That's what I'm saying. Fans wanted him a lot, wouldn't surprise me if it influenced the decision. Fans are emotional and fickle.
Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24
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For sure, but where is the logic he's going to take 4 steps further forward? It's a huge gamble.
So 2 - that is no where near enough data to determine if he can make another big step up and 3 is not cold. I'm not De Zerbis biggest fan, but he's clearly a better option, so I'm not sure 1 is true either.
No, I'm not. I've been to matches at various points of the season and fan sentiment is clear. It's not just a poll from Mitten alone. And winning back to back cups is not the same as an isolated win against PSG.
Correct, especially after a big win after watching us play terribly for months.
Like beating PSG or an FA Cup final.
If he does stay, I hope we get the pissed off Ten Hag we've seen the past couple of days rather than the dreary bore I've become accustomed to.
You seem to be operating under this absurd logic that any of us that want Ten Hag sacked think success is guaranteed with a new manager (none of us think that). When in reality the actual stance is “we are more likely to turn the ship around and progress under a new manager than we are with the current one”.
Thats literally how decisions should be made, nothing is guaranteed that should seem obvious. As far as “what makes me think I know best?” I mean I have opinions just like everyone else. But my opinion is based on what’s now 2 years of evidence of seeing the current managers plans play out, underlying horrid metrics from this season, a lack of adjustments made after initial game plans don’t work, questionable in game management, VERY questionable talent ID in transfers (although this isn’t totally on him). So yeah I think he should go as I think we’ve seen enough over a long enough time period to know he isn’t good enough. Some want him to stay based on our injury luck this year. Thats fine, people can have their opinions no matter how much i might disagree.
The entire point is making a decision that’s in the best interest of us progressing forward as I’m pretty sure everyone here wants to see us get back to dominating like we did a decade ago and before. But saying that those us that want him sacked can’t say shit if the new manager is also sacked in two years hilarious, as if we don’t have ample evidence that multiple managers can be failures without being related to each other.
Yeah I prefer dezerbi too and I stand by the comment that the other options aren't that good, including him
Just seen a video of a fan with ten hag out printed on his shirt at the game. Wtf is wrong with people.
Like LvG i think his eyes have been opened to what the English media are truly like and he felt like he had to defend himself and be aggressive. Maybe i'm remembering wrong but i don't recall the media being as aggressive with Jose, Ole or Moyes. I think our Dutch managers got the worst of it from the press.
There is nothing to suggest any of the shortlisted managers would do better.
Not saying TenHag should stay, but statements about his stubbornness is quite hypocritical from our fan base.
One manager actually wants to build a style of play, which he literally said in an interview that constantly changing the style won’t get us anywhere, which is more or less true taking into account some of the teams that have developed a sustainable style of play.
Remember the ole/ mourinho era, times we were actually getting results but our fan base was not happy due to the one dimensional style of play. Now someone is trying to implement something but as impatient as our fan base is , it is absolutely impossible to do so, without facing the sack.
Good things take time and any future manager will face the same fate atleast in the eyes of our fan base.
Hope Ineps is the key here that stops this cycle.
One manager actually wants to build a style of play, which he literally said in an interview that constantly changing the style won’t get us anywhere, which is more or less true taking into account some of the teams that have developed a sustainable style of play.
Remember the ole/ mourinho era, times we were actually getting results but our fan base was not happy due to the one dimensional style of play. Now someone is trying to implement something but as impatient as our fan base is , it is absolutely impossible to do so, without facing the sack.
Good things take time and any future manager will face the same fate atleast in the eyes of our fan base.
Hope Ineps is the key here that stops this cycle.
Nonsense, that’s impossible. “The fans” isn’t some amorphous blob that has broadly the same opinion that the club then has to try and align with. The club has millions of fans with millions of varying opinions on all sorts of different things related to the club. And some of those opinions change on a weekly/monthly/yearly basis. The massive divide between then Ten Hag in and Ten Hag out brigade demonstrates that. So all the club can and should do is make the most objective decisions they can on what they think is best for the club. It’s an inevitability that sections of the fans base will disagree with them no matter what they do.
He was brought in to get us back on track to competing with the top clubs. That was his remit. Winning a league Cup and an FA Cup are nice side additions but he's failed at making any progress at what he was actually brought in for.
Not just failed but widened the gap between us and the top clubs. Lumbered us with more expensive deadwood, created no style of play we have never looked worse on the eye test.
If your answer is purely that a couple of domestic trophies is enough then there is nothing to discuss with you.
It has
The fact McKenna has put both Chelsea and Ipswich on hold until he hears from United suggests to me that talks with his representatives went positive enough that he thinks he is the frontrunner.
As a club we need to stop listening to supporters, because ours have backed the wrong horse continuously over the last 10 years. It's like the only take away from the whole Fergie era was that he was good simply because he was given time. We were spoilt by that guy really, some of the things people come out with now makes me realise people just didn't really appreciate what made him so good. Like he was just some lucky guy that got time until it just worked out.
It's admirable in a way that our support is such an emotional, romanticising bunch, but our collective opinion is absolute garbage and that is shown by the swing in the poll after one single game. Not even a game we dominated, or finally had a breakthrough with our style of play, but a game we reverted to the old sit in and counter (a very disciplined and well carried out plan nonetheless). But after 50 or 60 games, prior to the final, it was around 80% for the sack, based on what all of that evidence led us to. Yet one game and is nearly 50/50 again. That is exactly why we shouldn't listen to the fans, right there. There's too many who just blow with the wind and are clearly incapable of forming a definitive decision themselves. No conviction in anything they believe.
It wouldn't surprise me one bit if he was to stay, have another lacklustre season, and these same fans will be back all over him again. Yet by that point there'll be nowhere to turn as no manager will want to come in mid way through the season and no doubt most of these options we have will be gone. Some may even be looking fantastic at their new club. You can just see it coming a mile off.
Tl;dr I hope Ineos have truly done a thorough review of everything throughout the season, come to their own decision with conviction, and give us a good reasoning behind why they decided what they did. If he's sacked, so be it. If he stays, put your money where your mouth is and give him a new deal. Don't drag uncertainty into next season. But most of all, don't listen the the fans who are in an emotional overdrive right now.
It's admirable in a way that our support is such an emotional, romanticising bunch, but our collective opinion is absolute garbage and that is shown by the swing in the poll after one single game. Not even a game we dominated, or finally had a breakthrough with our style of play, but a game we reverted to the old sit in and counter (a very disciplined and well carried out plan nonetheless). But after 50 or 60 games, prior to the final, it was around 80% for the sack, based on what all of that evidence led us to. Yet one game and is nearly 50/50 again. That is exactly why we shouldn't listen to the fans, right there. There's too many who just blow with the wind and are clearly incapable of forming a definitive decision themselves. No conviction in anything they believe.
It wouldn't surprise me one bit if he was to stay, have another lacklustre season, and these same fans will be back all over him again. Yet by that point there'll be nowhere to turn as no manager will want to come in mid way through the season and no doubt most of these options we have will be gone. Some may even be looking fantastic at their new club. You can just see it coming a mile off.
Tl;dr I hope Ineos have truly done a thorough review of everything throughout the season, come to their own decision with conviction, and give us a good reasoning behind why they decided what they did. If he's sacked, so be it. If he stays, put your money where your mouth is and give him a new deal. Don't drag uncertainty into next season. But most of all, don't listen the the fans who are in an emotional overdrive right now.
I have a ST and I disagree. Barely heard any chants for him this season, apart from the odd pocket of fans in about 4 or 5 games, and most other match going fans I know and sit near have said that they think he should go.
I agree, it's just to make INEOS seem like they're not sacking a manager after winning them a cup.
The league position is the better guage of how far we've come under ETH, not one game which could have been 2-2 if Haalands shot was 1 inch lower.
I like ETH, as a person he comes across as very decent but the reality is, with the players he has even with all our injuries, 8th place is pretty bad.
Give someone else a chance for a year, if it doesnt work out, get rid next summer and there might be better options available then.
I like ETH, as a person he comes across as very decent but the reality is, with the players he has even with all our injuries, 8th place is pretty bad.
Give someone else a chance for a year, if it doesnt work out, get rid next summer and there might be better options available then.
Liverpool have been predominantly the 2nd and on odd occasions 3rd highest team with the most possession other than City in the league since 2017. The foundation of Klopp's approach has always been a possession outfit, the press / transition is just a nuance in how they regain the ball high up and divert the opportunity to an attacking phase.
Also the press wasn't abandoned this season, the problem throughout the majority of fixtures has been the opposition beating the press beyond the first set of players and the chasm in the midfield that has followed as a consequence. Arguably if United did abandon the press and reverted to what we've witnessed the last three games, the manager would have churned more positive results.
Nobody's saying that. But he was given time. And I'm absolutely convinced that many if not all of the moaning wankers on here who adamantly want Ten Hag out now would've adamantly wanted Fergie out from 1988-1991.
9 games lost at Old Trafford
14 PL games lost this season.
19 games lost in all competitions.
85 goals conceded.
58 goals conceded in the PL.
57 goals scored in the PL.
Negative goal difference.
8th in the league (Our lowest ever position in the PL).
Highest number of shots faced in a PL season.
Finished bottom of our Champions League group (gaining just 5 points from 6 games and conceding a record breaking 15 goals).
Plus a bunch more of negative records I'm probably forgetting.
Poor in training, poor at managing injuries, poor at tactics and on and on and on. He literally doesn't know how to control games.
He's also been in the job almost 2 years and has been backed more than any other manager we've had (to the tune of £400m+). He is not qualified for the job and deserves no more time "to see if it works out". He is absolutely useless and has us in relegation form, Moyes was sacked for less than this. So too LvG, Jose and Ole.
It absolutely blows my mind how people are still willing to give the statically worst manager we've ever had "one more season". Standards are literally in the toilet.
14 PL games lost this season.
19 games lost in all competitions.
85 goals conceded.
58 goals conceded in the PL.
57 goals scored in the PL.
Negative goal difference.
8th in the league (Our lowest ever position in the PL).
Highest number of shots faced in a PL season.
Finished bottom of our Champions League group (gaining just 5 points from 6 games and conceding a record breaking 15 goals).
Plus a bunch more of negative records I'm probably forgetting.
Poor in training, poor at managing injuries, poor at tactics and on and on and on. He literally doesn't know how to control games.
He's also been in the job almost 2 years and has been backed more than any other manager we've had (to the tune of £400m+). He is not qualified for the job and deserves no more time "to see if it works out". He is absolutely useless and has us in relegation form, Moyes was sacked for less than this. So too LvG, Jose and Ole.
It absolutely blows my mind how people are still willing to give the statically worst manager we've ever had "one more season". Standards are literally in the toilet.
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I'm definitely ETH out. But United played brilliantly yesterday.
This is how Real Madrid qualified against Man city ( the biggest club in the world you know), they did what united did for not 1 half, but 4 halves. Donkeys like Ogden "armchair experts" are not worth listening two.
If they'd already decided to sack him, it still makes sense to wait a few days / a week for obvious reasons.
Many fans are high from the result yesterday and many fans who wanted him gone yesterday morning want him to stay as of today. But in a few days when they come to look at the season as a whole and not just through the prism of the FA Cup win, they'll revert back to their original opinion, albeit not holding the opinion as passionately as they did before.
INEOS will obviously know this and will let the dust settle before making an announcement and pulling the trigger.
Many fans are high from the result yesterday and many fans who wanted him gone yesterday morning want him to stay as of today. But in a few days when they come to look at the season as a whole and not just through the prism of the FA Cup win, they'll revert back to their original opinion, albeit not holding the opinion as passionately as they did before.
INEOS will obviously know this and will let the dust settle before making an announcement and pulling the trigger.
So what? If Ineos conclude from their analysis that Ten Hag is not the right man for the job, then he’ll be gone and they’ll choose another candidate based on availability and their perception of suitability. No manager is ever guaranteed to do any better, no matter what their record, so that’s an impossible prerequisite to meet.
You don't know that. I was only just born at that time so I don't know what fan sentiment was like that season. But if we hired Fergie now, and he'd had achievements at impressive as what he had at Aberdeen, then he'd have more support than ETH. I'm sure of it. Not just for footballing reasons but he's also a far more likeable guy.
Only way that happens is if Ineos keep ten hag and sack him in January. When Southgate will be a free agent
Well, this is from 1989:
I'm not even "Ten Hag in" necessarily. The season's obviously been incredibly shite. I'm just not sure if we should lay most of the blame for that at his feet, even if he has clearly made mistakes.
Is there anything to suggest they wouldn't?
Every managerial appointment and indeed every season even within a managers tenure is subject to any number of possible outcomes.
Well you can be adamantly what you want but you have zero basis for that assumption, just like those who think giving ETH time will guarantee him to become successful.... I am judging on merit based on the last 24 months, but hey if you want decide what I think then I know all I need to about you... agree to disagree and don't get in a mard when you cannot convince everyone to think the same way you do
Who thinks that?
Some of those stats are shocking, one of our worst seasons since Fergie. The change of support and amnesia since the cup final is the definition of knee jerk.
I think neither ETH or LVG had worked in England before and perhaps both underestimated the PL and the media.
With the other three though they knew the PL and English media well. But I wouldn't say any of them got an easier ride, perhaps just dealt with it better.
Not really if they've already decided. Trying to pretend to the fans they've actually taken this into consideration is stupid and a waste of time. Just back your decision if you've made it and think it's form the good of the club.
That clown got eaten by a giant gingerbaby.
What's even weirder is that some seem to firmly believe that McKenna is the oracle. He would be a massive, massive gamble.
I’m still in the out camp, but no fecking way if it’s for Thomas Frank and to a lesser degree even not McKenna. It’s far too big of a step up.
And they also say there happy to come 8th again, but apparently we've lowered our standards with Ten Hag
.I want to be a cardiothoracic surgeon but I don't have the training for it, oh well best thing to do is just go for it... doing something just because without the right preparation is idiocy, I don't generally like quotes for quotes sake but Ben Franklin aptly said "By failing to prepare you are preparing to fail." you can pretty much apply that to anything
And they also say there happy to come 8th again, but apparently we've lowered our standards with Ten Hag
People saying they'll be happy to let McKenna build something will be shown up if we finished 8th under him. The knives would be firmly out.
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