Me included mate, I fell to my knees on the train when I read it.This will have certain posters frotting at the mouth
Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24
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EtH is just trying to cover his ass by claiming he sees things the same way. INEOS giys will see through that and sack him right away.This will have certain posters frotting at the mouth
Am I doing this right?
It's all well and good Ineos talking strategy with him but if we're hovering above the relegation zone by May which is becoming an increasing possibility then I don't see how he can continue as manager. Our form needs to drastically improve for us to have something to cling on to.
By all accounts we've already sounded out Potter. If results don't turn he'll be gone, there's no question in my mind. For once we have an actual contingency in-place w/o panic signing after a drubbing.
Interim to the interim my ass. We've been run by children until now.
EtH is just trying to cover his ass by claiming he sees things the same way. INEOS giys will see through that and sack him right away.
Am I doing this right?
spot on mate!All meetings are very positive.
When they sack him, they will also have a very positive meeting where they agreed to part ways.
When they sack him, they will also have a very positive meeting where they agreed to part ways.
In breaking news ETH compliments new owners and said talks went well. I’m well and truly shocked he’s said these words.
Yeah I've grown tired arguing this same point to everyone bemoaning injuries. This isn't a Spurs situation where we are playing good stuff but occasionally getting battered because we have 0 fit CB's. We are relegation level going forward... with all of the players that would be expected to contribute to the attack being available for the majority of the season bar Shaw. No, Lisandro will not magically have us play brilliant stuff between the lines just because he gets healthy.
Absolutely. People wonder why we repeat the same cycle of shit when we continuously let the same players "have a fresh start" under a new manager.
I think where Chelsea went a bit wayward is that they didn't buy particularly well for all of the money they spent, and they probably went TOO young without any established veterans that can help lead a dressing room besides Silva who is old enough to be some of their father's. But essentially they brought in a ton of players within 1 or 2 windows who were all still developing and in need of minutes, and they couldn't possibly play them all equally.
He hasn't misjudged the qualities needed, he's previously referenced the mistake Pep made by under estimating the power and speed of the Premier League and then goes on to make the same mistakes. He's shit. A better support structure doesn't stop his baffling in game decision making.
Really confirms what most reasonably balanced fans have been saying for years , the issues are well beyond our managers who are effectively setup to fail.
It’s quite damning about how the club is run , no doubt some of the more emotionally animated folk will only see it as some sort of defence of ETH and have a “yeh but” response.
My money is on “you can think the club is poorly run and ETH is not good enough”. You can of course think that and you may he right. But we can’t reasonably appraise somebody in their job when there is so much chaos and issues around them that simply isn’t their fault or something they can control.
There is no other top club with as many dramas/issues as United. The pressures and expectations of United are comparable with the best clubs in the world and yet our consistent results/performances are probably closer to mid table level clubs than actually challanging for the top trophies.
The club isn’t setup to succeed , doesn’t have the best in class to help our managers or players and doesn’t even have a stadium we can be proud of, everything about United looks like a club that throws a new coat of paint on a club that’s well past its glory days. And some of you fans haven’t caught up yet , still clinging to this idea that we will find an unreal manager whose expertise is working in a dysfunctional club. Something Klopp and Pep don’t have to do.
Regardless of the set up I'd expect a manager that we pay millions a year to be a far better judge of a player than he has shown. Random Caf members could have picked better players for the PL.
Feel like his Antony purchase is the big failure. I was alright with Casemiro, Eriksen, Malacia, Licha and even Hojlund after learning the higher ups never gave reasonable alternatives.
The loans were dumpster dives because our DoF can't negotiate deals to save his life, which fecked up FFP.
"Erik totally misjudged the qualities needed to play in the Premier League."
This is why we were 4th in the CL group with Copenhagen and Galatasaray. He probably misjudged the Danish and the Turkish leagues too. Absolute nonsense.
ETH kept us relatively competitive when adopted a more conservative approach after the first two trashings vs Brighton and Brentford, and that defensive organization and intensity lasted around 6-7 months with players like Martinez, Casemiro and Rashford carrying the team and masking plenty of flaws around.
I think at some point ETH started opening the floodgates and introduced some new concepts here and there, added to the players being unable to mantain that physical and mental intensity leading to a remarkable drop in performances since March or so. I understand ETH trying to evolve from that conservative approach where we had for periods the deepest defensive line in the whole league, as he wasn't brought for that and we all aimed (manager included) for a more expansive game.
We can say now without worries that he absolutely failed at building something, not necessarily similar to Ajax but anything at all. We've saw his intentions, the tactical tweaks, the aims behind the signing of Mason Mount. We've seen him recovering players he tried to bin in the summer and suddenly went from 0 to 100 (Scott).
This is a manager who's simply incapable of giving us any sort of shape. He hasn't been able to sell his book to the players, and you can know why when you hear the guy for 5 minutes. This is a manager with amazing tactical flaws, getting outsmarted on a weekly basis by any Joe in the league and incapable of reacting properly in games.
This is a manager without any common sense. For a team lacking goals his two reinforcements have been Antony (who barely produced in a friends league) and a 20 years old from his same football agency who did nothing to suggest he could lead our attack. This is not a case of a manager "not finding the right players for the league" but someone who simply doesn't know what he's doing, at all. A manager who, despite the lack of personnel (injuries) still plays suicidal football leaving us completely open. And so on and so on.
I can sympathize with managers working under a poor structure when they hit the 'invisible wall' that separates us from City and Liverpool. Mourinho was there at some point and Ole was there at some point. Both lasted years in this circus of a club and with more or less grace they kept the house in order for some time. ETH gave us 6-7 months of solidness and decentish results and the rest has been a complete garbage.
I understand the claims against the board when someone isn't successful and doesn't fight for the league. When we are 8th, with the worst attack in the league, 3 points away from 11th, going for historical records in terms of loses (just a matter of time now), 4th in the CL, etc, etc. you can't tell me this is on the board.
ETH is not a case of a good manager working for a bad structure, it's a poor manager with a bad structure. This is why after 18 months and 400 M spent we're in unprecedented territory in terms of results and breaking negative records every week, with the worst performances we've seen in the last decade.
This is why we were 4th in the CL group with Copenhagen and Galatasaray. He probably misjudged the Danish and the Turkish leagues too. Absolute nonsense.
ETH kept us relatively competitive when adopted a more conservative approach after the first two trashings vs Brighton and Brentford, and that defensive organization and intensity lasted around 6-7 months with players like Martinez, Casemiro and Rashford carrying the team and masking plenty of flaws around.
I think at some point ETH started opening the floodgates and introduced some new concepts here and there, added to the players being unable to mantain that physical and mental intensity leading to a remarkable drop in performances since March or so. I understand ETH trying to evolve from that conservative approach where we had for periods the deepest defensive line in the whole league, as he wasn't brought for that and we all aimed (manager included) for a more expansive game.
We can say now without worries that he absolutely failed at building something, not necessarily similar to Ajax but anything at all. We've saw his intentions, the tactical tweaks, the aims behind the signing of Mason Mount. We've seen him recovering players he tried to bin in the summer and suddenly went from 0 to 100 (Scott).
This is a manager who's simply incapable of giving us any sort of shape. He hasn't been able to sell his book to the players, and you can know why when you hear the guy for 5 minutes. This is a manager with amazing tactical flaws, getting outsmarted on a weekly basis by any Joe in the league and incapable of reacting properly in games.
This is a manager without any common sense. For a team lacking goals his two reinforcements have been Antony (who barely produced in a friends league) and a 20 years old from his same football agency who did nothing to suggest he could lead our attack. This is not a case of a manager "not finding the right players for the league" but someone who simply doesn't know what he's doing, at all. A manager who, despite the lack of personnel (injuries) still plays suicidal football leaving us completely open. And so on and so on.
I can sympathize with managers working under a poor structure when they hit the 'invisible wall' that separates us from City and Liverpool. Mourinho was there at some point and Ole was there at some point. Both lasted years in this circus of a club and with more or less grace they kept the house in order for some time. ETH gave us 6-7 months of solidness and decentish results and the rest has been a complete garbage.
I understand the claims against the board when someone isn't successful and doesn't fight for the league. When we are 8th, with the worst attack in the league, 3 points away from 11th, going for historical records in terms of loses (just a matter of time now), 4th in the CL, etc, etc. you can't tell me this is on the board.
ETH is not a case of a good manager working for a bad structure, it's a poor manager with a bad structure. This is why after 18 months and 400 M spent we're in unprecedented territory in terms of results and breaking negative records every week, with the worst performances we've seen in the last decade.
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That line is to do with transfer market business, not with his coaching. In fact the full snip suggests he is a good coach.
He is not good coach.
We reasonably can, though. You're just making excuses for another manager who's showing to be not good enough. The entire club is set up to fail so we can't asses the quality of the likes of Antony, because he could be thriving in another structure, right? Well, not really. Far more likely than not he just isn't good enough. Same with ETH. Make plans to get rid and move on, that's what a top club would do.
I don't understand this "the issues are well beyond our managers" talk. Pretty much everybody knows that. Nobody thinks hiring a manager alone will solve everything. But we do need a competent manager either way.
You can't just lay the blame on the fees totally on Murtough. Murtough negotiated poorly sure, but Erik has a veto over all transfers. He knew the Casemiro and Antony deals were going to screw us over in terms of FFP yet he pressed on. After the shock defeats against Brentford and Brighton he was fully focused on surviving the next few months and not on long-term success, which is why he didn't gamble on cheaper, less recognizable signings.
I don't think he knew they would mess us up on FFP. We had sponsorship renewal issues which was also a factor. And he wasn't properly told what his budget was in just the summer that passed.
The excuses for this guy just never end. Kinda incredible, really.
Some people will find excuses for anyone. Even for Rangnick... the guy failed completely as a manager here, but some people were 100% sure that he would be great in some other position that he never held in England! Why? Because 20 years ago he did well in a small club in Germany! And because he told the press that we need a new squad.
The same with ETH. He is mediocre to bad at man-management, at in-game management, at everything, even at the basic level of understanding how capable or incapable his own players are, like Antony and Onana... But some people will keep insisting that with the proper structure he would be a great manager.
Well, yeah, with the proper structure that will prevent me of making any mistakes, I will also be a great manager for Man Utd! I just need someone to find world class players for me, another one to decide how to play, another one to do the man-management and motivate the players ... and I will lead us to the treble! Hire me! I will be a world class manager, if you only give me the proper structure!
The excuses you come up with for some players, and yet you have these sorts of comments about the manager
Exactly and not every single signing has been poor. Mittens headline lacks any form of critical assessment, he said Pep has Tixi but Tixi is not the outlier, Pep is. He's the best manager in Europe and Erik has no relativity to that. If structure is everything then why have managers had successive individual seasons at the club of which Erik also experienced last year. The Glazers didn't get credit for finishing third last season with a domestic cup the manager did. Now it goes south the Glazers are at fault? That's called fallacious reasoning. Both seasons have shown the same thing and that's managerial competence.
It has not been plain sailing for us since Fergie retired. We have secured just five top-four finishes in that time, while failing to challenge for the Premier League title.
2013-14 (7th)
2014-15 (4th)
2015-16 (5th)
2016-17 (6th)
2017-18 (2nd)
2018-19 (6th)
2019-20 (3rd)
2020-21 (2nd)
2021-22 (6th)
2022-23 (3rd)
Players recruitment and managerial appointments have been massive problems at Old Trafford. Sacking ETH after 2 seasons gonna be the worst decisions made by Manchester United. People who want another manager out after seeing countless managers fail really need to take a look at what the real problem is.
2013-14 (7th)
2014-15 (4th)
2015-16 (5th)
2016-17 (6th)
2017-18 (2nd)
2018-19 (6th)
2019-20 (3rd)
2020-21 (2nd)
2021-22 (6th)
2022-23 (3rd)
Players recruitment and managerial appointments have been massive problems at Old Trafford. Sacking ETH after 2 seasons gonna be the worst decisions made by Manchester United. People who want another manager out after seeing countless managers fail really need to take a look at what the real problem is.
What strategic review, the one INEOS are undertaking?
This is the way
The setup doesn’t stop our strikers putting the ball in the back of the net when they have the opportunity.
The set up of the club can only be used as an excuse for so long - they have thrown 1B at the team in the last 6 years (yes, not their own money). ETH has not been a good coach for us in any way, shape or form. Needs to go regardless of the structure.
Sacking which previous manager was "the worst decision" before that one then? They were all either flat out bad appointments or not good enough, like ETH. We have not sacked "countless managers", it's average for the league. Plenty of clubs who have sacked more and won way more in the same period. If anything we wait too long before reacting, like with players.
It's amazing that of all fanbases you'd expect ours to appreciate what difference a good manager can make but nope. Somehow the influence of a manager is supposedly so low now that it's impossible to judge him while he's under "poor structure". As if any of us can actually judge the structure in any shape or form.
Great post.
The Glazers strategic review of looking for investment.
He's actually doing a great job if you overlook our league position, loss of confidence in certain players, and the money he's spent on poor transfers.
Before the club structure is fixed, there is no point in replacing him.
Whilst we are setup to fail, a better manager will also be called fraud, worst manager we had etc.
We shouldn't be looking for temporary fix, but to find long term solution. This includes a well run football club, which we aren't.
Whilst we are setup to fail, a better manager will also be called fraud, worst manager we had etc.
We shouldn't be looking for temporary fix, but to find long term solution. This includes a well run football club, which we aren't.
"There's no point in putting out the fire until we figure out why it came about in the first place and aim to fix that" is a hilariously backwards POV. And stop saying we need a "long term" solution, almost no manager in the world stays at a club more than 4 years these days.
It seems that structure will be in place at some point soon. Whether they can start consulting with these people on the matters and make changes now so everything is in place, is anybodies guess. It would be a proactive way of going about it, instead of letting the season drop to bits whilst we wait.
I don't expect much good from the rest of the season, but I don't think there is any manager who will come and do any differently until summer.
Won't say no to McKenna anyway, with him you'll know there is a future.
ETH's stubbornness is his downfall.
Still - let's see what happens with the mythical return of injured players.
No matter what we think, or how calmly he speaks, Erik is against the wall and nothing short of huge winning run will save him.
Won't say no to McKenna anyway, with him you'll know there is a future.
ETH's stubbornness is his downfall.
Still - let's see what happens with the mythical return of injured players.
No matter what we think, or how calmly he speaks, Erik is against the wall and nothing short of huge winning run will save him.
I guess he’ll get till the summer whatever happens so. Walk of shame for the players in the next few months. I think under normal circumstances he’d be under the bus by now and we’d be back to square one. You have to feel these players will have to really up the ante as most will hopefully be playing for their future in our new model.
Will become Graham Potty
A sack of cash deals positivity 1+d20
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