England Cricket 2016/17 - Bangladesh, India & West Indies (ODI's only)

He's been the major major positive of the tour for England. Opener we've been looking for since Strauss retired.

If I was being hyper critical of him I'd say the one downer is that he's been a bit too easily bogged down. Its not a massive concern, and he's still learning his game and this will develop naturally, but I'd like to see him become a little better at rotating the strike which I think is really the only thing standing between him and really big hundreds in test cricket.

As long as they keep Bayliss and his 'AGRESSSSSSSSSIOOOOOOOOOON' talk a million miles away from him I'll be happy.
 
England haven't been great this series but have to say that the side has so much potential. Some big plus points to take from this series. Focus needs to be on getting a draw and a win from the remaining test matches. A 4-0 hammering will be embarassing.. they need to knuckle down and try and get a win from the last two matches, they have the talent to do it.. but there needs to be more resistance in the batting, far too many of the guys are abdicating responsibility and bowling wise, need to limit the runs being scored.. wicket taking hasn't been a problem but guys like Kohli have had it far too easy.

Rashid and Haseeb have been brilliant additions. Haseeb's innings with a broken hand.. wow and I think people are getting too worried about his over defensive play. I think on home surfaces and in more balanced conditions, he'll showcase his array of shots more.. he's just easing his way into the team by demonstrating his resilience and keeping it simple. As a youngster growing up in the 20/20 era, I find it very difficult to believe that he's just a mere plodder and when he does go for his shots, he's pretty easy on the eye and has great placement.

Cook, Haseeb, Bairstow, Root, Moeen, Buttler, Stokes, Woakes, Rashid, ???, Anderson.

For me if England can replace Broad with a proper high quality new talent, then they're well set on any surface going forwards. I'd persist with Buttler and let him find his niche.. I'd push Moeen higher up the order and let him construct an innings, and I'd go as far as putting Bairstow at three as he is a very mature batsmen and push Root down to 4 where he can play with more freedom. Problem with him at 3 is that it leads to batting collapses once he is out as psychologically, the opposition get a huge boost from knowing him and Cook are gone.. and England themselves flail without their two premier batsmen at the crease.
 
You can't play Bairstow at 3 if he's going to keep. I'm sure Stewart said he shouldn't bat higher than 5 and he should know if anyone.

Also IMO, Moeen is a #6 at best. He's clearly talented but far too lose in his play.
 
I don't understand how England lost this.. it wasn't a turning pitch at all. I don't see the positives you guys see. I saw a terrible performance on a pitch that had draw written on it.
 
You can't play Bairstow at 3 if he's going to keep. I'm sure Stewart said he shouldn't bat higher than 5 and he should know if anyone.

Also IMO, Moeen is a #6 at best. He's clearly talented but far too lose in his play.

I get that but something does need to be done because the order doesn't work for me at the moment. We lose wickets too quickly and then the likes of Bairstow and Moeen always have to anchor the innings and by then it is usually too late.

Balance in the middle order needs to be one flair player with one long innings type batsmen.. well tbf in this match Moeen and Bairstow played higher up the innings and played shite so you have a point. Dare I say it but KP would be monstrous in such a talented side.
 
I don't understand how England lost this.. it wasn't a turning pitch at all. I don't see the positives you guys see. I saw a terrible performance on a pitch that had draw written on it.

Definitely terrible, England's mental approach to the last two tests has been poor and they have defeated themselves more than the Indians tbh. I do think they'll be better for this series though. Discovering two players who could be legitimate first teamers of the future is still a huge positive for the future.
 
Playing 6 bowlers is unnecessary and a waste of a position. Batty has done nothing in this test and Ali bowled less because of him. Ansari was the same when he played. I know Duckett is off form but I would bring him back for the next test and bat him at 6 as we seem to have no other options and he has the talent which I believe will shine through at some point. For the next test, providing everyone is fit, would go with:

Cook
Hameed
Root
Bairstow
Stokes
Duckett
Buttler
Ali
Rashid
Broad
Anderson

That really bulks up the batting and allows for the use of 5 bowlers which is predominantly what England have been doing anyway.
 
Out of the series. Broken something in his hand, needs an operation.

Ah didn't know that. Well leaves a problem. Calling someone up at this last stage will be a problem. I think then Root has to open as not sure who else can and Woakes can play instead of Hameed as he is still a better batting option than Balance in his current form. It will be difficult for Bairstow to bat at 3 so Ali will need to move up:

Cook
Root
Ali
Bairstow
Stokes
Duckett
Buttler
Woakes
Rashid
Broad
Anderson
 
The pitch has been turning however, has not been unplayable and England's batting has been poor. In the same way, the Indian bowlers have bowled well but England have fallen into the trap of getting bogged down and then increasing the pressure on themselves. In the first test they batted well which then put pressure on India and they have not been able to do that at all. Letting India escape from 150-5 lost the game. England need to get back to basics and look to apply pressure on the bowlers and rotating the strike. Hopefully this has been a useful learning curve in the long run but a dramatic improvement is needed.
 
Ah didn't know that. Well leaves a problem. Calling someone up at this last stage will be a problem. I think then Root has to open as not sure who else can and Woakes can play instead of Hameed as he is still a better batting option than Balance in his current form. It will be difficult for Bairstow to bat at 3 so Ali will need to move up:

Cook
Root
Ali
Bairstow
Stokes
Duckett
Buttler
Woakes
Rashid
Broad
Anderson

I think Duckett's better off opening and hoping he can belt a few quick runs against the pacers than starting against spin in the middle order.

Wonder if they might be tempted to play all their bowlers though is:

Cook
Root
Ali
Bairstow
Stokes
Buttler
Woakes
Rashid
Ansari
Broad
Anderson

really that much weaker than your side with the bat?
 
Given there's a week long gap between now and the next test, England should call up an opener to replace Hameed. Gubbins or Jennings seem to be the options.
 
Given there's a week long gap between now and the next test, England should call up an opener to replace Hameed. Gubbins or Jennings seem to be the options.

Would be my pick.

Still somewhat holding out hope we might start the summer with him at 3.
 
I'd say England have bowled very well in general in all 3 games but the batting has let them down in last 2 games.

The balance is all wrong though. Batty/Ansari shouldn't have played. You don't play six bowlers and if you do you play someone who's actually good. Ideally, you'd have an extra batsman but apparently Ballance is unselectable which begs the question why he was picked in the squad to start of with.

Also worth pointing out that the likes of Aus, SA and NZ played on completely different pitches. These pitches haven't really done much.
Yeap these pitches haven't turned much. In this test England's batting failed big time. You can't score 280 on a decent batting pitch like that one and expect to win.

I really do wonder why Batty was picked. Seemed completely ineffective and Pujara/Kohli were scoring for fun off his bowling.
 
If I was being hyper critical of him I'd say the one downer is that he's been a bit too easily bogged down. Its not a massive concern, and he's still learning his game and this will develop naturally, but I'd like to see him become a little better at rotating the strike which I think is really the only thing standing between him and really big hundreds in test cricket.

As long as they keep Bayliss and his 'AGRESSSSSSSSSIOOOOOOOOOON' talk a million miles away from him I'll be happy.
He's hit more 6's in test cricket now then first class
 
I think Duckett's better off opening and hoping he can belt a few quick runs against the pacers than starting against spin in the middle order.

Wonder if they might be tempted to play all their bowlers though is:

Cook
Root
Ali
Bairstow
Stokes
Buttler
Woakes
Rashid
Ansari
Broad
Anderson

really that much weaker than your side with the bat?

Cannot see what Ansari adds, his bowling wasn't that great. Would rather an extra batsmen played. Was thinking Duckett at number 6 as the ball is usually older by then. His technical skills need improving before he can open.
 
Cannot see what Ansari adds, his bowling wasn't that great. Would rather an extra batsmen played. Was thinking Duckett at number 6 as the ball is usually older by then. His technical skills need improving before he can open.

We may end up doing that because of injuries but I'd hope not. For his own sake.

He looked utterly out of his depth facing spin, his technique was all wrong. He needs to go away and fix his issues before his confidence is wrecked for good.
 
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They say it is best to never meet your heroes, but Haseeb Hameed may well disagree.

The night before this series, he spoke with wide-eyed wonder about how "amazing" it would be to meet Virat Kohli. He was one of his cricketing heroes and the thought of playing against him was clearly a thrill.

Now he has not just met him, but won his respect. For while the relationship between these teams is not especially good - they came into the series with baggage from 2014, in particular - it was noticeable that Kohli not only applauded Hameed upon reaching his half-century in Mohali, but ran up to shake him by the hand at the end of his innings.

He had, to his great credit, recognised not only an innings of class and bravery, but perhaps something of a kindred spirit, too: this was one fine batsmen acknowledging another, albeit one who has achieved little by comparison at this stage of his career. It is a moment that is likely to console Hameed long after he has made the journey home to have surgery on his left hand.

"He's showed great character for a 19-year-old," Kohli said. "He put his hand up when his team wanted him to do it and the way he played with Anderson showed great maturity. You can sense it as a captain: this guy is intelligent, this guy knows the game.

"He's a great prospect for England. He's definitely going to be a future star in all forms if he keeps persisting with his skill. I'm really impressed and that's why I patted him on the back. It was an innings full of character and something that you need to applaud."

It may be relevant that Hameed, unlike some of the other players involved in this match, let his cricket do the talking and therefore hasn't irked the opposition. He doesn't feel the need to posture or pose; he doesn't feel the need to give opposition players a send-off when they're out or give them abuse when he is fielding.

Any thought that such behaviour equates to strong or brave cricket should have been banished years ago. Hameed has reminded us that you can be gutsy and determined without denigrating the opposition. And, both with his batting and his demeanour, he might have reminded one or two how this game could, and should, be played.

There were many impressive aspects of this innings. There was the range of strokes - including a delicious late cut, a slog-sweep for six and a front-foot hook - that showed he had been playing within himself in previous innings and hinted at an ability that could well feed into white-ball cricket. There was the sight of Hameed going to meet his new partner - James Anderson, a man with 118 more Tests than him - to offer some advice and encouragement and there was his ability to rotate the strike so effectively that Anderson only faced 11 out of the 40 balls they batted together.

But perhaps the most impressive feature of this innings was his ability to adapt to the physical imposition he faced and the bravery to attempt to do so.

Hameed batted three times in the nets on Monday. The first two times were unsuccessful: the pain was such that he could hardly hold the bat, far less control it. It seemed he would bat only in an emergency and perhaps at No. 11. But then he experimented with a different grip where he was able to take his little finger off the bat. And, after some practice in the nets, reported that he was happy with the new technique.

So, as a 19-year-old in his third Test, he not only went out to bat with such a badly damaged finger that he knew it required surgery, but he did so with a makeshift grip. And then he played England's best innings of the match. It was hardly surprising that Trevor Bayliss, the England coach, described the team as "in awe" of their young colleague.

"It's a hell of a skill to have," Bayliss said. "To change the way you play to combat that. A couple of headache tablets and out he went. It is a lesson for others. There's a lot of guys in there in awe of what he's been through. The lack of showing any pain, and guts and determination is a good sign. There's plenty of other guys who have got hit and make a big song and dance about it. Obviously he's got a big pain threshold."

They were sentiments echoed by Alastair Cook. He has been searching for an opening partner since July 2012 and the retirement of Andrew Strauss. But the search is over. Hameed is likely to be his regular opening partner for the rest of his career.

"He has impressed us all with technique, his talent and now his bravery," Cook said. "He has shown us he will do anything to get out there. That was a very special knock. We will hold him in huge respect for it."

International cricket is brutal though and, when Hameed does return, he must know he will face a sustained examination of his technique against the short ball. While his bravery is not in question, his habit of playing with low hands might render this the sort of incident that could reoccur.

Keen to test him with the bouncer here, India started with a short leg, leg slip and deep-backward square for him in the second innings. But while there were a couple of times he looked hurried by the short ball - and Mohammed Shami has bowled terrifically this series - he managed to get on top of the ball and play it straight down into the ground at his feet. And each time the follow-up full delivery demanded a forward stroke, his feet moved without hesitation and his judgement over which ball to play and leave remained impeccable. He looked, once again, calm and composed.

Within a couple of overs the leg slip had gone. An over later, the short leg had gone. Instead of just tucking the ball off his ribs or into the ground, Hameed had started to pull and hook. He is learning and adapting with every innings. It is a shame his series is over.

He was desperate not to go home. He has loved this experience and pleaded with the medical team to tape up the finger and let him carry on. But sense prevailed. He will leave in the next day or two and have the operation as soon as possible. You can be quite certain, however, that he will be opening the batting for England when their Test schedule resumes in July.

"He wants to stay and play the last two Tests," Bayliss said. "He wouldn't take no for an answer. He wants to stay. His old man said 'Just tape it up, he'll be all right'.

"It's a great sign. It's the sort of attitude you want. Not only can he play but it's great to see an attitude like that. We'll make sure he gets back and gets it done so he's right to go early next season."

It seems Hameed may have come into the match carrying the injury. He took a blow to the hand in the second innings in Visakhapatnam - his first ball was a sharp bouncer that he played poorly - and was then dismissed in the first innings here by a ball that jumped off a length and hit his glove in exactly the same place.

"The medical people think he probably cracked it in the second Test," Bayliss said. "He's copped another one in the same spot. It's a break that is all the way through the finger. The finger's in two pieces so it's an injury that the medical people say if he gets another knock on it, especially in the field, it could bend it right back. It's best to get it done as soon as we can."

Indeed it is. And for all the disappointment England may well have at the end of this series - it is hard to avoid the conclusion it reached tipping point on Monday - they will go home consoled in the knowledge that they have found a batsmen who should serve them well for a decade or more. You suspect Bayliss and Cook thought so after Rajkot. In Mohali, Kohli recognised it, too.
 
Cannot see what Ansari adds, his bowling wasn't that great. Would rather an extra batsmen played. Was thinking Duckett at number 6 as the ball is usually older by then. His technical skills need improving before he can open.

Its not really that Ansari adds anything but thst I don't think he'd be a worse bat than Duckett and can bowl some remotely useful overs.
 
Jennings had a fantastic season domestically. Another South African born player serves his time then gets called up. Going in halfway through a tour of India is a hell of a way to get started so good luck to the lad.

Dawson I always considered more of a one-day specialist and can't see him adding too much to the squad, in Rashid and Batty we already have 2 spinners that know which end of the bat to hold (could also count Moeen in there).
 
Can I just say -- and I think @NinjaFletch has pointed it out before -- that Bayliss' meddling is irritating?

Test cricket's been built on certain characteristics and England excel at those. They shouldn't relinquish it on a pseudo notion of 'keeping pace with the modern game'. There is a need to remind certain batsmen at times - Compton in his first stint in the England team, Pujara last year, Vijay now - the need to rotate. But this misplaced idea that 'aggression' should be added to what already works for a player is distracting. When Compton came back to the team, I felt like he was pacing himself well(against SA, I think it was). England won a test and I remember Bayliss said he'd expect the #3 to attack more and Compton just fell apart after that playing like he was caught between two styles.

I see Bayliss commenting similarly again re how England went about this series and it's just idiocy.

Cook has captained well in recent times and he should carry on as he is.
 
300 for <6 by the end of the day. No excuses. Cook & Root have to convert & win us this match.
 
It seems inevitable that an England batting collapse will occur - good knock from Jennings though, obvious bright spot of the day.
 
England in a very strong position here. No way is this track going to last till the final day. The best day for batsmen just went past us and England have done well so far.
 
England in a very strong position here. No way is this track going to last till the final day. The best day for batsmen just went past us and England have done well so far.
I disagree...I think they need to score at least 350. If they had remained 4 down, I'd say they won the day comfortably.

As it is...I'd say it was even.
 
I disagree...I think they need to score at least 350. If they had remained 4 down, I'd say they won the day comfortably.

As it is...I'd say it was even.
I'd say India have about drawn the day, from the toss onwards but India having to bat last puts England on top.
 
I'd say India have about drawn the day, from the toss onwards but India having to bat last puts England on top.
I just get the feeling England as with most of this series haven't taken advantage of things. I bet if India had won the toss, they would have tried to amass 500-550 and ensured they didn't bat again, or even if they did...it was to chase down a very small score after making England follow on.
 
I just get the feeling England as with most of this series haven't taken advantage of things. I bet if India had won the toss, they would have tried to amass 500-550 and ensured they didn't bat again, or even if they did...it was to chase down a very small score after making England follow on.
I'm sure they would but it would've been quite an achievement on this pitch. It's turning quite a bit.
 
I guess we'll find out tomorrow :)
Indeed! My prediction is that England get a lead of around 50-100, on first innings. After that, I think shall depend on how able to handle the pressure England's batsmen are second time around.
 
Haven't watched a ball so I could be wrong but a load of pundits were predicting ball to turn square in the first 3 tests as well but it never really happened.