Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Syphon Wallet said:
What other top club would tolerate 6th in the league with 11 losses?
Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, City, PSG the manager would be long gone.
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This even smaller clubs sack underperforming managers. Like Leicester sacked Raineri after winning the PL(a historic achievement). We have a cult of the manager mindset in our fanbase because of Saf that the other biggest clubs in world dont.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
I give up mate.
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Mate, you’re literally wasting your time. If people can’t see it at this point they will never see it. Even after he gets sacked they’ll be saying he should have been given more time. They’ve subscribed to the cult of personality, and they of the opinion the players need to be dragged kicking and screaming into success because they don’t want to achieve.
 
JeffFromHK said:
3KaHWMS.jpg


Anyone else feel that we love defending with a straight line of players and it never works?
When we are defending set pieces we also love defending with a straight line of players and all balls cleared surely go to the opposition
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Look at this snapshot. We have 6 players in the box. They have eight inside and around the box. Eight!
 
Ronaldo's Love Child said:
The scoreline against Brentford won't hit the headlines like the 7-0 mauling by Liverpool. It won't be talked about in years to come but make no mistake about it-the performance we saw yesterday leaves no doubt that ETH is the wrong manager at the wrong time for our club.


Yesterday's performance reminded me of Mourinho's United's performance against Sevilla a few seasons back. A must win game yet the players acted it out as if it were a pre season match. Sometimes teams can be slow to get started in matches and that is where you expect the manager to step in and interact with his team, either vocally, tactically or personel wise. After that match Mourinho did not acknowledge how bad or lacking in energy we were and instead went on a rant defending his record. It was at that point that Mourinho lost me.

Fast forward to 2024 and the match against Brentford had the same impact on me.

It's been difficult to properly assess ETH's performance as Manager this season as

a) our injury list has been nothing short of absurd this season and
b) United were shorn of three of their first choice attackers with the drama surrounding Sancho, Ronaldo and Greenwood and with no transfer money coming in from their departure to offset their absence either.

But the injury list has been something of a red herring at times as there have been a number of matches where we've pretty much had a full strength team out. Our performances weren't better even then and even when missing some players we have been comfortably outplayed (if not always beaten) by teams with players supposedly less talented than our lot.
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Greenwood hasn't played a match under Ten Hag he was never a factor or shouldn't have been in his planning. Ronaldo leaving left him a man short but he was 37 it's not like he was planning to build the team around him. Sancho could have been disciplined (fine/ban) and then brought back into the squad. It was Eriks decision to freze him out completely and then loan him.
 
We are going nowhere with ETH. Not sure he is worth keeping any more. The sooner we replace him with a better manager the better.
 
tjb said:
It's always both.

This appointment has been just a massive show of weakness from the club imo.

From the very beginnining. The plan when Ole was not to be manager was to adopt the football structure other teams are using, as it was clear it hadn't worked for us. Instead, one an Eredivisie manager with a seemingly good system and one semi-final in the Champions League campaign popped up, as usual we abandoned all our plans and gave him far too much power.

The sad thing is, in sacking Ole we had shown signs of improvement in this regard. Unlike Ten Haag, Ole had shown signs of good attacking performances with the problem usually being a lack of quality in the final third in games where we were camped in the opposition half. We struggled to break those down. Yet the fact was, we were camped in the opposition half. Ole deserved to stay as long as he did, but also deserved to be sacked once he showed that he couldn't manage a progressive side with big personalities.

With Ten Haag, we took a massive step back. His job is to get good and consistent performance from the team. Good and consistent performances come with control and chance creation. The hope for a good manager is that once they can get us playing good football consistently, we can challenge for key trophies consistently, improving in quality enough to where we can expect to win. None of the managers we've hired have even done that bar maybe Jose in small batches of 16/17 and 17/18. Yet we've always treated these managers like players are simply not giving them enough, rather than calling it what it is and seeing that both parties have simply failed to show cohesive quality. The manager's job also entails getting that cohesion, and somehow fans and the media, in regard to United, have always seemingly blamed players for this, as opposed to the managers. Right now, we're breaking negative records, yet people somehow still want to blame players for this. Players who have looked good in other clubs and with their national teams, yet can consistently concede 20+ chances a game at United. The system and strategy he uses sucks and the fact that despite his job being on the line, he's still using it, doesn't show resolve, but rather unseriousness, stubborness or a lack of ideas....or it could be all three. As a fanbase, we expect so little of managers. I hate the fact that's the case, as it exposes the fact that the media painted Sir Alex' success as simple. Like any good manager with time could get a team to play swashbuckling attacking football when given good support. It's quite clear the club thinks that ( with appointing Ole and Moyes) and the fans think that ( with how easily they crown a messiah).

Our problem is when we hire managers, we almost try to prove that we made the right decision hiring them, instead of assessing them to see if they deserve the job. We're more concerned with selling the idea of them to the public rather than ensuring they get us to success. A good club should see an underperforming, poor manager and be able to sack them within 2 months. At United we look for every reason to keep them, use small wins as indicators of success and can keep a bad underperforming manager for 2 years. Giving a manager " time" isn't an indication of a good structure. No club with a good structure would give underperforming managers time. They'd all sack the manager and replace them quickly. Making tough decisions decisively and giving fans faith that they can always make those type of decisions. Player's opinions and training practices are considered. Unlike us, they won't just consistently shut down any news coming from within the club, and treat the opinions of grown adults as petulance from children. Our mentality is still stuck in the 90's which is why we've been operating so badly. The managers don't suffer from this, its the players that do.
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Great post
 
JeffFromHK said:
3KaHWMS.jpg
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How many goals like this have we conceded now? And yet the other teams still get half a dozen of these opportunities every single game. Doesn't matter if it's Liverpool, Villa, Luton or Wigan.

Because we have a manager who is criminally incompetent and doesnt know how to set up a team to defend at this level of football.

Doesn't matter show shit Maguire, Lindelof, McTominay etc are. They did not defend at this sunday league standard prior to Hag.
 
VP89 said:
Martinez and Mount have effectively been injured all season. Hojlund was a project signing that the club and he synced on, knowing the benefits are reaped longer term than for immediate impact.

Also money spent isn't an indictment on our coach. We wasted money chronically well before ten hag came in.

Park the name calling mate, come back when you have an actual point.
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Were you not calling people 12 year olds for having perfectly valid points about how badly he was setting up the team 6 months ago?

Since then, it’s just been unrelenting evidence that he isn’t up to the task, literally on a weekly basis.

No one should be name calling in this, or any other thread. We all support the same club, but he has proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that he isn’t up to the task of coaching the team.

Clinging to a decent start (that still involved absolute hammerings and very obvious tactical frailties) is just damaging the team at this stage. The results are poor, the football is woeful and the stats are damning. We are going nowhere with Ten Hag in charge.
 
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JeffFromHK said:
3KaHWMS.jpg


Anyone else feel that we love defending with a straight line of players and it never works?
When we are defending set pieces we also love defending with a straight line of players and all balls cleared surely go to the opposition
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I believe Mainoo would of been right there at thr penalty spot preventing their goal.
 
I really don't think INEOS will see this and think this is the long-term guy for the job. Even with a structure behind him, I can't see ETH changing much.
Sunny Jim said:
frankly, as a fan, i was hm ashamed. There was something wrong with this goal
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I didn't celebrate personally. I was happy for Mount and to score but even if we won it wouldn't have changed the fact this manager has to leave.
 
A lot of our injuries have been our own making due to the ineffective pressing in our system and players not knowing what they are doing.

We are also far too reliant on our starting 11 and have not been able to shut out games early allowing for rotation of key players after 60-70 mins.
 
crossy1686 said:
Mate, you’re literally wasting your time. If people can’t see it at this point they will never see it. Even after he gets sacked they’ll be saying he should have been given more time. They’ve subscribed to the cult of personality, and they of the opinion the players need to be dragged kicking and screaming into success because they don’t want to achieve.
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The obsession with the manager is genuinely perverse.

EtH has 0 ties to the club. Didn’t play for or support us, he was interviewed for the Spurs job a year earlier.

If he leaves he won’t quit football & pine for Manchester United. He’ll take his compensation & move on to manage elsewhere in time.

I thought it was stupid but can sort of understand how someone like Solskjaer tugged at the heart strings but honestly there is nothing about EtH that captivates. His football is shite & he’s ‘happy’ to concede 30 shots in a game.

You don’t have to have ties to a club btw. Fergie didn’t & Klopp doesn’t but they earns the trust/allegiance over time whereas some of our fans spend more time defending the manager of that time then being concerned with the club itself.
 
Maluco said:
Were you not calling people 12 year olds for having perfectly valid points about how badly he was setting up the team 6 months ago?
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I've been heated for sure, 6 months ago I felt the criticism was certainly premature. Unsure about outright calling people 12year olds, it was a long time ago.

Im not going to argue against any criticism now, of course.
 
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AFC NimbleThumb said:
The obsession with the manager is genuinely perverse.

EtH has 0 ties to the club. Didn’t play for or support us, he was interviewed for the Spurs job a year earlier.

If he leaves he won’t quit football & pine for Manchester United. He’ll take his compensation & move on to manage elsewhere in time.

I thought it was stupid but can sort of understand how someone like Solskjaer tugged at the heart strings but honestly there is nothing about EtH that captivates. His football is shite & he’s ‘happy’ to concede 30 shots in a game.
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It’s his charisma and endearing personality.
 
I can’t wait to see the back of him. He’s had nearly two years and I see no signs of a foundation. Another awful appointment sadly.
 
There's no way the players can enjoy playing in that system either.

Rashford and Garnacho are always isolated in 1v2/1v3 and expected to create out of nothing. The midfield are always stranded after pressing high and getting played past, the full backs are knackering themselves with the Sisyphean task of plugging all the holes everywhere. The centrebacks are always exposed. Hojlund barely gets a kick of the ball against organised defences and certainly no crosses to attack.

High intensity football only works if the system works. Otherwise it just demotivates and fatigues the players and you get nothing but 30 shots conceded every game and dozens of muscle injuries.
 
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Shark said:
My faith in ETH is so low, that even after a monumental victory against the bin dippers, I'm half expecting us to go to Brentford and struggle.
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I knew it. He's one of the most predictably shite managers in the league.
 
I honestly dont understand why Sir Jim is dragging this out instead of just getting rid of this clown, we are 6th while playing awful Football with no chance of finishing any higher.

Surely Sir Jim cant be happy to see the club he has invested £1.3bn in playing such embarrasing Football.
 
A lot of comments during the week about sticking with ETH over Southgate etc has quickly turned, if ETH secretly wants out and was alarmed at the comments, it's job done last night at reversing those. We'd expect those type of stats against City or Pool, not Brentford with 17 defeats and 1 point in 18.
 
tenpoless said:
Whats worrying is outside of Van Gaal who is a stubborn nutter, all our managers post Moyes all resorted to playing either gungho or unstructured football and gave up their ideals. Erik being the latest. If anyone remembers it kinda happened with Rangnick too, for all his philosophy talks we resorted to playing shit football near the end for result and I have no doubt had he continued itd end up similarly like what we are seeing.

Something is wrong and that needs to be addressed regardless if Erik stays as the manager or not. No manager can thrive like this.
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Yeah it was pretty obvious after 4 games he was like 'i can't implement my style here'. People blamed Ronaldo but it wasn't just him, although he was an obvious issue. I remember Ronaldo trying to press from the front in one of those early games and then getting angry because the wingers weren't doing it when the ball went out wide. Total lack of coordination and effort.
 
TsuWave said:
United has one of the most patient fanbases of any supposed “big club”. In fact, I don’t think there’s any other fanbase as committed to “back the manager” as United’s. I have a theory it’s partially because Ferguson was here so long, and partially because many want to hold on to a childish notion that we’re not like other clubs (the “United way” thing is adjacent to this). A manager doesn’t survive a 7-0 mauling by their biggest rivals anywhere else (top clubs). Here, it was largely “shrugged off”and people just moved on.

One could argue that all the bad managerial appointments we made stayed here long after it was clear it wasn’t going to happen, and a factor in that is how reluctant United fans are to put pressure on the club to change direction/cut ties with managers.

For reference (and yes I’ll quote this again):


We’ve been so shite for so long that smash-n-grab wins are reason for people to come to this thread and declare a guy that has us 29 league games in with a goal difference of 0 should be afforded another season - just to see if it “clicks” - now that we have a “structure”. It’s insane.

Most people here would have been happy with evidence of progression in our football. To say this fanbase doesn’t give managers time/is expecting them to compete right away isn’t even being disingenuous - it's an outright lie.
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Spot on.
 
RedRocket9908 said:
I honestly dont understand why Sir Jim is dragging this out instead of just getting rid of this clown, we are 6th while playing awful Football with no chance of finishing any higher.

Surely Sir Jim cant be happy to see the club he has invested £1.3bn in playing such embarrasing Football.
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He probably is genuinely waiting on the rest of the executives to be put in place, and there's likely a CL clause in Eric's contract which would lessen the burden.

Sadly, there's no benefit of sacking him now. We aren't in threat of relegation, so might as well suffer through.
 
Shark said:
I knew it. He's one of the most predictably shite managers in the league.
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You're acting like this is something new for utd. Remember that amazing win at City followed by a loss to West Brom at home the following week under Jose?

Inconsistency is in the DNA of the club.
 
Rauður Djöfull said:
Has to go now
I've lost all faith in him
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This isn't aimed you, but was roasted for still wanting him out despite winning our previous match in dramatic fashion. Every single big club sacks underperforming managers. In fact most do. He's taken us backwards in shambolic fashion after spending 400 mil on his targets.
 
redshaw said:
A lot of comments during the week about sticking with ETH over Southgate etc has quickly turned, if ETH secretly wants out and was alarmed at the comments, it's job done last night at reversing those. We'd expect those type of stats against City or Pool, not Brentford with 17 defeats and 1 point in 18.
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Yesterday could've been his Watford. He was very lucky our d + onana held up, because one goal and we'd crumble, and could've gotten ugly
 
pcaming said:
He probably is genuinely waiting on the rest of the executives to be put in place, and there's likely a CL clause in Eric's contract which would lessen the burden.

Sadly, there's no benefit of sacking him now. We aren't in threat of relegation, so might as well suffer through.
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If we sack him now we still have a chance of winning the FA Cup, if we keep him weve probably got no chance.
 
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