England Euro 2024 Squad and Discussion

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Saka is the only one of the front four who deserves to keep his place.

Dropping him from of the side would not make sense.

Kane is clearly tired and Watkins will offer something different off the ball to stretch defences, Gordon too.
 
Valencia Shin Crosses said:
Which is funny, because I think at this point barring winning the Euros he's gone either way ( and I pray to god it's not us that's his next job). You'd think a manager leaving anyways wouldn't have anything to lose
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Southgate got absolute dog's abuse when he missed the penalty at Euro 96. I think he's hardwired to avoid anything like that happening again and for that reason, will never make a ballsy pick when it comes to stalwarts and media darlings in his team.

He isn't a Capello who will do what he wants regardless of fallout; he's the antithesis of that. A grey man who has to be forced along when it comes to adjusting his team. He'll always pick on the newbies in this sense whilst going nowhere near potential outcry for taking out big names.

It's looking increasingly likely that Wharton won't see the pitch and that Kane will have to be injured or fatigued beyond belief for anyone to get the nod over him.
 
Kane, Bellingham and Foden look knackered and Gallagher is not good enough at this level. Make some changes, start with the fresh legs and unleash the high quality bench players with half an hour to go. Any game will be 0-0 at that point anyway.
 
LDUred said:
Saka is the only one of the front four who deserves to keep his place.

Dropping him from of the side would not make sense.

Kane is clearly tired and Watkins will offer something different off the ball to stretch defences, Gordon too.
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Don't agree. Other teams have worked out how to stop him.
Either Bowen who is more direct or Palmer who is more skillful would be a much better option.
 
Not sure how Bellingham and Kane played the entire 90. Both were woeful. I can't tell if Kane is injured/not fully fit or this system just doesn't suit him.

Classic Southgate too, bringing on Gordon for 2 minutes. What's the fecking point?
 
The midfield looked a bit better when Mainoo came on. He's definitely a better link man than Gallagher. You can give it to him in the tightest space and he can keep possession, and England don't really have a lot of options who can do that. If everyone is at 100%, Rice, Mainoo and Bellingham could be England's most balanced midfield 3 from the player's they've taken, but Bellingham looks spent. It'd be interesting to see Palmer as the 10 instead, and either Toney or Watkins up front, as Kane looks like he's running through treacle.
 
How do you go in to a tournament without a left back?! (Not including an injured Shaw). It's just ridiculous.

Especially if the plan was always to play Foden from the left - you need a full back to keep the width/overlap etc. Think that's been one of the main issues, just no balance there.

Even within the squad though, there's better options, yet it's Trippier - who's had a poor season ...and a right back. :confused:
 
Rex Banner said:
Not sure how Bellingham and Kane played the entire 90. Both were woeful. I can't tell if Kane is injured/not fully fit or this system just doesn't suit him.

Classic Southgate too, bringing on Gordon for 2 minutes. What's the fecking point?
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I have watched him for Bayern a lot this season and he's been so sluggish, the difference is he gets service and they, let's be honest, are much better than most of the teams they play. He remains a top finisher and passer but he's easy as piss to mark for most CBs when it's just him on his own leading the line. If Kane plays, you almost need to drop the 10 (so Foden most likely) as Kane's strengths are dropping in and then finding the pacey runners forwards i.e. Gordon, Bellingham/Mainoo from the middle, Saka. Or you play someone more like Watkins who plays off the shoulder and in behind and put Foden in the 10 to create and drop into the spaces.

Everyone knows the issue, Southgate is picking people based off how good they are for their clubs without even thinking about his system. It's very much like watching United the last few years, lots of players you know are good in other setups, thrown together and expected to be world beaters.
 
Considering how easy it is to qualify for the knockout stags these days, he should have managed the squad better in regards to Bellingham who looked leggy at the end of this season at Madrid let alone now after 3 games in just over a week.
 
LDUred said:
Saka is the only one of the front four who deserves to keep his place.

Dropping him from of the side would not make sense.

Kane is clearly tired and Watkins will offer something different off the ball to stretch defences, Gordon too.
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Disagree with this.

The best football we played so far this tournament was midway the 2nd half with Palmer, Mainoo linking up.

Saka has to be dropped for Palmer.
 
Robindinho said:
How do you go in to a tournament without a left back?! (Not including an injured Shaw). It's just ridiculous.
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Because if your next in line natural Left Back is Ben Chilwell maybe its better to play Trippier, TAA or Joe Gomes there.

Its really not that big of a deal as people make of it imo, France won 2 world cups with strikers who didn’t score a single goal.
 
romufc said:
Disagree with this.

The best football we played so far this tournament was midway the 2nd half with Palmer, Mainoo linking up.

Saka has to be dropped for Palmer.
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Do think Saka has looked by far the best of the starting front four though. But agree would like to see Palmer start.

With Bellingham looking so leggy it would've been nice to see this last night from the start to play Palmer, give Foden a fair crack without Bellingham playing in his space, and try Saka on left:

Kane
Saka-Foden-Palmer
Rice-Mainoo

Alas we'll never know.

Surely it's time for Foden to be benched now unfortunately. I despise him at City because he's just so bloody annoyingly good, but he's been absolute pish for over a year now for England (un-ironically since we started playing Bellingham further forward thus taking up the space Foden would drift into). It would probably help either of them if the other was dropped!
 
romufc said:
Disagree with this.

The best football we played so far this tournament was midway the 2nd half with Palmer, Mainoo linking up.

Saka has to be dropped for Palmer.
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Agreed - I'd definitely give Palmer a start in the next game and Mainoo must start as well - or Wharton, but Southgate doesn't seem to fancy him at all.
I'd also drop Bellingham and Kane, both of them look knackered, but that Southgate would never do that in a million years.
 
Patchbeard said:
Do think Saka has looked by far the best of the starting front four though. But agree would like to see Palmer start.

With Bellingham looking so leggy it would've been nice to see this last night from the start to play Palmer, give Foden a fair crack without Bellingham playing in his space, and try Saka on left:

Kane
Saka-Foden-Palmer
Rice-Mainoo

Alas we'll never know.

Surely it's time for Foden to be benched now unfortunately. I despise him at City because he's just so bloody annoyingly good, but he's been absolute pish for over a year now for England (un-ironically since we started playing Bellingham further forward thus taking up the space Foden would drift into). It would probably help either of them if the other was dropped!
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The man has somehow conned the nation into thinking he had a good game yesterday. He's been terrible throughout his England career and yesterday was no different bar two decent crosses and two good free kicks. Assuming Kane gets a free pass due to history (I don't think he should), Foden should definitely be the player losing his place. I've come to the conclusion that he's a system player and struggles without that.
I have no clue why Saka is always the one that goes off - I get he's knackered but he offers a lot more than Foden for England. We basically replace like for like on the right rather than change the ineffective left and wonder why we don't improve markedly.
 
I would start Mainoo, but I'd probably hold off on dropping Saka for Palmer. I would drop Kane though and one of Foden/Bellingham.

Pickford
Walker Stones Guehi Trippier
Mainoo Rice
Saka Foden/Bellingham Gordon
Watkins

I'd try something along those lines. I'd also toy with the idea of starting Trent instead of Walker but then we're getting into the 'too many changes at once' territory.
 
Highfather_24 said:
Dont know why people want Bellingham as a CM, when he plays as a false 9 for his club. It doesnt really play to his strengths either, seems like another situation of fitting Scholes, Gerrard and Lampard together, rather than taking the ballsy move and choosing the right players, rather than all the big names together.

----------Mainoo--Rice
Palmer--Bellingham-Gordon
------------Watkins

Is what I would go for.
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He was Player of the Season in Germany playing in a midfield two behind a 10.
 
Avero said:
----------------- Pickford
Walker - Stones - Guehi - Shaw
--------- Mainoo ---- Rice
Palmer ------ Foden ------ Saka
--------------- Bellingham
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That's where I have Bellingham , he's either there or next to rice as the all action dynamic guy who can arrive in the danger zone .

He needs to be kept out of that creative line .
 
Belilngham needs to be doing the stuff that Gallacher came in to do. Then that frees up the space for all the creatives ahead.

Bellingham's got a great record this season, but he's also clearly run out of steam and has 3 goals in his last 16 games for Real. It's not the sort of form that demands he gets to operate as a 9.5.
 
The current tactics with Bellingham, Foden, Saka and Kane aren't working at all.

Kane drops deep and you essentially end up with Foden and Bellingham operating in similar space and Kane being too deep. I think it's going to be very difficult to set up the side in order to have these players performing well as a unit.

You don't have time to experiment at this stage of the tournament. Apart from a few individual moments, neither Foden or Saka have performed well. Kane hasn't performed well at all. Bellingham had a good half against Serbia and that's it.

So you start changing things, or you should start changing things. Do you focus on creating space for Bellingham to perform at his best or do you focus on allowing Foden to operate in that area. Kane barely looks fit, maybe it's a good idea to bring in someone like Toney that will be more aggressive up top.
 
Rex Banner said:
Not sure how Bellingham and Kane played the entire 90. Both were woeful. I can't tell if Kane is injured/not fully fit or this system just doesn't suit him.

Classic Southgate too, bringing on Gordon for 2 minutes. What's the fecking point?
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Because Southgate has induldged Kane to play anywhere he feels like for far to long, which has worked previously when we actually have runners and width, but he has not got that now. Kane's game is to come deep, use his wingers/other forwards to make space/run beyond him so he is pretty much left to get into position. With nobody on the right getting behind and Foden and Bellingham both sitting in that number 10 role, when Kane comes deep it's just crowded.

Either one of Bellingham or Foden needs to be dropped or Bellingham needs to play next to Rice at a number 8. Or play a 4-3-3 instead of a 4-2-3-1 and have Bellingham and Mainoo in midfield alongside Rice (like we did in last world cup with Mainoo replacing Henderson)
 
WeePat said:
I would start Mainoo, but I'd probably hold off on dropping Saka for Palmer. I would drop Kane though and one of Foden/Bellingham.

Pickford
Walker Stones Guehi Trippier
Mainoo Rice
Saka Foden/Bellingham Gordon
Watkins

I'd try something along those lines. I'd also toy with the idea of starting Trent instead of Walker but then we're getting into the 'too many changes at once' territory.
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I thought Watkins looked good when he came on in the previous game.

Teams have easily worked out how to play England because we are so predictable and attritional.
Dropping Kane is full of risks if we get beaten.
And Southgate is certainly not a risk taker.
But I agree that the current tactics are not working well.

We need to turn defenders and force them to face their own goal.
To do that you need skill and pace.
Southgate must know that but will always revert to type.
 
I missed the England Slovenia game and tried to catch the highlights after. Did anything happen in this match at all?
 
Don't get the Saka has played well line, outside of the first 30 minutes in game 1 he's been completely ineffective.

The entire front line has been below par
 
Rex Banner said:
Not sure how Bellingham and Kane played the entire 90. Both were woeful. I can't tell if Kane is injured/not fully fit or this system just doesn't suit him.

Classic Southgate too, bringing on Gordon for 2 minutes. What's the fecking point?
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Protection, Foden got himself booked for mouthing off at the ref
 
Pickford
Walker Stones Guehi Saka
Rice Mainoo
Foden
Palmer Kane Gordon

This would be far better. I like Saka and I get the whole needs to be on the rw thing but moving Saka to lb will solve 2 major problems, will finally give us a decent left back that can overlap and give use width on the left and create space for Palmer to start.

I'm surprised Jude isn't getting more shit from the media, considering he's been widely acknowledged to be our best player he's been completely useless.
 
Mainoo and Palmer in for definite (a little harsh on Saka but he hasn’t really done much since the first half against Serbia). I would bring Gordon in for Bellingham next match (and switch Foden to 10) but not a chance Southgate will do that.
 
Doracle said:
Mainoo and Palmer in for definite (a little harsh on Saka but he hasn’t really done much since the first half against Serbia). I would bring Gordon in for Bellingham next match (and switch Foden to 10) but not a chance Southgate will do that.
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Literally my thinking. Except if you're dropping Saka you might as well move him to left back instead of dropping him completely.
 
the_cliff said:
Literally my thinking. Except if you're dropping Saka you might as well move him to left back instead of dropping him completely.
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Yeah, I said that in a post last night. Didn’t bother even listing it this time though as there’s just no chance at all it will happen. Yesterday’s match would have been perfect for that experiment (second half at least) and I doubt it even entered Southgate’s mind.
 
Suedesi said:
I missed the England Slovenia game and tried to catch the highlights after. Did anything happen in this match at all?
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No, not really. Awful 1st half - Southgate got the starting lineup wrong, again. Mainoo came on for Gallagher at HT, which improved things and England played at a better tempo in the 2nd half (albeit without really creating much/anything). Palmer looked lively and direct when he came on for Saka after 70 minutes, but Kane, Bellingham and Foden were all poor again. Overall, disappointing.
 
The answer is to play two wingers Gordon and Palmer/Saka, and ONE of bellingham and foden at 10. The other comes on as the sub to replace whoever starts as they tire.

That not only keeps them all playing a part, but gives the two wide runners that kane needs for us to get the best out of him.

Had we played that, no one would have given a second thought to whoever was playing next to rice, because those three opponents would have been pushed so far back by that front line.
 
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