Oh yeah of course. But productive enough to drop Saka?
Some games yes. But mostly no.
Really weird player.
England Euro 2024 Squad and Discussion
- Thread starter BabySinclair
- Start date
- Status
Oh yeah of course. But productive enough to drop Saka?
Some games yes. But mostly no.
Really weird player.
Yep, agree with all of that. For me Bellingham and Foden are Gerrard and Lampard and just don’t think they should start together.
I would agree. So its just a situation where a good club player doesnt fit into his national teams plans. Has been the same across lots of countries for eons. Why he is playing him in midfield is an absolute mind boggler
Yeah I agree. Thats all thats been going for us - individuals. We look a small side out there now and no threat from set pieces which was another focus of our goalscoring under him at previous tournaments as well.
I don't think Trent has the physicality to effectively play as a RWB. Personally, I think he should just be back up to Walker in case we're losing and are chasing a game.
This will put him back in his Liverpool role and this is basically the side I'd put out if I was the coach. You can give TAA that freedom to roam into midfield. Rice in the #8 role where he excels and a DM in Wharton to balance it out. Gordon to add pace to stretch it out a bit.
I actually disagree. Rice/Stones/Mainoo(or Wharton/ and Saka all can cover enough for Trent not being a workhorse in that aspect. And he’d bring a wide creator/deep passer that the team otherwise doesn’t have. It just can’t be him in midfield, he lacks all of the other qualities you need to play there.
Yeah I was thinking Palmer seems more likely to have the kind of good arrogance you need in that situation. Southgate just has no idea what to do with all the attacking midfielders he has at his disposal, so left him on the bench in exchange for Bowen who holds the width and runs behind more. Which is dumb when you think about, because Walker offers that from RB, whereas we had no width on the left all game except for Trippier cutting back onto his right foot.
Given there's no left back fit, Southgate should have played Trent as an inverted left back stteping into midfield, Saka left wing to stretch the play, Foden (or Palmer) cutting in from the right wing with Walker providing width from RB. Take your pick of Gallagher, Mainoo or Wharton to play in the middle, it'd work with either choice.
I think this is the only way to accommodate TAA effectively. You could also use Konsa at LB too.
The problem is Shaw may be back soon and Kyle Walker exists. TAA isn't the far and away best RB that we should be tailoring the tactics for him.
Pickford
Walker Stones Guehi
Trent Bellingham Rice Saka/Gordon
Palmer Foden
Kane
...you're welcome GarethWalker Stones Guehi
Trent Bellingham Rice Saka/Gordon
Palmer Foden
Kane
I think in that setup you’d be better off having Watkins up top and upping the intensity. That midfield 3 should dominate physically and if you had those 3 forwards also pressing ahead of them you’d create a shitload of turnovers high up the pitch. Sure you lose a bit of clinical finishing benching Kane but the shape and spacing of the team makes far more sense and you become a much greater transition threat.
Thought about this, but if that’s the setup you wanted to run you’re better off benching Jude and playing Wharton or Mainoo there.
Jude isn’t some ball progression 8 that’s going to be positionally disciplined, he’s much more of a final third player so in that sort of setup I’d rather have Whartons passing or Mainoos elite dribbling/press resistance to keep things ticking over instead. But this is certainly the only setup where I think Palmer and Foden could both start.
Him and Belligham are tactical problems IMO
Disagree about Bellingham. The matter needs stern coaching and I don’t think Southgate even knows what he wants Jude to do. Evidenced by Kane dropping deep into the same space.
So shit.
There is a choice to be made between Foden and Jude. Gordon needs to be given that LW
As someone who has seen alot of Bowen in the last few years, that was 100% a shaky game from him, his general level has definately been higher than that. Take from someone who watches him week in and week out.
With that being said, I want to see Palmer get a good run out, there is clearly talent there. Bowen probably a better fit for a team that is containing the game vs a game we are chasing but Palmer is the way forward next match.
Sacrilegious to suggest. But play Gordon and Bowen left/right and you can afford Foden and Bellingham license to bomb forward.
Means dropping Saka and he’s often our best player, but two hard working wingers facilitates our two best midfielders.
I’d give it a go.
The Trent at right back doing his thing works on paper v Denmark , how does it work against Nico Williams , mbappe , doku even?
Rashford would do a better job if this is how Southgate intended to use Foden. He's been poor, but he's not getting the best use of him.
Trent isn't a midfielder, so his failings there are totally predictable.
This is all so predictable and frustrating. All this talent, and we see this dross instead?
Trent isn't a midfielder, so his failings there are totally predictable.
This is all so predictable and frustrating. All this talent, and we see this dross instead?
TAA and Foden out, Mainoo and Bowen in. Personally think its that simple to see a huge improvement.
I have to say I struggle to be that arsed about England when there’s no Utd players in there (arguably the same for any team). I’d probably rather Portugal win it with Dalot if Bruno staring.
Under Martinez? I don’t know if he has more convictions than Southgate tbh, suspect both teams will adjust in survival mode and hope for the best until they face the top teams on the knockout stages.
Wouldn't that isolate Rice defensively ?
No I agree Martinez is shite. They probably won’t win it either. My point is I’m a Utd fan above anything else. I like England I like the national fever caused by England winning, but I struggle to care that much if I’m not rooting for English Utd players in the team. We don’t have anyone in the team. If Mainoo was playing (he should be) I’d be much more emotionally invested in England winning. As it is, I’d probably rather Portugal win it for Bruno and Dalot.,
I actually disagree with this, which is probably unpopular on here. But whilst the imbalance is comparable, I think it's a system issue in both cases. Lampard and Gerrard absolutely could have played together. A midfield three with those two plus Carrick would have got the best out of them. The problem was playing them as a duo in a midfield two (despite both playing as the most advanced midfielders for their clubs).
The balance is off with Foden and Bellingham currently, but a good manager would pick a system that would get them both playing well together. For starters, playing a left footer as an inverted left wing is pretty awkward. This is exacerbated by having a right footed LB so there's no natural width at all. Saka LW and Foden RW would make far more sense given the full backs available. And a midfielder like Mainoo who can play tight give and goes with Foden. Not Trent, who would need runners behind so he can ping some long balls to be effective. Or Gordon/Eze LW, Foden #10 and Jude #8.
Southgate is a plum. His comments about having no left back and missing Kalvin Phillips show the flaws with his mindset. Excuses. He picks the system and its not working. Injuries make it difficult but there's plenty of options available. He jumped straight to face saving excuses because he doesn't know how to deal with it, doesnt recognise what's wrong and certainly doesn't know how to fix it.
Not with Walker, Bowen, Trippier and Gordon putting in a shift.
To think that there were rumours that we wanted Southgate to replace ETH are insane.
The fact that Southgate is so out of touch with club level management of players shines through with his blind tactical know how - he really doesn’t understand how to get the best out of a bunch of good players.
Any decent manager would work wonders with this team. Its failings and ultimate exit will be down to his lack of tactical experience at the crucial times once again.
It is one thing being lauded for creating harmony and pride within the squad - it’s another making the right calls, the big calls, in game to change the course at the right times. For this he fails time and time again.
The fact that Southgate is so out of touch with club level management of players shines through with his blind tactical know how - he really doesn’t understand how to get the best out of a bunch of good players.
Any decent manager would work wonders with this team. Its failings and ultimate exit will be down to his lack of tactical experience at the crucial times once again.
It is one thing being lauded for creating harmony and pride within the squad - it’s another making the right calls, the big calls, in game to change the course at the right times. For this he fails time and time again.
In a functioning side, rashford is generally the last person you would want on your team. In our complete shambles of a team, playing the football match equivalent of a mass panic attack, I agree this is probably where Rashford would shine.
I think this is our best and most balanced team. The left side has been a farce in both games and needs balancing, along with one of Wharton / Mainoo to bring composure in the middle of the park.
Pickford
Walker - Stones - Guehi
TAA — Mainoo -- Rice — Saka
Bellingham -- Foden
Kane
Walker - Stones - Guehi
TAA — Mainoo -- Rice — Saka
Bellingham -- Foden
Kane
Impossible this wasn't sanctioned by the player right ?
I'd like to think it's as simple as changing a few players but I think the problem is more fundamental in that our manager doesn't have any clue how he wants the team to play.
Pretty much every other team has a system and plays/functions as a unit. England have a bunch of individuals who are either all ignoring the plan or haven't been told what the plan is.
Pretty much every other team has a system and plays/functions as a unit. England have a bunch of individuals who are either all ignoring the plan or haven't been told what the plan is.
Join the club, I'm almost sixty and so stupid I didn't learn from 74, 78, the first world cups I followed. And then 94, the only time I've been living in the host country.
Today was dire, so slow. The couple of times we played faster it looked better.
That's not a bad shout at all
I think one problem is that Southgate has picked Mainoo and Wharton and he doesn't trust either of them because he's barely played them.
I'd give Palmer a go, he was excellent anytime I saw him the past season.
England have qualified for the knockout stages whilst barely scratching their potential, it shouldn't take a lot to get them playing much better.
I'd give Palmer a go, he was excellent anytime I saw him the past season.
England have qualified for the knockout stages whilst barely scratching their potential, it shouldn't take a lot to get them playing much better.
Everyone can see that problem is central midfield right now. It dosen’t work. Mainoo is to young for this stage. I have no idea what Wharton is doing in the squad. Rice don’t have that quality. Bellingham is big tactical problem. Arnold is no central midfielder. Southgate could have taken Henderson and Prowes which both would have improved midfield. Both in quality and leadership. To late for that now.
He looked fecking rattled/lost in the ITV interview that I saw.
Lamine yamal is 16 seems to be doing alright, is he too young too?
I've disliked a lot of England managers in my time, but its weird that Southgate takes the top prize given the success we've actually had under him.
It's obvious we're not winning under him and we're wasting yet another tournament.
It's obvious we're not winning under him and we're wasting yet another tournament.
- Status