I love the double standards of the media and England players. Kyle Walker pissing in the street, smashing escorts in lockdown and his kids having multiple mothers. The guy is fecking teflon. Bench Walker, stick TAA at right back and have a proper midfield ffs, the guys a distraction and would genuinely make the team selection easier.
England Euro 2024 Squad and Discussion
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Hearing Shearer sounding like he was going to pop a vessel did give me the occasional chuckle.
After trying to con us that Trent was good last time out, he admitted it wasn't working.
After trying to con us that Trent was good last time out, he admitted it wasn't working.
We look one of the worst teams in the tournament, Palmer and Gordon must be wondering if they will ever get a chance to prove themselves
I don't get how you can say that about Mainoo. He's been one of the best players on the pitch against both City and Liverpool this season yet Serbia and Denmark are too much for him?
What’s the consensus on England starting well but then seeming to take their foot off the accelerator letting the opposition into their last 3 euro games (Italy, Serbia, Denmark)?
The problem is the coach. All the players play in well coached sides with good managers & tactics.
Lesser teams look more cohesive and coached than this ultra-talented squad.
Lesser teams look more cohesive and coached than this ultra-talented squad.
I mean the person you quoted said Jordan Henderson and James Ward Prowse would be an improvement, can't really take that post seriously
Pickford
Walker Stones Guehi TAA
Rice
Mainoo Bellingham
Saka Kane Foden
Walker Stones Guehi TAA
Rice
Mainoo Bellingham
Saka Kane Foden
It's because he's had some of the best/most well rounded squads of any of these managers.
-Top goalscorer in Europe with 2 top PL strikers as backup
-One of the best RW in europe
-PL POTY
- La Liga POTY
- Probably the second best DM in the world right now behind Rodri
- Best creative right back in PL history
- Elite defensive right back
- UCL winning CB
- Some of the top young players in the world at LW and CM
In reality the main weaknesses of the squad on paper are LW (which would another real strength is rashford was himself, but without him it's just young promising players), and LB. LB is obviously a huge hole without Shaw, but Southgate knew for months that there was a real possibility he'd be without Shaw, and any half decent fecking manager would have planned for those contingincies before players even arrived in the summer.
Instead of getting creative or formulating some plans to get the best out of some of his best players and the team as a whole though, he's instead run a cookie cutter setup and then proceeded to put square pegs in round holes and hope everything works out. There's no real deeper thought put into his selection, he just picks big names along with a few players he's comfortable with and that's it.
So Spain can play a young 16 year old diamond in Yamal but Southgate do not have the balls to play Mainoo but play your best rb in midfield. Wonder how and why Ashworth rates this clown.
See .. I didn’t think they started all that well. I think they got lucky on the goal and looked otherwise disjointed, sloppy and clueless … which was then made worse by trying to defend the lead.
You’d have to think it’s the managers instructions. It boggled the minds when they had Italy on the rack in the final and now I see it happening again and again. For me, with their talent,, their best plan would be to go forward.
Walker is arguably the best RB in PL history, and has been one of England's most consistent performers for many years, and is still a very top quality RB in the present day
Walker is clearly problematic in his personal life, but why on earth would you want to drop one of the best right backs in the world for a bloke who can't defend? Walker is one of the least pressing issues in the mess of a team.
I'd want to get him in for set pieces mostly. I'd probably be playing something closer to Klopp gegenpressing and have him throwing the ball forward pretty much all day. I'd probably try and get Walker in so i could play a really, really high line but i'd probably be in more of a 352 or have him as a left back. I'm not sure he needs to be on the right wing to cover passes in behind.
I dont know what Southgates plan is. He isn't really taking advantage of either. Or anyone else in the team.
England’s only real hope at this point is for Southgate to adopt a fairly vanilla but much more sensible selection that will at least give the side some ability to use the whole pitch and progress the ball against the press.
Gordon in, Foden out. Mainoo or Wharton in for Trent in midfield. Shaw if fit in for Trippier.
If you are chasing a match, Trent in for Walker at RB and either Foden or Palmer in for Mainoo/Wharton. Otherwise go mainly like for like with fresh attackers and fresh legs next to Rice after 60-70 minutes.
Its not rocket science.
Gordon in, Foden out. Mainoo or Wharton in for Trent in midfield. Shaw if fit in for Trippier.
If you are chasing a match, Trent in for Walker at RB and either Foden or Palmer in for Mainoo/Wharton. Otherwise go mainly like for like with fresh attackers and fresh legs next to Rice after 60-70 minutes.
Its not rocket science.
This is true too. Go for a sensible selection and most of the problems will fix themselves.
International call-ups are earned, not entitled. Even Messi and Ronaldo have earned it with their careers.
Yeah he doesn't deserve it based on club form but you really need to have some tactical variety. The spots are not there to just fill them up with like 5 identical players who played well for their clubs without taking into account what tactical situations might be relevant in a tournament.
If his option #1 when faced with trouble is to sit in a low block and counter, you absolutely need someone like Rashford in there. He is still elite at running in behind and finishing.
Just to balance that I’m not purely Chelsea biased on the Bowen selection… Gallagher is NOT the midfielder you put on to make things in midfield more fluid and stable. Hes a human chaos machine; all running, kicking, and yellow cards. Half his won balls are balls he lost. Bowen is the Winger version of Gallagher.
Southgate seems to think England has to be a brute force, defensive, harassing team that overcomes better teams.
The Kalvin Phillips comment alone shows you what he mistakenly thinks England is.
England CAN play through teams. They have the players to do it. They have players that play for elite, technical teams and managers. They just need a manager that believes in them and lets them play.
Southgate seems to think England has to be a brute force, defensive, harassing team that overcomes better teams.
The Kalvin Phillips comment alone shows you what he mistakenly thinks England is.
England CAN play through teams. They have the players to do it. They have players that play for elite, technical teams and managers. They just need a manager that believes in them and lets them play.
Walker's a better right back than Alexander-Arnold. There's no footballing reason to drop him.
I am not sure if starting Bellingham ahead of Foden as #10 is a good idea. Bellingham is an attacking midfielder, Foden is better at creating chances.
But is Marcus Rashford in any way a preferred option to Cole Palmer? Based on last season's form, not reputation from seasons past.
I don't think so.
It's a mental thing at first then after that they were gassed defending so much. 3-4 England players were basically laying on the pitch at full time
feck does that have to do with you?
Southgate has generally struggled to get the best out of Foden, and with Englands setup i don't think it's much of a surprise. Kane likes to drop deep, Bellingham goes where? Leaves little space and movement for Foden to be effective.
It is a tad impressive that he's managed to introduce a strategy that doesn't get the best out of any of Englands star players. Drop Foden the bench and bring on someone that can make run ins behind from a wide position, play Bellingham higher up the pitch and why on earth do you need Alexander Arnold in a system where he already has Bellingham, Foden, Saka to play the creative roles. There's no immediate need for a central midfielder like him, you just need a mobile centre midfield duo good at ball retention that can play the easy passes to the attacking players.
It is a tad impressive that he's managed to introduce a strategy that doesn't get the best out of any of Englands star players. Drop Foden the bench and bring on someone that can make run ins behind from a wide position, play Bellingham higher up the pitch and why on earth do you need Alexander Arnold in a system where he already has Bellingham, Foden, Saka to play the creative roles. There's no immediate need for a central midfielder like him, you just need a mobile centre midfield duo good at ball retention that can play the easy passes to the attacking players.
Is it definite that it's not this Gareth doing the tactics?
Its a travesty that Southgate is playing Trent in midfield all the while having the likes of Palmer and Mainoo on the bench.
How this absolute chancer is still in the job is beyond me. We should have fired him after the last world cup. I was calling for his sacking after the Euros debacle.
Speaks volumes of the absolute incompetence of our FA.
We've got champions league winners, golden boot winners etc. but this helmet has the lack of awareness to complain about missing kalvin facking phillips in midfield
Tells you all you need to know about his level.
I'd cry if it wasn't so funny.
Speaks volumes of the absolute incompetence of our FA.
We've got champions league winners, golden boot winners etc. but this helmet has the lack of awareness to complain about missing kalvin facking phillips in midfield
Tells you all you need to know about his level.
I'd cry if it wasn't so funny.
And there in lies the failure. Because England CAN brute force teams if Southgate wished.
Roll out a midfield and attack of Gordon/Watkins/Saka/Bellingham/Wharton or Mainoo/Rice and press super high up and they’d be a nightmare to play against with easily enough quality to still hurt you in the final third. You’d have athleticism/pace/ and physicality in abundance to do so.
The problem is it’s clear he doesn’t wish to go that gung ho when out of possession. So England tends to drop deeper instead, yet still fields a team of technicians and half space players without any real outlet to counter nor any quality progressive midfielders from deep. It’s similar to United of this past year in that the team appears like an amoeba of contrasting styles and philosophies with a manager that is unsure how he really wants to play.
Either play a more conventional setup and get runners off of Kane and a solid midfield and look for transitions. Or commit to a more modern style of controlling the game in the opponents half with good ball playing from deep and excellent technicians in the final third. But you can’t do a little of both or it ends up looking like the Denmark match with a bunch of players occupying each others spaces and unsure of what the should be doing.
Finishing second would be a disaster for England, as that would mean playing Germany who are looking surprisingly strong.
This is embarrassing.
JWP would be though. A good portion of our tournament goals under The Gate have come from set pieces and JWP is a specialist. He's also a proper midfielder.I mean the person you quoted said Jordan Henderson and James Ward Prowse would be an improvement, can't really take that post seriously
As United fans, we should know better. It's not a personnel problem it's a coaching problem. We see this week in week out. It doesn't matter how good the players are if they're badly coached they're going to stink the place out. When some of these players go back to their clubs they'll be back to putting in better performances like when players leave our club they go on to have decent careers. Mainoo isn't going to save the say unfortunately.
Manchester United: Available personnel problem
England: One of the strongest national team squads in the world.
Mainoo isn't too young or inexperienced to be able to play well in this tournament, if you look at how others with similar or even less experience are kicking on (Yamal and Güler for example). It's only understandable peopel are asking for him to start (or at least feature) given how your midfield has looked, but I'm afraid he wouldn't solve the underlying issues as he'd probably look as clueless as the others on the pitch, and it's simply due to (lack of) tactics for me.
The substitutions last night also show that Southgate doesn't really have a clue on how to use his players. No wonder they all stand out for their own team under the likes of Pep, Klopp, Arteta, Emery, Ancelotti, and then look worse than players of Serbia and Denmark in this tournament. Good thing is that they are almost all young enough to flourish under your next manager but even then the 2021 Euros and Qatar WC are excellent opportunities which have been thrown away because of the FA keeping Southgate in position too long.
The substitutions last night also show that Southgate doesn't really have a clue on how to use his players. No wonder they all stand out for their own team under the likes of Pep, Klopp, Arteta, Emery, Ancelotti, and then look worse than players of Serbia and Denmark in this tournament. Good thing is that they are almost all young enough to flourish under your next manager but even then the 2021 Euros and Qatar WC are excellent opportunities which have been thrown away because of the FA keeping Southgate in position too long.
Biggest mistake was leaving Rashford at home. That one I don't get. Your best team over the last year was Rashford-Jude-Saka behind Kane. I get he's had a poor season and Foden and Palmer have been great and you have to try them out, but still, at least leave yourself the option of a go-to lineup you know would work
Midfield and LB, I dunno. Aside from Mainoo and Wharton, who else is there that's been ignored? The latter two are both really young and weren't really an option until March, so, it's kinda understandable the manager may not fully trust them(he doesn't have a choice anymore though at this point. Surely) - though instisting with Trent was an abomination after the Serbia game made it patently clear that he can't start there. He hasn't got a clue. When he inverts for Liverpool it's usually after they've consolidated possession, so he doesn't receive the ball on the turn under pressure, and then the knows how to fit within their play. He's in there for his passing and yet was consistently ahead of the ball in these games, how does that make sense...
I digress. Point is midfield has indeed been a problem for England over the last year - that the options that should fix it are an 18 and a 20 year old with a season or less of top flight experience is proof of that, no matter how good you think they are - and I'm not sure Southgate actually could do much more about it going into the euros
LB, I see people mentioning a couple names so maybe that was an area where more could have been done. Dunno.
I think he should've just called and then played Rashford, would have gone a long way to fix a lot of the issues. That said I also think England is overrated quite a bit. Exceptional players but the best don't really fit particularly well together. A strong defence and relying on one of those attacking players to find a goal is probably your best option. Kinda like France. I don't think England have the players to play like Spain or Germany
Midfield and LB, I dunno. Aside from Mainoo and Wharton, who else is there that's been ignored? The latter two are both really young and weren't really an option until March, so, it's kinda understandable the manager may not fully trust them(he doesn't have a choice anymore though at this point. Surely) - though instisting with Trent was an abomination after the Serbia game made it patently clear that he can't start there. He hasn't got a clue. When he inverts for Liverpool it's usually after they've consolidated possession, so he doesn't receive the ball on the turn under pressure, and then the knows how to fit within their play. He's in there for his passing and yet was consistently ahead of the ball in these games, how does that make sense...
I digress. Point is midfield has indeed been a problem for England over the last year - that the options that should fix it are an 18 and a 20 year old with a season or less of top flight experience is proof of that, no matter how good you think they are - and I'm not sure Southgate actually could do much more about it going into the euros
LB, I see people mentioning a couple names so maybe that was an area where more could have been done. Dunno.
I think he should've just called and then played Rashford, would have gone a long way to fix a lot of the issues. That said I also think England is overrated quite a bit. Exceptional players but the best don't really fit particularly well together. A strong defence and relying on one of those attacking players to find a goal is probably your best option. Kinda like France. I don't think England have the players to play like Spain or Germany
He's not getting ahead of Walker, so if you're already bringing Trippier too, he's a pointless inclusion.
I also don't buy the hype over his supposed playmaking abilities. At Liverpool, the system helps create space for him to just spam crosses to (what was) an absolutely world class forward line.
That's a very objective assessment.
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