England Euro 2024 Squad and Discussion

[Yagami]

We'll be knocked out by the first good side we play. As per usual.

Without a doubt, and hopefully that will be Southgate's last game.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

How many players is he rotating, 7 or 8 attackers should have been sufficient as quite a few of them can play in multiple positions. I would argue another defender was essential.

I'd argue it isn't. They will hardly be much rotation at the back and they are unlikely to get injured or suspended. In attack though, players WILL have to be rested if the groups are wrapped up quick. Plus used so that they are ready to be options in the knockouts. Not forgetting that due to the depth of quality in attack. They are rightly plenty of "horses for courses". Not to mention.a good number of game changers to choose from to change courses of games.

Its strange to see England fans suddenly hung up about taking less defenders and midfielders yet last tournament Southgate was abused left and right for picking more defensive players.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Especially Rashford who has played for England since he was 18.

Rashford has been in garbage form. Including him would have been a straight up footballing crime.

 

[Eplel]

Why do we need a press release from every single player that didn't make it?

 

[noodlehair]

Considering only 3 from Bowen, Eze, Foden, Gordon, Kane, Palmer, Saka, Toney and Watkins can play and a further 3 for subs to take 9 players for 3 positions is stupid when other areas are lacking depth.

*looks at defense*

Cooool.....

*goes and places large bet on England not to win Euro 2024*

 

[AfonsoAlves]

For people saying that england's squad is paper thin, which team has more depth?

You can't argue that for example Eze, Kane, Toney, Watkins, Saka, Foden, Bowen, Gordon, Palmer has "no depth".

Portugal's backups are Conceicao, Neto, Ramos, Jota and Felix. Bowen and Gordon have had better seasons than any of the guys here. So have Eze and Watkins.

France's backups are Muani, Barcola, Thuram, Coman and Giroud. How many of these guys had great seasons? Thuram had a decent one. Muani did alright, Barcola was a bench warmer, Coman has been horrible this season.

If you are saying England are thin because of Wharton, Mainoo etc in the team, why does the same argument not persist for France and Portugal who have Joao Neves, Zaire Emery in the team?

 

[AfonsoAlves]

Also don't understand the comments about England's defense on paper.

England have had a lot of frustration under Southgate, but when on earth has defensive fragility been one of them?

Do England's squad have to be like prime Spain in depth for them to be rated?

Even then, Spain had some very weak positions (like not even having a forward in 2012), having to rely on Joan Capdevilla and having some pretty poor forward backups like Negredo, Llorente and Soldado.

 

[IRELANDUNITED]

Wait, hold on. I’m only realising now. Joe fecking Gomez made the squad. How in the name of god has that happened?

 

[AfonsoAlves]

Wait, hold on. I’m only realising now. Joe fecking Gomez made the squad. How in the name of god has that happened?

Do you watch Liverpool games? He's been pretty good for them.

Back in the Capello, Sven, Hodgeson and McClaren days, we used to complain that we only selected "the boys", the high reputation players.

Now we're dropping them for lack of substance on the pitch and putting out the guys who are in form, people are complaining about their lack of reputation.

 

[Trequarista10]

Extremely poor is a bit harsh. Still all Premier League defenders with good repuations.

Yeah it's contextual though. For a side talked about as one of the favourites, it's extremely poor.

 

[Patchbeard]

Despite him being utter shite for us for 15 months.... I still would've taken Rashford and not one of Bowen/Toney/Watkins (in that order) purely because Rashford has always been dangerous at international level, whereas Bowen & Watkins looks like deers in the highlights and Toney has also been mostly shite since returning from his ban.

Bowen is an odd one as he looks great for West Ham against big teams, but seems to shit the bed every time he puts on an England shirt.

 

[Reapersoul20]

Nailed on to win it

 

[croadyman]

He took Dunk over Branthwaite my god

Apparently Southgate felt he wasn't ready yet, however also seen a suggestion he has kept Dunk due to Maguire injury. So IF Maguire had been fit then Branthwaite would have gone too.

 

[LInkash]

Wait, hold on. I’m only realising now. Joe fecking Gomez made the squad. How in the name of god has that happened?

He can play left back, which is especially useful in this squad as Shaw is recovering from injury and Trippier has only just got back from injury.

 

[croadyman]

Think the left side of attack lacks threat, it's not Eze's natural position but he is excellent and I view Gordon being standoffish under the pressure of the tournament.

Bellingham should realistically be deployed as an 8 as opposed to a forward, I think the midfield is more balanced and has composure if he's in it.

Defence doesn't look great I think Brainthwaite and Tomori offer more. Strange Tomori doesn't get a look-in for a team that finished second in their domestic league. If he was playing in England for a top eight I reckon he goes.

I would fully expect to see Tomori, White, Colwill and Branthwaite all to be around this squad for the World Cup qualifying campaign once Southgate is gone. Maybe then we will have strong options in all positions for 2026. Although knowing this nation we will find some way to pick faults.

 

[Kirk lazarus]

I think Eze has been taken as a serious starting option .

I hope so anyway . He makes things happen . He always has .

 

[ayushreddevil9]

In the 33?

No, final squad

 

[Maluco]

I can’t honestly believe that people are arguing that Rashford should have gone. The likes of Bowen, Eze and Gordon have had great seasons and the likes of Foden and Palmer are on another planet.

There is no way that choice wouldn’t have been criticized and there is no real argument as to why he should have gone ahead of any of those players.

He has been awful and, as someone who cares much more about United, I hope it’s the wake up call/rest that he needs to get back to his best.

 

[AfonsoAlves]

Yeah it's contextual though. For a side talked about as one of the favourites, it's extremely poor.

Is it any worse than France/Portugal's defenders?

• DF: Nelson Semedo (Wolves)
• DF: Antonio Silva (Benfica)
• DF: Danilo Pereira (PSG)
• DF: Joao Cancelo (Barcelona)
• DF: Ruben Dias (Manchester City)
• DF: Pepe (Porto)
• DF: Goncalo Inacio (Sporting Lisbon)
• DF: Diogo Dalot (Manchester United)
• DF: Nuno Mendes (PSG)

• DF: Ibrahima Konate (Liverpool)
• DF: William Saliba (Arsenal)
• DF: Jules Kounde (Barcelona)
• DF: Dayot Upamecano (Bayern Munich)
• DF: Jonathan Clauss (Marseille)
• DF: Benjamin Pavard (Inter Milan)
• DF: Theo Hernandez (AC Milan)
• DF: Ferland Mendy (Real Madrid)

Portugal has Ruben Dias who is fantastic. Are the talented but relatively unproven Silva, Inacio who plays in the Portugese league really better than Guehi, Konsa, Dunk? 40 year of Pepe is still going to get minutes.
Do you think that Cancelo, Dalot are really better than Walker and Shaw? do you really rate Nelson Semedo and Nuno Mendes higher than Trippier and Konsa?
I don't know why Danilo is listed as DF, he's more or a central midfielder now to be honest.

Let's do the same for France. Theres is slightly better, but again, i don't think the difference between Saliba, Upamecano, Mendy/Hernandez and Pavard is really that much to England's first choice. Upamecano has had a dreadful season.
I would rather than Konate, Kounde over Gomez and Dunk, yes.

The differences are nowhere close to what you're making them out to be.

 

[croadyman]

I can’t honestly believe that people are arguing that Rashford should have gone. The likes of Bowen, Eze and Gordon have had great seasons and the likes of Foden and Palmer are on another planet.

There is no way that choice wouldn’t have been criticized and there is no real argument as to why he should have gone ahead of any of those players.

He has been awful and, as someone who cares much more about United, I hope it’s the wake up call/rest that he needs to get back to his best.

Only has himself to blame for just jogging through games, he put more into places like Newcastle away and he is guaranteed on that plane.

 

[MrVolante]

The defence is actually really good on paper IF players are fit. Shaw is really good and proven effective at international level, Stones is a brilliant centre back, Walker is the best right back in the world and Guehi is a really talented CB who has pace. The issue is uncertainty, lack of games and lack of fitness. Guehi injured most of the season, Stones out for large parts of it, Shaw also out for most of the season. As far as I know Stones/Guehi have never even partnered each other, let alone for any long period of time. Only Walker is someone we have no real questions marks over. If we can't get Shaw fit then the choice to have no other left back is baffling. Even if it is just Hall or Mitchell, having the tactical option of a left-footed fullback to overlap and create width should be there and is more important than a 3rd choice RW. Trippier is a great set-piece taker and a wonderful crosser, he is not a left back.

Relationships of some kind, especially in international football where games are few and far between, are so key as well. It's why Maguire starting as long as he was fit, doing reasonably well for England and there was no obvious top level alternative made total sense. The other question mark for me (and maybe someone who follows Serie A could answer) is how Tomori has been shunned so poorly. I won't claim to watch him regularly, but a regular starter for A.C Milan is surely playing at a level where he should be getting more consideration than Lewis Dunk.

Ultimately think the tournament is a coin toss. We have incredible talent, some players I genuinely rate incredibly highly and we have really quality and variation throughout much of the pitch. Lots of really clever footballers too, not speed merchants but very clever, mature players who are very technically assured. But we also have a few positions with zero depth, and they all happen to be in defensive areas. Winning a tournament without a stable, reliable defence is next to impossible so we need pretty much all the first choice players to be fit for the knockouts. And then we're relying on them to not be incredibly rusty despite barely playing .. which is a huge ask.

 

[Trequarista10]

Is it any worse than France/Portugal's defenders?

Yes.

Do you think that Cancelo, Dalot are really better than Walker and Shaw?

Given Shaw isn't fit, and tends to take time to reach form, yes. I said England's RB is not a problem.

do you really rate Nelson Semedo and Nuno Mendes higher than Trippier and Konsa?

Don't particularly rate Trippier as a LB. He's also, like most of England's defenders, barely back from injury. Konsa seems to be going as 2nd choice RB, despite being the 4th best RB in the squad (arguably 5th, as he might also be behind our 2nd/3rd choice CB in Gomez).

Backup full-backs aren't as significant as starting CBs, and England's starting CBs are poor aside from Stones. Even Stones' best attribute is on the ball, so he's less effective for England than City anyway, and isn't so good defensively that he can compensate for his CB partner.

 

[MrVolante]

Yes.



Given Shaw isn't fit, and tends to take time to reach form, yes. I said England's RB is not a problem.



Don't particularly rate Trippier as a LB. He's also, like most of England's defenders, barely back from injury. Konsa seems to be going as 2nd choice RB, despite being the 4th best RB in the squad (arguably 5th, as he might also be behind our 2nd/3rd choice CB in Gomez).

Backup full-backs aren't as significant as starting CBs, and England's starting CBs are poor aside from Stones. Even Stones' best attribute is on the ball, so he's less effective for England than City anyway, and isn't so good defensively that he can compensate for his CB partner.

Stones is very effective for England. He's been huge for us in tournaments defensively. We also have the best right-back in the world defensively (who happens to be his City teammate) so there's that. I wouldn't swap our right side of defence (Stones & Walker) with any nations options.

Left side is yeah, an issue. Although I think you're harsh in calling it poor, Guehi is a good defender who could easily play for a top team. Left back is definitely an issue, although Shaw has been excellent for England so its down to whether or not he can find any rhythm. I think the issues are overstated (France will start Upamecano, who is a clown who found himself behind Dier, and probably Konate who had an awful season, Theo who can't defend to save his life and Pavard who is straight up average) but for sure there are question marks.

 

[AfonsoAlves]

Yes.



Given Shaw isn't fit, and tends to take time to reach form, yes. I said England's RB is not a problem.



Don't particularly rate Trippier as a LB. He's also, like most of England's defenders, barely back from injury. Konsa seems to be going as 2nd choice RB, despite being the 4th best RB in the squad (arguably 5th, as he might also be behind our 2nd/3rd choice CB in Gomez).

Backup full-backs aren't as significant as starting CBs, and England's starting CBs are poor aside from Stones. Even Stones' best attribute is on the ball, so he's less effective for England than City anyway, and isn't so good defensively that he can compensate for his CB partner.

Clearly you haven't watched Cancelo for Barca this season. He's been awful. I would take a half fit Shaw over Cancelo



Read the reaction on the barca subreddit towards Cancelo potentially staying:
tldr, "The guy literally cannot defend"



You're completely missing the point. I'm not asking you if there are better England fullbacks unavailable or better England CB's that are unavailable. I'm asking you, given your claim this England team is weak, to compare it to the other heavy favourite squads.

Konsa is not the 2nd choice when everyone is fit, but ffs he's still better than Nelson Semedo. They both played in the same league. The difference between them is night and day. You might not rate Trippier at LB but the reality is he's better than Nuno Mendes.

Let me give you a little context: Nuno Mendes who is Portugals 2nd choice LB has played a total of 6 league games this season and started 2 of them. He has played 260 minutes of league football this season. In his 4 substitute appearances he was so bad he was removed from the squad for the rest of the season.

 

[njred]

I gotta say I am surprised Maguire was left out. I thought he had strong season after being a flop at the start for united.

 

[ayushreddevil9]

England fans over the years - "We have not done well in tournaments because we picked players based on reputation and not from"

Also England fans - "Grealish and Rashford should have been included"

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

England fans over the years - "We have not done well in tournaments because we picked players based on reputation and not from"

Also England fans - "Grealish and Rashford should have been included"

I think most only think Rashford should have been included because of the profile of what he brings to the squad. You basically have one running threat now in Gordon among all of the attackers. International football is often played in transition and having those types of players can win you matches.

Obviously on merit Rashford would hardly deserve to be called up for Scotland much less England.

 

[Judas]

Unless Maguire is very very injured, weird not to take him.

I'm oddly underwhelmed by the squad we're taking, for all the talent we have, that midfield and defence just....isn't doing it for me.

 

[TheGame]

I'd argue it isn't. They will hardly be much rotation at the back and they are unlikely to get injured or suspended. In attack though, players WILL have to be rested if the groups are wrapped up quick. Plus used so that they are ready to be options in the knockouts. Not forgetting that due to the depth of quality in attack. They are rightly plenty of "horses for courses". Not to mention.a good number of game changers to choose from to change courses of games.

Its strange to see England fans suddenly hung up about taking less defenders and midfielders yet last tournament Southgate was abused left and right for picking more defensive players.

Southgate was criticised for leaving out players who were in form and rightly so. The issue with the defence is different this time with Maguire injured and a lack of depth and experience. Anyway it’s picked now so will have to see how it all goes.

 

[ayushreddevil9]

I think most only think Rashford should have been included because of the profile of what he brings to the squad. You basically have one running threat now in Gordon among all of the attackers. International football is often played in transition and having those types of players can win you matches.

Obviously on merit Rashford would hardly deserve to be called up for Scotland much less England.

He showed none of that during last season and you just cant hope for him to magically turn up in a major tournament.

Also sets a bad precedent that regardless of how shit you are, you can get picked because you were good at some point in your career. I would take players based on merit as they deserve it more and are in better form. They are far more likely to create something than players who have done feck all in last 12 months.

 

[Member 109952]

Was Eze really that good that you take him over Grealish?
People talk about form but that's too short termism - even during a chunk of last season a lot of people were saying that Grealish was very important to City. He was in their treble win.

I think England have a massive RW problem now. Foden never looks good there, and who else plays there? Gordon? Eze? Too untested.

 

[OT_United]

Was Eze really that good that you take him over Grealish?
People talk about form but that's too short termism - even during a chunk of last season a lot of people were saying that Grealish was very important to City. He was in their treble win.

I think England have a massive RW problem now. Foden never looks good there, and who else plays there? Gordon? Eze? Too untested.

Can only assume you mean LW? As Saka will be nailed on at RW.
I think it will be Gordon at LW when Foden plays central. Foden LW when Bellingham is advanced.

 

[Member 109952]

Can only assume you mean LW? As Saka will be nailed on at RW.
I think it will be Gordon at LW when Foden plays central. Foden LW when Bellingham is advanced.

Yeah LW sorry. I do like Gordon so hopefully it works out. But the attack may be an issue, especially since Saka looked a bit tired for Arsenal at the end of the season. We'll see.

 

[FootballAI]

Was Eze really that good that you take him over Grealish?
People talk about form but that's too short termism - even during a chunk of last season a lot of people were saying that Grealish was very important to City. He was in their treble win.

I think England have a massive RW problem now. Foden never looks good there, and who else plays there? Gordon? Eze? Too untested.

Grealish's form this season has been mediocre. Pep prefers both Doku and Foden for a good reason. Both Gordon and Eze have had a great season, name another pair of LW that is better than them in other national teams? In addition, Palmer can also play there since his left foot is just amazing, but Southgate might have a plan for him to back up Bellingham and Saka.

Overall, both England's wings are superb, I think these are their strongest area. Their CBs and LB are questionable though.

 

[Wumminator]

We'll be knocked out by the first good side we play. As per usual.

That hasn't happened under Southgate at all.

I've been a massive fan of Southgate for England, he has done very well. This squad selection is odd though. He's gone for the 'form' over actual talent which I genuinely think is an issue a lot of England managers fall into, despite the fanbase thinking the exact opposite.

 

[OT_United]

Yeah LW sorry. I do like Gordon so hopefully it works out. But the attack may be an issue, especially since Saka looked a bit tired for Arsenal at the end of the season. We'll see.

The luxury with England’s attack is that if someone isn’t performing there are solid alternatives like Palmer, Eze, Bowen.
The defence is a worry now. If Shaw isn’t fit then Southgate is missing him and Maguire, two of his most reliable players in recent years. The alternatives are average.

 

[Trequarista10]

Clearly you haven't watched Cancelo for Barca this season. He's been awful. I would take a half fit Shaw over Cancelo



Read the reaction on the barca subreddit towards Cancelo potentially staying:
tldr, "The guy literally cannot defend"



You're completely missing the point. I'm not asking you if there are better England fullbacks unavailable or better England CB's that are unavailable. I'm asking you, given your claim this England team is weak, to compare it to the other heavy favourite squads.

Konsa is not the 2nd choice when everyone is fit, but ffs he's still better than Nelson Semedo. They both played in the same league. The difference between them is night and day. You might not rate Trippier at LB but the reality is he's better than Nuno Mendes.

Let me give you a little context: Nuno Mendes who is Portugals 2nd choice LB has played a total of 6 league games this season and started 2 of them. He has played 260 minutes of league football this season. In his 4 substitute appearances he was so bad he was removed from the squad for the rest of the season.

Shaw has equally had poor runs of form, and hasn't kicked a ball for a long time, so yeah I'd have Cancelo over him at the moment. Odds on Shaw being fit for the whole tournament are slim, odds on him being fit and in good form are even thinner. Is Trippier out of position better than Nuno Mendes at LB? Not sure. Doesn't really change how good Trippier is at LB. If other teams have poor defences, it doesn't stop England's defence from being extremely poor.

Backup RB doesn't really matter, England are very stocked at RB. Konsa won't play. Walker will be first choice. If Walker is injured, likely Trippier will switch to RB (in the squad as LB), or Trent will switch to RB (in the squad as a CM). England have the best depth/selection of RBs in the world, possibly one of the best groups of RBs a national team has ever had. But you can only play one of them in their best position at a time.

CB is the biggest problem, which you overlooked. Not sure why you're so aggressively argumentative when you've ignored the core point. And focused almost entirely on Portugal, when there's several sides in the mix.

England's defence is objectively poor. It will need a lot of protection from midfield - either by virtue of a very defensive and cautious set up, or by virtue of dominating possession, or by playing extremely front footed and outscoring opposition. Southgate will opt for the cautious approach, as he couldn't coach a side to be a possession machine or an extravagant attacking side. This means our CMs, and to some extent the wide players and #10, will be stifled, we'll play tentatively, and opposition teams will outsmart us, gain control and craft out opportunities. We'll scrape to the late stages with some tight wins over middling sides, and lose to the first quality opposition. Like Southgate teams always do.

 

[SilentWitness]

Apparently Southgate felt he wasn't ready yet, however also seen a suggestion he has kept Dunk due to Maguire injury. So IF Maguire had been fit then Branthwaite would have gone too.

That's a bullshit quote from Southgate in terms of not being ready yet because he's had a full season at a club in Europe and then a full season in the PL and has been great in both.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Grealish's form this season has been mediocre. Pep prefers both Doku and Foden for a good reason. Both Gordon and Eze have had a great season, name another pair of LW that is better than them in other national teams? In addition, Palmer can also play there since his left foot is just amazing, ......

Honestly he has proven a naturally in every attacking role at Chelsea this season. LW, RW, AM and Cf(false 9)

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

The biggest issue I have with England fans is they think international ball is club football. Plus they seem to think their nation a giant in tournament ball. So rather than looking at the potential of the partnerships and stability the selections can bring to aid their superb attacking players to perform. They are hung up on quality and club like playing philsophies. A disease that murdered the fortunes of the last Golden generation.

In international ball the aim is first to keep the opponent out. Them Maximize your strengths and out score them to advance. For it's pure knock out football. Since recovery from unncessary risk or mistake is rait.
The aim is not to consistently entertain nor to beat up on every team you face. In international tournaments furthermore it's to grow into those 7-8 games as you do so that you peak by the last 2/3. No one can honestly claim Southgate hasn't picked a squad capable of achieving that goal 7-8 times.

As a fan base you only earn the right to demand consistent entertainment and dominance of play if your national team has the kinda international record of Brazil, Germany, Italy etc. Not when you have one trophy, won at home since international ball began. Y'all honestly need to stop complaining and actually get behind your team. Dwell on the actual positives.