Yes I noticed the girl contradicted him by saying Donny was the best after he said he was huffing and puffing
Too bad the game wasn't televised.
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Too bad the game wasn't televised.
One of our younger attackers could have played such a role, and very likely better. It is strange to have a player on such an astronomical wage as Mata if he is only good for a few easy cup games - it doesn’t make any sense. Give those 5 games to Hannibal and save 7m per year on wages alone (in addition to giving youngster some experience)
He was decent in the Wolves game at the end of the season.
I don't know about that, Mata was very good in the cup games.
He's also a very good/experienced character to have in the dressing room for the younger lads. It's his last year now, I believe he's being ushered into a coaching role of some kind.
He was decent in pre-season as well, especially against Everton.
true story
does city or any big team keep guys around on big wages because they are fun to be around and make the younger lads feel warm and fuzzy inside? it appears only United give out contracts to players who barely play and take up squad space for younger players.
Mata played 31 minutes in Europa league, 500 mins in Prem, 90 mins (1 game) in FA cup, 168 mins (over 2 games) in League cup. he was hardly used in any comp and is here on sentiment.
he was Also hardly avaiable due to his mothers death
Yes they did they kept Kompany around forever. His last couple of seasons he was mostly there for moral support and occasionally playing some cup games.
Liverpool still keep Henderson and Milner around.
thats true but in 2020 he was an unused sub for 20 premiership matches. That must be a record.
For 3 seasons Kompany suffered major injuries every year. He was crucial in their 2019 title closing stages playing 8 matches in a row as a starter. He actually started the season starting matches but again injuries. They then released him and he had another injury prone season. I believe he was injury prone which reduced his playing time.
Henderson is a key player for Liverpool and was playing 90 minute a game games for nearly 17 straight games and done his groin last season
Milner surprisingly started 4/7 champions league games he was available for and was unused in only 8 premier league games he was fit and available. (this includes being left out of the squad)
There’s plenty of teams that keep players around a year or so longer than they perhaps but it’s good to have a few experienced players in the dressing room.
As it happens I wouldn’t have minded seeing mata and certainly Jones/Lingard move on in this last transfer window but with the latter two it’s not as easy as it seems to get rid of them.
and what is incorrect?
Normally I might agree. But the situation with VDB is so strange that it requires some clarification. We've invested a lot of money on a player who might as well not be in the squad. I actually would like to hear from the people involved, even if it is obviously one-sided. Ole is free to clarify what is going on with Donny whenever he is asked about it in a press conference and I'd like him to do so, to be honest!
‘Confidentially’ on a public fan forum? The fact you’re still attempting to quip is flattering but that was dim even by the standards you continue to set. It’s the same song different cretin, using all manner of nonsense to evade your initial pointless response. Stay on topic.I figured I could exaggerate a little this time with 'going nuts', but I see that's supposed to work only one way.I appreciate, though, that you see me as a person you can confidentially go to if you want to complain about other posters that I have nothing to do with.
I’ve read this same post in multiple guises & addressed it.
We have multiple other players on the fringes with agents who choose to keep their discussions private. The club has had players far greater than VdB will ever be, cast to the fringes without needing their agent to front up to the press. His agent didn’t ‘need’ to do this, the actions are questionable & made to put pressure on the club. VdB has done nothing with the game time he’s had, he’ll be given chances against opposition befitting his standard.
A straw man argument.
Again, irrelevant. My original point [which has riled you so badly you’ve been in my mentions for 2 days] was about the action. His agent didn’t have to disclose anything, & better players have been treated far worse whilst their agents conducted business in private. The comments do nothing but stoke a fire, VdB hasn’t particularly performed well in bursts - he doesn’t warrant minutes otherwise OgS [who is one loss away from #OleOut] would surely be playing him.
What are you hoping to gain here? We disagree, move on.
thatwasthejoke.gif
Not really. It seems that it's either this or agents can't speak in public for you.
You've also been in my alerts all this time.
So again agents should just shut up at all times. That appears to be your point, as even this small comment is already mouthing off in your book. And yes, that's on topic; it's in fact at the core of our discussion.
I don't know which fire is stoked though. As I said, the club will know all about Van de Beek's opinion on his status at United (that he's unhappy he isn't playing and would prefer to move if he's considered not good enough), and any outsider can guess as much as well. What do the comments change?
I did say that a while ago already, but happy to go on while you do.
VDB cost 40m and hasn't had 2 starts in a row, which is incredibly rare for the biggest signing of any given window. Him shedding some light on the situation does reduce speculation (notice how the conversation has shifted since the accurate translations of the interview have been published). You're right that he's pressuring Ole into playing him or pressuring the club into loaning/selling him in the next window, by disclosing that there's some sort of agreement or understanding.
My disagreement with you came stems from the fact that you think there's a double standard between Albers and Raiola and that you think them giving interviews is somehow the same. As noted by many, their tone is completely different. Albers hasn't spoken negatively of the club, hasn't lost cases in arbitration for illegal transfer practices and doesn't offer Man Utd players to Liverpool. And those are the reasons Pogba and Raiola are disliked, not that they gave an interview discussing their client, which you think is "mouthy"/"being a gobshite".
I thought he looked good in central midfield in the one preseason game. Constantly made himself available to receive a pass from the CBs, did much better than Matic in the last game.
Maybe it's worth 40m to have cover for Bruno in case he gets injured.
Maybe it's worth 40m to have cover for Bruno in case he gets injured.
You are right. VDB was brought up in the Ajax system so he knows how to play. It's a matter of finding out if he is suitable for this league, but we can't find out if he is unless we give him game time. By game time, I do not mean 5 minutes here and there once a month, but a few games on the trot. Those saying he can't play the holding role have no idea how Ajax trains their players to play different roles. I believe VDB can play with any of our current midfield players but the sight of McT coming on injured in the Southampton games shows that there's an agenda why VDB is not playing. Maybe VDB was forced on Ole and is now showing who is in charge.
Here is a video of a discussion regarding VDB which the host explains another theory why VDB is not getting game time
There's some weird conspiracy theories surrounding Donny that is frankly bizzare. What you'll sack your manager for not playing this one player that at best is a tidy keep the ball moving type player? I mean there were conspiracies about Zaha shagging Moyes' daughter but even then we didn't go as far as to say the manager should be sacked for not playing him.
Donny is more than a tidy ball keeper. He’s actually pretty decent on goal too
Whether we should have spent 35m on him is a very fair question, but he’s not the spastic clown he’s been made out to be by some here. We’re all to speculate as to why we brought him in, but it is undeniable that Donny is nowhere near the class of Bruno or Pogba.
But that’s not surprising. There isn’t a single squad player on earth who is anywhere close to Bruno or Pogba. And I’m not sure I can identity more than 2 or 3 players in the entire PL who are.
So, was it was wise to spend 35m on a squad man? Or should we have spent 35m to bring in a proper CDM?
Whether we should have spent 35m on him is a very fair question, but he’s not the spastic clown he’s been made out to be by some here. We’re all to speculate as to why we brought him in, but it is undeniable that Donny is nowhere near the class of Bruno or Pogba.
But that’s not surprising. There isn’t a single squad player on earth who is anywhere close to Bruno or Pogba. And I’m not sure I can identity more than 2 or 3 players in the entire PL who are.
So, was it was wise to spend 35m on a squad man? Or should we have spent 35m to bring in a proper CDM?
No, you don't sack your manager based on any conspiracy theory, you sack your manager for lack of success as far as titles are concerned, or shit show performances on the pitch. VDB is a player who given game time might be able to produce for the team. He played a leading role for a proper football and is not likely to have forgotten how to play once he came to United.
What I would question is how VDB has not had a second on the pitch this season while Ole decided it was beneficial to bring on an injured McT on against Southampton. This is after Donny had a good pre-season game against Everton.
It will be impossible for him to do important things after 1 year of inactivity, need time
Really? Finishing 3rd and 2nd in his first two full seasons from being the perennial 6th best club at the time? And lets not pretend that there were not a lot of very good games and performances in there. Yes sometimes when we don'l gel we look like we can't string 3 passes together, but when we find our feet we're a very good team that plays a very explosive and attacking brand of football. And for the most part all of our transfers under Ole have been good to some extent. I'm fairly sure VDB will end up being fine as well, but if he doesn't he'd be the exception rather than the norm and that would be on him.
The problem is that none of those systems work for us. We have too many gifted attackers at the top end to be sacrificing them to accomodate VDB. He's also been physically underwhelming in his appearances so far. It's hard to see where he fits in tbh. Those three years together give you nothing defensively and nothing in terms of the engine room. It's Bruno or VDB for me, at least based on what we've seen so far. That's why Ole barely plays him.
I would like to believe he is good enough but so far there is no evidence show that he has something to offer in double pivot. Donny is not destroyer and he doesn’t dictate a tempo too. I don’t know what he offers honestly if he plays double pivot, I think he plays like Cleverley in double pivot which keep things simple and safe. McTominay is more destroyer than Donny so he plays over Donny. Fred is also more destroyer than Donny so he plays over Donny.
My big issue is that Ole is still insisting to keep him. Saul was available on loan, he would have been a better option. Why can’t Ole just let Donny go and get Saul on loan. If Donny is in his plan, then play him and give him lot of minutes because we spent 40m on him which we could have spend it on a midfielder that good enough to start for us.
My big issue is that Ole is still insisting to keep him. Saul was available on loan, he would have been a better option. Why can’t Ole just let Donny go and get Saul on loan. If Donny is in his plan, then play him and give him lot of minutes because we spent 40m on him which we could have spend it on a midfielder that good enough to start for us.
Good post, agreed. Nice to see someone who is able to understand and appreciate Fred here.
Given that Van de Beek was looking at transfer options but was blocked from moving by United in the end, my theory would be that United did plan to replace him with someone that better fits the team; but that this fell through and hence they finally did want Van de Beek to stay. If that's correcet, then actually neither the club nor the player are happy with the current situation, but what can you do. I'd fully except Van de Beek to continue to barely feature (since his style doesn't fit), and that the club will look to replace him in the January window.
Saul was available on loan in the summer. Saul wouldn't be available on loan in January. I doubt there is a realistic option to get in January to replace VDB, it will cost more as not many club will sell their player easily in January.
Well this is a straight up lie already.
His best performance for us came against Wolves in the deeper position. It suits him way more than any of the other areas we've tried him.
With respect to the claim that Donny’s “style” doesn’t fit United, I’m curious whether anyone here believes Fred’s or McTominay’s style “fits” United.
Fred needs no introduction here as a footballer who can’t complete a pass under duress, but when given a bit of space can. But he is completely useless in the final third. McTominay has a thumping shot in him, but I can’t imagine anyone here regards him as a proficient passer of the ball.
Fred needs no introduction here as a footballer who can’t complete a pass under duress, but when given a bit of space can. But he is completely useless in the final third. McTominay has a thumping shot in him, but I can’t imagine anyone here regards him as a proficient passer of the ball.
McTominay is entry-level Michael Carrick, he's a perfect Manchester United squad player mold.
Perhaps, but we only see a 6 or 7 performance out of McTominay when Fred is also playing. Absent Fred, McTominay rarely impresses. Sometimes, but then again he does what’s asked of a squad player.
Tell me what did he offer in that game? Did he dictate or control the tempo? Did he play in destroyer role?
Yes he did it all, and he got the assist that won us the game. It seems maybe you didn't watch it or don't remember it.
It seems we both were watching the same game but viewing it different way, so either your football knowledge is shit or my football knowledge is the one shit here. If that’s the case then we shouldn’t be listening and reading each other posts ever again because we won’t be on the same page. In my view, he didn’t dictate the tempo and he didn’t play like a destroyer in that game.
I am sincerely gutted for DVB. He is a great lad, showed his commitment by beefing up to manage the physicality of the league and nobody can question his footballing brain as well. He had a good preseason under his belt and still not picked once in the league. I don't know what is the plan for him by the United management but Southampton and then Wolves games he should have been in that midfield which was not performing to the level needed for championship team
I took a night off. Let’s park the futile attempts at humour & concentrate on the topic.
No one is saying all agents ‘should’ do anything. I’ve highlighted two that talk openly & labelled them ‘mouthy’, ‘gobshites’.
This is how I see it [so you can’t stop telling me how I do], there are countless agents & agencies. Take Manchester United for example & off the top of my head I can tell you who Ronaldo’s agent is, he is THE best player ever. I can tell you who Pogba’s agent is, cause his agents a gobshite. What I can’t do quickly is tell you who represents Lingard, Shaw, McTominay, Maguire, Greenwood & many other players. I can however now tell you who represents VdB because in spite of VdBs poor performances since joining the club his agent has resorted to leveraging the club in public.
So as I see it, Albers has more in common with a Raiola type than the other ‘nameless’ entities.
Albers works for VdB & his comments are in his clients interests, I don’t need you to keep regurgitating his reasons in different guises - that isn’t up for debate because that isn’t what apparently got you both upset. The point is he didn’t ‘have’ to do what he did & in doing so, it’s actually more of an exception than standard practice.
I address why I see Albers comments closer to Raiola’s than ‘unnamed’ contemporaries above but you seem to be stuck on the fact that Raiola’s actions are worse. I’ve addressed this already, his actions being worse don’t make Albers fine.
Look at a Lingard, a player whose career has stalled for United but is coming off the form of his life to end last season & more importantly has actually been a key contributor to our recent [measured] successes - where’s his agent(s) to provide clarity? You really are self righteous if you think he made those comments to ‘reduce speculation’ amongst the fanbase. He didn’t do this for us mate. It’s now an even bigger OgS issue.
I’ve been saying the conversation has shifted for multiple posts, the fact you’re trying to throw that in as some revelation shows you aren’t here to debate in good faith. If you’re so worried about the topic shifting how many more times are you going to mention Pogba being offered to Liverpool? We already know this & as bad as it is, it’s irrelevant in this discussion. No one cares why you dislike Pogba. How is losing legal cases relevant to Albers being vocal whilst many of his contemporaries do their business more discreetly? I’d advise you to stay on topic before echoing me about how the conversation has shifted.
There is a huge double standard, both agents [to varying degrees] have made comments to disadvantage the club publicly. The severity isn’t the discussion.
The severity is exactly the point of debate. From your post above, it appears you think there are only two categories: 'anonymous/unnoticeable' and 'mouthy/gobshite'. I think what we're both getting at here, is that that's a ridiculous black-and-white characterization that doesn't do the Van de Beek situation justice at all.
Goldbridge is an absolute imbecile, you're not adding good credibility by posting his videos!
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