Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

Status
Not open for further replies.
TsuWave said:
Yes, Ten Hag is not able to coach the players he found here nor the players he brought in, but somehow the DoF will magically find the players he can coach and fix his formation as team selections, the fact he can’t arrange a cohesive defensive shape, his substitutions and in-game management. Genius :wenger:

Besides, at no point in my posts did I argue what you need “more” or “before”. That’s not even taking in consideration that managerial change can be actioned much sooner and again fix some of our existing problems. Again, structural and managerial change aren’t mutually exclusive and evidently - both are needed at United.



Much like you previous post you’re arguing strawmen. Read above.
Click to expand...
So according to you today we should have played for a draw?
No sense at all.
 
TsuWave said:
You’re telling me to learn how to read when your reading comprehension got your arguing down a point that wasn’t being contested. Odd.

I’ve already said structural and managerial change aren’t mutually exclusive. Managerial change can be actioned right away without hasty long-term commitment. Salvaging something out of this season will enable long-term change by alleviating financial pressures and restrictions the club is dealing with - but just as important - Ten Hag is awful.
Click to expand...
Already addressed that point and said I disagree. But carry on, we don’t need to make short term decisions there is zero need.

We did it with Ole and we did it with Rangnick. Its not necessary and actually distracts way from fixing things we need to fix (as we have seen because in both cases we were promised DOF and structural changes etc and in both cases it did not happen).
 
christinaa said:
So according to you today we should have played for a draw?
No sense at all.
Click to expand...

:confused: what are you talking about and where did I say we should have played for a draw? What?

You: we shouldn’t sack the manager because we’ve done it before

Me: Yeah, we also shouldn’t buy players ever again following that reasoning

You: something something DoF

Me: A DoF won’t suddenly fix this manager’s list of shortcomings. - lists some of those -

You: so according to you we should have played for a draw

Me: what. the. feck :confused:
 
He's so lucky this club is a pure circus. Everywhere else, especially at clubs with ambition, he'd be a goner
 
Cassidy said:
Already addressed that point and said I disagree. But carry on, we don’t need to make short term decisions there is zero need.

We did it with Ole and we did it with Rangnick. Its not necessary and actually distracts way from fixing things we need to fix (as we have seen because in both cases we were promised DOF and structural changes etc and in both cases it did not happen).
Click to expand...
Bringing in Ole temporarily improved the situation. We went on to finish 2nd. If we applied your logic back then we'd have stuck with Jose, finished midtable, alienated most of the players, missed out on CL, been poorer financially, and overall been in a worse position as a club. All because you have this misguided belief that there's no benefit to removing a tragically poor manager that is damaging the team, until everything else at the club gets completely overhauled first
 
Cassidy said:
Already addressed that point and said I disagree. But carry on, we don’t need to make short term decisions there is zero need.

We did it with Ole and we did it with Rangnick. Its not necessary and actually distracts way from fixing things we need to fix (as we have seen because in both cases we were promised DOF and structural changes etc and in both cases it did not happen).
Click to expand...
Its crazy how we have clear samples of how this approach is not the way to go, and people still suggest it
 
Cassidy said:
Its quite obviously does not equate to creating more. Unless you have creative players in there. And its the only thing that has in part worked this season. Its not like its what we started with.

In any case I think we need Casemiro and Eriksen back in the 11
Click to expand...

Having them in the team will not fix any of the issues we are facing. The system and structure are all wrong, no player is fixing this. Not even prime Messi
 
TsuWave said:
:confused: what are you talking about and where did I say we should have played for a draw? What?

You: we shouldn’t sack the manager because we’ve done it before

Me: Yeah, we also shouldn’t buy players ever again following that reasoning

You: something something DoF

Me: A DoF won’t suddenly fix this manager’s list of shortcomings. - lists some of those -

You: so according to you we should have played for a draw

Me: what. the. feck :confused:
Click to expand...
You don't know anything about tactics and you're writing gibberish
 
VP89 said:
Its crazy how we have clear samples of how this approach is not the way to go, and people still suggest it
Click to expand...

Because it is comical - if not outright idiotic - sticking with a incompetent and underperforming manager because “we’ve tried changing managers before” :wenger:
 
Ayush_reddevil said:
Watch this game going on right now and look at the intensity & then ask yourself that even with a fully fit squad can we match this intensity and the answer is no chance.
Click to expand...
Of course we could, what we see is the prefered style of the manager. Sloooow things down, always take the safe option, keep possession first and foremost. We tried nigh on the very same thing under king Louie and it was awful. Better then now but still awful. Why didn`t the people in charge here learn their lesson then?
 
Rista said:
So what's the suggestion, don't sack him and let us sink even lower? Even in the scenario where you change the ownership and the club from the ground up, you replace him because he's clearly out of his depth.
Click to expand...
People say that stuff like we’ve been shitter each time we’ve sacked a manager and have conveniently forgotten that we’ve won trophies every time a new manager has come in.
 
TsuWave said:
Because it is comical - if not outright idiotic - sticking with a incompetent and underperforming manager because “we’ve tried changing managers before” :wenger:
Click to expand...
No, that's not why. Objectively it can be argued that any manager would fail in the current structure under the current DoF anyway. I don't think any manager gets a fair shake.
 
christinaa said:
You don't know anything about tactics and you're writing gibberish
Click to expand...

Says the person that presented “we sacked managers before” as justification for their stance, and got “we should play for a draw” out of a list of Ten Hag shortcomings. Cool
 
AndySmith1990 said:
Bringing in Ole temporarily improved the situation. We went on to finish 2nd. If we applied your logic back then we'd have stuck with Jose, finished midtable, alienated most of the players, missed out on CL, been poorer financially, and overall been in a worse position as a club. All because you have this misguided belief that there's no benefit to removing a tragically poor manager that is damaging the team, until everything else at the club gets completely overhauled first
Click to expand...
We then hired Ole instead of hiring a DOF like the club promised. Short term thinking worked out well didn’t it
 
PlayerOne said:
Having them in the team will not fix any of the issues we are facing. The system and structure are all wrong, no player is fixing this. Not even prime Messi
Click to expand...
Don’t agree but we move on
 
I think with the change in structure, ETH will magically develop the ability to change the game using subs. He will suddenly get the idea that there's a concept of midfield.

With the change in structure, there wont be wide open gaps between our frontline and the one whatever midfielder we play.

With the change in structure, we will be able to string 3-4 passes together and we will be able to generate atleast one good sequence of play during a game.

Can't wait for the INEOS takeover!
 
TsuWave said:
Says the person that presented “we sacked managers before” as justification for their stance, and got “we should play for a draw” out of a list of Ten Hag shortcomings. Cool
Click to expand...
:lol:
 
VP89 said:
No, that's not why. Objectively it can be argued that any manager would fail in the current structure under the current DoF anyway. I don't think any manager gets a fair shake.
Click to expand...

This is not correct - we’ve seen managers perform better under this same structure. So that kills that.
 
I absolutely agree that so much has to change at the club. But, I'm also at the point where I feel ETH just has to go ASAP.
 
ayushreddevil9 said:
I think with the change in structure, ETH will magically develop the ability to change the game using subs. He will suddenly get the idea that there's a concept of midfield.

With the change in structure, there wont be wide open gaps between our frontline and the one whatever midfielder we play.

With the change in structure, we will be able to string 3-4 passes together and we will be able to generate atleast one good sequence of play during a game.

Can't wait for the INEOS takeover!
Click to expand...

Lowest form of wit they say..
 
The manager fields teams like he is trying to brute force his partner’s iPhone passcode, and refuses to go back and ensure he checked all the obvious guesses:

 
Borys said:
He has been given exceptional amount of leeway to do whatever he wants, could've experimented a bit to find a working formula, instead he saw shit performances week in week out and STILL went for short term solutions (like McTominay as second striker). As a result, the team has made NO PROGRESS since the beginning of the season.

My biggest criticism at this point is he doesn't even try. Almost seems like he already made his decision on how he wants to play and which players he wants to use, and is surfing on "injuries" excuse all season without making anything to overcome actual issues.
Click to expand...

That's how I see it and I can't find anything to excuse or explain it. There is no level in Football where that type of attitude works.
 
McGrathsipan said:
What players?

Other than Martinez that may marginally improve the defence its a bit of a mysterious statement. We can't score. We've no players to score and it's not a new thing
Click to expand...
It was overplayed a bit earlier in the season by some fans when Martinez and Shaw were out but Martinez might help in the build up phase and Mount, well, he's another option at least, though i'm not optimistic. Something has to change with that attack and quickly; the more options he has the better. Clutching at straws possibly but i'm struggling to see ways that EtH gets out of this and this seems his best option to get everyone fit and available and just string some results together.

Also, i've never been entirely convinced that Casemiro is finished, and I attribute his performances as being poor because he's been tasked to cover an entire midfield by himself. I'd like to see him back and playing alongside Mainoo and we'll see what happens I guess.

On paper our best team is nowhere near title winning quality but it's not 8th place either and should perform better:

Onana
Dalot Varane Martinez Shaw
Casemiro Mainoo Bruno
Mount Hojlund Rashford​

Again, it's clutching at straws a bit but i'm struggling to see what else he can do with no signings in January.
 
Borys said:
He has been given exceptional amount of leeway to do whatever he wants, could've experimented a bit to find a working formula, instead he saw shit performances week in week out and STILL went for short term solutions (like McTominay as second striker). As a result, the team has made NO PROGRESS since the beginning of the season.

My biggest criticism at this point is he doesn't even try. Almost seems like he already made his decision on how he wants to play and which players he wants to use, and is surfing on "injuries" excuse all season without making anything to overcome actual issues.
Click to expand...
Yup. We've seen an absolutely batshit level of bad management from him. It's been nothing but bullshit excuses and failure. The only reason he is in a job is because we are caught up in this never ending takeover. Desperately hope sacking Ten Hag is one of the first things that Ratcliffe does, because he has been atrocious as a manager.
 
TMDaines said:
The manager fields teams like he is trying to brute force his partner’s iPhone passcode, and refuses to go back and ensure he checked all the obvious guesses:

Click to expand...

He’s too stubborn to adapt his game. He just wants more of the same but better, and then blames the players for not being better when we need prime Barca level players to do what he wants. What he doesn’t realise is his system doesn’t work outside of leagues that give you time on the ball to take multiple touches before passing.
 
crossy1686 said:
He’s too stubborn to adapt his game. He just wants more of the same but better, and then blames the players for not being better when we need prime Barca level players to do what he wants. What he doesn’t realise is his system doesn’t work outside of leagues that give you time on the ball to take multiple touches before passing.
Click to expand...
I’d love to hear your take on what our current system is supposed to be, because we just start with one obviously flawed front line and pivot to increasingly worse ones.
 
ayushreddevil9 said:
No.

His use of McTominay shows that the plans for the season are dead and we are in survival mode. There's nothing progressive about a lineup with him being there.
Click to expand...

Why can't anyone talk about football without resorting to wild hyperbole? This place has become a nursery.
 
The Hilton said:
Why can't anyone talk about football without resorting to wild hyperbole? This place has become a nursery.
Click to expand...
It's not really a hyperbole. Its based on 5 years of worthless performances.

And you can tell me whats wrong with my post. McTominay was transfer listed but we couldn't find a buyer. How can he be a part of the plans if he was allowed to go?
 
TMDaines said:
I’d love to hear your take on what our current system is supposed to be, because we just start with one obviously flawed front line and pivot to increasingly worse ones.
Click to expand...
That’s the thing, he’s slowly realising his system doesn’t work so he’s trying to adapt it so it changes week to week for the worse because he doesn’t know anything else. All this while he waits for everyone to get fit again and hopes they can repeat last season.
 
Does anyone think we'll see Mainoo paired with Eriksen, now that he's fit, or will we be forced to endure 'sometimes pops up with a goal but generally does feck all' McT for the foreseable?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.