anyone with pace. Players like Martinez and van Dijk can.

ETH can be criticised for persisting with his system without the players to play it. He surely would have done better playing counter attack like at Wembley. And yet would he have been able to sit off Sheffield United at Old Trafford? Crystal Palace? He'd have been sacked for a more fundamental reason that he'd abandoned the project he was brought in to implement. And he still would have lost quite a few games. Better to be hanged as a wolf than a sheep.
 
Genuinely baffled that so many fans want to keep him. We've made zero progress in the last 2 seasons!
 
Imagine sacking him for De Zerbi/Poch who have 0 achievements with their teams. The minute he had most of the squad mostly fit, we were able to stand up to probably the best team in the past 15/20 years. And we did it with academy products. Look at the relationship he has with the players, he never threw them under the bus this whole season. He was praising them all the time. Poch is a bottle job, De Zerbi is not proven, I get Potter vibes.
I think Hag finally got the grip of what it means to be United manager and sacking him in the middle of the project is madness.
 
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