Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

[Cathy Ferguson]

Brighton has a good owner, who knows he does not know which players to buy so have employed good DOF's. Our owners employ people who do not have a clue how to negotiate contracts, sales, purchases. No DOF so the managers have total power but not necessarily the knowledge of who they should buy, so more often than not has gone with people he knows and our negotiating team have allowed themselves to be ripped off. That is all down to the owners who also have feck all knowledge of Association Football.

I am pretty sure ETH approves all our signings. I am pretty sure we have a terrible structure supporting him. Both statements can be true at the same time. A great manager would have done more with 400m.

 

[Pink Moon]

If I was in charge I'd sack him.

The Glazers aren't responsible for the boring football or the atrocious results whenever you play anyone half decent. Managers with less resources than ETH get a tune out of their players. He should too.

 

[Daydreamer]

Nah you can't blame personnel here. He put Eriksen in a role where he had to cover massive amounts of space, constantly. We all know his limitations, and he put him in a role that highlighted them. It's shit coaching. It's shit tactics. This is what he used to be good at. If he can't do that here, then replace before it's too late.

As an outsider who doesn't watch all your games, this really stood out to me. Your game plan seemed to require players to do things they've shown no signs of doing at any point since they've joined United. You surrendered possession (43%) at home and played a sort-of midfield diamond (one of the most physically demanding formations) containing Casemiro and Eriksen. They couldn't keep up... but that is an entirely predictable outcome.

As I said, I don't watch all United games, so please clue me in if I'm missing something obvious. I know you're down three right wingers for all sorts of reasons, but do you not have anyone in the squad or U21s who can play there?

 

[Gehrman]

Ha ha - Who do we get in after the Naggelsman project?
We need to stick by ETH 100%

I think we should revert to Mourinho after Naggelsman.

 

[JuriM]

I am pretty sure ETH approves all our signings. I am pretty sure we have a terrible structure supporting him. Both statements can be true at the same time. A great manager would have done more with 400m.

I don't think any manager can negotiate player's prices - it's down to the people who are securing the deal's themselves. So a manager isn't at fault how much some player's cost.

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

I get behind the club, not the manager. He's a disposable employee.

But you'll never build a squad, style of play, system etc if you cut and change the manager every two years. He's got to be allowed to fail for a while, just as Arteta was allowed.

 

[sparx99]

They did enjoy themselves last season. I actually think off field situations and how it is affecting the dressing room and who is loyal to whom is causing issues.

Still feels like we had the handbrake on a lot. So many 1-0 wins. Brighton can score 3-4 goals with Welbeck up top.

 

[santeria13]

Arterta lost the first 5 premier league matches of the 2021-2022 season! They stuck with him though and it has paid off. ETH definitely deserves some criticism. I can see what he’s trying to do though and I think he’s been a bit unlucky with injuries and dead wood players from previous regimes holding him back. He deserves time to turn the ship around. I think next year is the make or break season. Dead wood like Martial, Maguire, and Sancho will likely be gone and we’ll have to see who he brings in to replace them. If results aren’t improved next season then all bets are off.

Can we stop using Arteta as a baseline? He's garbage. Arsenal are garbage. Their success is vastly overrated on here. What, 1 FA cup, a 2nd place, and a bunch of europa league finishes? Is that what we're aspiring to?

 

[Robbie Boy]

Sacking the manager is pointless unless you have someone you think can come in and make both an immediate impact, but also keep the team on an upward trajectory in the long term. EtH did that when he arrived, and it's really hard to judge at the moment because of how many injuries and off field issues there are.

Eventually we'll get players back and performances will improve, but we'll be lucky if it's in time to finish comfortably in the top 4. The team still lacks depth in certain areas, especially attack. People can keep going on about how much money he's spent, but in context it's still not enough. Chelsea's two CMs cost over £200m. The manager should get to the end of the season, and if they replace him then it should be somebody who can work with these players and also with some kind of long term strategy in place.

That's what Brighton had, and it's why they transitioned so seamlessly from Potter to De Zerbi.

He has enough credit in the bank for me not to get sacked. But, if we're looking like this in 2 months time, I'll have a different view. He's had to deal with a tonne of adversity and we have a substantial injury list. However, today's performance was very worrying. We weren't just outplayed, the players genuinely looked like they didn't give a feck.

And again, yes, the structures at our club aren't going to favour any new manager coming in. We really are run in shambolic fashion.

 

[AneRu]

The team is a mish-mash of different philosophies which tell a story on its own about the post-Fergie shambles we have witnessed. He hasn't helped himself though because when you look at the midfield he is putting out since last season it doesn't suit who he is as a manager or the football he says he wants to play.

In possession we don't look like a team coached by a Dutch manager, at least Ole's side knew its own limitations and was devastating on the break. We are neither and his three key players are anathema to how his previous teams played.

He also hasnt been careful with Rashford, who if over pampered, has a tendency to get big headed and deliver brainless shit like we were condemned to viewing today. Three years ago Rashford was developing nicely into a well rounded forward, I remember the passes he used to spray around alongside Martial, Bruno and Greenwood. He wasnt this selfish, thick headed one dimensional player we are seeing today. Its his job to extract that Rashford or he is done here.

Like I said in the first point there are basics expected of a midfielder at the level we aspire to play at. Half of our midfield doesn't meet those. I really hope that the likes of Hannibal, Mainoo and Gore get the chance to stake a claim for that 8. I also pray that ETH has the balls to do the needful with Casemiro, he is not the reason we lost but he is one of the major ones.

 

[ohhrooney]

No one can ever look at a bigger picture, if anything that's what's holding us back more, Arsenal finished 8th and 8th under Arteta every single person on this forum and the United board would have likely sacked him after his 2nd 8th finish and now look at Arsenal, football is not a linear path spend x = x performances its a journey if we fail to see that we will keep doing the same and being in the same situations we have been in, back the manager he is going to be great just needs some time

Explain in 100 words what makes you think the same feat will be repeated here? What do you see that has given you an assurance about us heading on the right path? Collectively wasting 135 million on Antony and Mount gives you hope?

 

[Drizzle]

Those wanting him sacked are utterly beneath contempt. Those who are debating it even. Mind-boggling to even mention it.

This manager is in the absolute worst environment to thrive, has terrible owners and an incompetent board, and inherited a squad of players who are mostly not suited to modern football and who are almost impossible to shift due to ridiculous wages and bad reputations.

He's had to deal with Ronaldo, Greenwood, Sancho, Maguire as well as the turmoil of the club sale and bitter fan protests. Any one of those would be a big challenge for a new manager. All of them in 12 months is unprecedented.

He's not once had a top striker to lead the line in all this time, until today - and even then most of us were debating about Hojlund being a young backup to Kane at the start of the window...now he's our only real striker. We've barely seen our other signings due to fitness issues, so we cannot judge the summer transfer window yet.

He got 3rd and a pot in his first season. And we're only 5 games into season 2. And people are debating sacking him. Unbelievable. Worst fanbase in the league we are. The worst. We deserve what we get.

 

[Just Hope]

Can we stop using Arteta as a baseline? He's garbage. Arsenal are garbage. Their success is vastly overrated on here. What, 1 FA cup, a 2nd place, and a bunch of europa league finishes? Is that what we're aspiring to?

I would give you a like if I could.

 

[The Hilton]

Jesus Christ this fanbase is insufferable.

It really is, I had fooled myself into thinking our fanbase was excellent, almost too loyal early on post-Fergie, but that's long gone. The most reactionary folks in here, if they get their wish and we drop ETH for De Zerbi, will be the first to call for him gone when we go through a poor period with him.

 

[el3mel]

But you'll never build a squad, style of play, system etc if you cut and change the manager every two years. He's got to be allowed to fail for a while, just as Arteta was allowed.

Where's that style of play ? When I see even tries to implement one, I'll stick with the manager. United has been playing the shit football it has been playing the last few years, absolutely nothing has changed, except for the fans deluding themselves otherwise.

Point is, the fact we spent 400m and in his 2nd season with the team lacking any kind of tactics, strategy or play style is enough to convince me he failed at his primary job as a coach, and thus doesn't deserve all these excuses.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

This De Zerbi stuff is so tedious. He's proven pedigree with taking a good Brighton team with great togetherness, and a great footballing structure above him, and improving them, just like Potter before him, in a relatively low expectation environment. He doesn't have any proven pedigree dealing with the egos he'd run into at United, a huge club with poor (but improving with EtH) standards and a poor footballing structure above him, in one of the highest pressure jobs in the world.

De Zerbi has done great things at many clubs not just Brighton.

 

[crossy1686]

Can we stop using Arteta as a baseline? He's garbage. Arsenal are garbage. Their success is vastly overrated on here. What, 1 FA cup, a 2nd place, and a bunch of europa league finishes? Is that what we're aspiring to?

Absolutely this. They’ve done feck all and spent a tonne of money. They’re nothing to aspire to.

 

[El Zoido]

Why didn’t we have any answer to them keeping the ball? We should have a plan in place to press them high and win back the ball.

Either EtH didn’t prepare for this (which would be catastrophic) or he isn’t able to teach the players his ideas (which also reflects negatively on him).

Pep couldn’t teach the City side in inherited and he never got criticised for that, so why should Ten Hag be? You can’t polish a turd. As if Pep would magically turn Scott McTominay in to prime Sergio Busquets.

I really would love to see Guardiola manage United and see the comments as he fails spectacularly just like every other manager here. I don’t know what else it’d take to make people understand that successful clubs aren’t built by a single man, and definitely not in the modern era. I disagree with plenty of Ten Hag’s decisons too, but this lunacy cannot continue. We will cycle through another 10 managers and still not win anything, the club is not built to win.

 

[Kinky Melinky]

Whether ETH should stay or go is open to debate. What is not open to debate is how we spent 400M. It actually beggars belief and is embarrassing.

 

[el3mel]

Jesus Christ this fanbase is insufferable.

Agree, Ten Hag fans and managers cultists who defend every manager to death are insufferable.

 

[Member 58925]

Ultimately the managers pays for lack of effort with his job and that’s how it goes, but you’re objectively wrong if you think tactics have a thing to do with this. Tactics were just fine until they scored with their very first chance because 6-7 out of 10 outfield players were jogging or walking. Once that happened, any matter of effort and teamwork was gone. We’re now looking at yet another manager on the way out the door because he couldn’t change the mentality in the dressing room.

 

[Mainoovement]

32 points in the last 19 games. I'm not off him yet but I think it's very reasonable to be concerned.

 

[bosnian_red]

As an outsider who doesn't watch all your games, this really stood out to me. Your game plan seemed to require players to do things they've shown no signs of doing at any point since they've joined United. You surrendered possession (43%) at home and played a sort-of midfield diamond (one of the most physically demanding formations) containing Casemiro and Eriksen. They couldn't keep up... but that is an entirely predictable outcome.

As I said, I don't watch all United games, so please clue me in if I'm missing something obvious. I know you're down three right wingers for all sorts of reasons, but do you not have anyone in the squad or U21s who can play there?

There are players who have played there before and younger players. He's played Bruno out there before. He's played Rashford there. He has Garnacho on the bench if he doesn't like Pellistri.

It's a very one off, weird feck up from Ten Hag, as I think he's been very logical and tactically astute before today. Could be a sign of pressure making him do weird things.

 

[mav_9me]

As an outsider who doesn't watch all your games, this really stood out to me. Your game plan seemed to require players to do things they've shown no signs of doing at any point since they've joined United. You surrendered possession (43%) at home and played a sort-of midfield diamond (one of the most physically demanding formations) containing Casemiro and Eriksen. They couldn't keep up... but that is an entirely predictable outcome.

As I said, I don't watch all United games, so please clue me in if I'm missing something obvious. I know you're down three right wingers for all sorts of reasons, but do you not have anyone in the squad or U21s who can play there?

We do. Pellestri for the right. Garnacho for the left. Hannibal for midfield.

Gotta get legs in there

 

[Robbie Boy]

Thank god i wasn't the only one to notice

Wait, what? Didn't you lot always used to say that Ole would walk if things go to shit etc.

I think this notion for any manager is fecking ridiculous.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

As an outsider who doesn't watch all your games, this really stood out to me. Your game plan seemed to require players to do things they've shown no signs of doing at any point since they've joined United. You surrendered possession (43%) at home and played a sort-of midfield diamond (one of the most physically demanding formations) containing Casemiro and Eriksen. They couldn't keep up... but that is an entirely predictable outcome.

As I said, I don't watch all United games, so please clue me in if I'm missing something obvious. I know you're down three right wingers for all sorts of reasons, but do you not have anyone in the squad or U21s who can play there?

You are missing that this has nothing to do with ETH. It is the Glazers and Murthough who coach the team. It is THE STRUCTURE.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

I am pretty sure ETH approves all our signings. I am pretty sure we have a terrible structure supporting him. Both statements can be true at the same time. A great manager would have done more with 400m.

The manager should have little to no say over how 400m is spent.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

To give a definite answer whether i would sack or keep him, first you have to tell me on what premise the next guy will be brought in. If it's just to shake off the bad vibes in and around the club (meaning that our players get another clean slate and a section of the fanbase gets its new toy) so that Bruno & Rashford United can scrape a top-four finish, then no. I've had enough of that. But i'm also resigned to the fact that this is exactly what will happen.

 

[Rojofiam]

Not when we signed him so in that sense de Zerbi is different.

I am well aware that ETH finished 3rd in his first season, but we are going backwards since April and have not played well or controlled a single game this season despite ETH spending 400m, which somehow is the Glazers fault. Will you stand by ETH if we finish outside top 6 this season?

De Zerbi has managed mid-table Italian teams and Shakhtar before going to Brighton.

And yes, I'll stand behind ETH even if we don't finish top 6.

 

[Acquire Me]

This De Zerbi stuff is so tedious. He's proven pedigree with taking a good Brighton team with great togetherness, and a great footballing structure above him, and improving them, just like Potter before him, in a relatively low expectation environment. He doesn't have any proven pedigree dealing with the egos he'd run into at United, a huge club with poor (but improving with EtH) standards and a poor footballing structure above him, in one of the highest pressure jobs in the world.

De Zerbi is not the answer. Great footballing environment from top to bottom is.

 

[bosnian_red]

Why didn’t we have any answer to them keeping the ball? We should have a plan in place to press them high and win back the ball.

Either EtH didn’t prepare for this (which would be catastrophic) or he isn’t able to teach the players his ideas (which also reflects negatively on him).

We pressed high. They played out of it and took advantage of both fullbacks having acres of space, predictably as we played a diamond. The mind boggling part was not responding to this.

 

[VP89]

Can I just ask what you are basing this on? Like, what specifically have you seen since he has come here that makes you think this (even the cup win…we have declined A LOT since that)

We are barely into this season. You can't rule any shit out from this stage even if you want to try to. When games come every 3 days, you can evaluate everyone.

Regarding Ten Hag, he is a progressive manager that brings standard, discipline and pedigree. He has already outdone his predecessors debut seasons and I have little doubt hel continue on his trajectory. Anyone drawing punts this early on the season is just being daft, especially considering how we were the same or worse a season earlier.

 

[OmarUnited4ever]

My patience with him is running thin tbh but the injuries are quite too much for key players like Varane and Shaw in defense, as well as having Hojlund not ready ntil recently, not bothered by the absence of Antony & Sancho, and Mount is new and not a key player (not yet).

I said it earlier something isn't working with the tactics and selection decisions he made which is totally on him despite the absences, like why start McTominay when you can retain the midfield shape or Cas/Eriksen/Bruno and play Pellistri?

 

[Member 58925]

Pep couldn’t teach the City side in inherited and he never got criticised for that, so why should Ten Hag be? You can’t polish a turd. As if Pep would magically turn Scott McTominay in to prime Sergio Busquets.

I really would love to see Guardiola manage United and see the comments as he fails spectacularly just like every other manager here. I don’t know what else it’d take to make people understand that successful clubs aren’t built by a single man, and definitely not in the modern era. I disagree with plenty of Ten Hag’s decisons too, but this lunacy cannot continue. We will cycle through another 10 managers and still not win anything, the club is not built to win.

I don’t think there’s a manager in the world this group of players couldn’t get sacked.

 

[izec]

He obviously wont be sacked, we know how the club operates. Wait until the seasons gone and the dressing room is lost. The question is if i would sack him right now, and the answer is yes. But maybe we need more embarrassing (away) losses to our rivals. Bayern could do the first of a couple. Our fanbase and club wants more suffering when it is obvious ETH is a lost case. Stubborn and quite honeslty out of his depth in every department. He had some external issues, but plenty have been his own wrongdoing as well. At the end of the day, he is not tactically special or the progressive coach we got promised, in contrary. His man management is atrocious as well. Counting the days until he is gone.

 

[clarkydaz]

Didnt he say in preseason the players aint doing what he wants?

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Where's that style of play ? When I see even tries to implement one, I'll stick with the manager. United has been playing the shit football it has been playing the last few years, absolutely nothing has changed, except for the fans deluding themselves otherwise.

Point is, the fact we spent 400m and in his 2nd season with the team lacking any kind of tactics, strategy or play style is enough to convince me he failed at his primary job as a coach, and thus doesn't deserve all these excuses.

A lot of those players should not have cost anywhere near what they did, that is down to bad negotiators. That is why he spent so much. Do you think the likes of Brighton would have paid what we did the Rasmus or Antony? We and Chelsea are a soft touch. I think all the issues we have is the volcano has finally exploded and not listening or seeing warning signs about some players has come to a head.

 

[KjaAnd]

Pep couldn’t teach the City side in inherited and he never got criticised for that, so why should Ten Hag be? You can’t polish a turd. As if Pep would magically turn Scott McTominay in to prime Sergio Busquets.

I really would love to see Guardiola manage United and see the comments as he fails spectacularly just like every other manager here. I don’t know what else it’d take to make people understand that successful clubs aren’t built by a single man, and definitely not in the modern era. I disagree with plenty of Ten Hag’s decisons too, but this lunacy cannot continue. We will cycle through another 10 managers and still not win anything, the club is not built to win.

EtH has had the budget to build his own squad. Yet, we play like a bottom half team. Look at the cost of Brighton’s starting 11 today.

 

[TheGame]

This. We were good vs Arsenal and Erik spoke about that game for two weeks how we looked good, should have won etc...
And then he does this.

Lets be honest now; last year he also had some baffling decisions which were costly (against Liverpool, Arsenal, Palace, Sevilla). Lots of mistakes for United manager.

Plus Brighton have attacking full backs and wingers. A diamond was never going to work against them.

 

[Member 58925]

We are barely into this season. You can't rule any shit out from this stage even if you want to try to. When games come every 3 days, you can evaluate everyone.

Regarding Ten Hag, he is a progressive manager that brings standard, discipline and pedigree. He has already outdone his predecessors debut seasons and I have little doubt hel continue on his trajectory. Anyone drawing punts this early on the season is just being daft, especially considering how we were the same or worse a season earlier.

He of course wants to bring standard and discipline, but how does he get it out of this group of players that is collectively incapable of playing with the mentality he requires? Right now it feels like no manager in the world can do that