Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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I’m just telling you that consistently beating them and beating them well does not happen in this league. You can if and but all you want with crying about the manager since wins doesn’t suit your argument but it is what it is. I just watched Forest beat Villa a week after this forum had a thread of will Villa finish above us?! Maybe go back to watch highlights of the early 2000 EPL if you want that, that’s not Ten Hag or any top manager in the EPL fault.
Wait until Brentford does Liverpool and holds them to a scrappy draw / really narrow Liverpool win tomorrow but you won’t be anywhere to be seen because it’s yet another example against your argument.

Consistently being shit against relegation fodders and barely getting a win via one goal doesn't happen so often for big teams in the league as well. These aren't even midtable sides. These are the worst teams in the league. United is supposed to defeat them 9 times out of 10. Get over it.

Wait until Brentford does Liverpool and holds them to a scrappy draw / really narrow Liverpool win tomorrow but you won’t be anywhere to be seen because it’s yet another example against your argument.

What example ? As I said it's fine to have a one off game against a bad opposition from time to time or getting a bad result in a game you're supposed to win. It happens. What doesn't happen is being shit consistently against these teams and winning because these teams are worse than you not because you actually played well. One time is fine, every time means you're terrible. It's not a surprise once we meet any semi decent team we get thrashed when we're playing like this against relegation fodders.

all you want with crying about the manager since wins doesn’t suit your argument but it is what it is.

There's nothing to be content about. The only thing I'm feeling is a relief we managed to get the needed points, not any sense of content with the team's form or any good signs for the future. It's what I saw against Fulham, Brentford, Burnley and Nottingam Forest, before getting thrashed immediately after by the first good team we faced. There's no reason to act like we turned a corner when that's how this season has been going.

And again, these are relegation fodders, not even midtable sides.
 
I see you're persistent on turning it personal, even though I don't care about you or your posts. Weird obsession. Imagine being obsessed by someone you don't even know what his name is on internet forum.
Buddy, I don't care about you or who you are. What I care about is your incessant moaning about every single thing at United that pollutes these threads.

I log on here every day to interact with my fellow reds, not to listen to negative nancies drone on and on about how bad and miserable we are.

You don't want me to single you out? Turn down your negativity because it's off the charts.

There's plenty of other posters here who want ETH gone, but as you've noticed only you get singled out since your eclipse every single one of them
 
yeah, definitely. At least the attacking dullness was matched by solidity in defence. This defence is so unpredictable. I hate to keep blathering on about it but the 7-0 shouldn't ever happen, it points to something fundamental that's gone wrong and was masked by the positives.
The fundamental issue are too many of these players have been on the end of too many big losses, takes its toll.

We need to ship people on pronto.
 
Fulham, Sheffield, Luton, Burnley and Nottingham occupy the spots between 15th to 20th. 3 of these will definitely get relegated this year yet you're trying to convince us it's a great job we scrapped wins by one goal against all of them.

Having a one off difficult game against a bad opposition is different from continuously barely managing to win playing relegation fodders every week. It's why we end up getting exposed playing any semi decent team.

I have no issue with your delusional nonsense but at least don't force it on us. Be relieved we get the points tonight but don't act like what we did in such run was extraordinary. This is Manchester freaking United.
It’s the brilliant results against them if we can accept our current level is mid-table team. That’s cross verified by the facts we consistently lose to Galatasaray and Copenhagen.
Of course, I know what you mean. This team should not be a mid-table level to begin with.
 
I’m just telling you that consistently beating them and beating them well does not happen in this league. You can if and but all you want with crying about the manager since wins doesn’t suit your argument but it is what it is. I just watched Forest beat Villa a week after this forum had a thread of will Villa finish above us?! Maybe go back to watch highlights of the early 2000 EPL if you want that, that’s not Ten Hag or any top manager in the EPL fault.
Wait until Brentford does Liverpool and holds them to a scrappy draw / really narrow Liverpool win tomorrow but you won’t be anywhere to be seen because it’s yet another example against your argument but you’ll be straight on here in a fortnight pissing and moaning when it’s Everton 0 - 1 Utd (Reguillon 90)
Man we're struggling against everyone, everyone! We haven't had a decent game this season, and you think that's normal?
 
That's such a crazy number, I don't know whether to be relieved and amazed or horrified that things could easily get even worse yet.
Imagine the outrage if we somehow manage to win the league with negative goal difference.
 
Buddy, I don't care about you or who you are. What I care about is your incessant moaning about every single thing at United that pollutes these threads.

I log on here every day to interact with my fellow reds, not to listen to negative nancies drone on and on about how bad and miserable we are.

You don't want me to single you out? Turn down your negativity because it's off the charts.

There's plenty of other posters here who want ETH gone, but as you've noticed only you get singled out since your eclipse every single one of them

You don't care yet you shoehorned yourself into a discussion that doesn't involve you just to attack me personally. That's the definition of obsession.

There's an ignore option which will let you not read my negative posts that hurt your precious feelings but you won't put me on your ignore list because as I said, you're obsessed with someone you don't even know what his name is.

There's plenty of other posters here who want ETH gone, but as you've noticed only you get singled out since your eclipse every single one of them

I don't care. This forum has a long history of bullying posters with the unpopular opinion. I was bullied during the Ole's reign when I said he's a terrible coach and people were religiously defending him and I was proven right at the end anyway. I won't come back and bring old posts and tell people they were wrong and I was right, because I totally and completely don't care.
 
So Eric, we managed to score 13 goals in 12 games. Worst out of the top 11. Only 7 teams have less while 12 teams have more, much more. Double than we do. Where should that lead?
 
Being six points off Arsenal with less than a third of the season played isn't good. You'd be 19 points adrift by the end of the season if you carry on like that.
Exactly.

Just like Spurs form before these 2 latest result doesn't mean as much in a long run, our current grinding out result against likely long term bottom half teams business is unlikely sustainable against teams higher in the table (our problem last season under ETH too, which has well continued now). The way we currently play is not as good as our best form last season, so it's not time to carry away with current results. 6 point gap with Arsenal now likely become wider than narrower given Arsenal had displayed a higher ceiling than they're showing right now, more than even our best form, which we're struggling to replicate, let alone surpass that level (Overreliant on individual brilliance from Rashford and Bruno. Expecting Rashford to hit the same form as last season now is a tall order).
 
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McErik is the most clearly flawed pivot we could conceivably put out yet he insists on playing it while leaving out a guy he spent 55 million on.

He needs to find a way of giving Mainoo minutes and obviously starting Mount.
 
Our finishing is diabolical honestly. Are we just untrained or lacking confidence? It’s ridiculous how much we waste chances, which we can’t afford to do when we barely create anything.
 
McErik is the most clearly flawed pivot we could conceivably put out but he insists on playing it while binning a guy he spent 55 million on.

He needs to find a way of giving Mainoo minutes and obviously starting Mount.
It's even hard to call it a real pivot seeing as McT is so attacking
 
Exactly.

Just like Spurs form before these 2 latest result doesn't mean as much in a long run, our current grinding out result against likely long term bottom half teams business is unlikely sustainable against teams higher in the table (our problem last season under ETH too, which has been continued). The way we played currently is not as good as our best last season, so it's not time to carry away with current results. 6 point gap with Arsenal now likely become wider than narrower given Arsenal had displayed a higher ceiling than they're showing right now, more than even our best which we're struggling to replicate, let alone surpass that level (Overreliant on individual brilliance from Rashford and Bruno. Expecting Rashford to hit the same form as last season now is a tall order).

Mate a huge proportion of our attacking moves are going through these players. We don't need brilliance from them, we need them to stop being complete and utter shit.
 
You don't care yet you shoehorned yourself into a discussion that doesn't involve you just to attack me personally. That's the definition of obsession.

There's an ignore option which will let you not read my negative posts that hurt your precious feelings but you won't put me on your ignore list because as I said, you're obsessed with someone you don't even know what his name is.
Pretty sure the only one who seems to have an obsession here is you.

Others are just getting tired of reading the delusional nonsense.

You still haven't answered who you think the "amazing" manager you think will replace Ten Hag and catapult us to immediate success is.

If you're gonna spout as much nonsensical garbage as you do, then at least have solutions to what you claim is a "terrible" manager
 
So Eric, we managed to score 13 goals in 12 games. Worst out of the top 11. Only 7 teams have less while 12 teams have more, much more. Double than we do. Where should that lead?
I mean we have a very raw striker leading the line and Rashford is way off form. Where are the goals supposed to come from? To be fair to ETH he brought McT into the side in an attempt to rectify that issue.
 
Pretty sure the only one who seems to have an obsession here is you.

Others are just getting tired of reading the delusional nonsense.

You still haven't answered who you think the "amazing" manager you think will replace Ten Hag and catapult us to immediate success is.

If you're gonna spout as much nonsensical garbage as you do, then at least have solutions to what you claim is a "terrible" manager

If you're tired, you can put me on the ignore list. No one is forcing you to read my posts as far as I'm concerned. At the same time, you have no business telling me what to say and what to not as long as I'm following the forum's rules. Don't like my posts, block me.
 
So Eric, we managed to score 13 goals in 12 games. Worst out of the top 11. Only 7 teams have less while 12 teams have more, much more. Double than we do. Where should that lead?


It should lead to buying experienced prolific goalscorer as soon as winter window opens.
 
International break now time to see how things compare.

This season in the Premier League P12 W7 D0 L5 GF 13 GA16 points 21

Last season in the Premier league after 12 games W7 D2 L3 GF 17 GA 16 points 23
 
It could be speed of play, movement, not enough dribbling, not enough risk taking or us not being direct enough.
Imo it's the speed of our play and our lack of ball carrier. And the accuracy. Atm if we go for speed we'll thrown the accuracy out of the window. Then our forwards. I have no idea what's wrong with their finishing anymore.
 
McErik is the most clearly flawed pivot we could conceivably put out yet he insists on playing it while leaving out a guy he spent 55 million on.

He needs to find a way of giving Mainoo minutes and obviously starting Mount.

Would you have started Mount? I thought the midfield pairing to start was right tbf
 
It should lead to buying experienced prolific goalscorer as soon as winter window opens.
Not one penny more will be spent for this manager. Let him sell Antony and Mount for 140 mils and invest it in Osimhen.
 
If you're tired, you can put me on the ignore list. No one is forcing you to read my posts as far as I'm concerned. At the same time, you have no business telling me what to say and what to not as long as I'm following the forum's rules. Don't like my posts, block me.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's very funny. All that complaining and you've yet to come up with a single solution other than 'Hurr Durr, Sack the manager, he doo doo'.

Make the loudest noise, lack the most substance.
 
Our finishing is diabolical honestly. Are we just untrained or lacking confidence? It’s ridiculous how much we waste chances, which we can’t afford to do when we barely create anything.
The rashford chance screams of a player with no confidence. A confident rashford slots it away first time. Same for the Garnacho chance. Hojlund should score as well but he's coming off two goals last game so I think he's just very raw and not a confidence issue.
 
I disagree.

He showed enough last season with some consistency. He's still playing a team that mostly isn't his. Onana has settled now, Martinez is excellent, Casemiro made sense last season but we overpaid. The other 'starters' mount, antony, hojlund, the jury is out but i wouldnt write off any at all.
Listen he has a tough run coming up Everton, Galatasaray , Newcastle all away, then Chelsea, bournemouth, Bayern at home, followed by West Ham and Liverpool away with Villa and Forrest the last 2 games before the new year. ETH needs his team to score 16-20 goals in his next 8 PL games, he needs 16 points which is 5 wins 1 draw and a min of 4 points in the CL just to qualify for Europa League next year.

And even that might not save him, Sir Jim will want his own man or he’ll get advice from Paul Mitchell who they should recruit.

Listen if ETH gets two CL wins from last two games and 16 points in the next 8 PL games he deserves the club support 100% however that looks highly unlikely!
 
:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's very funny. All that complaining and you've yet to come up with a single solution other than 'Hurr Durr, Sack the manager, he doo doo'.

Make the loudest noise, lack the most substance.

No, I'm not interested in talking with someone who says all I'm saying is garbage. Waste of time. No matter what I say you'll end up labeling it as such so why bother ?

Yes I have no opinion and all I'm saying is garbage. Will you put on me your ignore list now or you'll prove the bullying and obsession strategy this forum has is true ?
 
That, and decisions are a key part of coaching. The attack is so disorganized and players are constantly making the wrong decisions.
My feeling concerning Ten Haag and United attacking is that his systems don't actually work well in England. At Ajax he relied on two things, the quick transition attacks and overloading the flanks. The pace of the league was slower, the intensity was less, and Ajax had far superior players than any other team in the league. This meant that Ajax could camp out in the opposition half more regularly.

Their defenders, Blind, Martinez, Timber and Mazraoui were the players who actually were involved in the build up and progression phases as the team played mostly in the opposition half. As a result, the defenders positioning was fluid. They were constantly in different areas of the pitch and did not need to move back into their regularly positions as opposition teams didn't have the defensive or transitional qualities to take advantage of this chaos. This isn't like Pep having Stones step up into City's midfield or centre backs covering spaces on the left or right. This was almost suicidal. Timber would be in attacking midfield positions for a large share of minutes. There were games where Blind, the left back, would be the only defender actually in the back line. He could afford to play this way because it was the Eredivisie. The physicality and pace of the league was low enough that these actions could take place with little consequence. Ajax' midfield was also far more physical than any other team in the Eredivisie, so second chance disadvantages borne from gaps in midfield were recoverable.

He could also afford to push numbers up the pitch, particularly around the flanks when in possession. These patterns to break the opposition down on the flanks were complicated and required numbers. So you could have 4 players from Ajax on one flank, whilst still having a presence in the middle. That's a lot of bodies to commit to an attack and a priviledge that can hardly occur in England. City, even when attacking are not nearly as adventorous. Thieir structure around Rodri is sold and can facilitate those overloads on the pitch. Ten Haag's Ajax team did not have that structure. In England, these patterns would have been broken down quickly and created opportunities for transitions that could easily be exploited. In fact, both this season and last season, us trying to use those principles he had at Ajax resulted in us getting decimated. Yet everyone blamed our players when in actuality, these were tactical errors.

In fact, even in the Eredivisie, Ajax were punished quite frequently for this adventorous approach, but they scored enough goals to cover for this. Teams in England are far too good for that to occur. They would easily break up the complex combinations. They would also either quickly transition or keep possession of the ball (taking advantage of the space in the middle brought by the team shape). Losing the ball in the middle of the pitch with the fluid defensive line would result in us conceding goals ( similar to what we saw earlier in the season).

I actually think Ten Haag noticed that he would not be able to attack in this way in England due to how much we struggled with creating from wide combinations last season.. Which is why he started the season discussing about moving to a more transition based approach. This was essentially what helped him succeed in the Champions League in 2019. However, there were a few player profiles that he had then, that we currently don't have that allowed this to work. De Jong's transition play from midfield was very important and Ziyech was also having the best run of games in his life. Additionally they had Schone who was very energetic. However this transition game can't be used against teams like Luton, Everton or the like. In addition, we don't have a physical enough midfield to take that on or a strong enough defence to deal with the pressure since Shaw and Licha have been injured. So in games like today's, where we're expected to create chances, we're falling short because Ten Haag may not actually have a clear plan in attack. The complicated wide overloads that require too many steps to work successfully may require more bodies that we can't afford to use.

I'm starting to reach the conclusion that Dutch managers may not work in England for this very reason. The fluidity of total football may not work in this league.
 
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As I said last month, we need to kick the can down the road till the end of the season and then see where we end up.
Results are extremely vital now.

 
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