Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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el3mel said:
I didn't say sack him tomorrow. Meanwhile yes I would want him sacked at the end of the season if we are at the same spot as we were last season, barely scrapping top 4 while playing godawful football.

He hasn't done anything more than the previous managers (they all finished top 4, won domestic cups while playing shit football) for us to pretend he should be treated any different if he ends up with the same results as them.

As for who replaces him, I swear this argument is said every time we say the manager sucks (there's no other one around so let's stick with him). Is that the best argument you can master to keep him in the job, regardless of wanting him to leave now or not?
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Still not answered my question. Considering you want him gone , who do you want as a replacement. Never made any argument that no one can do a better job, asked you a simple question. Do you have any preference?
 
BluesJr said:
We played well in the game. If you can’t see that then I can’t help you. Was it perfect? No. Was it the ideal? No. We were good though. Robbed of a victory by a wrong angle.
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We didn't play well at all, that might be playing well if you're Nottingham Forest, but not United with a supposed elite manager at the helm.
 
Mickeza said:
No. Absolute weapon of a post. Until the structure at the top and the ownership model actually have the ambition and resources to win things whoever the manager is will need to perform an incredible job to win the league. That’s the simple reality. He inherited an average squad that was miles off the teams ahead of us and hasn’t been given significant amounts more than those teams despite the narrative.

ETH took over a team that finished 6th - it was:

11 points behind Arsenal
13 points behind Tottenham
16 points behind Chelsea
34 points behind Liverpool
35 points behind Manchester City

Pogba, Matic, Mata and Greenwood also got removed from that squad for various reasons for free. De Gea and Ronaldo have also since left for free.

So to close that deficit he has spent £380m. Sounds like feck loads doesn’t it? What a failure he is not having us ready to compete 13 months later. Except those 5 teams have also spent:

Arsenal - £370m (he’s had a whopping 10m more to close an 11 point gap)
Spurs - £280m (had a fair bit more here - then again there was a 38 point swing last year so…)
Liverpool - £265m (100m more - but just the 42 point swing last year)
Manchester City - £340m plus whatever bonuses they gave to Haaland senior (whopping 40m more to close that 35 point gap)
Chelsea - 1bn…maybe now you get the idea…

The issue is half you people have the memory of a goldfish and ignore context. Like today - when we’re missing 5 defenders away at the emirates, have no senior midfielders on the bench and have martial as our starting striker…in that context today was a good performance. Finishing 3rd last year in the context of where we were and what needed doing was a fantastic effort. It would also be this season.
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Can we pin this and cover it in gold please?
 
Mickeza said:
What is? Failing to sack your manager for not being top the season after he took over a side in 6th? You saying loser mentality over and over again doesn’t make your nonsensical posts any more of a winner.
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No, being content with top 4 because oh we are surrounded by other top clubs who spent a lot of money like us. Other clubs keep spending to reach the top while Man United fans convince themselves 400m isn't enough to even play good football.
 
el3mel said:
He literally criticized Sancho in the same press conference.
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Its clear Sancho has attitude problems. A manager will, and should, criticize a players attitude but never a performance in public.
 
AshRK said:
Still not answered my question. Considering you want him gone , who do you want as a replacement. Never made any argument that no one can do a better job, asked you a simple question. Do you have any preference?
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I replied on the question. If that's the best argument you have to keep him in job then you have no argument to start with.
 
el3mel said:
I replied on the question. If that's the best argument you have to keep him in job then you have no argument to start with.
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It's clear you are not the brightest guy around.

Ok let me spell it out. I am not saying or suggesting that there is no other manager who can or cannot do a better job. That's not my point.

I asked you a simple genuine honest reasonable question, considering you have made up your mind about tenhag and also given up on his signings. Do you have any names that you would want to manage our club? Name- like Enrique, Naggelsman, sam allardyce, john smith. Name. Hope that make sense.
 
Mickeza said:
No. Absolute weapon of a post. Until the structure at the top and the ownership model actually have the ambition and resources to win things whoever the manager is will need to perform an incredible job to win the league. That’s the simple reality. He inherited an average squad that was miles off the teams ahead of us and hasn’t been given significant amounts more than those teams despite the narrative.

ETH took over a team that finished 6th - it was:

11 points behind Arsenal
13 points behind Tottenham
16 points behind Chelsea
34 points behind Liverpool
35 points behind Manchester City

Pogba, Matic, Mata and Greenwood also got removed from that squad for various reasons for free. De Gea and Ronaldo have also since left for free.

So to close that deficit he has spent £380m. Sounds like feck loads doesn’t it? What a failure he is not having us ready to compete 13 months later. Except those 5 teams have also spent:

Arsenal - £370m (he’s had a whopping 10m more to close an 11 point gap)
Spurs - £280m (had a fair bit more here - then again there was a 38 point swing last year so…)
Liverpool - £265m (100m more - but just the 42 point swing last year)
Manchester City - £340m plus whatever bonuses they gave to Haaland senior (whopping 40m more to close that 35 point gap)
Chelsea - 1bn…maybe now you get the idea…

The issue is half you people have the memory of a goldfish and ignore context. Like today - when we’re missing 5 defenders away at the emirates, have no senior midfielders on the bench and have martial as our starting striker…in that context today was a good performance. Finishing 3rd last year in the context of where we were and what needed doing was a fantastic effort. It would also be this season.
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Well said, great post.
 
el3mel said:
I didn't say sack him tomorrow. Meanwhile yes I would want him sacked at the end of the season if we are at the same spot as we were last season, barely scrapping top 4 while playing godawful football.

He hasn't done anything more than the previous managers (they all finished top 4, won domestic cups while playing shit football) for us to pretend he should be treated any different if he ends up with the same results as them.

As for who replaces him, I swear this argument is said every time we say the manager sucks (there's no other one around so let's stick with him). Is that the best argument you can master to keep him in the job, regardless of wanting him to leave now or not?
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I don't disagree with you about standards and expectations.

On that last point though, it's not that there are no other managers of the required caliber. It's that as long as our structure continues to be a function of allowing the manager free reign over recruitment and squad planning, any manager will struggle and we'll continue in this never-ending cycle of spending hundreds of millions replacing the previous manager's deadwood with the new batch of deadwood.

This is what needs to be fixed first and foremost. Even Pep would struggle under this structure.
 
Mickeza said:
No. Absolute weapon of a post. Until the structure at the top and the ownership model actually have the ambition and resources to win things whoever the manager is will need to perform an incredible job to win the league. That’s the simple reality. He inherited an average squad that was miles off the teams ahead of us and hasn’t been given significant amounts more than those teams despite the narrative.

ETH took over a team that finished 6th - it was:

11 points behind Arsenal
13 points behind Tottenham
16 points behind Chelsea
34 points behind Liverpool
35 points behind Manchester City

Pogba, Matic, Mata and Greenwood also got removed from that squad for various reasons for free. De Gea and Ronaldo have also since left for free.

So to close that deficit he has spent £380m. Sounds like feck loads doesn’t it? What a failure he is not having us ready to compete 13 months later. Except those 5 teams have also spent:

Arsenal - £370m (he’s had a whopping 10m more to close an 11 point gap)
Spurs - £280m (had a fair bit more here - then again there was a 38 point swing last year so…)
Liverpool - £265m (100m more - but just the 42 point swing last year)
Manchester City - £340m plus whatever bonuses they gave to Haaland senior (whopping 40m more to close that 35 point gap)
Chelsea - 1bn…maybe now you get the idea…

The issue is half you people have the memory of a goldfish and ignore context. Like today - when we’re missing 5 defenders away at the emirates, have no senior midfielders on the bench and have martial as our starting striker…in that context today was a good performance. Finishing 3rd last year in the context of where we were and what needed doing was a fantastic effort. It would also be this season.
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Amen. We're on the right track. The recent drama with Sancho shows yet again how dire the situation really was. Woodward was so far out of his depth it boggles the mind.
 
AshRK said:
It's clear you are not the brightest guy around.

Ok let me spell it out. I am not saying or suggesting that there is no other manager who can or cannot do a better job. That's not my point.

I asked you a simple genuine honest reasonable question, considering you have made up your mind about tenhag and also given up on his signings. Do you have any names that you would want to manage our club? Name- like Enrique, Naggelsman, sam allardyce, john smith. Name. Hope that make sense.
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No that's clearly your point but you are trying to wrap it up to look like you are asking for replacement, so I'm saving you the effort.

And yeah I'm not the brightest around here. Who would I be in comparison to Ten Hag fans?
 
BluesJr said:
It’s not worth an argument tbh. No interest in talking with someone who lacks knowledge.
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Vague nonsense, I have enough knowledge to know we played like shit. You are simply deluding yourself to absolve ETH of everything.
 
Big Ben Foster said:
I don't disagree with you about standards and expectations.

On that last point though, it's not that there are no other managers of the required caliber. It's that as long as our structure continues to be a function of allowing the manager free reign over recruitment and squad planning, any manager will struggle and we'll continue in this never-ending cycle of spending hundreds of millions replacing the previous manager's deadwood with the new batch of deadwood.

This is what needs to be fixed first and foremost. Even Pep would struggle under this structure.
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I do agree that the club's structure needs to be fixed. Our main issue is the lack of strategy and plan and randomly splashing money on players and managers without planning what to do with them, and that's why we never move forward unlike other clubs.
 
The Mitcher said:
Vague nonsense, I have enough knowledge to know we played like shit. You are simply deluding yourself to absolve ETH of everything.
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Nope, been pretty critical this season as the first 3 games were shite. This was different.
 
Probably should have taken Erikson off for someone like Mjebri to offer some more energy in midfield. Not sure how he lasted the game. Need to get the defenders fit during the international break.
 
mav_9me said:
Well they are different people. So different approaches would be basic man management, no?
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So it's fine to criticize one in public but not another because they take it differently? If he had criticizes Martial in public you would have said he was right and Martial deserved it too.
 
el3mel said:
So it's fine to criticize one in public but not another because they take it differently? If he had criticizes Martial in public you would have said he was right and Martial deserved it too.
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He protected Sancho last season even gave him 3 months off during the season and always spoke well about him. He obviously chosen to take a different approach with him.

Last season he called out Rashford when he was not selected because he was late for training
 
The Mitcher said:
Why shouldn't the club sack him? What progress has been made?
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You want progress when we have to call on Maguire and Evans to see out the game?

From 6th last season he came 3rd and won a trophy. Bit early to write him off lets see how we do this season.
 
el3mel said:
No that's clearly your point but you are trying to wrap it up to look like you are asking for replacement, so I'm saving you the effort.

And yeah I'm not the brightest around here. Who would I be in comparison to Ten Hag fans?
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Thanks for admitting to my point that you indeed are not the brightest and have little ball knowledge. Now you have in fact saved my time and efforts.
 
AndySmith1990 said:
Yeah not sure what we're on track for. Other than regression
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Quite a few have been saying it since preseason with everything that’s gone on and others have been coming up with excuses to cover the mess, right up until last week it was the “it’s only been 3 games!” argument. Soon it will be the players or the Glazers or whatever other excuse but the fact of the matter is we’re looking worse and we’re spending daft money to do so.
 
el3mel said:
So it's fine to criticize one in public but not another because they take it differently? If he had criticizes Martial in public you would have said he was right and Martial deserved it too.
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I mean isn't that basic man management?

I try not to judge what the manager says about the players in general in public, because we have so little information. Be it critical or praise.
 
Cassidy said:
He protected Sancho last season even gave him 3 months off during the season and always spoke well about him. He obviously chosen to take a different approach with him.

Last season he called out Rashford when he was not selected because he was late for training
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I for one don't care about the manager criticizing the player in public or not. On the contrary I actually believe if a player can't take criticism in public then he has no business playing at top level. I also know Ten Hag doesn't say the truth all the time in public as shown by his comments on Maguire and De Gea from last season.

Just pointing out the hypocrisy of some here dealing with such comments.
 
Cassidy said:
You want progress when we have to call on Maguire and Evans to see out the game?

From 6th last season he came 3rd and won a trophy. Bit early to write him off lets see how we do this season.
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This might be a bit of a radical thought but if you wanted to see out a game and you had to bring on Maguire and Evans, wouldn’t you change the formation or the style of play to make sure you could see out the game or would you throw them on and carry on playing the way you were?
 
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